﻿Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 11:28 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 11:00 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
He is not a rgyalpo. Sometimes he is referred to as the king of the bstan, like in this passage a terma tantra of four armed Mahakala:

Emanation of Padma Heruka, 
the king of the Tsan with magic power, 
the one who divided heaven and earth in the west,
the empowerment is conferred upon Vajrasadhu.

Lhalhung describes him as having three aspects, jñāna Vajrasadhu in the presence of Vairocana in Akaniśtha; samaya Vajrasadhu in the presences of Vajrapani on Potala; and "puruṣa Vajrasadhu in Tibet, etc.


cloudburst said:
Thank you.
Do you know anything about how he is viewed by various schools?
For example, what about Sakya? Jeff Watt says
"Dorje Legpa: a worldly deity, special for the 'Treasure' Tradition of the Nyingma. He typically holds a vajra scepter and a heart, riding atop either a lion or a goat."

how to explain the common appelation "Damchen" Dorje Legpa?

thanks

Malcolm wrote:
Skyes bu Dorje Legpa appears as a worldly deity tamed by Guru Rinpoche as a display.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 10:58 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



cloudburst said:
This is a surprising answer, not what I expected at all.
Most sources seem to indicate he is a worldly protector, even Terma sources.



He definitely seems to have the form/proportions/ traditional iconography of a gyalpo ....

is it the Karma Kagyu who regard him as a wordly protector? Do you know anything about what I am talking about?

Malcolm wrote:
He is not a rgyalpo. Sometimes he is referred to as the king of the bstan, like in this passage a terma tantra of four armed Mahakala:

Emanation of Padma Heruka, 
the king of the Tsan with magic power, 
the one who divided heaven and earth in the west,
the empowerment is conferred upon Vajrasadhu.

Lhalhung describes him as having three aspects, jñāna Vajrasadhu in the presence of Vairocana in Akaniśtha; samaya Vajrasadhu in the presences of Vajrapani on Potala; and "puruṣa Vajrasadhu in Tibet, etc.


cloudburst said:
Thank you.
Do you know anything about how he is viewed by various schools?

Malcolm wrote:
Have not done a survey.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 9:49 PM
Title: Re: Death in the family
Content:
tobes said:
Hello Dharmawheel community - my partner's father is about to pass away. As far as I can tell, all looks peaceful and auspicious, but if anyone can include him in their daily prayers/practices for the next few weeks I would be appreciative. His name is Noel. I think Guru Rinpoche is especially good for him, but whatever you usually do is great.

Malcolm wrote:
Sing song of the vajra to him, quietly, of course.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 9:47 PM
Title: Re: US Government declares America is a Battlespace
Content:
PeterC said:
I’m trying to think of when the armed forces were last deployed on American soil - not the armed forces, the regular army, and not in an exercise.  Hawaii in WWII?  But even then it was deployed against a foreign invading enemy.  This isn’t something you can come back from.

Malcolm wrote:
Hurricane Hugo and the 92 riots in LA. Context here:

https://www.everycrsreport.com/files/20060814_RS22266_c6617a8c1fc8c51828f9ab4d4a42de8366358c24.pdf:

It discusses all the relevant laws and their past interpretation, though all bets are off with this guy and his flunky, William Barr.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 9:08 PM
Title: US Government declares America is a Battlespace
Content:
Unknown said:
“I think the sooner that you mass and dominate the battlespace, the quicker this dissipates and we can get back to the right normal,” Esper said during the call, an audio excerpt of which was published by The Washington Post. “We need to dominate the battlespace.”

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/defense-secretary-pledges-pentagon-support-to-help-dominate-the-battlespace-amid-unrest/2020/06/01/7c5b4630-a449-11ea-8681-7d471bf20207_story.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 7:16 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
PeterC said:
https://twitter.com/bad_takes/status/1267594813710446593

He had the church site cleared of protestors with tear gas and rubber bullets before he went there for this peculiar photo-op with a bible.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, it was awful. He had the protesters cleared at the same time he was telling the country he was protecting the protesters. The church thing was something.

Minobu said:
no friggin way...thats wack .
can't be..if it is reaslly not  some bull shit...he can't possably come back from something like that...if ain't true...this gives his people  more ammo...

now show me please where he really had the place lit up with rubber bullets to clear out what exactly a church...whatwas in the church...
i;m friggin dreaming man its a nightmare..

Malcolm wrote:
The church had a fire in the basement The night before. It is directly across from Lafayette park.

Protesters Dispersed With Tear Gas So Trump Could Pose at Church
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/01/us/politics/trump-st-johns-church-bible.html
Minobu said:
WASHINGTON — People who gathered outside the White House to protest police brutality spent Monday waving signs and screaming for justice. They watched as police officers and National Guard units flooded Lafayette Square, delivering on a threat made by President Trump. And just before the city’s 7 p.m. curfew went into effect, they were hit with flash-bang explosions and doused with tear gas.

It was because the president, who spent part of the weekend in a secure bunker as protests roiled, wanted to have his picture taken holding a Bible at a battered church just beyond the gates.

That church, St. John’s — the so-called Church of the Presidents because every one since James Madison has attended — had been briefly set ablaze as the protests devolved on Sunday evening. After Mr. Trump’s aides spent much of Monday expressing outrage over the burning of a place of worship, Hope Hicks, a presidential adviser, eventually hatched a plan with others at the White House to have the president walk over to the building, according to an official familiar with the events.

As Mr. Trump delivered a speech in the Rose Garden vowing to send the military to states where governors could not bring rioting under control but calling himself “an ally of all peaceful protesters,” the sound of explosions and the yells of demonstrators could be heard. After receiving repeated warnings to disperse before the city’s curfew, the crowd was tear-gassed.

Mr. Trump began his walk to the church at 7:01 p.m. for a photo session that lasted about 17 minutes. On his way over, after protesters had been driven from the park, he was trailed by a group of aides, including Attorney General William P. Barr. Mr. Barr had strolled to the edge of the police line to observe the crowd in the minutes before the tear-gassing began.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 7:09 PM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Grigoris said:
Yes, I am interested.

When do we start?

jake said:
I will commit to reading up to the start of Chapter 1 (pg. 54 book, 122 pdf) of the Pruden translation by 14th Sunday.

Grigoris said:
The intorduction is 60 pages and seems to just be an outline of the content.  Is it worth the effort?  Personally I think we should dive into the text.  Maybe take Malcolm's advice or start from page 1 of the actual text?

Malcolm wrote:
The intro provides historical material mainly. Better to dive in.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:53 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Wayfarer said:
I can't help but think that the US riots will be exploited by the Orange Emperor. You can see he's itching to declare martial law and start shooting with real bullets. I don't think he'll be allowed to do it, but the longer the riots go on, the more mileage he will get on a 'tough on criminals' act that plays to the fears and insecurities of the electorate. It would be a vastly different matter if all the protests were peaceful, but the vision of stores being ransacked and people running off into the night with stolen goods only plays into the Law & Order storyline.

Malcolm wrote:
The protests were peaceful, until the police start attacking protesters on the first night. They’ve been peaceful everyday, and the police have violently attacked civilians everyday.

The looting, while regrettable, is totally understandable, and on balance, isn’t that big a deal.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:47 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



tobes said:
Thanks for taking the time here Peter C. There is virtually nothing here that I disagree with. I'll take an insider's perspective on the relation between these race riots and the recent polarization of political views over mine ( which is not only very distant, but also very uninformed) - it looks very connected from here, but perhaps that is a false perception.

I suppose I have inferred this because it seems like every particular issue is playing out in exactly the same intractable way. i.e. even 'should we go into lockdown or not?' basically followed this tribal logic.

Be clear though, I am not suggesting that two opposing sides are normatively or morally equal - in this case for example, I think the moral-political balance falls almost entirely on the side of the protesters. It is more a question of: 'how do we stop this slide into complete breakdown, with all of the consequences that will follow?'

Don't Americans need to be really thinking about this question? It seems like everyone has more or less given up; it's a fait accompli. The cookies will fall where they fall, blood will flow where it flows. Am I being too pessimistic here? What's the way out that doesn't involve the complete destruction of the other?

Dan74 said:
FWIW, I have a very similar impression. The entrenched partisanship, the striking dearth of civic discourse and the seeming absence of a common project..

Manjushri said:
Me too. It would make one hopeful to witness a bit more awareness of the potential catastrophe that may befall the community and country as a whole, based on the lack of dialogue and extreme antagonism between the two sides, without any compassion for the additional innocents dragged in the process, without any seeming attempt of resolution that lacks the risk of falling into full-scale bloodshed. It really is heart-breaking to see a community divided with a bottomless pit separating the two sides and the threat of blind and ruthless violence that takes over guilty and innocent indiscriminately.

Malcolm wrote:
All this “community divided” hand wringing is nonsense. There is a fascist in the White House, and if one does not see this one is either blind or one is complicit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 10:24 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
PeterC said:
https://twitter.com/bad_takes/status/1267594813710446593

He had the church site cleared of protestors with tear gas and rubber bullets before he went there for this peculiar photo-op with a bible.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, it was awful. He had the protesters cleared at the same time he was telling the country he was protecting the protesters. The church thing was something.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 9:15 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Neofascist in spades. What he says is a complete lie.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 8:50 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
tkp67 said:
It might be note worthy that all regions have local accessible public access radio available over the internet.

I tuned into a public broadcast in Minnesota the other day that gave priority to local black leaders who were informed, educated with reasonable and poignant explanations with suggestion for reform.

When you hear the minds of the community directly without the bias of mass media it puts them so much closer and the pollution of media agenda further away.

tl:dr of the last broadcast was that over policing of minorities is an centuries old income stream. If we look to the militarization of the police it looks like tax dollars get put into the military for plundering and then decommissioned military equipment is resold to the police at a premium through gains from forfeitures.

The govt has quite the hustle. Same as it ever was, reminds me of when I was working IT in the aerospace industry.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, and then there is the privatized prison scam. I’ve been watching the mind of the country for a week now. And the people are pissed. The only media putting a spin on things is the trump controlled state media, aka Fox News.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 8:09 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Now trump is threatening to violate the posse comitatus act. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Trump is making his fascist move.

PeterC said:
The insurrection act of 1807 provides a pretty big loophole, and has been used in recent history.

But yes, troops on the street isn’t going to help him in November.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it does, but that depends on state government failure. He is using this to bypass state governments.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:51 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Now trump is threatening to violate the posse comitatus act. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Trump is making his fascist move.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:46 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Now trump is talking about how he is going to keep peaceful protestors safe at the same time he is attacking peaceful protesters with police.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:43 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Now attacking crowd with rubber bullets and mounted police as well as gas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:38 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The police just attacked peaceful protestors with batons, shields, flash bangs, and gas outside the White House on National TV.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:13 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 6:04 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
https://gizmodo.com/report-over-100-militant-groups-have-been-promoting-se-1843051231
Unknown said:
The report suggests this isn’t just casual dabbling in violent fantasies. The groups have uploaded CIA handbooks, military manuals, and the bomb assembly manual “The Anarchist Cookbook.” One 133-page-plus planning document reviewed by the TTP reportedly identifies strongholds like “national guard depots, police stations, and factories that produce munitions” as “very solid targets” and proposes taking out rail lines and ports to “sabotage shipments.” The TTP found that one Arkansas fan of several boogaloo pages was arrested earlier this month after allegedly livestreaming a hunt to kill a police officer on Facebook Live.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 5:37 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Grigoris said:
So how are we going to structure this?

Malcolm wrote:
I would start with the dhātu chapter.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 5:24 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Ceisiwr said:
It failed because the system collapsed under the weight of its own in efficiencies. The USSR, as with all Communist states, saw growth in the initial years due to extensive growth. Eventually, however, there are only so many new factories you can build. What lead to its eventually demise was its inability to develop intensive growth. That, as well as the stiffing political climate and other inadequacies of the planned economy lead to its downfall. Even if the USSR was not competing with the West it still would have faced these problems, for they are inherent flaws.

Malcolm wrote:
Were it not for the fact that it was competing with the West, it would have lasted considerably longer. For example, the reason why Earl Butz changed our agricultural system in the early 70's was to make our wheat so cheap that formerly competitive Soviet wheat could not find a market. Of course, it also destroyed the small dairy industry in the US at the same time, but who cares right? By these and other means, the US drove the economy of the USSR under. We simple wielded greater economic power than they did. That, combined with a corrupt government, did them in. China, which had largely the same kind of government, saw the writing on the wall, and decided that the best way forward was to have an authoritarian state combined with a limited market economy, which is what they have now. Consumerism to keep the masses distracted and unable to address the corruption which is at all level of Chinese governance, from top to bottom. So it is not as simple as saying Marxist-Leninism failed because of its inherent flaws. China is a Marxist-Leninist state, and it had not failed yet.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 5:06 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
I like Dorje Legpa as sort 9f the patron saint of pro gamblers which is what I am now.

Malcolm wrote:
The Ma sang are credited with inventing Pagchen, the "Great Game," a sort of Tibetan version of dominoes, popular in the Dzogchen Community. I played the Boss a couple of times. It was intense. He yelled at me once because he could not read my face, "Don't be indifferent" he said. He liked to win, and when he did not win, he would get very annoyed.

http://web.archive.org/web/20081205061947/http://www.ssi-austria.at/bagchen-regeln.htm

https://www.pagat.com/tile/cdom/bagchen.html

Crazywisdom said:
Sounds fun. Do you wager in this game? I am partial to Texas Holdem.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it is fun to play (about as fun as watching paint dry to watch). And yes, it is a gambling game and to win, requires skill.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 5:04 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



cloudburst said:
Isnt it true that some traditions regard Dorje legpa as and enlightened being, others and a worldly entity? Some Nyingma traditions hold DL to be an enlightened protector, no?

Malcolm wrote:
Dorleg is a wisdom protector. Beyond samsara.

cloudburst said:
This is a surprising answer, not what I expected at all.
Most sources seem to indicate he is a worldly protector, even Terma sources.
Like other important Nyingma protectors, there is a wealth of treasure literature on Dorje Lekpa's (Skt. Vajra Sadhu) origins and characteristics, much of it contradictory. However, the following essay will attempt to collate the various myths of Dorje Lekpa, based on the terma sources quoted in the 1734 "Biographies of the Ocean of Oath-Bound Protectors," written by Lelung Zhepe Dorje (1697-1740).
He definitely seems to have the form/proportions/ traditional iconography of a gyalpo ....

is it the Karma Kagyu who regard him as a wordly protector? Do you know anything about what I am talking about?

Malcolm wrote:
He is not a rgyalpo. Sometimes he is referred to as the king of the bstan, like in this passage a terma tantra of four armed Mahakala:

Emanation of Padma Heruka, 
the king of the Tsan with magic power, 
the one who divided heaven and earth in the west,
the empowerment is conferred upon Vajrasadhu.

Lhalhung describes him as having three aspects, jñāna Vajrasadhu in the presence of Vairocana in Akaniśtha; samaya Vajrasadhu in the presences of Vajrapani on Potala; and "puruṣa Vajrasadhu in Tibet, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:40 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
That doesn't answer my question. If the leftist person subscribes to socialism, marxist communism, ancom or any other purely anti-capitalist ideology which aims to supplant capitalism with some form of post-capitalist economic system then yes, they are totalitarians.

Grigoris said:
Nope, that is just BS.

Ceisiwr said:
Do explain how replacing liberal democracy and capitalism, the two most wonderful of systems, is not totalitarian?

Malcolm wrote:
Liberal democracy is just fine. Its utility has been severely damaged by irrational conservative policies like austerity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:37 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Ceisiwr said:
Many of the former socialist countries had appalling environmental records. Short of anprim I don't see how replacing capitalism with an inferior economic system will help the environment.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is true, because they were in a world economy dominated by capitalism and they felt they needed to hasten their industrial development to catch up. For example, China. India, while not a communist country, also has willing damaged its environment in order to keep up in the world Capitalist economy. Capitalism is destroying our environment.

Ceisiwr said:
Lmao! Spoken like a true ideologue. Even when socialism fails, its really capitalism's fault.

Malcolm wrote:
No, Marxist-Leninism in the USSR failed all by itself. But the conditions for its failure were predicated on the fact that it was competing in a Capitalist system as a state capitalist entity. China has not failed in this way, despite a similar ideology, because they got a hand up from Nixon, and then a neoliberal boost from Clinton.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:35 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Ceisiwr said:
I don't need to read it. I'm well aware of the productivity gap in the US and elsewhere.

Malcolm wrote:
well, go back to DWT, dude, because if you can't spend give minutes reading an article that deconstructs your thesis, what is the point of talking to you?

Ceisiwr said:
I already countered your nonsense. The wages are still set by supply and demand. Issues with productivity and pay do not change that fact.

Malcolm wrote:
No, actually all you did was make an assertion that you have countered my assertion, which means you haven't shown anything.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:29 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Ceisiwr said:
No, it shows that there is a gap between productivity and wages. Wages themselves are still set by the market forces of supply and demand. Productivity increases can lead to higher wages than can rise above the market price, but the base wage itself is set by supply and demand. Your tweet does not show that workers in the US are paid less than market value.

Malcolm wrote:
You clearly did not read any of the articles, but focused instead on the tweet.

Ceisiwr said:
I don't need to read it. I'm well aware of the productivity gap in the US and elsewhere.

Malcolm wrote:
well, go back to DWT, dude, because if you can't spend give 5 minutes to reading an article that deconstructs your thesis, what is the point of talking to you?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:28 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Dan74 said:
Ceisiwr, I do agree with you characterisation of many on the Left as intolerant and too quick to adopt "with us or against us" and abuse labels like racist and fascist (in the English-speaking world).

Your going on about Socialism as totalitarian doesn't really make sense to me. Germany had a number of socialist Chancellors, like Willie Brandt and Sweden had Olaf Palme. Socialism essentially prioritises workers owning the means of production and can be implemented in a variety of ways, most of which don't need to resort to totalitarianism or even a big government. So for instance, workers owning shares of the factory they work at and actually receiving dividends. Increases productivity and empowers the workers to actually make decisions. Public companies, Unions, etc are hallmarks of Socialism, why mix it with totalitarianism?

You can see the current form of capitalism fail in so many ways, from the destruction of the environment, to boom-bust cycles, to the race to the bottom on taxes. Any clear-thinking person must see that a change is desperately needed.

Ceisiwr said:
Many of the former socialist countries had appalling environmental records. Short of anprim I don't see how replacing capitalism with an inferior economic system will help the environment.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is true, because they were in a world economy dominated by capitalism and they felt they needed to hasten their industrial development to catch up. For example, China. India, while not a communist country, also has willing damaged its environment in order to keep up in the world Capitalist economy. Capitalism is destroying our environment.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:26 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
Yes. actually it does.
No, it shows that there is a gap between productivity and wages. Wages themselves are still set by the market forces of supply and demand. Productivity increases can lead to higher wages than can rise above the market price, but the base wage itself is set by supply and demand. Your tweet does not show that workers in the US are paid less than market value.

Malcolm wrote:
You clearly did not read any of the articles, but focused instead on the tweet.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:24 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Dan74 said:
Ceisiwr, I do agree with you characterisation of many on the Left as intolerant and too quick to adopt "with us or against us" and abuse labels like racist and fascist (in the English-speaking world).

Your going on about Socialism as totalitarian doesn't really make sense to me. Germany had a number of socialist Chancellors, like Willie Brandt and Sweden had Olaf Palme. Socialism essentially prioritises workers owning the means of production and can be implemented in a variety of way, most of which don't need to resort to totalitarianism or even a big government. So for instance, workers owning shares of the factory they work at and actually receiving dividends. Increases productivity and empowers the workers to actually make decisions. Public companies, Unions, etc are hallmarks of Socialism, why mix it with totalitarianism?

Ceisiwr said:
That is social-democracy, which is managed and regulated capitalism. That is not socialism, which aims to replace capitalism.

Malcolm wrote:
Capitalism needs to be replaced. It has been destroying the planet and its people since 1492.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:22 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Ceisiwr said:
Nationalism and Fascism are not the same thing, unless the SNP are Fascist now?

Malcolm wrote:
There is only a Scottish National Party because Scotland is a occupied country. My ancestors were pushed off our land during the Clearings.

Ceisiwr said:
So, not all forms of Nationalism are Fascist.

Malcolm wrote:
SNP is not a nationalist party, per se. They have the name "national" because they are an independence party. The Scots are all communists, or didn't you get that memo?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:18 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Ceisiwr said:
Once again a poor example. True, to be a conservative is to not want things to change. Naturally this can mean an opposition to demographic change. Such opposition isn't inherently Fascist. Of course some go even further and fully switch to being Fascist.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, it pretty much is. Opposition to demographic change is predicated on nationalism. Nationalism is fascism. Period.

Ceisiwr said:
Nationalism and Fascism are not the same thing, unless the SNP are Fascist now?

Malcolm wrote:
There is only a Scottish National Party because Scotland is a occupied country. My ancestors were pushed off our land during the Clearings. British racism towards Highland Scots is an old history.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:17 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
Are we Theravadins then justified in burning all of your sutras, defrocking all of the Mahayana and Vajrayana monks and nuns, closing all of your monasteries and enforcing the teaching of The Way of the Elders as being the only acceptable form of Buddhism?

Malcolm wrote:
You already did that. Shri Lanka, Burma, Thailand, Cambodia, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:15 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Ceisiwr said:
So do explain how a worker is forced to sell his labour below market value. The price of labour is determined by the market forces of supply and demand.

Malcolm wrote:
No, this is false.

https://www.businessinsider.com/supply-and-demand-model-of-labour-markets-is-fundamentally-broken-2018-6

https://www.businessinsider.com/category/inequality-in-britain

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-05/supply-and-demand-does-a-poor-job-of-explaining-depressed-wages



Ceisiwr said:
That does not show that workers are paid less than their market value.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes. actually it does.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:14 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Ceisiwr said:
Once again a poor example. True, to be a conservative is to not want things to change. Naturally this can mean an opposition to demographic change. Such opposition isn't inherently Fascist. Of course some go even further and fully switch to being Fascist.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, it pretty much is. Opposition to demographic change is predicated on nationalism. Nationalism is fascism. Period.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 4:10 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Ceisiwr said:
So do explain how a worker is forced to sell his labour below market value. The price of labour is determined by the market forces of supply and demand.

Malcolm wrote:
No, this is false.

https://www.businessinsider.com/supply-and-demand-model-of-labour-markets-is-fundamentally-broken-2018-6

https://www.businessinsider.com/category/inequality-in-britain

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-05/supply-and-demand-does-a-poor-job-of-explaining-depressed-wages


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 3:58 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
We can already see above from Malcolm how easily it descends into "I dislike this persons politics, therefore they are fascist. This means i am justified in crushing them".

People have no right to suppress the human rights of another human being, even if their politics is distasteful. Of course, given what i've seen, i doubt many of you here would agree with troublesome concepts such as negative human rights. If you do agree then you should be anti-antifa.

Malcolm wrote:
I have no interest in crushing anyone. But there used to be time in this country when someone who even breathed far-right ideologies would be shutdown hard by everyone. Trump's rhetoric has unleashed them. And now the racists and fascists feel very emboldened. And Trump is advocating for intensified police brutality: "It's a movement, and if you don't put it down, it will get worse and worse..." Donald Trump, June 1st, 2020. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/01/us/politics/trump-governors.html Basically, the president has declared war on the people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 3:38 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
Malcolm

Yup, it always boils down to money and class preservation, the planet be damned. Market economies do not have to be "capitalist."
Of course not. A barter system is a market economy. An inferior market economy.

Malcolm wrote:
That is not the only option.



Ceisiwr said:
Yeah, i got out of this cult a long time ago. In the UK, no one is "forced to sell their labour well below market value".

Malcolm wrote:
Oh they definitely are. It is even worse here in the US.

Ceisiwr said:
Are you going to trot out the pathetic labour theory of value for us now?

Malcolm wrote:
You mean the one codified and advanced by Adam Smith? No, there are more modern ways of understanding the complexities of labor's relation to capital and markets, etc. I am not a Marxist, not by any stretch. Marx is outdated, 19th century pseudo-science.

Ceisiwr said:
Also, Trump, whatever his faults, is not a Fascist. Even if he were, he can't do anything about it due to your constitution.

Malcolm wrote:
He most certainly is. The American Constitution is hanging on by a thread. Four more years of that guy, there won't be a constitution.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 3:33 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Ceisiwr said:
Where do you stand when antifa classes conservatives as fascist?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, since you like to cite historical examples, in the 1930's, Conservatives in Britain were largely supportive of fascism in Europe, until they finally understood that Hitler was bent on invading England.

After the war, conservatives founded groups such as Chesterton's League of Empire Loyalists. The remnants of Chesterton's so-called League of Empire Loyalists, a group whose members were predominantly Tories (formed in 1954) eventually merged with British National Party to form the National Front.

Then there is the Monday Club.

So the answer to your question is that with respect to Conservatives, they may not be fascists necessarily, but there sure are a lot of fellow travelers on the right these days ({Putin lovers, etc.), just as there were in Conservative circles in the 1930's. If you have not read it, you need to read "Fellow Travellers of the Right: British Enthusiasts for Naz Germany, 1933-9" where we find out extent to which Conservatives in England were sympathetic to fascism (but only on the Continent, of course): https://www.amazon.com/Fellow-Travellers-Right-Enthusiasts-Paperbacks/dp/0192851160.

So, there is a lot of justification for the charge that conservatives often sympathize with fascists.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 3:12 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


clw_uk said:
That doesn't answer my question. If the leftist person subscribes to socialism, marxist communism, ancom or any other purely anti-capitalist ideology which aims to supplant capitalism with some form of post-capitalist economic system then yes, they are totalitarians.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, it always boils down to money and class preservation, the planet be damned. Market economies do not have to be "capitalist."

Capitalism is not merely an economic system; it is also a system of power relations which depend on owners of capital having more power than those who are forced to sell their labor well below market value. That power is backed up by the State, which according to Conservative ideology, should do nothing more than provide security for markets, property, and national borders (read Nozick's "State, Anarchy, and Utopia" for a detailed intellectual blueprint for how this all works), but little or nothing in terms of environmental, health, and social protection, with the wan hope that the all-knowing market will sort it all out.

clw_uk said:
However even then, at least in the UK, Conservatives don't go around bashing leftists.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh dude, get real. You most certainly do. For example:
I used to be a Communist for 10 years before I did a complete 180 and adopted a near Thatcherite outlook, so i've seen vitiriol from both sides aimed at me for different reasons. The worst i've ever experienced has come from socialists/communists/antifa types. In fact its from my time moving in communist movements as to why im so anti-antifa now. I know how they think. I know that for them the ends will always justify the means, and I know how easily it is for them to completely "other" someone else. To class them as "the enemy", as "the fascist" that needs to be destroyed, when in reality the person just thinks differently to them.
Donald Trump is a fascist. He needs to go. His followers are fascists. They need to be shutdown. Hard.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 2:55 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Toenail said:
Malcolm, the situation of blacks in the US is different than the situation of turks in Germany. Please, you are over simplifying things. I am sympathizing much with black people in America, especially the disadvantaged and also I am seeing systemic racism, with appointed judges etc. The situation in Germany is different. You'd better think more differentiated and rational. You are emotional. Emotions are bad masters, that's why we meditate.

Malcolm wrote:
The historical conditions that led to the presence of Turkish workers in Germany (worker deficits in a burgeoning industrial economy, and so on) are different. But I know Turkish people from Germany, and they do complain about being treated as second class citizens by white Germans. And, son, I am not emotional. I am clear. Got it?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 2:52 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
clw_uk said:
Antifa and white supremacists are both equally awful.

Queequeg said:
No they are not.

clw_uk said:
Yes, they are. It’s even worse with antifa because it sounds like a positive thing, Anti-Fascism. Of course, it ends in hell just the same when you are of an authoritarian and totalitarian mindset and are judge, jury an executioner all in one at the same time. It then becomes easy to simply label an enemy as “fascist”. Once you have done that, it becomes acceptable to crush them. It’s why a Tory like me has had rape and death threats from antifa in the past. It’s even in the history. Antifa in the Weimar Republic spent a lot of its time fighting the Iron Front who, unsurprisingly, they classed as “fascist”.

Malcolm wrote:
Antifaschistische Aktion came into being in July, 1932. Six months later, during the Machtergreifung when the Nazis took power, the Iron Front, Antifaschistische Aktion, etc. all went underground. Antifaschistische Aktion spent most of its time fighting Nazis.

In any case, the KDP had its shots called by Moscow, and if you accept Dan's thesis that success against the Nazis was a result of the Red Army defeating Hitler on the Eastern front, you still would be speaking German if it was not for Antifa.

The American Antifa is generally anarchist in orientation, not Stalinist, like the KDP prior to WWII. It is not the same organization as Antifaschistische Aktion, even though they may have borrowed the flag. Antifa in the US have also borrowed the three arrows logo of the Iron Front.

I don't know about Antifa in Britain, but in the US, they played a significant role in fighting the Alt-right and protecting people during Charlottesville:
CORNEL WEST: The anti-fascists, and then, crucial, the anarchists, because they saved our lives, actually. We would have been completely crushed, and I’ll never forget that. Meaning what? Meaning that you had the police holding back, on the one hand, so we couldn’t even get arrested. We were there to get arrested. We couldn’t get arrested, because the police had pulled back, and just allowing fellow citizens to go at each other, you see, and with all of the consequences that would follow therefrom.

So, in that sense, you know, I think what we’re really seeing, though, Sister Amy, is the American empire in decay, with the rule of big money, with massive militarism, facilitated by the scapegoating of the most vulnerable, of immigrants, Muslims, Jews, Arabs, gay, lesbians, trans and bisexuals, and black folk. The white supremacy was so intense. I’ve never seen that kind of hatred in my life. We stood there, and nine units went by, and looking right in our eyes. And they’re cussing me out, and so forth and so on. They’re lucky I didn’t lose my holy ghost, to tell you the truth, because I wanted to start swinging myself. I’m a Christian, but not a pacifist, you know. But I held back. But that kind of hatred—but that is just the theater. It’s big money. It’s big military. And it’s the way in which this capitalist civilization is leading us toward unbelievable darkness and bleakness. And the beautiful thing is the fightback. It was a beautiful thing to see all the people coming back. But they had more fascists than anarchists, more fascists than fightback.
https://www.democracynow.org/2017/8/14/cornel_west_rev_toni_blackmon_clergy

There is also a tendency to conflate Black Bloc with Antifa. Black Bloc is a protest strategy, not an ideology. They are not the same. Right now, Antifa has become the Right's boogieman. It is nonsense of course. These days, any time there is looting or property damage as a consequence of a riot caused by police violence, the instinct of the Right is immediately label this as Antifa violence. That is nonsense, for example the retweet that was posted from a Trump cultist above.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 1:57 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
clw_uk said:
Antifa and white supremacists are both equally awful. Anyone caught rioting, be they left wing or right wing, should be arrested and prosecuted.

Malcolm wrote:
Definitely not. Antifa saved your ass in WWII. Without Antifa, you'd be speaking German.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 1:24 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
If you knew this place, then this would be easy to understand.

If it was not Mr. Floyd, it would have been another black man killed by the police in some depraved way and caught on film. Maybe next week, or next month, or next year. This is why this is so outrageous. This is why people are so angry. Because we can be 100% certain that some black man will be killed by police officers acting without regard for him as a human being in the near future. This is daily life in America.

Bundokji said:
As you said, i don't know, so if you are a US citizen, you are a more reliable source of information than myself.

But i still think that if racism is so systematic in the US, surely there have been other reported incidents. I am trying to think of other contributing factors. Just earlier today, i read on the BBC how the streets are filled with protestors after weeks of lockdown. It occurred to me that possibly lockdown stress might have had an influence on people's behavior this time, among other things.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it means that people have free time to make known their grievances, when at other times, they could not get time off of work to hit the streets. Can you imagine going to your boss at Taco Bell or Walmart and saying, "I need tomorrow off to protest another murder of a black person by a member of the police"? Your boss would laugh in your face and tell you that you have a choice, report to work or be fired. This happens with voting too. People are forced to choose between working and voting all the time in the US, not to mention to systematic voter suppression, which even Trump admits is so effective that without it no Republican would ever hold office in the US again:

“The things they had in there were crazy. They had things, levels of voting that if you’d ever agreed to it, you’d never have a Republican elected in this country again."
Donald Trump, March 30th, 2020, Fox and Friends interview.

And this has been going on for 40 years, and more:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 1:04 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Bundokji said:
I try to refrain from commenting on the riots in the US due to my lack of knowledge of how bad or legitimate racial tension in the US is. However, the
It is not easy to understand how the death of George Floyd ignited all this chaos! What would have happened if he did not die? another normal day i guess?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, when there is a drought, all it takes is a spark to start a prairie fire.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020 at 1:01 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



tkp67 said:
sad state of affairs

Malcolm wrote:
No evidence that these people breaking the window are "Antifa." Sorry, this is just a bunch of right-wing bullshit.

tkp67 said:
Who said they are antifa?

Malcolm wrote:
Did you actually read the retweet you posted?

"Protestors begging Antifa to stop. Their protests have been hijacked."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 10:26 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



tkp67 said:
sad state of affairs

Malcolm wrote:
No evidence that these people breaking the window are "Antifa." Sorry, this is just a bunch of right-wing bullshit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 10:24 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
Dan, yeah. There's just so much wrong with your comments even as I get your overall point.

I really don't think you (in Europe/Aus) can ever really understand what is happening here if you have not lived here and breathed it.

Malcolm wrote:
The “why can’t we all just get along” refrain is pretty weak.

Dan74 said:
If that's all that's all you reduce it to, then it is. Kinda self-confirming reasoning  like all strawmen.

Malcolm wrote:
Its the white moderate response King was talking about.

Dan74 said:
Dig into your own privilege as a well-educated middle-class urbanite, dig into your assumptions, look around. The proletariat is on the other side. How did that happen?

Malcolm wrote:
Dan, one, I am not an urbanite. I live in the country, surrounded by cornfields, in the poorest county in Massachusetts amid failed farms, which are a result of GOP changes in the 1970's to Roosevelt-era farm policies. Two, as a white person living in America, I understand my privilege far better than you.


Dan74 said:
The tragic thing for me to see is not just the brutality by the so-called law enforcement, but that rather than directing the anger at those who foster and fan the divisions in your society between all the oppressed communities, whether due to colour, geography, bank account or profession, people are still fighting each other, rather than uniting and changing the system that exploits them, treats them like commodity and sows poisonous hatred between them.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, that is why we are trying get the GOP out of power, because they have become the party of racial hatred and fear, led by a racist president and a cabinet of racist white men. And in fact, these protests are not all blacks. There are equal numbers of young whites, blacks, and latinos protesting, and bravely suffering violent provocations and attacks by the police. It is not the protestors who started the violence in Minneapolis, it was the police. Here is an eyewitness account by a member of the Minneapolis City Council:
In Minneapolis, businesses have been burned and looted and the National Guard has been called in to help restore order. But a member of the City Council, Jeremiah Ellison, summed up the situation this way: The police started it.

“No one was looting anything in the first night of this protest, no one was lighting anything on fire on the first night of this protest, and yet the response from the police was incredibly brutal,” he said. “The original provocation to street violence was from our officers.”

On the day after Mr. Floyd died, Mr. Ellison gathered with others at the site where Mr. Floyd was detained and walked with them to a nearby police precinct, he said. The crowd was relatively peaceful, he said, but the officers sprayed tear gas. Once the marchers reached the precinct, tensions grew, but in Mr. Ellison’s view the police overreacted.

“One of the city’s employees has just murdered someone in the most brutal fashion,” he said, “and for you to then pretend like you’re the victim and you’re under siege, to fire mace and tear gas and rubber bullets in response to water bottles being thrown — you have at that point 100 percent antagonized the situation.”
And we have seen this in city after city, where the police attack peaceful protestors, and then of course you have seen the aftermath of the violence. Combine this with a inept pandemic response by an incompetent, racist president, throwing millions of out of work, and you have a lot of people who do not know where their next check is going to come from. But all the GOP gives a shit about is making sure that capitalists who exploit people for wages have their property protected.

What you don't understand is that Trump removed dissent decrees imposed by the Holder Justice department all over the country. This is why the police love Trump. He caters to their worst instincts.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/29/us/politics/justice-department-civil-rights-george-floyd.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/31/us/police-tactics-floyd-protests.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 9:35 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
Dan, yeah. There's just so much wrong with your comments even as I get your overall point.

I really don't think you (in Europe/Aus) can ever really understand what is happening here if you have not lived here and breathed it.

Malcolm wrote:
The “why can’t we all just get along” refrain is pretty weak.

The police have been initiating violence against peaceful protestors for a week.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 9:22 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
One of the more tone deaf posts you made.



Dan74 said:
It is a beautiful letter and like all writings it can and does get misapplied and misinterpreted. Sadly it seems, it's become something of a rallying cry of a blowhard with no actual interest in addressing root causes, but plenty of fire for vilifying all who don't dance to the same tune. An automatic response trotted out to anyone who calls for understanding of 'the other side', in the spirit of The Art of War that exhorts us to know our enemy. In the battlefield of ideas, to try to actually understand where 'the other side' is coming from is now seen as a weakness, while slogging some dickhead with a white pride banner in the head, a badge of honour. This is not how wars are won. And not to mention the very basic humanist understanding of the banality of evil and that nothing that is human can possibly be alien to any of us. And when one starts talking about the systemic oppression of groups other than the people of colour, then one truly belongs in the basket of deplorables. It has just become so black-and-white, hasn't it? The battle lines have been drawn, take your place in the trenches and fire!

It appears that the great US of A is hellbent on fighting wars. On drugs, on terrorism, on racism, the martial mentality is too hard to overcome. Identify the enemy and shoot. Works in Rambo movies..
And who appointed you the arbiter of tone, Malcolm?

There is one thing that you don't lack and that's a sense of conviction. Like being sure that it was premeditated because 'you had a feeling'. Regardless of your noble motives, disregard for facts makes one a zealot. And zealotry is not going to bring about a healing of your divided community.

Malcolm wrote:
I never said that Floyd’s murder was premeditated. I said that it is impossible the two men did not know each other. So, you ought to get your facts straight.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 9:13 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
One of the more tone deaf posts you’ve made.

http://okra.stanford.edu/transcription/document_images/undecided/630416-019.pdf

Queequeg said:
Letter from a Birmingham Jail - that link to the actual document. Very neat.

One of the greatest documents in US history setting out what it ought to mean to be American.

Dan74 said:
It is a beautiful letter and like all writings it can and does get misapplied and misinterpreted. Sadly it seems, it's become something of a rallying cry of a blowhard with no actual interest in addressing root causes, but plenty of fire for vilifying all who don't dance to the same tune. An automatic response trotted out to anyone who calls for understanding of 'the other side', in the spirit of The Art of War that exhorts us to know our enemy. In the battlefield of ideas, to try to actually understand where 'the other side' is coming from is now seen as a weakness, while slogging some dickhead with a white pride banner in the head, a badge of honour. This is not how wars are won. And not to mention the very basic humanist understanding of the banality of evil and that nothing that is human can possibly be alien to any of us. And when one starts talking about the systemic oppression of groups other than the people of colour, then one truly belongs in the basket of deplorables. It has just become so black-and-white, hasn't it? The battle lines have been drawn, take your place in the trenches and fire!

It appears that the great US of A is hellbent on fighting wars. On drugs, on terrorism, on racism, the martial mentality is too hard to overcome. Identify the enemy and shoot. Works in Rambo movies..


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 6:25 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
They are nomads. They don't live according to your social rules. Why should they?

Manjushri said:
I don't don't think I said that they should, at any point at all. I merely referred some reasons why integration has not succeed yet.

I have never been disrespectful to you during this whole conversation and honestly don't see the reason for such bellicose replies and accusations that you have branded me, but I wish you peace and welfare nonetheless.

I hope only that people understand that asserting gross generalizations do not work at any level in problem solving when it comes to such issues. Saying that "white people are generally racist, even if they don't openly display it", in my head sounds similar to the xenophobic discourse of the anti-pluralism bigots that say that "in general all muslims are fundamentalists or extremists that only appear moderate on the surface". I believe that if the system is to be changed by addressing the issues in public discussion, a different kind of discourse (i.e. more nuanced/balanced), is of the utmost importance.

Malcolm wrote:
I haven’t accused you of anything. But I do think you don’t see your own privilege and fail to see how as a privileged white person your very position in the world, like mine, depends on a set of economic relations that are racist and exploitative. And the rise of nationalist sentiment in Europe is most definitely racist. That’s just a fact.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 12:32 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/05/george-floyd-protests-police-violence.html:
Police Erupt in Violence Nationwide

The ongoing protests following the killing of George Floyd were caught up in violence again on Saturday, as police all over the country tear-gassed protesters, drove vehicles through crowds, opened fire with nonlethal rounds on journalists or people on their own property, and in at least one instance, pushed over an elderly man who was walking away with a cane. Here are some of the ways law enforcement officers escalated the national unrest.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, June 1st, 2020 at 12:28 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Grigoris said:
101198789_10158246477519793_5261699829431533568_n.jpg

Malcolm wrote:
Correct. All these "moderates" are quoting MLK incorrectly, in exactly the way MLK said that white moderates were the most harmful to civil rights:

First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a “more convenient season.” Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.
http://okra.stanford.edu/transcription/document_images/undecided/630416-019.pdf


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:41 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Last night a cop in NYC flashed the white power sign and sniggered:

Queequeg said:
That guy needs to be fired, now. But at least he offers confirmation of what people are saying about NYPD.

Malcolm wrote:
You can find several videos of NYC cops flashing white power signs at protestors. Here is another:




In MN, you see this:



A lot of fascists in these crowds.

M


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:29 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Has to be seen to be believed:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:18 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Then there was this, which is being spun by the right wing media as an assault on an innocent white guy...but not so.



It apparently has to be viewed on twitter.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:11 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
They might let in pattern evidence.

Malcolm wrote:
Laura Coates (a former federal prosector on CNN) opined that pattern evidence is hard to prove in these cases, because the patterns have to match precisely, which is the usual defense of these cops, that pattern evidence can't be shown. She was saying that standard which had to be met was absurdly high in these cases.

Queequeg said:
That's because it has to be a pattern.

The issue is that each situation is unique, and if you're trying to establish that, for instance, a cop has violent tendencies, you have to rule out the possibility that this cop just happens, by chance, to find themselves in violent confrontations over the course of a 20 year career. So for instance, and this is just imaginary for illustrative purposes, in year three of his career, he responds to a domestic violence call and confronts a psychotic man, and using a choke hold to to subdue him while grappling. In year 11, he uses a choke hold to get an assailant off a fellow cop. And now something like this. A 20 year career, and we have these three incidents. Is that a pattern? No.

Now, say, he has a stack of complaints against him, of all sorts, of excessive force. Now we might be getting somewhere, but that evidence might well be limited. Prosecutor might not be allowed to present more than the vaguest evidence because the defendant should be tried for this alleged crime, not his record. Did the cop in this instance, have the intent to murder Mr. Floyd? Its not clear that past incidents will offer any real insight and instead just raise the prejudice against him for his character.

Malice aforethought is really hard to establish for these and a host of reasons.

Practically speaking, each of those prior incidents would basically have to be tried to establish that they fit a pattern applicable here. Its just too tenuous to present to a jury and presents too much possible prejudice.

If this were a civilian defendant, if things are done by the book, such evidence would not be admissible there either. Consider a defendant who has a rap sheet five pages long for a bunch of petty crimes, and then he's accused of felony murder (homicide while committing a separate felony like armed robbery). The prosecutor is going to want to present that record because they want to paint the guy as a bad guy. Is that fair for the defendant? Maybe there's the argument that he could flip that evidence, saying, "I'm a petty thief. I shop lift, and steal car radios. I have a drug problem. I don't do armed robbery." Too much prejudice, and if the judge is fair, they would agree.

Malcolm wrote:
I understand the issue. In most cases the police are granted immunity for what would otherwise be crimes, as long as they are committed in the commission of their duty. Simple example, speeding 100 miles an hour down a highway to respond to a call, accidentally running an old lady off the road. Anyone else would go to jail. Just a day's work for the police.

Last night a cop in NYC flashed the white power sign and sniggered:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:02 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Fa Dao said:
Ive had that for quite a while...was just hoping there might be something more out there and figured if there was you would know about it....

Malcolm wrote:
Eventually I will publish something.

Fa Dao said:
Hopefully sooner rather than later...neither of us is getting any younger, right? Would be nice if you could focus on actual practice texts/commentary related to Vajra Bridge. IMO Semde doesn't have enough in the way of actual practice that leads to Rainbow body and Upadesa is too advanced for most people..myself included. Longde on the other hand strikes a nice balance that most people can get something from it......

Malcolm wrote:
The Longsal Longde commentary has absolutely everything you need to know in order to practice successfully.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:53 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
Dorje Legpa is not a rgyal po, he is a ma sang, one of the seven ma sang brothers, not Mongolian at all.

cloudburst said:
Isnt it true that some traditions regard Dorje legpa as and enlightened being, others and a worldly entity? Some Nyingma traditions hold DL to be an enlightened protector, no?

Crazywisdom said:
I like Dorje Legpa as sort 9f the patron saint of pro gamblers which is what I am now.

Malcolm wrote:
The Ma sang are credited with inventing Pagchen, the "Great Game," a sort of Tibetan version of dominoes, popular in the Dzogchen Community. I played the Boss a couple of times. It was intense. He yelled at me once because he could not read my face, "Don't be indifferent" he said. He liked to win, and when he did not win, he would get very annoyed.

http://web.archive.org/web/20081205061947/http://www.ssi-austria.at/bagchen-regeln.htm

https://www.pagat.com/tile/cdom/bagchen.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:45 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Minobu said:
what kind of police force has other officers hanging around and not enforcing the law , and putting a blind eye to murder in broad daylight.

what kinda cops were those that never reported what was happening till iphone coverage comes out..actually still kept their mouths shut.

fire the whole lot and bring in new ones..not going to happen

we got bad cops up here and it's the same deal...

Up here the cops are the only public service that consistently gets away with murder and brutality..

A policeman  shot and killed a kid on an empty street car holding a pocket knife....he got like 6 months or something..

I got strangled at 3 AM  for walking home ...told that i was not wanted on their streets and i was not even known in police anything..

the guy strangled me cause i did not answer my name fast enough...i woke up the next day with the full imprint of his hand on my neck.

i'm white and he looked like something out of Bum Fck  Alberta ..

Malcolm wrote:
Are you French Canadian? The reason I ask is that one of the most racist books I ever read was Anne of Greene Gables.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:34 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
DNS said:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/29/us/minneapolis-george-floyd-friday/index.html

The police officer who cut off the airway to Mr. Floyd is charged with only 3rd degree murder.

I'm not an attorney, but from what I know from studying some law, First Degree is for pre-meditated murder; Second Degree is for voluntary manslaughter; and Third Degree is for involuntary manslaughter like accidents.

It sounds like it should have been Second Degree murder.

Malcolm wrote:
Charges can always be elevated. Often, in this kind of case, this is the easiest charge to get an immediate warrant for.

Crazywisdom said:
This video is one of the worst ever seen. They can get any warrrant they want. No judge is going to refuse to sign...

Malcolm wrote:
Maybe, but Laura Coates also made this point.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:33 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:


Queequeg said:
You're assuming too much at this point about prior interactions and that a jury would interpret that video the way you do.

Malcolm wrote:
As I said before, it is impossible these two men did not know each other. They worked in the same nightclub.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:30 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
They might let in pattern evidence.

Malcolm wrote:
Laura Coates (a former federal prosector on CNN) opined that pattern evidence is hard to prove in these cases, because the patterns have to match precisely, which is the usual defense of these cops, that pattern evidence can't be shown. She was saying that standard which had to be met was absurdly high in these cases.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:28 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Tlalok said:
They're not gunning down (as many) black people in the streets, but they're still hideously racist societies.

Malcolm wrote:
They are mainly freaked out about Muslims. Nice play Putin.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:26 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Manjushri said:
I don't know how well are you acquainted with Gypsies, so you may not know, but they are culturally very rich and unique, proud people. Like all people, they can be extremely friendly, fun and joyful. However, their cultural idiosyncrasies unfortunately are bound to clash with some Western values. A very strong patriarchal system, early and forced marriages, unwillingness to allow higher educations studies, unwillingness to allow marriages outside their social group, whether forcefully imposed by family or taken as granted as traditional principles with long history, all of these have the tendency to create some friction within the Western societies in which they live in. In many cases this explains their isolationist behavior which is not rooted in racism. Hope this clarified any possible misunderstandings.

Malcolm wrote:
They are nomads. They don't live according to your rules. Why should they?

Tiago Simões said:
To be fair most modern roma aren't nomadic.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, I am aware. They are like Tibetan nomads in this respect too. Nomads only live in black tents in the summer. They usually have family ties to settled agricultural communities.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:00 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Manjushri said:
I don't know how well are you acquainted with Gypsies, so you may not know, but they are culturally very rich and unique, proud people. Like all people, they can be extremely friendly, fun and joyful. However, their cultural idiosyncrasies unfortunately are bound to clash with some Western values. A very strong patriarchal system, early and forced marriages, unwillingness to allow higher educations studies, unwillingness to allow marriages outside their social group, whether forcefully imposed by family or taken as granted as traditional principles with long history, all of these have the tendency to create some friction within the Western societies in which they live in. In many cases this explains their isolationist behavior which is not rooted in racism. Hope this clarified any possible misunderstandings.

Malcolm wrote:
They are nomads. They don't live according to your social rules. Why should they? One of the functions of the Shengen zone was to allow free movement between European nations. Of course, in a pandemic

We have Roma in the US as well, over a million. There is also racism, or antiziganism as it is called, against them here, of course.

https://www.newsweek.com/tucker-carlson-fox-news-gypsies-trump-immigration-640004

https://www.mediamatters.org/tucker-carlson/conservative-media-outlets-stoke-fears-gypsies-are-coming-america-and-defecating?redirect_source=/research/2017/07/18/conservative-media-outlets-stoke-fears-gypsies-are-coming-america-and-defecating-streets/217302

Anyway, while there are racist Europeans in all European countries, I've met many, questions of white privilege I generally confine to the old colonial powers because the majority of the wealthy of these nations has been stolen from other places.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 8:44 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Manjushri said:
find it curious that you mentioned the Gypsies which unfortunately are a group of people that you perhaps may not know, but make a conscious effort to detach themselves from the society in which they're inserted and welcomed. I can tell you that in my country, Gypsies receive a very generous social support paycheck, own "businesses" yet have tax exemptions, freely make use of all social benefits and services as anyone should, yet fail to abide by social standards by behaving in a privileged manner and even discriminating against other people.

Malcolm wrote:
Beautiful example of racism.

Manjushri said:
Explaining why a group of people which has been (and still is) the subject of systematic attempts at integration that unfortunately didn't succeed is racist?

The point is that, despite the governamental and societal willingness to integrate such group, the fact that it failed isn't due to racism. I don't think that it is that hard to grasp.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it is. The precise, same arguments have been used in the United States to oppress native Americans and black people. The same arguments are used by the Chinese against Tibetan nomads. Trust me, I have heard Europeans, who would shocked that they could be any other welcoming and open-minded, hatefully bitch about the Roma for years. And still have not addressed the fact that Western European civilization (in which I include the Anglosphere) has seized an outlandish share of the world’s resources for hundreds of years. It has also engaged in brutal oppression and genocides in Asia, Africa, the Americas, etc., for hundreds years as well. We are a part of it. We need to recognize this fact and own it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:37 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
Was reading an interesting text about preliminaries and D.I. I took from the commentary that if one completes the preliminaries successfully that in itself is a form of D.I. Since the mind would have been grasped and the natural state will arise and recognized, without need of a introduction. It didn't mention this was in regards to capacity, superior, inferior etc, but still is a gradual approach, still a subtle unification of the two disciplines of maha and Anuyoga. I don't think is appropriate to discuss the ability to self cut through that subtle condition but.... You know it's there, and would still need the transmission from a guru, so it kind of negates itself. Still interesting commentary. I'm wondering if this a wrong view, a wrong approach, and am a little perplexed as to why this would be considered authentic introduction to Ati yoga. Is not my understanding, but always interesting concepts of "self liberation" or "self deception". Is a fine line I guess.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
If you have received introduction, then you have a basis to work with such practices. If you don’t, well you don’t.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:34 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Manjushri said:
find it curious that you mentioned the Gypsies which unfortunately are a group of people that you perhaps may not know, but make a conscious effort to detach themselves from the society in which they're inserted and welcomed. I can tell you that in my country, Gypsies receive a very generous social support paycheck, own "businesses" yet have tax exemptions, freely make use of all social benefits and services as anyone should, yet fail to abide by social standards by behaving in a privileged manner and even discriminating against other people.

Malcolm wrote:
Beautiful example of racism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:32 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Toenail said:
Europeans are not collectively racist. Racism is the belief that one race is superior to another because of their distinctive features. Prejudice etc is not racism. I am not defending racism or prejudice etc, but to declare guilty a whole group of people - whites or Europeans etc - is wrong. Curb your emotions, Malcolm, and stay overseas with your stirring.

Malcolm wrote:
Like Americans, Western Europeans enjoy the spoils of five hundred years of colonial exploitation. Systematic racism is not an emotion or a feeling of hate, it is the systemic denial of opportunity to minorities. Brexit is racist. Orban’s Hungary is racist. The treatment of migrant workers in Spain is racist. The treatment of Turks in Germany...Algerians in a France...migrants in Italy...etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:12 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
One of the shootings is deadly.

Saw your post Malcolm, i'll be right back.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, seven people were shot last night in Louisville as well.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Was it people shooting each other, or were officers involved? The shootings here did not have cops involved, thank god. If that happens, i think all hell will break loose.

Malcolm wrote:
People shooting others. Not police shootings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:11 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
One of the shootings is deadly.

Saw your post Malcolm, i'll be right back.

It doesnt feel like there are good intentions out here, just feels like young people turned on by the chaos. When tear gas was thrown earlier, people were running and smiling.

Malcolm wrote:
Rage is rage. When poor whites and blacks rioted together in the 17th century, they passed the first slave laws. Laws shutting down rights to assembly are coming to a neighborhood near you.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:07 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
One of the shootings is deadly.

Saw your post Malcolm, i'll be right back.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, seven people were shot last night in Louisville as well.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:03 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
These riots, i fear, could have a "backfire" effect. In my city, there are fires everywhere, hotels full of bullet holes, trashed and destroyed restaurants. On the news here, people just came on and said this isnt progressing the cause, and could be having the opposite effect. A lot of business owners around here are very liberal, and they are getting upset all of their stuff is detroyed. Many are black business owners telling people to stop. They just had the chance to re-open their doors, only for destruction.

So, i have the ask, genuinely, how is this progressing the cause? How will destroying businessess, restaurants (many of which are owned by blacks who worked hard to be successful), causing fires in streets, people are injured here, etc. How does this get the police off of anyones back, or keep them from wrongfully killing minorities? Do you think this will backfire and people will say "forget the cause, its not about that now, its just pure destruction"?

Also, does no one care about covid now? These large groups wont help the situation. So, what about that? Do we just ignore the pandemic we are in the middle of? Many people, including the governor of NY, said that going out could equal the death of someone else, so is that irrelevant now?

The black community is already more heavily affected by the virus too, so this cant help that situation.

Malcolm wrote:
These are all valid questions. But I would submit to you that this is happening in every major city in the nation, all at once. This means that this is an explosion of national rage at a racist system. Also, there are millions of people out of work, especially people 18-30, (and unemployment is especially high among minorities right now), who constitute the majority of protestors. Right wing agitators have been stirring shit up everywhere. Of course Barr has tried to paint this as all antifa violence, but that is a lie. That’s not to say there has been not been leftist mayhem as well. Most  of the looting is done by poor people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 11:34 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:



Manjushri said:
The history of the Continent has been studied thoroughly and is perfectly acknowledged in my first post, as you saw.

I nonetheless still fail to see how exploitation and colonialism in the past can act as a proof for a supposed general mindset in the world today.

PS: Perhaps you are conflating two arguments? My gripe was from the beginning, I repeat, with the bewildering assertion that "white people in general are racist".

Malcolm wrote:
Not all suffering is suffering connected with sensations. Not all racism is connected with thoughts and intentions. Societies can be racist, and to the extent one does not recognize and object to it, one is participating in it.

Objecting to this thesis automatically makes one rascist, because the facts are too obvious to refute.

Manjushri said:
Not recognizing and not objecting to racism sure makes one an enabler of it at the very least, quite probably a racist indeed.

But do most white people not recognize and object to racism? The argument still stands, for in no way does one see a generality of white people condoning racism or rejecting it once in sight.

Malcolm wrote:
White people in the US, England, France, Germany, etc., ignore racism they witness everyday.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:49 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:



Manjushri said:
The history of the Continent has been studied thoroughly and is perfectly acknowledged in my first post, as you saw.

I nonetheless still fail to see how exploitation and colonialism in the past can act as a proof for a supposed general mindset in the world today.

PS: Perhaps you are conflating two arguments? My gripe was from the beginning, I repeat, with the bewildering assertion that "white people in general are racist".

Malcolm wrote:
Europeans have been the major exploiter of the world’s resources since 1492 and remain so to this day. That is the very definition of privilege. That exploitation is based on a doctrine of white supremacy, and still is a function of such beliefs, the very laws to protect minorities in European dominated countries are proof of this. If systematic racism was not endemic in all European dominated countries, these laws would not be needed.

Manjushri said:
I understand what you wrote, I agree with you and think it's revolting. I just simply don't see how that proves the assertion that the generality of white people is racist.

People may live in a privileged country whose actual condition derived from despoiling other nations in the past. People may even live in a country that as of today still drains and exploits other countries by the hands of a greedy, unscrupulous, despicable government that acts behind an apparently innocent façade or through private megacompanies and despotic oligarchs. Still, this in no way says or proves anything concerning the thoughts, views and principles of the actual people that live in the country.

Malcolm wrote:
See my immediate reply.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:46 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:





Manjushri said:
Not really sure what you mean by that or how does that tie into the idea of white people being generally racist. Perhaps you will be kind enough to ellaborate?

Malcolm wrote:
Study your own history again, and then factor in the fact that Europe has not come to grips with its own racist past.

Manjushri said:
The history of the Continent has been studied thoroughly and is perfectly acknowledged in my first post, as you saw.

I nonetheless still fail to see how exploitation and colonialism in the past can act as a proof for a supposed general mindset in the world today.

PS: Perhaps you are conflating two arguments? My gripe was from the beginning, I repeat, with the bewildering assertion that "white people in general are racist".

Malcolm wrote:
Not all suffering is suffering connected with sensations. Not all racism is connected with thoughts and intentions. Societies can be racist, and to the extent one does not recognize and object to it, one is participating in it.

Objecting to this thesis automatically makes one rascist, because the facts are too obvious to refute.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:31 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:





Manjushri said:
Not really sure what you mean by that or how does that tie into the idea of white people being generally racist. Perhaps you will be kind enough to ellaborate?

Malcolm wrote:
Study your own history again, and then factor in the fact that Europe has not come to grips with its own racist past.

Manjushri said:
The history of the Continent has been studied thoroughly and is perfectly acknowledged in my first post, as you saw.

I nonetheless still fail to see how exploitation and colonialism in the past can act as a proof for a supposed general mindset in the world today.

PS: Perhaps you are conflating two arguments? My gripe was from the beginning, I repeat, with the bewildering assertion that "white people in general are racist".

Malcolm wrote:
Western Europeans have been the major exploiter of the world’s resources since 1492 and remain so to this day. That is the very definition of privilege. That exploitation is based on a doctrine of white supremacy, and continues to this day as a function of such beliefs. The very laws that protect minorities in Western European dominated countries are proof of that this is so. If systematic racism was not endemic in all Western European dominated countries, these laws would not be needed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:15 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Europeans also have white privilege, man, just look at your countries and their ghettos.
Dude, Europe is white privilege central. Merkel  knows this, which is why she is such a kind-hearted person, even if her austerity policies are a product of technocratic blindness.

Manjushri said:
Not really sure what you mean by that or how does that tie into the idea of white people being generally racist. Perhaps you will be kind enough to ellaborate?

Malcolm wrote:
Study your own history again, and then factor in the fact that Western Europe has not come to grips with its own racist past. The people of all the former Colonial European powers, England, France, Spain, etc., live in countries that remain bastions of white privilege.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:11 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Manjushri said:
I studied (and therefore lived) in Britan, England to be more precise, for three years. Not once did I come across an instance of racism, nor did I meet individuals with intolerant or xenophobic views. In fact, I was pleasantly surprised to find how welcoming and sympathetic, kind and interested people were towards the others, independent of their skin colour, language or culture. Hence why the post above has taken me aback.

Queequeg said:
I don't know what your exact experience was, but in my experience, when studying abroad, you're in an enlightened bubble. You're not working and interacting on a daily basis with people, and don't often have occasion to meet and interact with regular people. You probably never end up in the marginalized parts of town. The experience you do have outside of the school bubble will be shallow and passing. Its a nice, extended bit of tourism. You don't actually live in those places.

Manjushri said:
Well, perhaps to an extent, but I can tell you that during those three years I held three different jobs, one at a Poundland shop, another at a hospital and another at a Sports Direct shop. As you may guess, all these three workplaces provide plenty of various experiences and allow one to come across all sorts of personalities and social types of all ages. I also befriended people of all strata and visited, dined and slept in homes in the outskirts and "less fancy" parts of the city I lived in.

The only less pleasant experience I had was when walking back home after a night out, me and a couple of passersby had to take refuge in a kebab shop because a fight broke out on the street between two groups of young people. Don't know if it was a "turf brawl" or whatever, but it was an altercation between Middle-Eastern looking young lads that went sour out of the blue.

Malcolm wrote:
Dude, Europe is white privilege central. Merkel  knows this, which is why she is such a kind-hearted person, even if her austerity policies are a product of technocratic blindness. And, I’ve met met many racist and anti-Semitic Europeans. Alternative for Germany, the French National Front, Orban’s Hungary, etc., all prove this. The E.U. has also failed. You Judy don’t know it yet.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:08 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Manjushri said:
...
I come from a European country that has a dark history of colonialism, exploitation and slavery. However, I have studied abroad for some years and travelled through most of Europe (and other places around the globe), and I must say that neither in my homeland nor abroad, in the thousands of people that have entered (and left) my life, I have ever met anyone with those views or similar ones. I wonder what makes one expound an incredibly controversial statement like that with such certainty?

justsit said:
Just curious - how much of the time you spent in the US involved discussion of the American civil war and its enduring legacy? Or the Civil Rights movement of the 1960's?

Manjushri said:
I didn't spend much time at the US to be honest, and I may have only standard knowledge or not be aware of the profound complexity of the themes you mentioned in detail, but that's not really the point, is it? I acknowledged from the beginning the history of exploitation and prejudice from colonial powers (and the USA) and their peoples in past times. What I find a bit confusing is the assertion that white people in general are racist, which certainly doesn't conform with my perception or experience which I described above.

Malcolm wrote:
Europeans also have white privilege, man, just look at your countries and their ghettos.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 10:05 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Living in America is not the same thing as visiting. Our systematic racism is just as obvious as that of Britain, etc. You just have to see it for what it is.

Manjushri said:
I studied (and therefore lived) in Britan, England to be more precise, for three years. Not once did I come across an instance of racism, nor did I meet individuals with intolerant or xenophobic views. In fact, I was pleasantly surprised to find how welcoming and sympathetic, kind and interested people were towards the others, independent of their skin colour, language or culture. Hence why the post above has taken me aback.

DharmaN00b said:
Sounds like you got hoovered into the foreign student areas where the whole local economy is catered for that. The town where I live gets a lot of funding and support from Chinese students although there's a heavy multicultural mix with a high proportion of first second and third generation Pakistani Bangladeshi and Indian.

Whether you travelled further afield, from the intellectual sectors I don't know, but in general the trouble is more in poor areas and not easy to say racist elements involved or not. You may have been aware of extremist cells here too. By that I mean fundies, or groups like the EDL or Britain First. They tend to clash once in while.

EDIT: just saw QQ's post.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh, it’s pretty easy. In rural America you will run across plenty of white people who have no clue how to deal with black people because their innate goodness has been corrupted by a culture that encourages generational racism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 9:58 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You just can’t make this up:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 9:00 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Tlalok said:
White people generally cannot, and will not ever let themselves see black people as other human beings, their entire ego, culture and system of government is predicated on treating black and brown people like cattle.

Manjushri said:
Sorry for the intrusion, but if I may ask, do you genuinely, literally believe this? I must say I find this post a bit baffling (and perhaps even a tad racist or at least prejudiced?), but I'm interested in learning the fundament that supports it.

I come from a European country that has a dark history of colonialism, exploitation and slavery. However, I have studied abroad for some years and travelled through most of Europe (and other places around the globe), and I must say that neither in my homeland nor abroad, in the thousands of people that have entered (and left) my life, I have ever met anyone with those views or similar ones. I wonder what makes one expound an incredibly controversial statement like that with such certainty?

Malcolm wrote:
Living in America is not the same thing as visiting. Our systematic racism is just as obvious as that of Britain, etc. You just have to see it for what it is. In particular, our president does not see black and brown people as human, unless they are kissing his ass. And he regularly posts shit from white supremacists.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 8:57 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Fa Dao said:
Where does the Longde Tantra King of the Infinite Expanse/klong chen rab byams rgyal po'i rgyud fit into this schema? Any idea as to its history etc?

Malcolm wrote:
You should Sten Anspal”s paper on klong sde, it’s about the only literature out there on klong sde.

Fa Dao said:
Ive had that for quite a while...was just hoping there might be something more out there and figured if there was you would know about it....

Malcolm wrote:
Eventually I will publish something.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 8:30 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Danny said:
it would stand since we don't discount the effectiveness of the different streams of Dzogchen into Tibet,

Malcolm wrote:
There are only two streams of Dzogchen transmission in Tibet: kama and terma. On the Buddhist side of things, so-called sems sde and klong sde are kama, long lineage. On the terma side of things, there is man ngag sde, the pinnacle of which is the 17 tantras.

In Bon, on the "kama" side of things there is ZZNG, everything else is terma.

Fa Dao said:
Where does the Longde Tantra King of the Infinite Expanse/klong chen rab byams rgyal po'i rgyud fit into this schema? Any idea as to its history etc?

Malcolm wrote:
You should Sten Anspal”s paper on klong sde, it’s about the only literature out there on klong sde.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:53 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
If the police joined the protestors, like the police chief of Santa Cruz did today, there would be no violence. But as long as the police are seen as symbols of oppression by the black community and act oppressively, which they do, there will never be an end to this.

Rinchen Samphel said:
The only thing that worries me is if the National Guard is deployed, which is possible if these riots get too violent and police are unable to keep it confined. I'd hate to see more lives lost because of protesting a life lost. Im all about the freedom to assemble and free speech, but I get worried when it shows signs of turning violent. Its now happening in my city too.

Malcolm wrote:
Right, cops get to be violent with impunity, but protestors are supposed to be calm and civil. Give me a break.

Fa Dao said:
Bro..seriously...you need to take a step back and take a breath. Starting to sound like you are condoning the violence, looting and rioting as well as blaming all LEO"s for the actions of a few bad apples. Look at it like this..how would it be if all Buddhists were held responsible for the actions of a few Buddhist teachers who have sexually assaulted some of their students? Look man, I get it....this whole thing has really gotten to you..but sometimes its good to take a step back and clear your head a bit...know what I mean? No judgement here..we all have our demons to deal with, right?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:14 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:



Nemo said:
Actually it does. As I posted earlier. The window is Oct 6 to 11th.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6884792-MACE-E-PAI-COVID-19-ANALYSIS-Redacted.html?fbclid=IwAR21EkFOEEpu8RmtGvjD0fwD5hpS2l5Z8pOTSdQfHIsGxBjzdavkfN8FIcU

Malcolm wrote:
There is no information about where he was infected. He was not a lab worker at the Wuhan lab.

Nemo said:
Serious shit went down at the WiV in early October. The entire area was locked down. A postdoc disappeared and she was scubbed from the website. I think she is patient zero. I can dig it all up if you are curious.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, always curious.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 7:06 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Minobu, We won the war of 1812. We also inherited Britain’s former world dominance, cause nukes.



So, while I applaud you for your enthusiasm, the story of American Democracy is much darker than it appears on the surface, sorry to say.

Minobu said:
Yeah well they make damn good movies....

Look at Britain, She drew up all the lines on the planet including yours after you lost the war of 1812.
Then she gives everyone independence but everywhere She drew a line like  British Occupied Iraq.  Instead of dividing amongst the Sunu Shite and the Kurds...


No no no , mister put em all together ,and make trillions  cause they hate each other...we can sell arms , police them, invade them, and re-give them their independence....IT's Kenner It's Fun!!!! Kids...

Look at India, first up make Pakistan and Bangladesh one country and give Kashmir to India...mwuuuuahahahahaha ...

Britain invented the Opium Trade....Yankee Traders got in on it neer end...but hey figured out how to use the money from drugs to fund a plethora of wars and sell arms......
All of the European wars excluding WWWII were a con amongst the aristocracy .

So yeah you can go on about this game...

But out of the muddy swamp the Lotus rises above it and Blossoms.

Thats what your forefathers were...friggin Lotus Blossoms from what ever it is that  causes an immune system to develop.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 5:04 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
Wayfarer said:
within the domain of discourse of comparative religion, ‘the absolute’ has a meaning, but that doesn’t make it easy to define.

Astus said:
The question at hand is about "Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’", and as the term itself was taken from Blofeld's translation, it turned out that Huangbo's records did not actually name anything "The Absolute", but it's rather the translator's choice to render various common Buddhist terms as such. So it's not just that there is no absolute, nobody has even mentioned it before Blofeld.

Wayfarer said:
I think ‘the absolute’ is not a bad candidate for translation of ‘the unconditioned’ (as used in, for instance, the translations in Sutta Central.)  After all, nothing can be ‘partially unconditioned’.

Malcolm wrote:
Uncompounded dharmas are nonexistents by definition.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 4:51 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Nemo said:
Even the CCP has given up on the wet market lie now.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/covid-19-chinas-cdc-says-wuhan-wet-market-was-site-of-superspreader-incident-but-not-outbreaks-source/amp

My track record on Covid predictions is pretty good. Better than any official source. Here is what I think happened.

In 2011 F16, a universal antibody(temporary cure) for all 16 influenza A strains, was discovered. The parent of all influenza A strains was the Spanish Flu. Zoonotic diseases are rare and incredibly dangerous. American interests hired a hot shot virologist in Wuhan to do research much too dangerous to be allowed within the United States. She was to secure multiple SARS type coronaviruses, perform gain of function testing in the lab and then develop a universal antibody for SARS, MERS, etc just like F16. This could theoretically be worth billions dollars. GoF testing began in the Wuhan Institute of virology in 2019. A postdoc got infected because discipline was getting lax at the lab. Because it was kept secret it escaped early containment and the Chinese military took over the institute. The military tried to cover up the cover up leading to the entire world getting infected.

Malcolm wrote:
But your theory does not account for this, which is from the Daily Mail report the National Star report is based upon:
The 'patient zero' - the first person to actually contract COVID-19 in Wuhan - has not been confirmed but authorities believe it may have been a 55-year-old man from Hubei province infected on November 17.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8369085/Wuhan-wet-market-NOT-origin-coronavirus-pandemic.html

Nemo said:
Actually it does. As I posted earlier. The window is Oct 6 to 11th.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6884792-MACE-E-PAI-COVID-19-ANALYSIS-Redacted.html?fbclid=IwAR21EkFOEEpu8RmtGvjD0fwD5hpS2l5Z8pOTSdQfHIsGxBjzdavkfN8FIcU

Malcolm wrote:
There is no information about where he was infected. He was not a lab worker at the Wuhan lab.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 3:06 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Nemo said:
Even the CCP has given up on the wet market lie now.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/covid-19-chinas-cdc-says-wuhan-wet-market-was-site-of-superspreader-incident-but-not-outbreaks-source/amp

My track record on Covid predictions is pretty good. Better than any official source. Here is what I think happened.

In 2011 F16, a universal antibody(temporary cure) for all 16 influenza A strains, was discovered. The parent of all influenza A strains was the Spanish Flu. Zoonotic diseases are rare and incredibly dangerous. American interests hired a hot shot virologist in Wuhan to do research much too dangerous to be allowed within the United States. She was to secure multiple SARS type coronaviruses, perform gain of function testing in the lab and then develop a universal antibody for SARS, MERS, etc just like F16. This could theoretically be worth billions dollars. GoF testing began in the Wuhan Institute of virology in 2019. A postdoc got infected because discipline was getting lax at the lab. Because it was kept secret it escaped early containment and the Chinese military took over the institute. The military tried to cover up the cover up leading to the entire world getting infected.

Malcolm wrote:
But your theory does not account for this, which is from the Daily Mail report the National Star report is based upon:
The 'patient zero' - the first person to actually contract COVID-19 in Wuhan - has not been confirmed but authorities believe it may have been a 55-year-old man from Hubei province infected on November 17.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8369085/Wuhan-wet-market-NOT-origin-coronavirus-pandemic.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:55 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
Dorje Legpa is not a rgyal po, he is a ma sang, one of the seven ma sang brothers, not Mongolian at all.

cloudburst said:
Isnt it true that some traditions regard Dorje legpa as and enlightened being, others and a worldly entity? Some Nyingma traditions hold DL to be an enlightened protector, no?

Malcolm wrote:
Dorleg is a wisdom protector. Beyond samsara.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:49 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:



Rinchen Samphel said:
So thats not corrupt to you? You are sayings people who decide to become a cop and "enforce" white supremacy arnt corrupt? Or are you just trying to score some points with Malcolm by making such a claim with no substance?

Tlalok said:
America is a white supremacist country. America's police are there to enforce white supremacy. Killing, maiming, and imprisoning black people is what they're supposed to do.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Oh yeah, thats why there are no whites, hispanics, etc. anywhere to be found in jail. Because they arnt black, and no cops care about crime. Man, dont worry about even calling 911 (unless, its against someone being black, or else theh wont come.)

Malcolm wrote:
In April of 2019, there were 475,900 blacks in US prisons, 436,500 whites, and 336,500 "Hispanics" in US prisons. Blacks are 12% of the population, Hispanics are 16% percent of the population, and whites are 64% of the population. That means there are six times as many blacks in US prisons than there are whites per 100,000, and double the rate for Hispanics. This article, by the way, has the hopeful title: "The gap between the number of blacks and whites in prison is shrinking":

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/04/30/shrinking-gap-between-number-of-blacks-and-whites-in-prison/

So figure it out. Think there is no justification for claiming that America is a white supremacist country now?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:44 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
How does that mean cops get to be violent...

Malcolm wrote:
The police systematically place their own safety over the safety of others. This is why they kill so many people extrajudicially, and get away with it. All they have to do is say, "I was afraid for my life." Try that as a civilian as see how far that gets you.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Your point is not made, given within the context of what i said. You must be reading something i am not (projecting? Oh shoot, nevermind, we already cleared that up)

Malcolm wrote:
Not every response to you needs to address the point you specifically would like to make, which was, that you hope, quite sincerely I imagine, that more people will not be injured in the days of unrest to come.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:42 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Tlalok said:
The cops aren't corrupt, they're doing exactly what they're supposed to, enforce white supremacy.

The system is working fine, its supposed to do this.

Rinchen Samphel said:
So thats not corrupt to you? You are sayings people who decide to become a cop and "enforce" white supremacy arnt corrupt? Or are you just trying to score some points with Malcolm by making such a claim with no substance?

Malcolm wrote:
He is saying that whoever works for a corrupt system is corrupted.

Dr. West describing the failure of "black faces in high places," as he puts it:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:39 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
How does that mean cops get to be violent...

Malcolm wrote:
The police systematically place their own safety over the safety of others. This is why they kill so many people extrajudicially, and get away with it. All they have to do is say, "I was afraid for my life." Try that as a civilian as see how far that gets you.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 2:35 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
The only thing that worries me is if the National Guard is deployed, which is possible if these riots get too violent and police are unable to keep it confined. I'd hate to see more lives lost because of protesting a life lost. Im all about the freedom to assemble and free speech, but I get worried when it shows signs of turning violent. Its now happening in my city too.

Malcolm wrote:
Right, cops get to be violent with impunity, but protestors are supposed to be calm and civil. Give me a break.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Yeah, thats exactly what i said.... get off your moral high horse so you can adequatly perceive what i am saying: I HOPE NO LIVES ARE LOST. Enough have been lost, the last thing we need are more black lives lost for the sake of protesting black lives already lost. How does that mean cops get to be violent, i dont agree with what the cop did to George Floyd, i dont agree with what happened to Arbery, i dont agree with the black man being killed in my city a couple weeks ago who was found with 15 BULLETS in him. Do i have to completely explain myself like this every time to prevent you from projecting ideas on what i am saying? Give yourself a break, maybe another 1 year break from this site. You just cant seem to handle there are other people with other views.

Malcolm wrote:
I am not projecting anything onto you at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 1:50 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:



Minobu said:
I don't think this sort of thing is helping..

back to what i have been trying to say for weeks now...

until you stop seeing people as either black or white...the knot never gets undone.

everytime a statement like above is voiced...the knot gets tighter.

Biden had an opportunity to speak out about his own subconscious racism and it wasn't on his or his handlers radar even..

It's like Mara is having a field day...

Queequeg said:
Its too far gone for kumbaya.



Minobu said:
this whole it all stems from colonial thinking white supremacy conquer the world and give them Jesus thing is passe..

The point malcolm made is true ...BUT!!!!!

then came the American Revolution and the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and the whole paradigm...

this changed the world paradigm....

Malcolm wrote:
It changed the world for white Americans. It hasn't done much for the rest of the world, quite frankly or minorities in our country.

American freedom for white people has come because America has been kneeling on the neck of the world since WWII. Just look at the long string of fascist dictators we have supported since WWII. Look at the number of struggles for freedom American foreign policy has thrown under the bus since then.

When considering our history in the 19th century, look at the illegal territory grab we made in the aftermath of the Mexican-American war. First, we illegally annexed Texas in 1845, a total Putin move. Then we illegally occupied Santa Fe de Nuevo México after provoking a war with Mexican Troops and forcing them to attack us. We also invaded Alta California and Baja. We even invaded Central Mexico and for a time, captured Mexico City. We basically bought off the Mexican government in the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo for $15 million, and assumed control of the Mexican Cession, supplemented in 1852 by the Gadsden Purchase of S. Arizona, etc. Speaking of James Gadsden, he was also instrumental in the expulsion of the Seminole Tribe in 1823. His grandfather, Christopher Gadsden, was the designer of the Gadsden Flag.

Then came the Spanish-American War, where we took over Puerto Rico, Guam and the Philippines. This lead to the Phillipine-American war. You might recall Trump retelling, with relish, about how Pershing engaged in mass murder of Muslims in the Philippines, having them shot with bullets soaked in pig's blood. It is a false story of course, but it just shows how much of a bigot and a racist that Trump is.

And of course, we do not even need to mention the incredible cruelty with which we have and still do treat native people. America's history is woven in the blood and tears of slavery, genocide, and oppression in the name of White Supremacy. To not understand this is to not understand America.

So, while I applaud you for your enthusiasm, the story of American Democracy is much darker than it appears on the surface, sorry to say.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 1:02 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
I ment pehar not legpa.

Malcolm wrote:
Pehar Gyalpo's origins are far from certain. However, in general, based on traditional accounts, we can understand he first resided in Bengal, later moved to Bhata Hor (the Central Asian Uighur Turks of the Orkhon Uighur Empire (745 – 840)), and thence to Samye. It is important to keep in mind that the Uighur Turks were a) enemies of the Tibetans in the 7-9th centuries, and b) followed Tengrism, Buddhism and Manichaeism, with the last being the official religion of the Bhata Hor from 762 onwards.

A popular tale, which my own teacher told me, was that when Guru Rinpoche was involved in taming the spirits of Tibet, there was a young monk in the audience at Samye who asked Guru Rinpoche what frightened him most. Guru Rinpoche replied "sdig pa." (misdeeds). The next day, Guru Rinpoche encountered a massive scorpion (sdig pa, same spelling, different meaning), at which Guru Rinpoche manifested as the wrathful guru, Guru Drakpo, seized the scorpion by its tail, and threatened to smash its head with his vajra. Given that the Tibetans were at war with the Uighur Turks at this time, this could also be interpreted as symbol of Tibetan martial prowess in Central Asia. But given how little we actually know about


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:44 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Minobu said:
until you stop seeing people as either black or white...the knot never gets undone.

Malcolm wrote:
Sorry man, but this is so wrong under the present circumstances in the US.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:42 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


justsit said:
...said the middle class white man.

Minobu said:
I don't think this sort of thing is helping..

back to what i have been trying to say for weeks now...

until you stop seeing people as either black or white...the knot never gets undone.

everytime a statement like above is voiced...the knot gets tighter.

Biden had an opportunity to speak out about his own subconscious racism and it wasn't on his or his handlers radar even..

It's like Mara is having a field day...

Tlalok said:
Black people have been begging white people to do this for centuries. White people generally cannot, and will not ever let themselves see black people as other human beings, their entire ego, culture and system of government is predicated on treating black and brown people like cattle. It's where disagree with the quote from Dr. King that Malcom posted, a riot isn't the language of the unhead, it's the language of the ignored.

Malcolm wrote:
Unheard is ignored.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:40 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:


Danny said:
it would stand since we don't discount the effectiveness of the different streams of Dzogchen into Tibet,

Malcolm wrote:
There are only two streams of Dzogchen transmission in Tibet: kama and terma. On the Buddhist side of things, so-called sems sde and klong sde are kama, long lineage. On the terma side of things, there is man ngag sde, the pinnacle of which is the 17 tantras.

In Bon, on the "kama" side of things there is ZZNG, everything else is terma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:37 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Danny said:
Sure, there is even Mongolian influence with introduction of Gyalpo dorje legpa,

Malcolm wrote:
Dorje Legpa is not a rgyal po, he is a ma sang, one of the seven ma sang brothers, not Mongolian at all.

Danny said:
possibly it has always been present as a unbroken transmission, of an earlier tradition than Buddhist?

Malcolm wrote:
If you accept Bon claims, sure. I don't.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:35 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Danny said:
I knew the source was garab dorje, but the authorship of the tantra 10th - 14th century?

Malcolm wrote:
The 17 tantras are early eleventh century termas, ca. 1030.

Danny said:
Right, so we can say that there's 3 streams of Dzogchen, Indian (mahasanti), a mix of later Tibetan Shang shung/ indo/Persian influence, and pure Tibetan bon/Buddhist terma traditions.

Have I got that ballpark understanding?

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
While certainly one can find pre-Buddhist Tibetan myths woven into various Buddhist mahayoga,  anuyoga, and atiyoga tantras of the ancient tradition, the influence of Iranian religion on the actual doctrinal content of Dzogchen teachings is minimal at best. The reverse cannot be said of the Bon tradition, where the influence of Indian religion on Bon is overwhelming.

I personally do not believe there is any evidence at all which indicates the ZZNG is pre-Buddhist. This does not mean I discount the teachings of the ZZNG, since they are very interesting and more or less the same in meaning as the Buddhist Dzogchen teachings, using similar language, concepts, anatomy and so on. But the borrowings from the Buddhist tradition are very obvious and cannot be ignored.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:19 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Tlalok said:
White people care more about the destruction of property than they do about black lives.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, but it is has been that way colonial times. Here is a timeline of laws concerning slaves, etc.:

https://www.shsu.edu/~jll004/vabeachcourse_spring09/bacons_rebellion/slavelawincolonialvirginiatimeline.pdf

This one stands out, which seems very similar to the reasoning PeterC mentioned about conditional immunity:
1669: Virginia law enacted: An act about the casuall killing of slaves.

WHEREAS the only law in force for the punishment of refreactory servants (a) resisting their master, mistris or overseer cannot be inflicted upon negroes, nor the obstinacy of many of them by other then violent meanes supprest, Be it enacted and declared by this grand assembly, if any slave resist his master (or othe by his masters order correcting him) and by the extremity of the correction should chance to die, that his death shall not be accompted ffelony, but the master (or that other person appointed by the master to punish him) be acquit from molestation, since it cannot be presumed that prepensed malice (which alone makes murther ffelony) should induce any man to destroy his owne estate.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:14 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:


Fa Dao said:
blaming all LEO"s for the actions of a few bad apples.

mandog said:
I don't really agree. While it may be the case that there are many good cops, there are systemic problems with how policing is done in the United States in general. It is not accurate to describe these systemic problems as "the actions of a few bad apples".

Fa Dao said:
Naw bro..I think there is a very vocal minority on the far right and far left that needs to be addressed. The MSM stokes the shit and sensationalizes a few bad apples making everybody believe that things are worse over the entire country than what they really are. I think the majority of people in the US are just like anybody else in the world..want a good life, family, job, security, freedom etc. Im not saying that things are perfect here..it is samsara after all...just that things are not as bad as the MSM et al would have everybody believe.

Malcolm wrote:
Right, because the news is not supposed to be reported. Get real man. The "media" is not stoking this. Racist cops are stoking this. How? By lynching black men in public with impunity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:06 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:



Dan74 said:
I'd be very interested to hear what you and other Americans who are passionate about this think is the way forward. What measures should be taken to bring about this positive peace that MLK spoke of? I mean the obvious think is a change of culture in the police force, but I mean on a deeper level.

Malcolm wrote:
When there is justice, there will be peace, and not until.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:54 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
The only thing that worries me is if the National Guard is deployed, which is possible if these riots get too violent and police are unable to keep it confined. I'd hate to see more lives lost because of protesting a life lost. Im all about the freedom to assemble and free speech, but I get worried when it shows signs of turning violent. Its now happening in my city too.

Malcolm wrote:
Right, cops get to be violent with impunity, but protestors are supposed to be calm and civil. Give me a break.

Fa Dao said:
Bro..seriously...you need to take a step back and take a breath. Starting to sound like you are condoning the violence, looting and rioting as well as blaming all LEO"s for the actions of a few bad apples. Look at it like this..how would it be if all Buddhists were held responsible for the actions of a few Buddhist teachers who have sexually assaulted some of their students? Look man, I get it....this whole thing has really gotten to you..but sometimes its good to take a step back and clear your head a bit...know what I mean? No judgement here..we all have our demons to deal with, right?

Malcolm wrote:
“Certain conditions continue to exist in our society, which must be condemned as vigorously as we condemn riots. But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation’s summers of riots are caused by our nation’s winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. Social justice and progress are the absolute guarantors of riot prevention” MLK

Nothing has changed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:43 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Danny said:
That would be composed by manjushrimitra and explanatory tantra by the amazing longchenpa?

If memory serves.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
No, they are both teachings of Garab Dorje.

Danny said:
I knew the source was garab dorje, but the authorship of the tantra 10th - 14th century?

Malcolm wrote:
The 17 tantras are early eleventh century termas, ca. 1030.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:16 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
I can't find anything except references to a tv show I don't watch. From what I can glean, it sounds like a conspiracy theory. Illuminati stuff.

Malcolm wrote:
You should watch it. It is very funny.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:10 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
↑ said:
. That distinction belongs to the Sound Tantra, which makes observations similar to the Rangshar, which is the fundamental explanatory tantra of the Great Perfection.

Danny said:
That would be composed by manjushrimitra and explanatory tantra by the amazing longchenpa?

If memory serves.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
No, they are both teachings of Garab Dorje.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:08 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
The only thing that worries me is if the National Guard is deployed, which is possible if these riots get too violent and police are unable to keep it confined. I'd hate to see more lives lost because of protesting a life lost. Im all about the freedom to assemble and free speech, but I get worried when it shows signs of turning violent. Its now happening in my city too.

Malcolm wrote:
Right, cops get to be violent with impunity, but protestors are supposed to be calm and civil. Give me a break.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 12:13 PM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
The 18 sems sde empowerments are the empowerments of the mental focus of a meditator. The various direct introductions one sees used these days are variations on number 2. it is important to understand this point to avoid the fault of claiming that in Dzogchen no formal empowerment is needed. The Rangshar states in chapter 8:
“The faults of not obtaining the empowerment are as follows: In the bardo one is alarmed, panicked, exhausted, impeded, and one can also lose consciousness.

“While one has not yet left the body of traces, migrating beings will not see one as worthy of respect. One’s merit will be small, one’s life short, one’s enjoyments of living will be few, one will be powerless, and many obstacles will occur. Nothing will be accomplished. Those are the faults of not obtaining the empowerment for the conduct of secret mantra. A yogin of secret mantra conduct must first obtain empowerment. If empowerment is not obtained, not even the Buddha will be able to turn the wheel on the stage of a tathāgata. If the wheel cannot be turned, then the nirmāṇakāya will not be able to benefit migrating beings with compassion. Therefore, the empowerment of the conduct of secret mantra must be obtained.”
Therefore, we can understand that the meaning of direct introductions, etc., are the same in meaning as the fourth empowerment, etc.

Danny said:
How do we understand what you posted and what's in the semde kunbyed rgyalpo tantra (although some argue that it is not a tantra because it lacks the 10 subjects or qualities) but......
The non view, meditation, conduct, samaya, initiation, mandala etc of semde?

I'm not following the assertion that empowerments are essential.
Also fault of not obtaining seems out of context, does the quote refer to doubts of having received "something", again this seems like taking the mind as the path.

Thanks
Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Kun byed rgyal po in its entirety is a sustained argument about the nature of the basis, bodhicitta; not the path, rig pa. This why it negates the ten qualifications of the path, since they don’t apply to the basis. Further, the kun byed rgyal po is not the root tantra of the Great Perfection. That distinction belongs to the Sound Tantra, which makes observations similar to the Rangshar, which is the fundamental explanatory tantra of the Great Perfection.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 12:02 PM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
OK, so I did a little more reading on this. I'm not an expert by any means, but I understand it a little better.

Qualified Immunity is a defense against a so-called Section 1983 claim. After the reconstruction amendments were passed, Congress realized they needed a mechanism for their enforcement because it was unlikely that local or state governments would do so. So they created a private, civil claim by which a person could bring a lawsuit, essentially in tort, against officials who violate a person's federal civil rights.

A tort is a private claim, meaning it is a claim that belongs to an injured individual against another party who caused that injury. In the case of 1983 claims, the injury is a violation of civil rights caused by a government official.

1983 claims are civil claims. Civil claims are different than criminal charges. The most obvious difference is that in a civil case a person can seek monetary (money) or equitable (compulsion of certain acts or refraining from acts by a defendant) awards. Criminal charges are brought by the state and most often involve questions of someone's liberty ie. whether they go to prison or not.

There are certain kinds of immunity that apply to officials in criminal cases, but this travesty of qualified immunity is not a defense to a criminal murder charge. It could be a defense to a civil claim for damages under 1983 where the claim concerns the violation of the right not to be killed by the police, for instance.

---

When I learned about civil forfeiture it blew my mind - IIRC a person can have their property taken by the government just for being charged with a crime - they don't even have to be convicted. Its insane.

Malcolm wrote:
Memo 618.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:39 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd Protests
Content:





Rinchen Samphel said:
Stuff is starting to get a little scary. If anyone on this site lives in the cities affected, or choose to join the protests (which I dont think many would recommend), please be as safe as you can. CNN headquarters has been damaged by this as well, just saw a video of people breaking the windows, throwing flash bombs, tear gas, all sorts of stuff. There is a possibility this could unfold in other parts of the country as well. In my state we had a black man recently killed by a cop, and protests where happening here, so far nothing related to this though. Like I said, stay safe, stay updated on whats going on in your city too. Dont want to accidently end up in the middle of a protest.

Malcolm wrote:
Prophetic words from Dr. King: “Certain conditions continue to exist in our society, which must be condemned as vigorously as we condemn riots. But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation’s summers of riots are caused by our nation’s winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. Social justice and progress are the absolute guarantors of riot prevention”

#BLM #FTP


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 11:37 AM
Title: Re: Multicolored Garuda
Content:
Toenail said:
Does this practice of Dzogchen Community come from Kalachakra?

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t recall ChNN ever giving this practice. But generally yes, it is an activity form of Kalacakra.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:51 AM
Title: Re: emptiness of everything (subject and object) is cure for everything?
Content:
Grigoris said:
If emptiness was the cure then all phenomena (including all beings), due to the fact that they lack inherent nature, would be liberated.  But they are not.

spike said:
Buddha nature is the inherent nature which exists in all beings.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, but that really doesn’t mean much. All fire is hot, so what? Buddhanature is just a religious fetish. Like God.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:34 AM
Title: Re: personality views
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You haven’t even a single clue.

Lazy Lubber said:
What "u"? What "you"?

Malcolm wrote:
Don’t be an idiot.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:31 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
PeterC said:
Two observations.

1. One of the reasons police in the US act so irresponsibly is that the qualified immunity jurisprudence has got completely out of control.  The conditions necessary to secure a conviction are increasingly challenging - essentially you need a precedent where a policeman has been convicted for doing exactly the same thing. Reuter’s is running a campaign against this, has done some very good reporting on it, and there are several members of SCOTUS who are keen to tear the whole system up, including Thomas who has written several times that it has absolutely no legal basis at all.

https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-police-immunity-opposition/

Queequeg said:
I'm not familiar with qualified immunity but did a quick search. This is a defense against a civil claim of a violation of civil rights? Its a federal defense? It would not be a defense on the murder charge, would it?

PeterC said:
It is absolutely a defence against a murder charge. It is the legal bedrock of police misconduct.  The worst part is the ‘established precedent’ part of the two-pronged test.  Courts have previously found that a policeman is not liable for murdering someone in their home because there is not an on-point precedent where a court has previously found it impermissible for police to murder someone in their home (as opposed to, say, in their car on on the street).

This sounds crazy, but it’s a fair statement of how the jurisprudence works.

https://www.scotusblog.com/2019/11/symposium-so-what-exactly-are-the-parties-still-fighting-about-in-nysrpa-v-city-of-new-york/

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/05/george-floyd-supreme-court-police-qualified-immunity.html

https://reason.com/2020/05/11/how-supreme-court-doctrine-protects-cops-who-kill-or-otherwise-use-excessive-force/

https://www.unlawfulshield.com/2019/10/supreme-court-may-be-preparing-to-consider-several-major-cases-on-qualified-immunity/

This, followed closely by so-called “civil forfeiture” (where the police steal your assets and you have to prove their innocence to get them back) is probably the most evil legal doctrine currently in force in the US.

Malcolm wrote:
This all represents a failure of moderates to effectively govern. The only rational response to the nascent authoritarianism in this country is a broad-based left wing revolt against the status quo on every issue from civil rights and justice reform, banking, to energy and climate change, immigration, militarism, etc., take your pick.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 10:03 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
PeterC said:
Two observations.

1. One of the reasons police in the US act so irresponsibly is that the qualified immunity jurisprudence has got completely out of control.  The conditions necessary to secure a conviction are increasingly challenging - essentially you need a precedent where a policeman has been convicted for doing exactly the same thing. Reuter’s is running a campaign against this, has done some very good reporting on it, and there are several members of SCOTUS who are keen to tear the whole system up, including Thomas who has written several times that it has absolutely no legal basis at all.

https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-police-immunity-opposition/

Queequeg said:
I'm not familiar with qualified immunity but did a quick search. This is a defense against a civil claim of a violation of civil rights? Its a federal defense? It would not be a defense on the murder charge, would it?




Malcolm wrote:
It’s memo 618 for the police, and yes, even for murder. Laura Coates explained it all very clearly on CNN.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:56 AM
Title: Re: personality views
Content:
confusedlayman said:
Even if u know emptiness of everything, non self and impermanance.. is it possible to still have persoinality views?

Lazy Lubber said:
"u" cannot know emptiness...

Malcolm wrote:
You haven’t even a single clue.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:56 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Grigoris said:
Geez, I wish I knew this before I ordered all four volumes!

Hopefully will be here soon!

Malcolm wrote:
Well, vol. 4 has the most excellent "refutation of the pugala" chapter, chapter 9.


Kunzang Tobgyal said:
Is the Poussin translation the one you recommended Malcolm?

Malcolm wrote:
It’s has its issues, but it is the easiest to obtain.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:54 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:



Queequeg said:
What are you basing this assertion on? I don't think he has made a statement. The owner of the nightclub remarked that they both worked there but on different nights.

I'm not ruling it out, but on what we have so far, premeditation and intent are not going to be proven.

Malcolm wrote:
Dude, all you have to do is look at the smug expression on Chauvin’s face to see it was personal.

Queequeg said:
Intent and premeditation is something wholly different. He's depraved. He's indifferent to Mr. Floyd's life. He's a POS. Premeditation and intent are incredibly difficult elements to establish, especially in a chance encounter like this. They will never get a conviction on the charge. Maybe some more information shakes out that changes my analysis, but as much as I hate to say it, we can't just convict people for being lousy human beings.

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t have any proof, but I know it’s true. In this case, Occam’s Razor.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:42 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Knowing George Floyd. This was personal. 1st degree murder.

Queequeg said:
What are you basing this assertion on? I don't think he has made a statement. The owner of the nightclub remarked that they both worked there but on different nights.

I'm not ruling it out, but on what we have so far, premeditation and intent are not going to be proven.

Malcolm wrote:
Dude, all you have to do is look at the smug expression on Chauvin’s face to see it was personal.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:30 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
To be clear, I'm not trying to minimize the outrageous conduct of these police officers or minimize Mr. Floyd's lost life.

I'm just sharing how this lawyer sizes the case up.

Police need to be trained better at restraining people. There was no need for Mr. Chauvin to keep his knee on Mr. Floyd's neck once he was subdued. He was cuffed, face down, unarmed and there were at least four officers there who could have held him down without choking him to death until more backup arrived.

I don't recommend watching the footage, but what is so distressing to me, that makes me feel angry and hopeless, is the banality of this killing. Its truly horrific.

Malcolm wrote:
There was no need to arrest this man at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:30 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The cop lies.

Queequeg said:
The sky is blue.

What did he lie about?

Malcolm wrote:
Knowing George Floyd. This was personal. 1st degree murder.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:16 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
fckw said:
If you hold on to the dzogchen doctrine, then it can be done in a lifetime.

Grigoris said:
Quite a persistent delusion this one.  Pretty common among Westerners, since they do not believe in countless lifetimes before this one.

fckw said:
While in my previous post I still had taken the view of a gradual path for the sake of speaking in the same context as your argument, if you are serious about dzogchen then you should be trying to take a view of taking the result as the path. In other words, if you keep on insisting on holding on to a view of a gradual path then - according to the view you have taken - you are a practitioner of one of the many gradual vehicles by definition, but not of dzogchen. So, you have to make a choice here.

Also, may I kindly point you to a https://wisdomexperience.org/product/buddhahood-life/ whose title might be of relevance in this context.

Malcolm wrote:
No, if you are a dzogchen practitioner you understand that the state of dzogchen is beyond cause and result and you cultivate that knowledge, integrating in that state as much as possible. But continuing in that knowledge is cultivating a direct perception as Javier very correctly points out.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 9:06 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
It’s much simpler than this: if, when you hear the teachings for the first time, you are immediately free of afflictions, permanently, then you are a nongradualist. If you still experience affliction following introduction, etc., you are a gradualist.


fckw said:
Also, may I kindly point you to a https://wisdomexperience.org/product/buddhahood-life/ whose title might be of relevance in this context.

Grigoris said:
I was hoping that t was a link to a hardcore porno mag, that would have been of more concrete benefit for my instant liberation.

fckw said:
Nah, that would be against forum rules. But I'm sure you can find something using duckduckgo.com. As for your "No True Scotsman" informal logic fallacy, ràsanach, to say the least.
So, you don't take Vimalamitra seriously. That's your own choice again. I did not write that book, Vima did. You can ask Malcolm to get an interpretation of the title, I did not invent it neither.

But to point out the confusion here. There exist 2 common and subsequent pitfalls that you can spot nearly all practitioner fall into. The first one happens relatively early along the path. The second one happens much later on along the path.

The first mistake happens, when a practitioner for the first time gains deeper insights through practice. Typically, this is the moment when unresolved narcissistic tendencies surface. The practitioner walks around with pride and thinks to him- or herself that enlightenment has now be reached. After all, how could the (non-) "experience" be deceiving? This mistake is so gross, it's relatively easy to spot. Some practitioners stop there and it takes years to get rid of it. They walk around and claim that "no practice is necessary". It's typically the moment when your Zen-masters would send you to do a lot of physical work in order to rid yourself of your pride or simply hit you with a stick. The resulting experience that even basic suffering in front of the hard work or shame of having been beaten with a stick has not been eradicated serves often as a kind reminder that enlightenment might not be so easy to gain, after all, despite some initial success along the path. In the best case, this results in a more humble attitude and helps the person to get out of the pitfall of grandiosity.

The second mistake happens much later along the path. It consists of a very subtle clinging to the idea that "it just cannot be so simple". Buddhanature must be somehow "hard to get". After all, years of practice and a lot of work were necessary to get to the stage where one is. It turns out, behind this wrong view is still some narcissistic tendency, although it's much more subtle than the one in the first stage. This is the place where people typically get stuck with the idea that practice must be kept up forever and ever, because there is really a huge amount of karma to get rid of, and after all, all the great masters were going through a lot of work. (At least, according to the stories.) The narcissistic tendency here is, after all, the pride in one's own unworthiness of really and fully having buddhahood at one's own core (figuratively speaking, because in fact, it's the other way round: the all-ground comes first, then the rest follows). So, it implies that the person keeps clinging to his/her own identification 1) with a self as a practitioner and 2) attributed ideas of "not enlightened", "Buddhist practitioner", "must study hard" to this self. These are thus 2 identifications at the same time, the self and its attributions. This is the pride people take in not being a buddha. In other words, the pride they take in claiming to be an "ordinary buddhist practitioner" instead, which equates to: "someone who is more special than everyone else who is not even a practitioner of such an important endeavor as buddhist practice and therefore even more lost than myself". It implies the person is fixated upon a persona ("buddhist practitioner") rather than letting go of this self-definition.
The biggest irony though lies in the fact that such practitioners, when confronted with their refusal to change their view and get out of this much more subtle pitfall, will point one to the mistake #1 as described above. In their confusion they are unable to distinguish between the two types of mistakes or two types of narcissism which are however of an entirely different nature. As they cannot perceive their own mistake of type #2 they mistakenly belief that other practitioners automatically must speak from POV of mistake #1. They interpret the words of people who already got out of pitfall #2 always from the POV of pitfall #1, which is a confusion or a misinterpretation.

Ken Wilber (yuck...) probably would call this a "pre-/trans-fallacy" of some sort. To provide an example from a different tradition: When e.g. Jesus Christ says "I and the Father are one" (short for: "I am God, and God is me") then this obviously does not mean the same as when John Doe says "I am God". Criticizing JC for taking the view of your average John Doe is however missing the point. So, if Vimalamitra says: Buddhahood in this life is possible then criticizing me for simply repeating his words is missing the point in the same way.

To complicate matters even more: although dzogchen takes the view of taking the result onto the path, nowhere does dzogchen state that no practice is required. This is again the same pre-/trans-fallacy at work. Just because someone has taken the dzogchen view of taking the result onto the path does not mean the person has realized everything there is to realize. Taking the dzogchen view is a means of practicing, not a statement of realization. Misunderstanding this point leads to all sorts of confusion, as we can see here in this thread. A practitioner on the level of Vimalamitra who does not commit to mistake #1 nor #2 will hardly talk of the need for formal practice anymore. After all, the identification with mistake #2 has dropped away also. That's why dzogchen is sometimes said to be "effortless".

Yet, as a response to such a statement, typically a person who still is subject to mistake #2 will reject the position that dzogchen is "effortless"! How could anyone claim that practice is "effortless"? Surely the person must be either lazy or deluded, how else could it be? But such a person's position, as I've shown above, is still subject to mistake #2. The person clings to a subtle belief of "unworthiness of actually being a buddha". Once the mistake has been put aside, a person freed of both mistake #1 and #2 will actually neither insist that the practice is hard nor that it is effortless. Instead, the person will simply continue practicing and stating either this or that depending on whichever context is current and whichever audience is present. For both "hard" and "effortless" are just ideas, fixations (negatively spoken), or, to take a more enlightened perspective, such words are just "skillfull means" applied as deemed appropriate. They are not ultimate realities. In the same way the whole idea of a gradual path of practice is not an ultimate reality. How could buddhahood be either gradual or sudden or always-already-the-case or any other concept that our minds may produce? Again, these are just ideas, and it's necessary to drop them. Vimalamitra does address practitioners who are trapped in pitfall #2 - not pitfall #1! - in order to help them out of their trap, stating that "buddhahood in this life is possible" and hence implying that the person should finally accept the dzogchen view of practicing if s/he has not done so yet and drop the narcissism of clinging to the idea of not being worthy of already being a buddha. It's a teaching device to help people along the path, not a statement of ultimate reality.

So: I could equally say that dzogchen is a hard practice that takes a lot of time, i.e. many lifetimes. Or I could say that it's effortless. Or I could even say it's your present state, so don't look further. Honestly, I don't care personally. (Except that I care so much that I just spent like 45 minutes or so on keeping correcting this post to make sure it's not misunderstood in any possible way.) But insisting that it's ONLY one and NOT equally the other (or neither, for that matter), that's clearly a mistake.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:57 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Queequeg said:
An article recounting the time line. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/29/us/derek-chauvin-george-floyd-worked-together.html

The defense will likely argue this was the proper protocol under the training regimen Minneapolis police are required to follow.

Its not going to be an easy conviction.

As for the connection working at the same club - it appears they didn't cross paths.

Malcolm wrote:
The cop lies.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 8:50 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
#BLM #FTP


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 6:09 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Sems sde does not have a complete path since it is devoid of the teachings of the secret and unsurpassed secret cycle of man ngag sde.

florin said:
Yeah. Complete nonsense. Misleading people much ?
Your late teacher says the following:
“In substance, these three phases(The three series) correspond to three aspects of the Dzogchen teaching: "understanding" (rtogs pa), "stabilizing" (brtan pa), and "integrating" (bsre ba). One should not think, however, that the practice of Dzogchen must necessarily start with Semde and end with Mennagde; total realization can also be achieved by practicing only one of the three series, inasmuch as each of them is a path complete in itself. It is simply a matter of understanding which aspect receives greater emphasis in one series rather than another and knowing how to embark on the path that will be most beneficial in terms of one's capacity.”

Malcolm wrote:
Elsewhere, Norbu Rinpoche has emphasized the fact that sems sde cannot be practice in absence of the two stages; so it is a question of capacity, as he indicates. He also said at the Yangti retreat, that people should not remain stuck in klong sde, that they need to move on.

ChNN said lots of things and it is easy to cherry pick this and that.

But the man ngag sde tantras and commentaries are very clear that there are many adherents of sems sde are following a path of mind rather than ye shes. ChNN has also pointed out that no one obtains rainbow body through sems sde alone. So, I stand by my statements.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 5:42 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Queequeg said:
Jake and I have been discussing our interest in studying the Abhidharmakosabhasyam of Vasubandhu (the "Kosa") recently and thought we might give it a shot as a book club here on DW. Seeing that others might have an interest, and hoping to capitalize on the collection of learned members here who might be able to offer input from time to time, we thought it might make for a fruitful effort.

We're going to have it here in the Discovering Mahayana Buddhism subforum so that the thread can be fully moderated, meaning, posts will require approval before they appear in public. We hope that this will keep the discussion focused and maintain a level of quality.

It is a big work, running to four volumes in the English translation (from the French by Poussin). We'll try to keep a certain pace, but this will of course depend on the participants. If it loses steam, well, we'll only have ourselves to blame. We're also anticipating this as an open ended study, so we have no set schedule.

So, with that, how about it Wheelers?

Malcolm wrote:
You only really to study chapters 1-6, which cover suffering (1-2), the cause of suffering (3-4), and the cessastion of suffering (5-6). You don''t really need to study the path (7-8) since we do not practice this path. So the last two chapters are academic only.

Grigoris said:
Geez, I wish I knew this before I ordered all four volumes!

Hopefully will be here soon!

Malcolm wrote:
Well, vol. 4 has the most excellent "refutation of the pugala" chapter, chapter 9.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 5:39 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
People have gained the wrong impression because of an over-emphasis on an apophatic approach.

M

Danny said:
Just pick you up on this point. Dzogchen existed long before nyigma schools, admittedly an origin story wrapped in myth with perhaps a few written key sentences here and there. If however within a framework and system, one can make an argument Where it only works within that framework or system, and again there exists definitions and categories of different types of awakening, thinking of Gampopas lam rim approach to mahamudra etc, much different from Ganges mahamudra of Tilo and Naro for example which was less intellectual and more raw, it's hardly a surprise this wrong impression you speak of wouldn't exist in regards to Dzogchen.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Dzogchen was always a part of secret mantra, and always depended on empowerments for entry. Garab Dorje is involved in more than just Dzogchen tantras, he is the fountainhead of Yamantaka practices and other deity systems.

There is an 11th century Indian text that identifies Shri Simha has part of a school which de-emphasized the need for creation stage. So we have independent confirmation that Dzogchen, or what became Dzogchen, definitely existed in 8th centuruy India.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 5:33 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Queequeg said:
Thanks, M. That's the kind of input we were hoping for.

In terms of the path - is that because its the Sarvastivadin path that is described there?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, hinayāna path.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 5:32 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
I guess the fault that the basis is intellectually understood as this and that would mean one has not recognized the mind, and remedies would still apply?

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Yes. It means one is still in mind, judgements, and discrimination. The basis needs to be experienced in two ways: the reality of the mind has to be confirmed and vidyā needs to be confirmed in a direct perception. Statement one is about the first confirmation, statement two is about the second.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 5:01 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharmakosabhasyam Book Club
Content:
Queequeg said:
Jake and I have been discussing our interest in studying the Abhidharmakosabhasyam of Vasubandhu (the "Kosa") recently and thought we might give it a shot as a book club here on DW. Seeing that others might have an interest, and hoping to capitalize on the collection of learned members here who might be able to offer input from time to time, we thought it might make for a fruitful effort.

We're going to have it here in the Discovering Mahayana Buddhism subforum so that the thread can be fully moderated, meaning, posts will require approval before they appear in public. We hope that this will keep the discussion focused and maintain a level of quality.

It is a big work, running to four volumes in the English translation (from the French by Poussin). We'll try to keep a certain pace, but this will of course depend on the participants. If it loses steam, well, we'll only have ourselves to blame. We're also anticipating this as an open ended study, so we have no set schedule.

So, with that, how about it Wheelers?

Malcolm wrote:
You only really to study chapters 1-6, which cover suffering (1-2), the cause of suffering (3-4), and the cessastion of suffering (5-6). You don''t really need to study the path (7-8) since we do not practice this path. So the last two chapters are academic only.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 4:58 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:



Queequeg said:
I kid.

jake said:
I had a conversation with a 5yr old that was just like that!

Malcolm wrote:
98 percent of all twitter conversations are like that.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 4:53 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
Cheers, I'm unaware of anything other than the lore of mahayoga tantras revealed at Shitavana by dakini karmendrani in relation to padmasambhava. I get your point about the powdered mandala etc but as part of the path of transformation, bskyed rim and rdzogs rim.

Malcolm wrote:
It refers to the colored powdered mandalas of elaborate and unelaborate empowerments of Dzogchen Nyinthig; the unelaborate and very unelaborate empowerments do not have such mandalas.

Danny said:
Maybe Anuyoga as a non gradual extension of mahayoga, that's not clear.

Malcolm wrote:
The empowerments referred to here are Dzogchen empowerments, not the empowerments of the eight lower yanas, however, the empowerments from mahāyoga or anuyoga can stand in for the elaborate empowerment, but not the unelaborate empowerment.

Dzogchen is a complete systems that unifies all the teachings of the nine yānas into one yāna, so nothing is excluded. People have gained the wrong impression because of an over-emphasis on an apophatic approach. And because, frankly, there are many people selling Dzogchen teachings who do not have the qualifications to give these empowerments, which means they are not qualified to give Dzogchen teachings.

M


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 4:22 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
LastLegend said:
It’s personal preference has nothing to do with who is right.

Queequeg said:
Intelligibility is a reasonably objective standard. But sure.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, at least tpk67 has a company.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 4:00 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
When one understands Dzogchen as the basis, then these qualms vanish. Some people need a gradual introduction; others do not.

Danny said:
Agree, my understanding is simply recognizing the basis, semde would be parallel with mahamudra,

Malcolm wrote:
Sems sde does not have a complete path since it is devoid of the teachings of the secret and unsurpassed secret cycle of man ngag sde.That means that sems sde only has an intellectual presentation of the basis. One cannot confirm vidyā in direct perception on the basis of sems sde instruction, one can only confirm the reality of the mind.

However, for someone who has received these instructions, the whole of Dzogchen can even be discerned in mahāyoga tantras such as the Guhyagarbha, Hevajra, and so on, but not without them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 3:52 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
Could we make distinction though between garab dorjes introduction and later padmasambhava mahayoga instructions as non gradual vs gradual Dzogchen?

Malcolm wrote:
No, we cannot. In fact, the Three Phrases are part of the Vima Nyinthig, and typically would only be given after someone had received the four Nyinthig empowerments.

There is a useful distinction in the Mutig Trengwa and the Rig pa Rang shar Tantras: they basically state there are (1) the empowerment of
pristine consciousness for those who understand and (2) the empowerment of colored powders for those who do not understand. The latter tantra further specifies that there are additional empowerments for the former kind of person: (1) the empowerment of the appearances of a sentient being, (2) the empowerment of the mental focus of a meditator, and (3) the twenty-one introductions.

Khenpo Ngachung specifies that the four Nyinthig empowerments are basically an elaborated form of the fourth empowerment.

The 18 sems sde empowerments are the empowerments of the mental focus of a meditator. The various direct introductions one sees used these days are variations on number 2. it is important to understand this point to avoid the fault of claiming that in Dzogchen no formal empowerment is needed. The Rangshar states in chapter 8:
“The faults of not obtaining the empowerment are as follows: In the bardo one is alarmed, panicked, exhausted, impeded, and one can also lose consciousness.

“While one has not yet left the body of traces, migrating beings will not see one as worthy of respect. One’s merit will be small, one’s life short, one’s enjoyments of living will be few, one will be powerless, and many obstacles will occur. Nothing will be accomplished. Those are the faults of not obtaining the empowerment for the conduct of secret mantra. A yogin of secret mantra conduct must first obtain empowerment. If empowerment is not obtained, not even the Buddha will be able to turn the wheel on the stage of a tathāgata. If the wheel cannot be turned, then the nirmāṇakāya will not be able to benefit migrating beings with compassion. Therefore, the empowerment of the conduct of secret mantra must be obtained.”
Therefore, we can understand that the meaning of direct introductions, etc., are the same in meaning as the fourth empowerment, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 3:45 AM
Title: Re: George Floyd
Content:
DNS said:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/29/us/minneapolis-george-floyd-friday/index.html

The police officer who cut off the airway to Mr. Floyd is charged with only 3rd degree murder.

I'm not an attorney, but from what I know from studying some law, First Degree is for pre-meditated murder; Second Degree is for voluntary manslaughter; and Third Degree is for involuntary manslaughter like accidents.

It sounds like it should have been Second Degree murder.

Malcolm wrote:
Charges can always be elevated. Often, in this kind of case, this is the easiest charge to get an immediate warrant for.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 1:26 AM
Title: Re: After Recognition of Nature of Mind...
Content:
Danny said:
I guess it depends on if you view Dzogchen through the lens of the Buddhist sciences, and like the approaches and compartmental stages and empowerments and so on. That's fine. Maybe it's teased out over the centuries as the orthodox way and it's somewhere inherent within and effort is required. I don't know, and not really sure at this point if I'm all that interested.

Malcolm wrote:
When one understands Dzogchen as the basis, then these qualms vanish. Some people need a gradual introduction; others do not. But the measure of the practitioner, whether they use a gradual approach or a nongradual approach, is how often they are distracted from their primordial state a.k.a the basis or not, and thus, how much they are dominated by mind and its attendant karma and afflictions or not.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 1:16 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:



PeterC said:
They know that MLK existed, was black and was a civil rights leader.  I wouldn’t assume their knowledge goes that much deeper.  And as this thread shows, people know what the word ‘racism’ means, but that’s quite different from understanding the reality of it today.

I wouldn’t assume too much.

Malcolm wrote:
I guess I hold people to a higher standard of decency, and when they are found wanting, I am not particularly kind to them.

PeterC said:
I have found that in general, if you hold low expectations of people, you are less likely to be disappointed.  The more time goes by, the less I find myself expecting of people.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh, I don't have high expectations of people at all. Quite the contrary; but I am not at all tolerant of the intolerant, and less so, the older I become.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 12:37 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The US media and education system make it very difficult to really understand the history of racial inequality in the country. We can't take it for granted that people will recognize these issues and its important to explain them objectively and reasonably.
Ummmm, it is have been 50 years since the civil rights movement? Everyone knows who MLK is. Everyone knows what racism is. Come on.

PeterC said:
They know that MLK existed, was black and was a civil rights leader.  I wouldn’t assume their knowledge goes that much deeper.  And as this thread shows, people know what the word ‘racism’ means, but that’s quite different from understanding the reality of it today.

I wouldn’t assume too much.

Malcolm wrote:
I guess I hold people to a higher standard of decency, and when they are found wanting, I am not particularly kind to them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 12:16 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:



Minobu said:
and thank the gods and enlightened ones that when we read it today after being inspired by these words "We the people of the United States...," it includes women, African slaves, Native Americans,

Malcolm wrote:
The point is, Minobu, that the preamble to the constitution still does not include women (ERA anyone?), African Americans (see Thirteenth), and native people.


Minobu said:
yes indeed and very astute of you to elucidate this aspect of where we were as a human race at the forming of the Constitution and the freedom America brought to the world....

but i can't help but look at it from a evolutionary process and what exactly brought these enlightened thoughts to paper.

Because of the words written back then.../.we have this very thread happening today...Blacks and Native , and women can vote now, Blacks are no longer legal chattel , still slaves metaphorically , but free slave...

So what do you think Malcolm am i some kinda Buddhist nut job that sees your revolution as inspired evolution...

............

but back to you Constitution...the words like Dharma Teachings..has an effect in our development .....

Malcolm wrote:
Words of the Declaration of Independence come to mind:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

Then people who are systematically disadvantaged look around and said to themselves, "Why the hell is it that only white people get to pursue Life, Liberty, and Happiness...especially since their life, liberty, and happiness is through their exploitation of us?"

Ideas are powerful things.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 30th, 2020 at 12:12 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
Queequeg said:
Anyway, doesn't matter.

As an exercise for my own edification, to connect Absolute Truth to the nullity of the Absolute and connect Malcolm's comment...

On close examination, Absolute Truth itself is a convention that is empty for the same reason that all conventions are empty. This is the so-called, emptiness of emptiness. Can this even be called a view because "the view" would be a dependent dharma, and where subject and object and all the other dharmas are established as empty, there is nothing but Vimalakirti's silence.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 11:44 PM
Title: Re: Seven line prayer
Content:
Nita-ooi said:
This might be a dumb question, but do i need an empowerment to recite the seven line prayer of Guru Rinpoche?

Malcolm wrote:
Not a dumb question. The is you do not need an empowerment to recite this. Please do. Dedicate the merit. Save the planet.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 11:40 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
PeterC said:
I suspect our friend Rinchen Samphel has checked out at this point, given the tone of the discussion.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, he has been rightfully chided for spewing racist views. Maybe he will be more comfortable over on Dharmawheel Alt right a.k.a Dharmawheel Engaged, with "Seth Rich" and Nicholas Woods.


PeterC said:
However we do need to understand where some white people are coming from when they say they dislike movements like BLM, and it's not always because they have racial bias, it can be due to the experience of their lives. There are a lot of predominantly white communities in the US which are very poor and not particularly pleasant places to live.

Malcolm wrote:
As you know, no one ever got pulled over just because they were a good ol' boy.

PeterC said:
I don't know where RS lives / has lived or what it's like there. But you often come across white folks from places like, say, Kentucky who will look at the BLM movement and think - how bad can it really be for them?  Worse than for me? Why do they need special treatment?  It's important to understand why people might think this. Sure, they're not black, but societal injustice isn't a competition, the fact that other people suffer doesn't negate your suffering. The poor white communities in the US actually have a lot in common with poor black or hispanic communities, in that often the same policies perpetuate the lack of economic opportunity in each - the failure of the education system, the healthcare poverty trap, and so on.

Malcolm wrote:
Nevertheless, most of the complaints are from former Jim Crow states where white people "lost" their special privileges. And they continue to vote their racism in the form of supporting the GOP, even if the same economic policies that harm blacks and latinos harm their own communities. They don't care since they hate minorities more than they love themselves and their families.

PeterC said:
The US media and education system make it very difficult to really understand the history of racial inequality in the country. We can't take it for granted that people will recognize these issues and its important to explain them objectively and reasonably.

Malcolm wrote:
Ummmm, it is have been 50 years since the civil rights movement? Everyone knows who MLK is. Everyone knows what racism is. Come on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 11:33 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:



Minobu said:
and thank the gods and enlightened ones that when we read it today after being inspired by these words "We the people of the United States...," it includes women, African slaves, Native Americans,

Malcolm wrote:
The point is, Minobu, that the preamble to the constitution still does not include women (ERA anyone?), African Americans (see Thirteenth), and native people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 10:17 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:



Queequeg said:
But addressing Malcolm's comment, I think this comment is remarking on the title of the thread without regard for the discussion that followed.

Malcolm wrote:
It doesn't really have to. There is no absolute. If there were an absolute, it would have to be an absolute of being or nonbeing. Negating the absolute is not a commentary on whether the "absolute" is being or nonbeing. Neither predicate applies. So there is no absolute. Since the relative truth cannot be established, the ultimate truth cannot be established. In the end, there is nothing left to say. Hence Vimalakirti's answer.

Queequeg said:
Sure, but in the context of this thread, it was a question about what Huang po, in translation, meant by "Absolute". At the penultimate point, there is an "Absolute Truth". At the ultimate, we sit around without anything to say to each other.


Malcolm wrote:
Nope. The original question was simply:
What is Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’ ?

Is the ‘One Mind’ considered as The Absolute ?  Oneness with the Buddha is Oneness with the Absolute?  or is it that **Everything** is Emptiness of self-being ?
If the reply applies to all Mahayana sects, kindly indicate


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 8:53 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Kim O'Hara said:
This is circulating on social media. I thought I would share it here for those who haven't seen it. Some of you may even like to share it further.


Kim

Malcolm wrote:
Done.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 8:32 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The Tulsa race massacre (also called the Tulsa race riot, the Greenwood Massacre, or the Black Wall Street Massacre) of 1921 took place on May 31 and June 1, 1921, when mobs of white residents attacked black residents and businesses of the Greenwood District in Tulsa, Oklahoma It has been called "the single worst incident of racial violence in American history." The attack, carried out on the ground and from private aircraft, destroyed more than 35 square blocks of the district – at that time the wealthiest black community in the United States, known as "Black Wall Street".

PeterC said:
One might say, bombing black neighborhoods? That was 1921, a long time ago.  But how about 1985, then?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MOVE#1985_bombing

Malcolm wrote:
Indeed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 5:34 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharma for Dummies, er... Yogis
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, I don't agree.

Grigoris said:
Can you think of a simpler introduction?

I can't.

Malcolm wrote:
I think it is very inaccurate and misleading.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 5:33 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharma for Dummies, er... Yogis
Content:
Matt J said:
I appreciate the responses. Abhidharma has been my weakness, even when I was doing a lot of Theravada retreats. I've been a bit inspired by people who read the Bible in 90 days. If you do that, it is only 12 pages a day. I thought I should do something like that. What sort of long, often boring, but necessary text can I break up into bite sized chunks? Abhidharma! But then I thought, well, more concepts is the last thing I need, and you can get lost for days in that stuff.

Looks like the focus is on Mipham. I do have the 4 volumes. I often pull them from the shelf, determined to read them only to put them back. Perhaps in conjunction with some of the commentaries, plus my current aspiration to gain a more developed view of the experience of grasping, I can digest them.

Mind is Buddhist Psychology is good--- simple, not too complicated, a bit more in depth.

Feel free to keep the recommendations coming, I'm sure I'm not the only one who will find this thread useful.


Malcolm wrote:
Avoid the debates, focus on the descriptive material.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 5:32 AM
Title: Re: Why did the Buddha choose not to live of Light?
Content:
cjdevries said:
Giri Bala apparently ate way too much food.  After she married, her mother in law teased her about it.  She resolved that she was going to live without food, so she prayed to God, please send me a guru who will help me to live without food.  One day her guru materialized to her and said he was moved by her request.  He taught her a kria technique, which involved mantra and a rather difficult breathing exercise.  She said the breathing exercise was more difficult than the average person could do.  "No medicine or magic is involved; nothing beyond the kria."

Malcolm wrote:
As I said above.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 5:30 AM
Title: Re: King Gesar - Dharmapala
Content:
Könchok Thrinley said:
Hi,

lately I have been introduced to and gotten lung for the practice od King Gesar as a dharmapala. And quite frankly I don't know much about him and there does not seem to be much on the internet about him (especially when one ignores the shambhala as a source). When did King Gesar first appear as a dharmapala? I know that Mipham discovered a sadhana for him. Is he seen as a standard dharmapala? Was king Gesar even real? I just find it a bit strange that this quite violent warrior from a popular folktale is considered an emanation of Guru Padmasambhava and a dharmapala.

Malcolm wrote:
The first evidence we have of Gesar at all is in a text called Lang Poti Seru (roughly 1450), which sites Gesar in the late 10th to early 12th century as a local chieftain in the Ling region of Eastern Tibet.

The modern day tradition of Gesar as a dharmapāla begins with an 18th century terton, Lha Rig Chen po's Gesar, the King of Vajra Life.

MIpham's terma of Gesar, which is based on the above, has Gesar as guru, yidam, and dharmapāla, as does Khenpo Jikphun's Gesar cycle. I don't know about Namkhai Drime's Gesar cycle. Mipham's cycle is very rich with many texts for divination, Sang, Lungta, etc.

Gesar is very important, for example, the Horse Race ballad conceals a presentation of the Dzogchen path, based on the commentary of Mipham.

Personally, I am quite comfortable with the ambiguity of Gesar. People do not hesitate to propitiate Achi, they also should not hesitate to propitiate Gesar. It can bring nothing but benefit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 3:19 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:



npr said:
Negating it is also a stand.

Queequeg said:
You can't negate something that isn't there in the first place.

If I say "there is no such thing as the horns of a rabbit", all I'm really saying is the horns of a rabbit do not arise.
But addressing Malcolm's comment, I think this comment is remarking on the title of the thread without regard for the discussion that followed.

Malcolm wrote:
It doesn't really have to. There is no absolute. If there were an absolute, it would have to be an absolute of being or nonbeing. Negating the absolute is not a commentary on whether the "absolute" is being or nonbeing. Neither predicate applies. So there is no absolute. Since the relative truth cannot be established, the ultimate truth cannot be established. In the end, there is nothing left to say. Hence Vimalakirti's answer.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 3:16 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
There is no absolute, so how can Zen have a standpoint regarding it?

npr said:
Negating it is also a stand.

Malcolm wrote:
No, for example, when my bank account is empty, and I describe it as such, this is not a stand, this is just a fact.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 2:55 AM
Title: Re: Why did the Buddha choose not to live of Light?
Content:
cjdevries said:
I am looking at Autobiography of a Yogi by Paramahansa Yogananda.  He describes Giri Bala, the saint who lived on ether, air, and sun through a yogic technique given to her by a holy man at age 12.  She never ate again after age 12 years and 4 months.  She said this wasn't designed for everyone; not everyone was meant to go without food and water.  Yogananda asked her why we couldn't teach the yogic technique to everyone and have everyone live off air and sun and she replied something like: that's not the way God wants it.  Everyday people are supposed to eat.  She seemed to imply that this technique was only for ripe practitioners.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, fakirs always have an excuse for everything.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 2:51 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Grigoris said:
I would also recommend you read https://www.pegc.us/archive/Articles/eco_ur-fascism.pdf...

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, everything Ecco describes there, describes Trump to the letter.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 2:42 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
I know about Mandela's early background. His legacy was, however, disavowal of violence and reconciliation.

Malcolm wrote:
Mandela never disavowed violence. In 1990, in Atlanta, at a ceremony to honor MLK, Mandela declared, ""Unlike you, we are still under the grip of white supremacy. Non-violence is a good policy when conditions permit. There are also times when conditions do not permit."

Apart from the fact that he really did not understand what it was like to be black in America, we can see that his position on violence was not merely a simple advocacy of nonviolence. And frankly, neither was Gandhi's.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 1:46 AM
Title: Re: Abhidharma for Dummies, er... Yogis
Content:
Matt J said:
Any good, pithy resources on Abhidharma? Short and practical rather than long and in-depth.

Grigoris said:
Glimpses of Abhidharma by Chogyam Trungpa.

It is a decent enough gateway text.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, I don't agree.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 1:38 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
There is no absolute, so how can Zen have a standpoint regarding it?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 1:33 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
‘There’s an African American man threatening my life.’ Amy Cooper

“In this country, American means white. Everybody else has to hyphenate.” Toni Morrison

"I can't breath." Eric Garner, George Floyd, ???


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 1:12 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Dan74 said:
Perhaps just like the generational poverty afflicting the black communities and driving many to crime, we can start to consider the generational problems with the culture and the roles of law enforcement driving so many to victimise members of society least able to defend themselves.

Malcolm wrote:
What you don't get here is that the generational poverty of black people has been _systematically imposed_ upon them since the failure of Reconstruction, this is but one of the more obvious examples:

The Tulsa race massacre (also called the Tulsa race riot, the Greenwood Massacre, or the Black Wall Street Massacre) of 1921 took place on May 31 and June 1, 1921, when mobs of white residents attacked black residents and businesses of the Greenwood District in Tulsa, Oklahoma It has been called "the single worst incident of racial violence in American history." The attack, carried out on the ground and from private aircraft, destroyed more than 35 square blocks of the district – at that time the wealthiest black community in the United States, known as "Black Wall Street".

..................

About 10,000 black people were left homeless, and property damage amounted to more than $1.5 million in real estate and $750,000 in personal property (equivalent to $32.25 million in 2019).

Many survivors left Tulsa. Black and white residents who stayed in the city were silent for decades about the terror, violence, and losses of this event. The massacre was largely omitted from local, state, and national histories.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 1:02 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
We are all human and one of the greatest gifts is to be able to share and converse freely. So if I have fears and neuroses (who doesnt) I should not live in PC fear of blurting out something stupid. We all do. And hopefully we learn from it.

DharmaN00b said:
Yes, this works very well in an academic setting where we're not supposed to think anything. In the example I presented maybe there was some fishing going on.. probably not the best context to draw any conclusions at all... and if in doubt stop digging. In any case this thread blew up! yikes

Malcolm wrote:
That tends to happen when people defend the indefensible.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 12:54 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Tiago Simões said:
This use of metaphor just proves that the American right wing is obsessed with death and killing. Just a death cult.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, hence the fetishization of guns.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 12:24 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
And now this:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 12:15 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
So their full slogan was "I can breath thanks to NYPD", rather than "I can breath (because I am white)."

Malcolm wrote:
The police in the United States are the principle defenders of our white supremacist order. These two statements amount to the same damn thing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 29th, 2020 at 12:08 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Dan74 said:
My sense is that when the situation is already so toxic and the passions are running hot, what one needs is cool heads. Mandelas and MLK's not Malcolm X's and Faroukhans.

Malcolm wrote:
Mandela was jailed for terrorism. He fought an active armed struggle against Apartheid in SA, he was a communist revolutionary who relied on Che Gueverra's principles of guerilla warfare. He was not a "cooler" head. He was a principal founder of the armed wing of the ANC, uMkhonto we Sizwe (MK), because he decided that nonviolence that had been advocated previously was not working:
Secondly, we felt that without sabotage there would be no way open to the African people to succeed in their struggle against the principle of white supremacy. All lawful modes of expressing opposition to this principle had been closed by legislation, and we were placed in a position in which we had either to accept a permanent state of inferiority, or to defy the Government. We chose to defy the Government. We first broke the law in a way which avoided any recourse to violence; when this form was legislated against, and when the Government resorted to a show of force to crush opposition to its policies, only then did we decide to answer violence with violence.
http://db.nelsonmandela.org/speeches/pub_view.asp?pg=item&ItemID=NMS010


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 11:53 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Fa Dao said:
Agreed! It has become far too commonplace to call somebody a racist, fascist, leftist, nazi, etc etc when one doesn't agree with someone elses views and doesn't even really know the person. The moment the name calling starts, reasoned conversation goes out the window and the person shuts down to any real fact based discussion thereby further entrenching them in their viewpoint. Consequently you end up with tribes at each others throats..not good for any society in any country. No society can sustain that for any length of time and hope to survive. Whats wrong with a little common civility and in some cases simply agreeing to disagree?

Norwegian said:
People however are fascists, far right-wing, and so on if they adhere to certain ideas, hold certain views, and partake in or support certain actions. It's very simple really.

And the idea of "agreeing to disagree" when it comes to matters like human rights, racism, oppression, sexism, protection of the environment, animals, and so on, is laughable. A sort of "there's good people on both sides" take, where one can maturely shake hands and say "Let's agree to disagree" over these issues. Absolutely no. People who are racist and put forth racist views and actions, are a threat to the safety and stability of society. Likewise with people who treat the environment in a destructive manner. And so on. They and the harm they cause should be dealt with.

Dan74 said:
This makes perfect sense.

But what if your own kids express fascist views?

Malcolm wrote:
If you cannot convince them they are deeply mistaken, disown them.

Dan74 said:
If a colleague, who up until now seemed to be a really decent and reasonable fellow, come out with something shocking? Do you slam them down? Or do you hear them out?

Malcolm wrote:
You explain to them how incorrect they are being, and if they refuse to listen, you shun them.

Dan74 said:
You might find out that behind those views is a horrible experience one had never really managed to process. Or perhaps a simple inherited bigotry one never really gave much thought to. There are just so  many possibilities.

Malcolm wrote:
Bigotry through inheritance is not excusable. If someone said to you, "Oh, I am anti-semite because my grandfather was a Nazi," you do not tolerate this.

Dan74 said:
One of my colleagues is black, born and raised here in Switzerland and she has some amazing stories, ranging from nasty to facepalm. Once one of her kids came home from kinder looking a bit serious. So after some quizzing, he told her that they had a clown come and the clown, when needing a member of the audience, called out to him as 'the chocolate-coloured kid in the back'. As the only black kid in the group, he was made understandably uncomfortable and she tried to speak with the kinder staff and the clown and explain how that felt. She didn't raise a ruckus and demand that the clown be fired, she just wanted to tell her story. Mind you, she grew up in much more racist times in what was a 99.99% white city. That of course colours not only the way you are seen but the way you see how you are being seen.. It's tricky. The clown was not being a bigot. He was simply clueless. And that why sharing stories is important.

Malcolm wrote:
Her experience, whatever is may be, does not come from growing up black, latino, native, or asian in America, where there is history of slavery, Jim Crow laws, etc., laws against immigration, and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 11:45 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
Who is doing the excusing or not excusing? Do you have that moral high ground, Malcolm? I don't. We can say that it's not OK. That's fine. I can teach my kids that certain kind of language and jokes are not OK (and I do). But at the end of the day, human beings are mixed bags with messy contradictory characters. What I find to be more valuable is to hear out people's stories and begin to understand how it is for them.

Malcolm wrote:
Hi Dan:

What I understand is that the United States, Australia, New Zealand, and Canada were all founded on the principles of white supremacy. The preamble of the Constitution of the United States begins "We the people of the United States...," but the people did not include women, African slaves, Native Americans, and still do not.

I also understand that conservatism is a political philosophy which is predicated on white supremacy and always as been:

"According to Burke’s code, slaves of impeccable manners and behaviour should have a right to buy their freedom at “rates to be fixed by two Justices of the Peace”, though he fails to suggest where they might find the money. A renowned advocate of individual liberty, Burke nevertheless thought that despite being committed slave owners, the “people of the southern (American) colonies are much more strongly…. attached to liberty than those to the northward”[14]. In his fascinating “Counter History of Liberalism” Domenico Losurdo describes Burke as “the tutelary deity of the slaveholding South”."

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/edmund-burke-unspoken-villainy/

With respect to Burke's heir, principle among them William S. Buckley:

"In its earliest days, National Review defended Southern segregation in euphemistic terms. Buckley published articles by highbrow segregationists praising the conservative South as a check on liberalism. In perhaps its most infamous editorial, National Review asked whether whites should dominate in the South. Its “sobering answer”? Yes.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2018/10/05/conservatives-self-delusion-race/

Of course, Buckley, being an intelligent man (someone with whom my mother, an arch-liberal if there ever was one, civil rights activist, first-wave feminist, etc. was in fact friends, and someone whom I met as a toddler, though I have no memory of it) changed his position to the present, absurd idea of "color-blindness" common in conservative circles these days:

Colorblindness served conservative purposes. It allowed not only conservative writers but politicians like Barry Goldwater to oppose civil rights legislation from a “race-neutral” standpoint, in line with broad American values. They could always point to a higher principle than racism — whether constitutional or otherwise — to explain their opposition to black demands for equality...William Rickenbacker, another editor, argued that the magazine was best when it “bravely” said “the things everyone knows.” These “givens” included that “white people and Negroes do not actively seek each other’s company” and that “the bastardy rate” among blacks threatened “their claim that as a race they are ready to hold up their end of the social and legal structure of this country.” He demurred that this wasn’t a moral claim, merely a demographic one.

The strategies outlined at this meeting — legal colorblindness, law and order, free market dogmas and frankness about racial “realities” — were the go-to approaches for National Review and the burgeoning conservative intellectual movement for discussing race.

This last sentence remains the conservative and GOP approach to these issues. But what are they predicated on? Why of course, Edmund Burke once again:

Good order is the foundation of all good things. To be enabled to acquire, the people, without being servile, must be tractable and obedient. The magistrate must have his reverence, the laws their authority. The body of the people must not find the principles of natural subordination by art rooted out of their minds. They must respect that property of which they cannot partake. They must labor to obtain what by labor can be obtained; and when they find, as they commonly do, the success disproportioned to the endeavour, they must be taught their consolation in the final proportions of eternal justice. Of this consolation, whoever deprives them deadens their industry and strikes at the root of all acquisition as of all conservation. He that does this is the cruel oppressor, the merciless enemy of the poor and wretched, at the same time that by his wicked speculations he exposes the fruits of successful industry and the accumulations of fortune to the plunder of the negligent, the disappointed, and the unprosperous.
https://socialsciences.mcmaster.ca/econ/ugcm/3ll3/burke/revfrance.pdf

A perfect example of blaming poor people merely for being poor, as well a clear indictment of the principle of social welfare as a depredation upon the very people social welfare is intended to assist. Here we find the nascent seed of Reagan's welfare queen, and our own Rinchen Samphel's racist rant about black people (admirably rebutted by PeterC), which we can easily read above.

Conservatism is predicated on a Calvinist notion that success is a result of divine providence, and to be successful in spite of meager beginnings is a sign that one has been blessed by providence. Burke is not revolutionary here, since he embraces this principle very clearly. If you are rich, you deserve it, since it was afforded to you by God, and if you are poor, well, behave and you might go to heaven. It is no wonder that Christianity and conservatism go hand in hand.

There is a danger that Buddhists can succumb to the same kind of theistic thinking with respect to karma. I know of racist Tibetan teachers who assert that black people are black because of their negative karma. Of course, such thinking is ridiculous and immoral.

And this is the point: some views are immoral. What kinds of views? Views that claim that some people are intrinsically better than others because of race, creed, gender, or sexual preference. Equally immoral are views that diminish the very real, global harm of modern capitalism, which is predicated and built upon white supremacy. In the US, this history is visible everywhere.

While the framers of the US Constitution were themselves advocates of white supremacy, the language of the constitution permitted slow progress in overcoming the US's own twin original sins: genocide and slavery. But these stains on our national history have not been completely erased. We still have much to do, and it is a process of centuries, not decades. And it seems we always take two steps backward for every step forward we take. The fact that unarmed black men are murdered daily in the United States and that native women are exploited as sex workers in man camps, etc., and regularly raped and murdered by white men is appalling. Native people are more likely to suffering violent crimes (70 percent of all incidents)  at the hands of white men than blacks and white men. Federally recognized tribes do not have jurisdiction over over non-Indian perpetrators, even for crimes committed on reservations. So you can see, racism is the US is still a huge problem, and I have little sympathy for white people who claim they have no privilege in our society.

White privilege was granted to poor whites as long ago as the 1705 Virginia Slave Codes, which formed the basis of the laws against "miscegenation," etc., and made it illegal for anyone other than white Christians to purchase Christian white slaves. Following this, other laws were passed in order to grant privileges to landless whites to ensure their fidelity to the wealthy white colonial authorities in the South. The act largely favors indentured servants, which imposed a time limit on obligatory service if they were christian in their native country, apart from Turks and Moors who could prove they were not slaves in England or any other Christian country. All other non-christian peoples brought to this country were automatically considered slaves in Virginia.
https://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/_An_act_concerning_Servants_and_Slaves_1705

So, Dan, I think you really do not understand what we mean by "white privilege" in the United States. I think you are lacking context, and therefore, you make uninformed pronouncements such as:

Dan74 said:
To me the notion of privilege based on colour is a ham-fisted approach to redress past injustice and present inequality.

Malcolm wrote:
So just to make it plain for you: "white privilege" means the privilege all white people in the US experience, no matter how poor or disadvantaged they may seem, because of our deep history of codes, laws, and local ordinances that systematically elevate the rights and opportunities of white people at the expense of blacks and native peoples in the United States.  That's what white privilege is, and that is what is means.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 8:34 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
To an extent I agree. But to me, no matter how egregious the views, that's not a deal-breaker. On the one hand, actions speak a lot louder than words. And on the other as long as the other person is prepared to share and listen, then I am prepared to engage in a respectful manner.

As a little kiddo, I grew up in the Ukrainian hinterland where anti-Semitism of the most virulent kind was normal. My parents taught me to be grateful to people for not being anti-Semitic and hold them in high regard (kinda in Uncle Tom fashion). My mother was especially subjected to it because she looks quite Mediterranean. Then even in Australia, two Russian colleagues were racist with one regularly making nasty anti-Semitic remarks and jokes in my presence. But when it came to crunch, he actually was very helpful and decent to me. People are funny like that.

Malcolm wrote:
My grandfather on my mothers side, who lived in the Detroit area,  was very racist again blacks as a group, and very kind to his black employees. But the latter does not remove the injury of the former.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 8:32 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
DharmaN00b said:
A long time ago I was on probation and had one of those 'gotcha' moments. My officer mentioned that the white race are devils.

I was obviously in no position to object but it would have been very easy to have taken the comment personally. Clearly there are a number of consequences to sweeping the racist echo chamber under the rug, where plotting can take place.. as much, if not more, than giving people a platform to conciously (or otherwise) air their dirty laundry in public.

People in hard situations are going to cheat... sometimes sneaky and others a bit 'on the nose'

Dan74 said:
This is such an important point that in the English speaking countries (at least in Australia, IME) goes unheard. We are all human and one of the greatest gifts is to be able to share and converse freely. So if I have fears and neuroses (who doesnt) I should not live in PC fear of blurting out something stupid. We all do. And hopefully we learn from it.

Malcolm wrote:
When common decency is referred to as PC speech, one knows one is in the presence of bigots.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 7:55 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Tlalok said:
White people don't have to worry about getting the Mozambique drill during every single interaction with police. That's an example of white privilege.

Malcolm wrote:
Precisely. I do not have worry about this:


Rinchen Samphel said:
Nice YouTube vid

Malcolm wrote:
If you will look in the left hand corner, it’s from the NYT.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 7:54 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
...

BTW, thank you for sharing your voice and your story here.

Ayu said:
Well, I'm sorry to say, I'm able to live without such misanthropic comments: https://dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=33709&p=533602#p533568

How can anybody call it "nice" to see when a man is being killed? There obviously is something essentially wrong with rightist view.

Dan74 said:
Ayu, I took Richnen's comment differently.

The video was a horrible thing, I couldn't watch it, except just the start. I think Malcolm or someone said to him earlier that he must've learnt his stuff from YouTube videos and then "the other side" posts a youtube video. He said "nice video", in a dark humour sort of way. I don't for a moment believe that anyone here would find this 'nice' or applaud this. It is a turn of phrase. I wouldn't make much of it. How can one react to a video which appears to show a man being murdered by a law enforcement officer?

Malcolm wrote:
The source of that video was the Times.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 9:36 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:



Rinchen Samphel said:
At this point i just have to accept that you have been very privileged, and cant see how anyone else who is white cant have had a life different than yours.

Tlalok said:
Thing is bud, if all else was the same, and you were born black, you would have had a harder life than you do now. That's white priviledge.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Aight pal, you know me. In and out of jail, dui's, hospitals, homelessness, abusive father you would hit me till i pissed myself (but at least i had one right?!), dropped out of school when i was in my teens, yeah, typical white privilege. Thanks for catetorizing me based on my skin color, so un-racist of you. The reason why i have the views i do, is because sitting around being a victim wouldnt have put me in college (back in school for the first time in 10 years), wouldnt have gotten me a job as a union laborer, and thats a lot better than sitting around thinking my dad or bullies owe me something. Sitting around being a victim 24/7 wont get you a life, society wont change for you or anyone else, you will only die a victim who has nothing more than resentment.

Malcolm wrote:
It is interesting how people on the right always frame things in terms of victimology. You claim not to be a victim, and yet you wear victimized resentment as a badge of pride, not even noticing that if you were a black man with the same set of social conditions, it would have been much harder for you to pull yourself up, because the deck is that much more stacked against you. In other words, you claim not to be a victim, but you talk like a victim ( which is common in the alt right and fellow travelers). And yet, when black people do get upset and protest and struggle against the obvious disadvantages they have, which frankly, are much more acute than what you’ve experienced in life, people like you marginalize their struggle against racist oppression as if it is just a fantasy. Well, it isn’t a fantasy at all. You have never experienced racism, so you really don’t know what it feels like. Unlike me, you have no members of your family that have experienced racism from white people, so you really have no clue, like the rest of the MAGA crew. And your lack of empathy is shameful in someone who pretends to be a Buddhist.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 1:46 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
Queequeg said:
Its what I see it in forums like this, that is just not appealing to me, and I sense some people use the aesthetic to paper over their own tentative understandings. That makes me wonder, what benefit such elliptical language/thought is supposed to do for someone who doesn't yet actually have genuine insight? It just looks like word play.
Whatever floats your boat, but it seems immersing oneself in spontaneous word soups is not a particularly effective practice without a solid grasp of basics.

Meido said:
Well, I share your annoyance.

The kind of Zen talk that we often see aped in online forums is the encounter dialogue between masters and their disciples that can be found in many texts. These were not originally word soup, and did not occur among people who lacked an understanding of basics.

But the problem obviously is not that we have an over-abundance of Zen masters using true living words in that manner. It is that there are people with little or no Zen practice experience who read such things, are attracted by a style seemingly of iconoclastic freedom and mysterious spontaneity, and adopt it as an affectation.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, we used to have a word for this bank in the days of Punk Rock: poseurs.

And this behavior is silly, and makes Zen look ridiculous and trivial (it isn't).

People whacking each other with sticks on line and uttering mysterious profundities (aka gibberish) is just sad.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 1:24 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
There’s Only One Possible Conclusion: White America Likes Its Killer Cops:
George Floyd was murdered by Minneapolis police in broad daylight over Memorial Day weekend. We know he was murdered because video shows Floyd handcuffed and pinned under the knee of an officer who was crushing his throat into the pavement. Floyd could be heard telling the officer that he couldn’t breathe. He could be heard telling the officer, “Don’t kill me.” Onlookers were heard begging the officer to stop killing the man.

The police didn’t stop. The police are never going to voluntarily stop killing black and brown people. The killings will continue until the majority of white people in this country make the killings stop.

The police work for white people, and they know it. White people know it too. Deep down, white people know exactly who the police are supposed to “protect and serve,” and they damn well know it’s not black and brown people. We saw some video of that too, over the weekend. Amy Cooper was walking in Central Park with her dog. Her dog was off its leash, in violation of park rules and city ordinances. A bird watcher, Chris Cooper, who happens to be black, asked her to follow the rules. Instead of just putting her dog on a leash, Amy decided to use Chris’s race against him. She first threatened to call the cops, and then did just that, claiming that an “African American man” was “threatening” her in the park.

The very instant that Amy Cooper felt she needed the support of institutionalized racism to get her through her morning, she knew exactly where to find it. She knew exactly whom to call. Amy Cooper was the one in violation of the rules. Yet there she was, calling the cops. No doubt, it wouldn’t have even occurred to her to call them to the scene of her lawlessness if not for the way cops tend to harass, jail, and, yes, murder people who look like Chris Cooper. Or George Floyd. Or Eric Garner. Or Terrance Crutcher. Or Alton Sterling. Or Emantic Fitzgerald Bradford Jr. Or Amadou Diallo.
When Amy Cooper threatened to call the cops, she was threatening to take a black man’s life. It’s a threat that only works because cops are so consistently willing to murder black and brown men. Amy Cooper was able to dial up 400 years of racial oppression and violence on her phone more easily than I am able to order a pizza.

It doesn’t have to be this way. It is entirely within the scope of white power in America to rein in its police. White people could elect mayors and prosecutors who are committed to police reform. White judges and juries could hold the police accountable for their crimes. White Republicans could challenge and eventually break the power of police unions just as easily as they break teachers’ unions or any labor union that stands in the way of rapacious capitalism. If a majority of white people decided, today, that racist policing should end, we’d start seeing changes to police forces by the middle of next week.

But white people do not stop their cops. A majority of them clearly want the cops to behave this way. They want the viciousness. They want the horror. Why? It’s not just that a majority of white America probably thinks Amy Cooper did the right thing in her specific situation; it’s that they think they will one day be in a situation where Amy’s actions are justified. One day they might be alone in a park around a strange black man, and what might happen then? Sure, Chris Cooper seems like a “nice” black person, but what if he wasn’t? What if he was a “mean” or “aggressive” black person, and you were just alone in the park, illegally walking your dog? Best to keep brutal, dangerous, and racist cops around, because, hey, you never know.

White people think they might one day be Amy Cooper and want to have somebody to call, just in case. They know they’ll never be Chris Cooper. Making a society that’s safe for Chris Cooper to bird watch while black just isn’t the most important thing to a majority of white America.

Oh, a bunch of white people will be performatively outraged and saddened by Amy Cooper’s behavior. They’ll gladly participate in her online dragging. But when it comes to neutering the police so that the Amy Coopers of the world don’t have that kind of privilege and power over the Chris Coopers of the world, most of those white people will fall silent.

By the same token, white people will participate in the outrage over specific murders, like George Floyd’s murder or Breonna Taylor’s. They will join in calls to bring individual racists to account, like Amy Cooper or Gregory and Travis McMichael. But when it comes time to deal with institutional purveyors of racism, as opposed to individual bad actors, the outrage and support of the white community is not there. We see that disconnect on display now as police use coronavirus to threaten and harass black and brown people.

The Center for Constitutional Rights, the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, and the Legal Aid Society have joined an enforcement motion asking courts to investigate the New York Police Department’s social distancing enforcement during the pandemic. The legal motion suggests that the NYPD is in violation of court orders imposed on the city after its unconstitutional stop-and-frisk program. The lawyers are asking for an immediate moratorium on NYPD enforcement of social distancing orders.

Since March, 81 percent of social distancing violations issued by the NYPD have been made against black or Latinx people. And those stats simply confirm what our eyes are already telling us. We’ve all seen the pictures of white people gathered in parks as police officers politely hand out masks, but no tickets, just as we’ve all seen videos, shot just a neighborhood away, showing black and brown people getting beaten and manhandled by the cops for allegedly violating social distancing protocols.

Anybody could have seen this coming. In fact, I wrote about how this would happen once the NYPD was empowered to enforce social distancing. I don’t have a crystal ball. I’m not a wizard. I just know that cops cannot be trusted with the power they already have—and should never be given any more. Putting the NYPD in charge of enforcing social distancing was a decision that was so obviously going to lead to racially biased enforcement of the orders that one has to assume it was intentional.

Most black people know what happens when cops are given power, but we can’t get 51 percent of white people to do anything about it. We can’t get New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio, who centered his first mayoral campaign on his opposition to stop-and-frisk, to take a stand against the racist actions of his police force. We can’t get the white people who are willing to gather in large crowds to enjoy a spring day to gather in a large crowd to protest at City Hall.

Why would they? White people are not ignorant and they’re not blind. They see the racial bias in policing, and they know that bias benefits them. They know they’re not going to catch a beatdown for not wearing a mask. They know they’re not going to be choked to death on the street in broad daylight. They know that having racist police officers around gives them incredible power, and power makes people feel good even if they never use it. I’ve been in rooms where I’ve heard white people congratulate themselves for not calling the cops on some black person, as if declining the option to use terrorism against a black person was some kind of liberal bona fide.

Black people have tried, again and again, to end the horror of police brutality against us. We march, we protest, we educate, we vote. We teach our children a special set of rules. We produce art and literature and music documenting our pain. We start organizations and movements. And yet we can’t achieve structural change in policing because a majority of white America always sets its will against us. White people in our own communities, our alleged “friends and neighbors,” consistently vote and act in ways that empower the police and ignore their brutality against us.

White people could put their police dogs on a leash. But they won’t. And more black and brown people will get mauled and killed until white people decide to do better. More black people will die like George Floyd, because most white people want to live like Amy Cooper.
https://www.thenation.com/article/society/white-america-cops/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 1:12 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
BTW, the Preamble to the IWW Constitution:

The working class and the employing class have nothing in common. There can be no peace so long as hunger and want are found among millions of the working people and the few, who make up the employing class, have all the good things of life.

Between these two classes a struggle must go on until the workers of the world organize as a class, take possession of the means of production, abolish the wage system, and live in harmony with the Earth.

We find that the centering of the management of industries into fewer and fewer hands makes the trade unions unable to cope with the ever growing power of the employing class. The trade unions foster a state of affairs which allows one set of workers to be pitted against another set of workers in the same industry, thereby helping defeat one another in wage wars. Moreover, the trade unions aid the employing class to mislead the workers into the belief that the working class have interests in common with their employers.

These conditions can be changed and the interest of the working class upheld only by an organization formed in such a way that all its members in any one industry, or in all industries if necessary, cease work whenever a strike or lockout is on in any department thereof, thus making an injury to one an injury to all.

Instead of the conservative motto, "A fair day's wage for a fair day's work," we must inscribe on our banner the revolutionary watchword, "Abolition of the wage system."

It is the historic mission of the working class to do away with capitalism. The army of production must be organized, not only for everyday struggle with capitalists, but also to carry on production when capitalism shall have been overthrown. By organizing industrially we are forming the structure of the new society within the shell of the old.
https://archive.iww.org/culture/official/preamble/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 1:06 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Grigoris said:
Since the McCarthyist era most Americans believe that anything left of Fascism is Communism.

Malcolm wrote:
These days many (ignorant) Americans have even convinced themselves that Fascism is itself a left-wing movement.

Grigoris said:
Crying shame really when you consider that the U$ had a healthy Anarchosyndicalist movement, with the Industrial Workers of the World (Wobblies) having over 150,000 members at it's peak.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup. And Eugene Debs, Bernie Sanders' inspiration, was one its founders. The IWW was the only non-racist, non-sexist union in America when it was founded.

Grigoris said:
But Americans, in general, suffer from a complete ignorance when it comes to their history anyway.

Malcolm wrote:
Seriously? George Washington did not cut down that cherry tree?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 28th, 2020 at 12:14 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Tlalok said:
White people don't have to worry about getting the Mozambique drill during every single interaction with police. That's an example of white privilege.

Malcolm wrote:
Precisely. I do not have worry about this:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 11:25 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Fa Dao said:
Yeah..sorry Rinchen..its true..Greg is not a liberal, hes a full on commie...

Malcolm wrote:
Greg is not a "commie," he is an anarchist.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 11:24 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Dan74 said:
There are kids born in affluent urbanite educated Black families who have tonnes more privilege than a white kid born to unemployed parents in a backwater trailer park after manufacturing went abroad to the applause of urban elites cheering globalisation.

Malcolm wrote:
You don't get it. You probably never will. And your argument is mistaken. "Kids born in affluent urbanite educated Black families" do not have and will never have more privilege in America than "a white kid born to unemployed parents in a backwater trailer park" unless there is a fundamental change in the attitudes of white people toward black people.

A white kid born to unemployed parents in a backwater trailer park will never have a cross burned in his front yard, etc., or be subject to the casual, thoughtless racism black people in the US experience daily, etc., not to mention the organized racism of the penal system in the US, or the economic racism affecting black small business owners and so on.

You don't get it, because you do not understand the social history of class and race in the US.

You don't get it, because you don't have an overtly racist president.

You don't get it, because you don't really understand just how deeply racism is embedded in American cultural life.

You don't get it, probably because you have not read deeply in American History.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 8:59 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
Blacks have commited 52 percent of crimes from the 80's to about 2010, though blacks make up 13 percent of the population. The stats are ugly, and thats why i cant support the BLM movement, if the black community actually cared about black lives, there be more work on why the above is true, why 70+ percent of black murders are done by other blacks. And this is just the stats, and if someone thinks is racist, well, ok. But why do black lives only matter when a white cop kills a black person? Im not saying its right, what i am saying is its easier to support BLM and get pissed at white cops than it is to confront the actual problem.

Grigoris said:
Seems you do not have an idea what "the actual problem" is.

Why don't you go research the link between race and poverty?  For starters.

Rinchen Samphel said:
I have, hence why i have aquired the viewpoint i have.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, all on YouTube.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 1:03 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Rinchen Samphel said:
Screw off, this is the most generalizing arguement that overlooks the common stuggles of the middle-class and marginalizes it based on race, rather than class.

Malcolm wrote:
Study some history. Race is class in America.

Rinchen Samphel said:
Look at the present, no its not.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, it is. And the fact you don’t see this means you are blind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/26/us/minneapolis-police-man-died.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 1:00 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Rinchen Samphel said:
Screw off, this is the most generalizing arguement that overlooks the common stuggles of the middle-class and marginalizes it based on race, rather than class.

Malcolm wrote:
Study some history. Race is class in America.

The struggles of white people in the US are nothing compared to the struggles of African Americans, Latinos, Native Americans and so on. The fact that you cannot acknowledge this is merely an illustration of your blindness to your own privilege.

Rinchen Samphel said:
And here is this arguement, "but look back 100 yrs ago!" We cant solve this problem by bringing upon black people the sufferings of their ancesters, which they themselves never experianced. Half of my family was in france until the 1900's and the other half was in the north, poor farmers, and my great grandfather died from drinking paint thinner during the depression. Never owned slaves or took part in that, they married native americans, and got along with people just fine. Nobodies suffering is more important than anyone elses. Why should i have to pay for what i never did, 60 or 100+ years ago? Why should i have to pay for a "privilege" that i didnt ask for, or even fully believe in? Are we going to start pointing out "attractive-privilege"? You know attractive people typically have more confidence, a more heathy sex life, and aquire higher positions easier. Oooh, or what about "skill-privilege", some people just have a knack for carpentry, but we shouldnt let that overshadow this person over here who doesnt have the privilege of being more inclined towards that work. What about, i mean, i could go on. No one becomes a hero through being a victim, no one grows out of the mud through being a victim, and no one should have to pay for things they didnt do, just because of their skin color.

Malcolm wrote:
It doesn't matter, your ancestors were white, and their very ethnic background granted them privileges, legal and social, systematically denied to African Americans, etc. Whether you understand this or not, you, as a white male in the US, have inherited this privilege.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 6:39 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Biden will be 1000% better than the orange guy. But whoever is president after Trump is going to have a hell of a job rebuilding the gvt.

But, it is looking increasingly likely that no matter who wins the WH, the dems are poised to take 60 seats in Congress. This means they can override any veto and with a democratic house, can pretty much pass any legislation they want, with or without presidential approval.

Grigoris said:
To quote you from another thread:

Malcolm wrote:
Anything at this point is better than Trump.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 6:36 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Rinchen Samphel said:
Screw off, this is the most generalizing arguement that overlooks the common stuggles of the middle-class and marginalizes it based on race, rather than class.

Malcolm wrote:
Study some history. Race is class in America.

The struggles of white people in the US are nothing compared to the struggles of African Americans, Latinos, Native Americans and so on. The fact that you cannot acknowledge this is merely an illustration of your blindness to your own privilege.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 5:06 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Könchok Thrinley said:
I mean the right wingers are already whipped into frenzy at this point. Just remember that few weeks ago in some states there were groups of people with assault weapons at their local congresses when the votes on opening up were happenng. I can't imagine how crazy they will go if the democrats actually override Trump. Mostly because Trump will throw a tantrum and feed it.

Malcolm wrote:
Nah, these clowns are weekend warriors, who are mainly dangerous to deer and to each other.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 4:07 AM
Title: Re: Why did the Buddha choose not to live of Light?
Content:
Lucas Oliveira said:
Why did the Buddha choose not to live of Light?..
"Devas, on seeing me, said, 'Gotama the contemplative is dead.' Other devas said, 'He isn't dead, he's dying.' Others said, 'He's neither dead nor dying, he's an arahant, for this is the way arahants live.'

"I thought: 'Suppose I were to practice going altogether without food.' Then devas came to me and said, 'Dear sir, please don't practice going altogether without food. If you go altogether without food, we'll infuse divine nourishment in through your pores, and you will survive on that.' I thought, 'If I were to claim to be completely fasting while these devas are infusing divine nourishment in through my pores, I would be lying.' So I dismissed them, saying, 'Enough.'

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.036.than.html

Malcolm wrote:
Your citation provides the answer:

I thought, 'If I were to claim to be completely fasting while these devas are infusing divine nourishment in through my pores, I would be lying.' So I dismissed them, saying, 'Enough.'


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 3:48 AM
Title: Re: Zen’s stand regarding ‘The Absolute’
Content:
npr said:
If you can see the original Chinese text of Huang Po, and see what the original term that was translated to Absolute, was,  that can be nice

Astus said:
What translation? Could you please give some refernces?

Queequeg said:
Blofeld

Malcolm wrote:
Antiquated to the point of uselessness.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 3:42 AM
Title: Blue Wave 2020?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
It is looking that way:

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-to-make-of-those-new-senate-polls-that-have-democrats-way-ahead/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 3:39 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Queequeg said:
Anyway. I just shake my head and cast my vote for the person to replace the orange man.

Grigoris said:
That is what they are betting on...

Malcolm wrote:
Biden will be 1000% better than the orange guy. But whoever is president after Trump is going to have a hell of a job rebuilding the gvt.

But, it is looking increasingly likely that no matter who wins the WH, the dems are poised to take 60 seats in Congress. This means they can override any veto and with a democratic house, can pretty much pass any legislation they want, with or without presidential approval.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 2:56 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
SonamTashi said:
I always find it strange when right-wingers claim liberals and actual leftists of only watching CNN when most (especially leftists) don't watch CNN at all. It seems like clear projection from people who are so dependent on Fox News.

Malcolm wrote:
Especially since MSNBC is further to the left.

And now this:

https://abcnews.go.com/theview/video/rep-james-clyburn-defends-joe-biden-70887259


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 12:23 AM
Title: Re: Nyingmapas who don't practice Dzogchen?
Content:
Varis said:
Hey everyone,

I was wondering if there are Nyingmapas who only practice HYT without Dzogchen? Or is the general consensus that if you have the karma to meet a Nyingmapa lama you probably have the superior capacity for Dzogchen?

Malcolm wrote:
There are Nyingmapas who mainly focus mahayoga and anuyoga. But the goal of all is Dzogchen, even if they are not practicing Dzogchen directly.

Crazywisdom said:
Some mantra practice is generally important to assist folks with activities.

Malcolm wrote:
There is, according to Mañjuśṛimitra, both a direct and an indirect way to realize Atiyoga.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 27th, 2020 at 12:22 AM
Title: Re: Nyingmapas who don't practice Dzogchen?
Content:
Pero said:
I don't know about today due to the influence of Dzogchen teachings but I think some Nyingmapas in the past had to have done so. Each vehicle can be practiced on its own. Also for example, I remember there is a Dzogchen explanation to the Guhyagarba tantra and a Mahayoga explanation of it from the Zur clan.

Crazywisdom said:
The Guhyagarbha is really very amazing. Longchenpa provides explicit Dzogchen instructions and classifies it differently than Zur.

Malcolm wrote:
Nevertheless, it is still classified as a mahāyoga tantra by the Nyingmapas, despite Longchenpa's, Khenpo Jigphun's, and Khenpo Namdrol's very profound explanations of it. For example, it remains within the mahāyoga section of Nyingma Collection of Tantras in all its different recensions. And ChNN very clearly includes it within mahāyoga in the Precious Vase.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 11:40 PM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Rinchen Samphel said:
Rationalization: the thread.

Trump has already won, yet again, not because he is the most qualified person, but because the dems cant stop shooting themselves in the foot and then blaming it on "white repubs" and their "racism and patriarchy".

Malcolm wrote:
The GOP is demonstrably racist and patriarchal.


Rinchen Samphel said:
Please, keep doing it and blaming the consequences of it on the other party and the majority of americans, the evil white people.

Malcolm wrote:
White people are not evil, but they are blind to their privilege.


Rinchen Samphel said:
Im sure that will secure the vote.... No wonder the democratic party is so disconnected from the people, their own voting base is disconnected from reality because of repeating what the media propaganda machine says. Just so yall know, just because you repeat what some so-called "expert" says, doesnt mean you're intelligent or are exempt from your duty to actually research info outside of the CNN narrative.

Malcolm wrote:
Lazy.


Rinchen Samphel said:
Not to mention, this whole Biden controvery came from an interview with Charlamagne Tha God.... LOL, yeah, he sure knows what he is talking about. Mayonnaise.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, Joe screwed up, and apologized immediately.

Rinchen Samphel said:
*Trump does, or says, something wrong*
Dems: Facist, racist, hitler!

Malcolm wrote:
Trump definitely has fascist tendencies. The amount of ass-kissing and fawning he requires of his subordinates is embarrassing, something we are accustomed to seeing from weak leaders. He is a very weak leader, and if, as you say, he is going to return the WH house because of another electoral college win, the USA is doomed, and will never recover from another four years of this idiot and his cult.

Rinchen Samphel said:
*Biden does and says something wrong*
Dems thinking to themselves: "i know there is a way to justify this, its not actually racist..


Malcolm wrote:
What most Democrats are saying is that Biden spoke out of turn because he, like most white people in this country, are blind to their privilege. But again, Biden apologized immediately. Has Trump ever apologized for anything? No. Trump is not a decent person. Biden is a decent person. Take your pick.

Rinchen Samphel said:
and we shouldnt believe all women now, we only said that to hurt republicans, now it doesnt apply." And for that last thing said, dont post that bullshit article that says "believeallwomen" is a conservative trap. I was there, as where all of you back in 2017, we remember.

Malcolm wrote:
As far as Tara Reade goes, her story is not credible:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 11:26 PM
Title: Re: personality views
Content:
confusedlayman said:
Even if u know emptiness of everything, non self and impermanance.. is it possible to still have persoinality views?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is when your knowledge of absence of self and impermanence are still only intellectual. One has to realize these things, not merely understand them intellectually.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 10:48 PM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Bundokji said:
I was referring to sankharas (or samskara) being described as anicca and dukkha while dhammas being described as anatta.

Malcolm wrote:
Here, you mean "sankhata" in Pali, in all _conditioned_ phenomena are impermanent (annica).

Caoimhghín said:
The Pāli actually has saṁskārā: Sabbe saṅkhārā aniccā; sabbe dhammā anattā
All conditions are impermanent. All things are not-self.
(SN 22.90 Ven Sujāto translation)

It's also the same in Sanskrit: sarvasaṁskārā anityāḥ, sarvasaṁskārā duḥkhāḥ, sarvadharmā anātmānāḥ, śāntaṁ nirvāṇam

The Chinese similarly has  一切行無常，一切法無我，which is identical to the Pāli. 行 is the operative word here, which translates "saṁskārā" rather than "saṁskṛta." "All conditioned phenomena are impermanent" would read 一切有為(法)無常.

It is, of course, true that all conditioned phenomena are impermanent regardless of the above.

Malcolm wrote:
Interesting, In Tibetan, a distinction is made by between [mngon par] 'du byas (saṃskṛta) and 'du byed (saṃskārā), with the former being reserved for "compounded phenomena," and the latter, found in the passages similar to what you describe, 'du byed thams cad mi rtag pa, is generally confined to discussions of the second link of dependent origination and the saṃskārā skandha.

My point is that in Mahāyāna, we do not generally talk about "saṃskārās" in the way Bundokoji does.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 6:59 AM
Title: Re: Karmic consequence of having troubled relations with Gurus
Content:
treningday said:
Right now, I'm basically exiled. As in, not allowed to come to the center until I change my view. So this is what I need to fix but upon examining it and being very honest I don't think that there's anything very wrong. And I don't think a lama should require that of their student.

Malcolm wrote:
Personality cult. Avoid. Find a better guru.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 1:37 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You are conflating two different uses the term "dharma": the first refers to teachings; the second refers to discrete entities that bear characteristics. Your use of the term samskara, while found in some Vipassana circles, is really derived from Hinduism, unless you are referring to a) the second link in the chain of dependent origination or b) the saṃskara skandha, the aggregate of formations (caitya). Some people use the term samskaras to refer what in Buddhism would be called vasanas, or traces.

Bundokji said:
I was referring to sankharas (or samskara) being described as anicca and dukkha while dhammas being described as anatta.

Malcolm wrote:
Here, you mean "sankhata" in Pali, in all _conditioned_ phenomena are impermanent (annica).



Bundokji said:
Not affirming, at least in worldly logic, stops short of denying and often described as "suspending judgement" or simply remaining silent to allow the practitioner to find out for himself/herself. In the second part of the paragraph, you went on to explicitly state that he denied it. Anyway, maybe i was reading too much into your input.

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, the Buddha both refused to affirm there was an ultimate self and he denied there was an ultimate self.

I suggest you review this sutta:

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn/dn.01.0.bodh.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 1:09 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Minobu said:
Maybe that's the key.for me anyway..exposure to so many different cultures and interacting with so many different races that eventually you just become color blind..

Malcolm wrote:
"Color-blindness" also has its own problems, and can lead people to not accept the existence of, or diminish, incidents of racism towards people of color, etc., because supposedly we are "beyond racism." This was the narrative that Fox News pushed for years, i.e., that we live in a post-racial society. This is obviously false, as in the US, UK, Australia, and yes, even Canada, there is a rise in xenophobic sentiments across the board.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/02/chinese-canadians-denounce-rising-xenophobia-tied-coronavirus-200202191216923.html

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/racism-coronavirus-canada-1.5449023


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 12:12 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


PeterC said:
He's a white US person in his 70s.  Of course he's racist.

Malcolm wrote:
My mom is a white person in her eighties. She is not at all racist. Not even a tiny bit.


PeterC said:
If you put Sanders through the ideological purity test, you would also find him lacking.

Malcolm wrote:
Bernie left NYC, and moved to Vermont, which was a black population of 1% (9000 out of 900,000). In the last election, he was largely oblivious to issues of race, because his constituency, for all intents and purposes, is about as white as it gets in the US. But he learned his lesson.


PeterC said:
But what we can say with confidence is that he would do way more to help non-white people in the US than would trump.  And since there aren't any other options out there, that's the question we have to ask on this, and many other topics.

Malcolm wrote:
At least Biden will hire competent people, rebuild the State Department, etc., and purge all the incompetent fools that Trump installed.

Basically, Trump has eviscerated the government. Our pandemic response is direct outcome of GOP policies.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 12:06 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yes, all of the countries with a history of colonial occupation around the world are racist, and are founded on the basis of a doctrine of Anglo-European cultural supremacy. Everyone knows that is true. Everyone.

Kim O'Hara said:
I wish everyone did know it, but there are some white people (here, and probably even in the US) who are simply oblivious to it. They are mostly poorly educated, mostly rural and regional, and mostly older, but there are plenty of them.
And most of them are decent enough people. They live their lives from day to day without much contact with non-white people and don't discriminate (or not much) when they come across them, but they simply never learned enough history in school and have never had to re-think what they learned in school.


Kim

Malcolm wrote:
No, they also know it. But they are willfully ignorant.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 12:04 AM
Title: Re: What are the most minimalist or simplest forms or schools of Buddhism?
Content:
Enryu84 said:
You can reach enlightenment without knowing anything, just by meditating.

Malcolm wrote:
Umm, no, this is completely false. This is not what the Buddha taught.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 26th, 2020 at 12:03 AM
Title: Re: Nyingmapas who don't practice Dzogchen?
Content:
Varis said:
Hey everyone,

I was wondering if there are Nyingmapas who only practice HYT without Dzogchen? Or is the general consensus that if you have the karma to meet a Nyingmapa lama you probably have the superior capacity for Dzogchen?

Malcolm wrote:
There are Nyingmapas who mainly focus mahayoga and anuyoga. But the goal of all is Dzogchen, even if they are not practicing Dzogchen directly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 11:46 PM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:


Danny said:
Plus any small business owners out there will tell you they want government ou of their way and not an expanded plan to increase them as your silent partner.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because small businesses hate roads, bridges, electricity, telephones, and the US Post Office.

This anti-government rhetoric is extremely harmful. Reagan lead directly to Trump.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 11:34 PM
Title: Re: Interesting paper on some early Dzogchen texts
Content:
lelopa said:
she doesn't translate "rDo la gser zhun"  as "written with gold on stone"
that's good - but I wouldn't translate it as "Pure Golden Ore " either

Malcolm wrote:
Mipham glosses the title in this way:

[T]he intimate instruction of how to meditate is the treatise exemplified by a skilled smith smelting the element of gold in gold ore into liquid, meaning that it is actually extracted...

This leads to the title, "Smelting the Gold from Ore"


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 9:01 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:
Tlalok said:
Joe Biden is a white man in America.

White people are proud of the genocide of the indigenous people they called “savages” because the Native American holocaust was their “manifest destiny.” They have no trouble calling themselves the “founding fathers” of an economic superpower fueled by the bloody brows and calloused hands of enslaved Africans who occupied this continent centuries before the arrival of the men who enshrined white supremacy into the American ethos.

White people aren’t inherently racist but America is.

In America, whiteness is bulletproof. It is a birthright, a vaccine and a deflector shield that has historically shielded white people from self-awareness and the recognition of anyone’s humanity aside from their own. This country convinces housewives that they should spit in the face of schoolgirls and turns laymen into lynch mobs. That’s what simply living in the cool breeze of American history will do to white people.

Because of how America is set up, if we somehow found the kindest, most compassionate white infant who ever took a breath of American air, that child would need every ounce of strength, humility and consciousness it could muster from its baby muscles to simply not be racist.

And it would fail.

Because it would still be a white baby in America.
From: https://www.theroot.com/joe-biden-just-proved-why-he-must-have-a-black-woman-as-1843614180

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, all of the countries with a history of colonial occupation around the world are racist, and are founded on the basis of a doctrine of Anglo-European cultural supremacy. Everyone knows that is true. Everyone.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 2:16 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
All media views human activity as an entertainment to be sold. It views everything as a commodity, Including social change movements and culture.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Including crayons and pastels? What about oil paint? Latex? Acrylic?

Danny said:
Art as a medium is also a commodity, someone famously said all art is propaganda.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Art is only a commodity if it is sold as such. There is plenty of art that is not commodified.

Propaganda isn't art.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 1:48 AM
Title: Re: is Biden subconsciously racist
Content:


Minobu said:
When the day comes that you see others as just a person and it doesn't matter your ethnicity , or religion, or , culture, and why bother labeling , America will be more...like Canada .

Malcolm wrote:
Right, because there is no racism in Canada.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 1:45 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
All media views human activity as an entertainment to be sold. It views everything as a commodity, Including social change movements and culture.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
Including crayons and pastels? What about oil paint? Latex? Acrylic?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 1:39 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Buddha never used the term "self" to refer to an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity. He also never asserted that there was no conventional "self," the subject of transactional discourse. So, it is very clear in the sutras that the Buddha negated an ultimate self and did not negate a conventional self.

Bundokji said:
The problem is that the Buddha's utterances are dharmas and both dharmas and sanskara are taught to be anatman.

Malcolm wrote:
You are conflating two different uses the term "dharma": the first refers to teachings; the second refers to discrete entities that bear characteristics. Your use of the term samskara, while found in some Vipassana circles, is really derived from Hinduism, unless you are referring to a) the second link in the chain of dependent origination or b) the saṃskara skandha, the aggregate of formations (caitya). Some people use the term samskaras to refer what in Buddhism would be called vasanas, or traces.

Bundokji said:
The issue of skillful means is justified by making that distinction between sanskara and dharmas when that distinction is not applicable to the lord Buddha as even his human actions cannot be driven by ignorance.

Malcolm wrote:
With respect to skillful means, this is a Mahāyāna concept.

Bundokji said:
The above has manifested itself in your answer appearing to be paradoxical. On the one hand, the Buddha never used the term self to refer to an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity, and on the other hand he negated it. How can he negates it without referring to it is a logical impossibility.

Malcolm wrote:
When I said the Buddha never used the term self to refer to an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity, I meant that he never affirmed such a proposed self.

This is really not difficult to understand, and is not a subtle point at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 1:02 AM
Title: Re: Momentariness
Content:
Artziebetter1 said:
Does momentariness imply things coming out of nothing?if the cause ceases completely before the effect even begins to arise,how do effects arise?
there must be things beginning the arise as soon as its cause begins to dissapear,but then why call it momentary?

This doctrine is the hardest buddhist doctrine to wrap my head around since coming into buddhism,especially from a hindu backround.I've read shankara's Bhasya on the brahma sutras against momentariness or Kshanabhanagavada and I havent seen any alternative views wich could prove momentariness.

please explain it to me.

Malcolm wrote:
The Madhyamaka view is that causes and effects are neither the same nor different, because a cause and an effect cannot be temporally dislocated nor can they be simultaneous. Therefore, the only thing that can explain how cause and effect functions is that causes and effects are neither the same nor different, for example, ghee from milk, etc. Naturally, this is all strictly on a conventional level. Ultimately, arising from causes and conditions is just a convention. In ultimate truth, nothing ever arose from the beginning.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 12:39 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Grigoris said:
There is no utility in the metaphor, it does not correspond to Buddhist theories/doctrine of mind.

I think I made that clear from the beginning.

If you believe it does correspond, then the onus is on you to find a doctrinal source that supports it.

Caoimhghín said:
If course it doesn't. The Buddha teaches anātma, not of the ātma. If you want to find out what people are saying "the ātma is," you have to leave Buddhism necessarily, because Buddhist people will only tell you what that "the ātma isn't." As far as metaphors go, I think the Tree of Jīvātma perfectly describes the naïvety of the mind who suggest such a brain homunculus lives in the branches of their mind. I think this because, as other posters have pointed out, the bird who does not eat is not like a "bird" in any way truly, and likely is an impossible being, i.e. one who only exists in story.

Of course, the intended function of the myth is to teach you about your wonderful shiny ātma syzygy, the you who is always victorious and never humiliated, who is uninjured when you are injured, etc.

Grigoris said:
A Dharma brother of mine practiced in a Hindu tradition that used the analogy as the basis for their daily practice:  Trying to mainatin the position of a passive unintruding observer (atma) while watching themselves (jiva) act.  At some point he felt he was losing his mind, that he had actually become two versions of himself.

Malcolm wrote:
The Hindu view in general is that there is a purusha who passively enjoys prakṛti and its transformations; the main disagreement is whether that purusha is one (Vedanta) or many (Samkhya).


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 25th, 2020 at 12:22 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Anatman is the negation of an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity that moves from one temporary body to another. It is not the negation of "Sam," "Fred," or "Jane" used as a conventional designation for a collection of aggregates. Since the Buddha clearly states in many Mahāyāna sūtras, "all phenomena" are not self, and since everything is included there, including buddhahood, therefore, there are no phenomena that can be called a self, and since there are nothing outside of all phenomena, a "self," other than an arbitrary designation, does not exist.

Bundokji said:
Why negating an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity is more accurate than negating the "ism" in worldly views according to your understanding?

Malcolm wrote:
The "ism" being negated by the negation of an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity is "self-ism," aka atmavada, specifically, the atmavadin views of Vedanta.


Bundokji said:
For example, the Buddha might use what appears to be an eternalist or nihilist language when he teaches in certain contexts, so even eternalists and nihilists can be right once in a while akin to a broken clock. So why to bother negating the self whether absolute or otherwise?

Malcolm wrote:
Buddha never used the term "self" to refer to an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity. He also never asserted that there was no conventional "self," the subject of transactional discourse. So, it is very clear in the sutras that the Buddha negated an ultimate self and did not negate a conventional self.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 5:54 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:



Bundokji said:
Is anatman  a denial of the self?

Malcolm wrote:
Of course. It is the negation of an absolute self, but not "the self" used as a name for the collection of aggregates.

Bundokji said:
Would it be accurate to say that it is the negation of absolutism? or the dogmatic "ism" in worldly views regardless of it taking a negative or positive forms?

Malcolm wrote:
Anatman is the negation of an unconditioned, permanent, ultimate entity that moves from one temporary body to another. It is not the negation of "Sam," "Fred," or "Jane" used as a conventional designation for a collection of aggregates. Since the Buddha clearly states in many Mahāyāna sūtras, "all phenomena" are not self, and since everything is included there, including buddhahood, therefore, there are no phenomena that can be called a self, and since there are nothing outside of all phenomena, a "self," other than an arbitrary designation, does not exist.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 5:18 AM
Title: Re: Nihilistic view
Content:
Bundokji said:
...except that i don't see anything spiritual either in confirming or denying the self.

Grigoris said:
Good for you!

Anatman is one of the four defining characteristics (Four Dharma Seals) of a Dharma.

Any body of teaching that does not include Anatman cannot be Dharma.

So somebody out there obviously considers  the discussion of whether there is a self or not, of vital spiritual significance.

Bundokji said:
Is anatman  a denial of the self?

Malcolm wrote:
Of course. It is the negation of an absolute self, but not "the self" used as a name for the collection of aggregates.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 4:22 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
It's important not to get locked into information ghettos.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is what newspapers of record are for, etc. Not that they are perfect, they all make errors. But in general, the sales of advertising forced newspapers to strive for objectivity in reporting.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 3:55 AM
Title: Re: Does the Bön tradition believe we have a self/soul?
Content:


Varis said:
I assume by common people you mean Tibetan/Himalayan folk beliefs, right?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 3:53 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
Well lets answer a question with a question,
Where do you go to get trusted news?

https://www.thebalancesmb.com/what-is-propaganda-and-how-does-it-work-2295248

Malcolm wrote:
By the same author:

Q: Is Breitbart News a credible news source for you? Why or why not?

No. True journalists have no agenda, with the opinion pages separated from news gathering.

Breitbart clearly has an agenda baked into their stories, which really aren’t designed to inform, but to persuade.

The acid test of fairness is simple: fair, journalism-based newspapers and magazines will post stories that are critical of any public figure or elected official, and they’ll save opinion for the oped pages. Biased outlets with only go after one side
https://www.quora.com/profile/Guy-Bergstrom


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 24th, 2020 at 3:50 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Dan74 said:
Do public broadcasters have any significant influence on the US public opinion?

Malcolm wrote:
No, however, the cable news channels do have such influence. In particular, Fox News has an enormous influence on a certain subsection of the American public, older, racist (whether they admit it or not), white people who are afraid of the inevitable demographic shift that will inevitably make the US browner, blacker, and multilingual.

Roger Ailes was an evil genius.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 10:50 PM
Title: Re: Does the Bön tradition believe we have a self/soul?
Content:
GrapeLover said:
But the elements disperse at death etc and are just part of your conditioned existence.

Varis said:
The bLa lingers after death and acts like a sentient spirit AFAIK.

Malcolm wrote:
This is because among common people, there is an ambiguity between bla and consciousness. Barbara Gerke has perhaps one of the best summaries I've yet read:
The meaning of bla evolves from the notion of what could be rendered
into English as ‘subtle life essence’,7 but is in fact more complex
considering the internal and external manifestations of bla, as well as
the shamanic and Buddhist historical influences that have shaped body
concepts, perception and ritual practices in the Himalayan enclaves.
Tibetan-English dictionaries offer a variety of translations for bla.8
Apart from the literal meaning ‘higher’ or ‘above’, the most commonly
adopted form of translation is ‘soul’.9 I find the translation of bla as
‘soul’, especially in anthropological works, to be unsatisfactory for several
reasons. Firstly, the notion of ‘soul’ is strongly rooted in Western
religious thought and does not reflect the numerous cultural meanings
that bla has acquired in Buddhist and non-Buddhist contexts among
Himalayan communities. Secondly, ‘soul loss’ is an anthropological
invention of the early 20th century that had appeared while studying the
temporary absence of some unidentified life force among certain cultures.
10 Thirdly, bla has most commonly been translated as ‘soul’ probably
because the European connotation of a subtle body that is capable
of leaving the coarse body has survived most prominently in the
Platonic notion of the ‘psyche’.11 Another viewpoint to be considered
also is that

the subtle body has been one of the hardest concepts in Buddhist and
Hindu thought for Westerners to appreciate, perhaps because it implies a
lack of separation between ‘body’ and ‘mind’, which Western science
has had difficulty in accepting (Samuel 1993b: 237).

I am not suggesting here that bla is the same as the Indian Tantric concept
of the subtle body, but only that a certain ethnocentrism within
North American and European intellectual circles has led to a misunderstanding
of the concepts of the body and its subtle physiologies
found among other cultures, which in turn may have supported the
translation of bla as ‘soul’.
Gerke, Barbara. (2007). Engaging the subtle body: Re-approaching bla rituals in the Himalayas.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/265186982_Engaging_the_subtle_body_Re-approaching_bla_rituals_in_the_Himalayas


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 10:24 PM
Title: Re: Guru Padmasambhava ID Request
Content:
humble.student said:
I was given a picture of Guru P many years ago, the same as this one, and was wondering from which cycle of teachings it comes from.


Malcolm wrote:
It is from a cycle called Sampa Lhundrup, and specifically, this is the form of Guru Rinpoche for warding off Mongolian Hordes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 10:22 PM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:


Nemo said:
But I don't really think Biden is electable.

Malcolm wrote:
The alternative is far worse.

Nemo said:
Bernie would already be beating him. Instead the elites stuck you with this nag with one foot in the glue factory. The DNC seems to think that business as usual will suffice. The far left is a voter bloc now and without concrete concessions no one is showing up.

Malcolm wrote:
Let us hope you are wrong. Bernie is giving full throated support to Biden these days. Apart from the converted, everyone in America is tired of the Trump  shit show.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 12:08 PM
Title: Re: Advice for Consultation with Guru
Content:
n8pee said:
I've not spoken to my root guru in seven years or so due to my travel and moving around the U.S. I've recently secured an audience via Zoom, which has been made available due to today's COVID crisis.

I have specific practice questions of course. But I feel this urge to let him know his impact on my life, as I've never had a significant private audience with him, but don't wish to make our time together about me and my perceptions. I first met with the lineage teachings nearly twenty years ago.

I am welcome to any advice about how best to utilize the guru's time. From my side he is Vajradhara, and has been the source of all blessings. How does one meaningfully communicate in this situation?

Malcolm wrote:
Remember that from his side he is a human being, no matter what you think.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 12:07 PM
Title: Re: Ticks
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
So I'm wondering: How did all these old yogis and forest meditators avoid ticks when meditating out in nature? Were there just less ticks back then? Were there just fewer tick-borne diseases? Or did they have the special tick repelling instructions?

Malcolm wrote:
When one reaches a certain level of samadhi, lice, ticks, etc., naturally leave the body.

Tenma said:
I thought for yogis and ngakpas, the lice and ticks were dakinis and thus one reason not to cut hair?

Malcolm wrote:
Never heard that.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 12:06 PM
Title: Re: Ticks
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
When one reaches a certain level of samadhi, lice, ticks, etc., naturally leave the body.
What's that level? Where is this stated? Why does this happen?

Malcolm wrote:
When one reaches strong heat on the path of application.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 9:58 AM
Title: Re: Heartbreak
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
I am truly asking on behalf of others. I know some may not believe that.

Any info on this diet and behavior then?

Malcolm wrote:
Google  vasant lad, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 9:57 AM
Title: Re: Ticks
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
So I'm wondering: How did all these old yogis and forest meditators avoid ticks when meditating out in nature? Were there just less ticks back then? Were there just fewer tick-borne diseases? Or did they have the special tick repelling instructions?

Malcolm wrote:
When one reaches a certain level of samadhi, lice, ticks, etc., naturally leave the body.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 8:52 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
Indeed, cheerleading for political parties will do that to you. I've retired from politics for a few years now, politics used to be the art of the possible. I was elected twice to executive board of a Union with other 90,000 members world wide. Hardly qualifies me as a right winger. But what it does qualify me to opinion on is the dirty pool played on both sides of the argument.

Neither side has anybody's best interest at heart.

Regards

Malcolm wrote:
It’s not about parties. I am not a Democrat, nor a Socialist, etc. it’s about values. Right wing values suck much worse than even the most embarrassing PC over reaches.

40 years of Reaganism lead to this. And yes, the Pandemic in the US is precisely the fault of the GOP.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 7:47 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Kim O'Hara said:
Great work, Nemo, especially considering the climate you live in.


Kim

Malcolm wrote:
The problem on the NorthEast Of The USin general is that upgrades to older homes are prohibitively expensive, especially in rural areas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 7:35 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Dan74 said:
I think you hit the nail on the head, Malcolm, when you said "ignorance." But from where I stand, it is understandable - a concerted propaganda and disinformation campaign has been run for years, and not only by Fox & Co. The web of lies that has been spun has gotten so thick that it is little wonder you are in the post-truth world and people just choose what they want to believe, completely disregarding (distrusting) the facts.

Malcolm wrote:
No, this shifts responsibility and deprives them of their personal responsibility. These people are willingly complying with evil, harmful policies. We are not in a post-truth world. Facts are still facts, even if 30 percent of the country willfully ignores them, even though they know they are lying. This is how all authoritarianism gets a foothold and spreads. The cult of Xi, Modi, Trump, Orban, Putin are all identical in this respect.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 4:55 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
This is the level of ignorance we are dealing with here.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 4:47 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
Why the left who collectively consider themselves the most tolerant, when you scratch the surface actually the most intolerant?
Like the smell of your own farts too much?


Regards

Dan74 said:
I am not American, but I know that whatever it is, generalising about people isn't helpful.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, you don't live in America, so you really don't know the situation here and how bad it is.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 4:24 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Danny said:
Why the left who collectively consider themselves the most tolerant, when you scratch the surface actually the most intolerant?
Like the smell of your own farts too much?


Regards

Malcolm wrote:
"In order to maintain a tolerant society, the society must be intolerant of intolerance."
Karl Popper

For this reason right wing whinging about "tolerance" will fall on deaf ears, since the right wing is basically just a bunch of intolerant, racist, snowflake assholes. Not to mention the fact that right wing policies are actually harmful to the planet and the people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 4:10 AM
Title: Re: Three Dharmapala of Dudjom Tersar
Content:
pemachophel said:
In the Dudjom Tersar, I believe there is an "entrustment" for Damchen Chitor, not an "empowerment." At least that's what Lama Dawa said when He was giving it. I've also received a number of Dudjom Tersar Protector practices, especially Ma Ekadzati, from Loppon Orgyen Tenzin (at Enrico's in Austria), and, if I remember correctly, these were simply bestowed as lungs.

Just checked my empowerment file and the one's vbestowed by LOTR were all lungs.

Malcolm wrote:
A srog gtad is a kind of empowerment.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 4:09 AM
Title: Re: What are the most minimalist or simplest forms or schools of Buddhism?
Content:



Dgj said:
Consider this: to master a hua tou for example, which is not a complicated practice, people spend years working very hard. They attend retreats (hours upon hours of meditation for days). Even if that's all their teacher assigned them and told them not to read or study, it is intense and takes great effort, yet very simple to learn and do.

PadmaVonSamba said:
Yeah, but isn’t it usually when they stop trying so hard, that’s when they finally  “get it”
No?

Dgj said:
Not always. Hakuin tried his way to enlightenment, pushing incredibly hard all the way.

"Meditating With Koans" translated by JC Cleary is full of similar stories and is what Hakuin used as a guide.

Then there's the iron ball explanation:
It is like swallowing a red-hot iron ball. You try to vomit it out, but you can't.” — Zen Master Wumen
Great effort is part and parcel of koan study.

Malcolm wrote:
The simplest practice is one based on a gnosis free of proliferation, rather than all these other paths based on a mind possessing proliferation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 3:00 AM
Title: Re: Shower of Blessings GY
Content:
pemachophel said:
Loppon has jogged my memory. I believe the empowerment Lama Dawa gave was from Jamgon Kongtrul.

Malcolm wrote:
Makes sense too, since Mipham's White Lotus was inspired by the Kongtrul's terma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 2:38 AM
Title: Re: What are the most minimalist or simplest forms or schools of Buddhism?
Content:



Queequeg said:
Do good. Avoid evil.

Malcolm wrote:
You forgot a lines: Observe your mind.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 2:36 AM
Title: Re: Heartbreak
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
OK, and the solution?

Malcolm wrote:
Vata pacifying diet and behavior.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 2:10 AM
Title: Re: Three Dharmapala of Dudjom Tersar
Content:
Grigoris said:
Is there a specific empowerment that includes the three Dharmapala of the Dudjo Tersar:  Ekadzati (Ralchigma), Rahula and Dorje Lekpa?

Or is it that each one is received sperately?

Is there even a specific empowerment for the worldly protector Rahula, or is he given as part of a particular Yidam/Dharmapala mandala?

Malcolm wrote:
Rahula is not a worldly protector. He is a "wisdom" protector. Ekajati, Rahula, and Dorje Lekpa can be practiced as yidams, provided one has the empowerment for this.

There are many different empowerments for all three of these deities. The standard one is the seven protector empowerment by Longchenpa found in the Rinchen Terzod.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 2:08 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Grigoris said:
There are even people out there that believe that Trump's actions are going to cause him to fail to be re-elected...

Malcolm wrote:
The only hope that Trump has is an electoral college win. This is why he is promoting quarantine rebellions in swing states that went to the Dems in 2018.  He is hoping he can get enough disgruntled lumpen proletariats to get him another win, since he knows quite well he can never win through the popular vote. However, Arizona is looking increasingly like it is going to flip. If it does flip, it severely curtails his path even to an electoral college win.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 2:05 AM
Title: Re: Heartbreak
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
I am wondering what the physical and subtle basis is for heartbreak. I remember earlier in my life when I was heartbroken it felt like there was a pain or stiffness or blockage in the center of my upper chest... For instance, in cases of divorce, rejection, loneliness, isolation & pain, do you all know of good ways to work with this feeling, perhaps on a subtle level? Perhaps one of the chakras is blocked or something. May all beings benefit!

Malcolm wrote:
Disturbed vata or rlung.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 1:03 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:


Nemo said:
But I don't really think Biden is electable.

Malcolm wrote:
The alternative is far worse.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 23rd, 2020 at 12:00 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Wayfarer said:
Of course there are probably many better books on Madhyamika than Garfield’s but in the context of the discussion, his interpretation is preferable to Batchelor’s, because he takes seriously the aspirational aims of Buddhism and doesn’t try to repurpose it as a secular philosophy.  And as I mentioned there’s a link to a series of his lectures on the site at the moment.

Malcolm wrote:
Garfield updated his translation of MMK with his translation of Tsongkhapa's commentary on the MMK. Therefore, it is better to refer to the latter than the former.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 10:48 PM
Title: Re: Shower of Blessings GY
Content:
pemachophel said:
Terma,

I say there is an empowerment for Shower of Blessings only because my Teacher, Lama Dawa, gave an empowerment for it. During that empowerment, He did not say that it was actually an empowerment taken from somewhere else, as sometimes also Lamas do. However, at the time, I did not think to ask more about the provenance of this particular empowerment. Sorry.

Malcolm wrote:
He either gave you the empowerment of Kongtrul's Seven-line Supplication Treasure, or Apam's Seven Line Supplication Treasure. My guess it was the latter, since this was widely promulgated by HH Dudjom Rinpoche, Jikdral Yeshe Dorje.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 10:38 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:



Artziebetter1 said:
Thanks malcolm.

So,saving beings in samsara is a eternal endeavor?


Malcolm wrote:
If you never go beyond time, yes.

Artziebetter1 said:
the tathagatagarbha sutras say everyone will attain nirvana,but the avatamsaka sutra says that samsara is eternal.wich one is upaya and wich one is definitive?

Malcolm wrote:
Both are upaya.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 4:48 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:
Artziebetter1 said:
I thought the Dzogchen view was that thru its teachings all sentients will achieve irreversible buddhahood one day?

Malcolm wrote:
In this world billion world system; but there are infinite world systems with infinite sentient beings. Even if this number is static, and there are statements by the Buddha to the effect that the sattvadhātu does not increase or decrease, i.e., grow larger or become smaller, an infinite set can contain an infinite number, which while being fixed, cannot be counted.

Artziebetter1 said:
Thanks malcolm.

So,saving beings in samsara is a eternal endeavor?


Malcolm wrote:
If you never go beyond time, yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 3:01 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:
Artziebetter1 said:
I thought the Dzogchen view was that thru its teachings all sentients will achieve irreversible buddhahood one day?

Malcolm wrote:
In this world billion world system; but there are infinite world systems with infinite sentient beings. Even if this number is static, and there are statements by the Buddha to the effect that the sattvadhātu does not increase or decrease, i.e., grow larger or become smaller, an infinite set can contain an infinite number, which while being fixed, cannot be counted.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 2:57 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Okay, well I don’t feel the need to push the issue at the moment; but my first sentence is correct at least though right?

Malcolm wrote:
All sentient beings who make a connection with Dzogchen teachings will attain irreversible buddhahood, eventually.

Grigoris said:
Over an infinite quantity of time it essentially means that an infinite number of sentient beings will achieve Buddhahood, leaving an infinite number of afflicted sentient beings.

Malcolm wrote:
The actual teaching from the Sound Tantra states that at the end of this great eon, all sentient beings in this billion world system will attain buddhahood through Dzogchen teachings. The question is asked, "Where do the sentient beings of the next great eon come from, a) if all sentient beings in this world system attained buddhahood, and 2) without creating brand new sentient beings?" One answer is that not all sentient beings manifest and that there are an infinite number who are latent. The other more obvious answer, but not addressed by Longchenpa, is that there are infinite numbers of world systems, with infinite numbers of beings, and that those have no obstacle to being reborn in the billion world system that form after the next period of twenty void eons between great eons.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 2:03 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Okay, well I don’t feel the need to push the issue at the moment; but my first sentence is correct at least though right?

Malcolm wrote:
All sentient beings who make a connection with Dzogchen teachings will attain irreversible buddhahood, eventually.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 22nd, 2020 at 12:41 AM
Title: Re: will the 5 lights always be there?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
All sentient beings with a connection to Mahāsandhi are said to attain eventual irreversible Buddhahood.

Every other sentient being is said to attain a level of Buddhahood by or at the end of each mahakalpa; however, they can still be  ignorant at the beginning of the next mahakalpa.

Malcolm wrote:
No, this is not really how it is. This is a difficult point in Dzogchen. However, basically, the point is that as there are infinite sentient beings, they do not all take rebirth in a given eon; so in every eon there are plenty of sentient beings to go around.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 21st, 2020 at 2:37 AM
Title: Re: Karmic cause become gay
Content:
Varis said:
It's become a joke among people of my generation (I'm in my 20s) that many women my age are bisexual. While it's obviously not objective, the fact that the joke has caught on like wildfire suggests something I think.

Malcolm wrote:
Then there is the LUG phenomena, i.e., lesbian until graduation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 21st, 2020 at 2:07 AM
Title: Re: LN Ngondro requirements
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The reason why Sakyapas insist on empowerment first is that 1) it has to with the Sakyapa theory, articulated by Jetsun Drakpa Gyaltsen, that there are two approaches to entering secret mantra: a gradual one for less fortunate students, which is consistent with the Kadampa/Kagyu/Gelug graduated approach (rim gyis pa); and the sudden approach (cig car ba) for more fortunate students, where one is given the ripening empowerment with little or no preparation. 2) It has to with Sakya Pandita's assertion that one cannot be said it have a secret mantra guru without having received empowerment, and therefore, secret mantra practices like vajrasattva, mandala, and guru yoga are not appropriate for those who have no been ripened by empowerment. The Nyingmapas generally are more in accord with the Sakya POV, with some differences in terms of their understanding of direct introduction as a means of ripening, for Nyingmapas it is valid; but not for Sakyapas, who insist that direct introductions should only be given on the basis of having received a full major empowerment.

Varis said:
Very interesting. Thank you, Malcom.

Malcolm wrote:
I should also add, that i don't know anyone who ever managed to complete a ngondro without having, at some point during their ngondro, receiving a full empowerment or at least "a blessing" initiation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 21st, 2020 at 1:50 AM
Title: Re: LN Ngondro requirements
Content:


Varis said:
Sakyapas hit you with the mandala up front, it's the older way of doing things.

Malcolm wrote:
The reason why Sakyapas insist on empowerment first is that 1) it has to with the Sakyapa theory, articulated by Jetsun Drakpa Gyaltsen, that there are two approaches to entering secret mantra: a gradual one for less fortunate students, which is consistent with the Kadampa/Kagyu/Gelug graduated approach (rim gyis pa); and the sudden approach (cig car ba) for more fortunate students, where one is given the ripening empowerment with little or no preparation. 2) It has to with Sakya Pandita's assertion that one cannot be said it have a secret mantra guru without having received empowerment, and therefore, secret mantra practices like vajrasattva, mandala, and guru yoga are not appropriate for those who have no been ripened by empowerment. The Nyingmapas generally are more in accord with the Sakya POV, with some differences in terms of their understanding of direct introduction as a means of ripening, for Nyingmapas it is valid; but not for Sakyapas, who insist that direct introductions should only be given on the basis of having received a full major empowerment.

Varis said:
If we're being honest though, I think the Gelugpa approach of lam-rim prior to Vajrayana makes the most sense for westerners. Helps you develop a solid understanding of what this is all about.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't agree with this perspective. Vajrayāna first; life is short, time is passing, and we are living in time.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 21st, 2020 at 1:21 AM
Title: Re: LN Ngondro requirements
Content:


Grigoris said:
Why would contemplating the Four Thoughts be advanced?

Malcolm wrote:
Part of the shared preliminaries, so, suitable for beginners and advanced alike,
Refuge and bodhicitta?
These are unshared refuge and bodhicitta, since there is also a guru jewel, in addition to the usual three.

Grigoris said:
Accumulating merit through mandala offerings?

Malcolm wrote:
Mandala offerings are strictly found in HYT, their source is the Guyasamaja, and are actually a branch of guru yoga proper. Sometimes, they are placed before Vajrasattva, but generally, in most ngondros, they come after.

Grigoris said:
Okay, maybe the Vajrasattva part, but even then there is (as you rightly pointed out) no self-visualisation, so even in terms of tantra it is pretty "low" on the scale.  It is basically a purification practice to prepare one for Vajrayogini (for example), so...

Malcolm wrote:
Vajrasattva is from Yoga tantra. But the visualizations used in Ngondro (central channel, etc.) come from HYT.

Grigoris said:
So how, in your opinion, is it advanced?

Malcolm wrote:
One can realize the meaning of Dzogchen/Mahamudra through guru yoga alone. Not only is it advanced, it is the pinnacle of all practices. You don't really need anything else.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 21st, 2020 at 12:26 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
krish5 said:
I am very confused, more so than ever regarding the corona virus. My state re-opened pretty much everything, including pools, malls, and casinos. I know they have extra rules but still very concerned about this virus spreading more now, than ever. I am still pretty much staying in most of the time, except grocery shopping once a week and once or twice a week picking up food. But no matter how careful i am, i know am still at the mercy of this virus and people who might have it. I know the responsible thing to do is to keep this lifestyle up, of staying home, even though free to go out now, but it is not living really and i am becoming very lethargic and depressed staying home. So if this virus doesnt kill me, these other things will, the way it is going. I dont know if i am making sense, but can anyone who has more knowledge about this virus than me, give some advice, suggestions, how to go about living during a pandemic like this that doesnt seem to be going away. To balance trying to be safe and also to live some too, if that is possible. Thanks.

Malcolm wrote:
Wear a mask when you go into public. Wash your hands. Don't touch your face until you have washed your hands. Avoid the covidiots who think this is a "flu," "5G radiation," or who think that it can be prevented by ingesting or injecting bleach, UV light, taking Hydroxycholoroquine, and other such covidiocy.

If you are a practitioner of the Dharma, you need to reflect on the four thoughts, etc., devote yourself to practice. What else is there for a Dharma practitioner to do?

Cut down on watching cable news. Vote for Biden.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 20th, 2020 at 5:30 AM
Title: Re: Sattvic/Yogic Diet Challenge
Content:
Hermetic said:
Our friends like Malcolm think contrary to this.

Malcolm wrote:
I am a Doctor of Tibetan Medicine, and have studied Ayurveda extensively in India.

Do you have any idea how many different kinds of meat are described in such classics as the Charaka Samhita, etc.?

In addition to that, I have studied yoga and the Yoga Sutras with Srivatsa Ramaswami, the last remaining living disciple of Krishnamacarya. He made it very clear that in Yoga, the substance of one's diet is really of no importance at all. What is important is not to eat too much, so the body remains light. There is no mention of a "sattvic diet" in the Yoga Sutras. This idea comes from chapter 17 of the Bhagavad Gita (Feuerstein, Shambhala, 2011; pg. 291):
Foods [that] promotes life, [the factor of] lucidity, strength, health, joy, and delight, [and that are] savory, rich-in-oil, firm, and heart [-gladdening]—[these are] dear to the sattva-natured.

Foods [which are] pungent, sour, salty, hot, sharp, harsh, and burning—[these are] desired by the rajas-natured. [They] cause pain, grief, and disease.

And [food] which is spoiled, tasteless, putrid, stale, left-over, and unclean—[this] is food agreeable to the tamas-natured [individual].
You will notice here too an absence of mention of meat. Rather, the text focuses on qualities of food. Meat can be sattvic. It just depends on how it is prepared. Finally, most people cannot live on sattvic foods alone, but need some rajasic foods for various reasons.

Finally, my point is that Tibetan texts on yoga do not recommend that one avoid meat, on the contrary, they recommend that one eats some meat in order to build one's strength and immunity, given how harsh the Tibetan climate is.

Everything is relative, including diet. It is very stupid to base one's diet on religious idealism. You have no idea how many patients I have seen who have ruined their health following unhealthy vegetarian and vegan food regimens.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 20th, 2020 at 3:00 AM
Title: Re: Rigzin Tsewang Norbu Vajrasattva
Content:
Toenail said:
Is there a translation of this text available in English?

Malcolm wrote:
Not that I am aware.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 20th, 2020 at 1:41 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
krish5 said:
unless it all is politically based...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 20th, 2020 at 1:38 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:



Grigoris said:
It is just a matter of time before the infection rate sky-rockets again.  Especially in large urban centers.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, if we would just take down all those 5G antennas, the problem would be solved without the forced sterilizations posing as vaccines for a virus that does not exist....


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 11:36 PM
Title: Re: Validity of online empowerments
Content:
Toenail said:
They are often called branch empowerment etc. and the substances are often the same, like Vajra master initiation etc. Is it not enough to have received them once in a major empowerment in person?
Hi Malcolm,

not sure if you saw this edited part of my posting.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, as I said, it depends on the empowerment. If you want to receive a major empowerment, it is necessary to suffer through the endless repetitions, and so on.

That said, having received one, well, then unless you wish to receive another for some reason, there is no need.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 11:31 PM
Title: Re: Sattvic/Yogic Diet Challenge
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
...

Grigoris said:
When it comes to Ojas:  Is this something that is found in particular food, or is it that particular food assists us in producing ojas (like iron and folic acid is helpful for producing blood)?

Malcolm wrote:
Ojas is actually not found in food, per se. It is the final product if you will, of the seven-fold process of metabolism described in Ayurveda/TM: nutriment (rasa)-->blood-->flesh-->fat-->bone-->marrow-->seminal precursor. The last tissue, seminal precursor is then divided: the pure part becomes ojas, is concentrated mainly in the heart region, but is evenly spread through the body; the impure part is discarded as reproductive tissue in both men and women (until menopause).

The more nutritionally dense one's food is, the more ojas is available, provided these metabolic pathways are functioning properly. Vegetarians can have an ojas enhancing diet, provided they eat enough foods that are "sweet" in taste and oily in quality. Bitter and astringent foods tend to be poor supporters of an ojas-enhancing diets. Ojas-enhancing diets tend to be anabolic. There are certain instances where one will want to engage in a cleanse, which is basically a kind of catabolic diet, as a preliminary to engaging in rasāyāna, which is the consumption of herbs and foods that anabolic in nature, but which do not have high levels of ama, undigested or improperly digested foods (think arterial plaque). The downside of meat, of course, is that it can result in a lot of ama. This is why, when eating meat, it is better to eat it stewed, rather than frilled or fried.

For vegetarians, a kind of date and milk drink is very good for building ojas in depleted people. This is an excellent recipe: https://kripalu.org/resources/kripalu-recipe-immunity-building-ojas-milk


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 10:57 PM
Title: Re: Validity of online empowerments
Content:
Toenail said:
The ritual implements, are they really essential?

Malcolm wrote:
It depends on the kind of empowerment.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 10:29 PM
Title: Re: Validity of online empowerments
Content:



javier.espinoza.t said:
and how did peope webcasting the wang actually received it? was there a simil to the Guruyogas of WWT?

i never saw such thing. maybe i'm wrong. could someone corroborate this? maybe i have more empowerments that i thought (laughs)

heart said:
Yes, kind of similar to the wwt transmission. Basically every deity retreat he did there was a donwang, Mandarava, Ayu Khandro's Singhmukha, Changchub Dorje's Shitro and so on. Donwang's is just a visualisation, then Rinpoche did tri-lung for the sadhana.

/magnus

javier.espinoza.t said:
mm i thought the wang component was actualy approached through DI.

how is that "Donwang's is just a visualisation"?

Malcolm wrote:
He means that there are no ritual implements, etc., used, like a vase, laying out a mandala, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 10:27 PM
Title: Re: Sattvic/Yogic Diet Challenge
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Sunrise:

Contrary to your assumptions about yogic diets, you will frequently find in Tibetan yoga manuals recommendations to eat meat and also drink a little alcohol, and other nutritiously-dense foods, because these stimulate metabolism.

The kind of diet recommended in the advice you have posted here makes sense for a very hot climate. It does not make much sense for a very cold one. Context is everything.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 10:24 PM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:


Dan74 said:
The danger I see is the ever shrinking window of actual human contact and technology becoming the master, rather than the servant.

Malcolm wrote:
We have been very promiscuous as a civilization. In fact, social isolation has been the norm for most of human history, where most people have lived in isolated bands, and strangers met with suspicion; precisely because of contagious diseases to which there was no immunity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 3:01 AM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
Trump and Manafort used the term first:
Slight correction: the Washington Examiner used the phrase first.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 2:59 AM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
This just in:


https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/flynn-gleeson-proposed-schedule?fbclid=IwAR3bo3flA9jkDdwplI9wzc59vaKkbOMdzybJ-D1wHErvFKmHws3ZZNATSl8

Unknown said:
Flynn had pleaded guilty in December 2017 to lying to the FBI earlier that year about his Russian contacts. But in recent months, Flynn has tried walk back that plea and push allegations of prosecutorial misconduct — with his former boss, President Trump, cheering on the effort. The Justice Department’s move last month to try to drop the case is believed to be unprecedented, given the multiple occasions Flynn previously affirmed his guilty plea in court.

In appointing Gleeson, Sullivan has also asked him to examine whether Flynn committed perjury.

Gleeson told Sullivan on Monday that he would like until June 10 to file his friend-of-the-court brief addressing the question of whether the court can deny the DOJ request to dismiss the case and if so, the legal standard for doing so.

Gleeson also said by then he’d lay out “any additional factual development I may need before finalizing my argument in opposition to the government’s motion in this case.”

Gleeson did not elaborate on what areas of the factual record he may like to look at, or whether it would include how top DOJ officials went about reversing course in the case.

Finally, Gleeson told Sullivan that by June 10 he could also address “whether, based on the record before the Court, it should order the defendant to show cause why he should not be held in criminal contempt for perjury.”


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 1:20 AM
Title: Re: LN Ngondro requirements
Content:
heart said:
I never heard anyone teach you need a vajrayogini empowerment to do guru yoga, so who told you that you needed it?

/magnus

Grigoris said:
Did you read the opening post?

This discussion is in reference to the opening post.

heart said:
Yes, I did, there is no need for empowerment for self-visualisation in a guru yoga.

Malcolm wrote:
This is arguably false. If you gave not received empowerment or direct introduction, you have no guru at all.

But it is true that Nyingma and Kagyu Lamas give ngondro transmission to people who have not received either empowerment or direct introduction.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 19th, 2020 at 1:13 AM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:
Fa Dao said:
Yeah..thats what I thought..you didnt listen to either of them. Its that type of thinking and clinging to that narrative that will get Trump reelected

Malcolm wrote:
BTW, no one ever accused Trump of collusion. Collusion is not a legal term outside of antitrust law. Just to remind you:
[A] listener called in to ask about the legal meaning of the word “collusion.” Bharara and his two guests were quick to set the record straight; the term collusion, despite it frequent use, has no actual legal definition outside of antitrust law. Instead, Bharara raised a different question for his guests: If collusion has no legal meaning in the context of the Russia investigation, then “why has the word … captured everyone’s attention?” What’s more, how did a word with no legal relevance to the case become so associated with the Trump-Russia allegations?
https://www.lawfareblog.com/where-heck-did-term-collusion-come

So you must forgive us for being underwhelmed by some journalists who lately, surprise, realize that collusion is a meaningless term when applied to "Russiagate."

Trump and Manafort used the term first:
Mook did not use the word “collusion,” but the press, in reporting his comments, did. Within the hour, in an article timestamped at 9:55 a.m., the Washington Examiner reported that Paul Manafort and Donald Trump Jr, had responded to Mook’s allegations and “vigorously denied any kind of collusion between Trump Sr. and the Russian president.” (To be clear, Manafort denied “any ties” between Putin and the Trump campaign, and Donald Trump Jr. criticized Mook for “lie after lie.” Neither one of them mentioned “collusion.”) Ninety minutes later, at 11:27 a.m., ABC News repeated what it termed Mook’s “allegation of collusion between the campaign and Russia.” And three hours later, at approximately 12:35 p.m., Bernie Sanders’s campaign manager, Jeff Weaver, told CNN’s Jake Tapper, “If there was some kind of collusion between the Trump campaign and Russian intelligence or Russian hackers, that clearly has to be dealt with.”
Those of us with our wits about us never thought there was collusion or a conspiracy between the Trump campaign and the Russians.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:58 PM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:


Fa Dao said:
Yeah..thats what I thought..you didnt listen to either of them. Its that type of thinking and clinging to that narrative that will get Trump reelected

Malcolm wrote:
Nope, no need. Flynn screwed himself without any help from the FBI. It is not a narrative, these are just the facts of the case laid out in the charges leveled against him and the ensuing trials. As always, it is the coverups that get these guys in trouble, not what they may or may not have done.

The narrative that is being pushed in public is the one that Trump has been railing about for nearly four years, that Flynn was treated "unfairly." That narrative is complete rubbish.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:55 PM
Title: Re: LN Ngondro requirements
Content:
DechenDave said:
I received a surprise lung for the LN Ngondro During a weekend of teachings last year. The guru yoga section of the sadhana the lama read from contained a self-generation of Vajrayogini: https://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-masters/dodrupchen-I/longchen-nyingtik
Do I need a Vajrayogini empowerment to be able to do this?
As well, I have seen shorter LN Ngondro sadhanas which seem like they could be more suitable to daily practice. Does having received the lung for the sadhana I linked to enable one to select a shorter one or is a separate lung necessary?

Malcolm wrote:
In general, the empowerment in order to practice the outer and inner guru sadhanas of the Longchen Nyinthig is the called the Coronation of the Victor Empowerment. It is the empowerment for both the outer and inner guru sadhanas of LN. The secret and most secret guru sadhanas have their own empowerments.

Most people do not realize that the preliminary practices of the LN do not actually include the outer guru sadhana. The outer guru sadhana is combined with the ngondro text to make up what people now refer to as the LN Preliminaries.

So, there is in fact an empowerment for this outer guru sadhana, but it is not always given beforehand.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:42 PM
Title: Re: Dzam Ling chi sang
Content:
pemachophel said:
I was told it commemorates Guru Rinpoche's offering sang on top of Hepori and enrolling the spirits of Tibet as Dharma Protectors and Guardians.

Malcolm wrote:
Perhaps, all I know is that there is a long Gesar Ballad called Dzamling Chisang.

Toenail said:
Do you have a link or something to the text? Can also be Tibetan.

Malcolm wrote:
An account supporting Pema Chophel's statement can be found here:

https://www.tbrc.org/#library_work_ViewByOutline-O1GS577454CZ288083%7CW27932


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:35 PM
Title: Re: Karmic cause become gay
Content:
Norden said:
Hello guys

As far as I can tell Buddha never condemns gay people, Buddha taught us to have compassion to all living beings. But the question is, what is the karmic cause that makes someone become  a gay? Thanks in advance.

Malcolm wrote:
According to Abdhidharmakoṣabhaśya, a bardo being with excess desire whose fetus becomes a male fetus during the third week of gestation will likely end up becoming pandaka; one can infer that a bardo being with excess anger whose fetus remains female will become a female pandaka.

According to Ayurveda and Tibetan Medicine, gender preference is largely a biological outcome resulting from a uniform quantity of male and female reproductive tissues at the moment of conception.

The question of pandakas is really only an issue for monastic ordination. It is not a moral issue, though, naturally, there are non-gender specific issues with oral sex and anal sex described in the teachings on sexual misconduct.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:29 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
We seem to have slipped off topic here...

Grigoris said:
I dunno man.

Seems to me that Batchelor is the mongoloid spawn of the same colonialist attempt to Protestantise Buddhism, that started in Sri Lanka and lead to the Theravada Buddhism we have all come to recognise. it.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, but now we are talking about genocides, and so on. Its a little off-topic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 11:27 PM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:
Fa Dao said:
I know they're quite long but did anyone here actually listen to the videos I posted? Aaron Mate is a true blue Bernie supporter and Glenn Greenwald is about as old school liberal as they come...

Malcolm wrote:
The details of the Flynn case are extremely clear. He lied to the FBI. That in itself is a felony. He plead guilty to that charge. Then he changed his mind and perjured himself before a judge, under oath. These are the salient facts.

Mate and Greenwald's opinions don't really matter very much. Even if Russiagate were complete bollocks through and through, Flynn does not get a pass for lying, especially because he was appointed to a high office.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 8:53 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
We seem to have slipped off topic here...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 10:51 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
I think you're putting the Dharma in a completely anachronistic philosophical framework.  Practice of the Dharma doesn't particularly need philosophy.  Of course most serious practitioners spend a lot of time on philosophical questions, but they don't really have to. However if you want to ask what the Dharma thinks about 'secular values', you need to look at the question in the context of the Dharma as expounded by the Buddha and reflected in the canonical texts of your lineage. You don't need to read Kant to understand the Dharma, the Dharma has no interest in or relation to the European enlightenment, Christianity, etc. These topics have nothing to say that adds to the understanding needed to practice the Dharma, and by trying to relate the two to each other you enter the eponymous thicket of views, fetter of views etc. The question of whether one can hold 'secular values' independent of any non-empirically-observable beliefs is something in which that Dharma took very little interest.  The Dharma of Sakyamuni did engage to some degree with the other dharmas of its day, and explained why they didn't, in its view, lead to liberation.  But that's really all that it's concerned with: suffering, the ending of suffering, achieving liberation (expressed in different forms in the different vehicles).  It doesn't need to care about anything else, really, except the basics of how to provide the conditions for practice, how to relate to society while you practice, but advice of that kind is mostly around how to do that in a way that minimizes disruption to your practice.

Malcolm wrote:
Bravo. Well done. And any way, Buddhism accounts for ethics in the context of the ten natural nonvirtues, which it considers the core frame around which all secular and religious morals and ethics are constructed.

Most of these morals and ethics involve various interpretations of the constraints upon persons these ten natural nonvirtues impose upon our personal conduct.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 12:35 AM
Title: Re: Dzam Ling chi sang
Content:
pemachophel said:
I was told it commemorates Guru Rinpoche's offering sang on top of Hepori and enrolling the spirits of Tibet as Dharma Protectors and Guardians.

Malcolm wrote:
Perhaps, all I know is that there is a long Gesar Ballad called Dzamling Chisang.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 12:25 AM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:
Queequeg said:
I don't think Flynn knew he was an asset, if he was. Maybe he was an angle. Which made him a liability all the same.

The problem is not that Trump is some Manchurians.

Malcolm wrote:
Flynn was arrogant, and thought he could get away with lying to the FBI. He is not a very smart man.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 18th, 2020 at 12:24 AM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:



smcj said:
So yes, he was set up in a perjury trap.

Malcolm wrote:
Lying to the FBI is not perjury, but it is a felony.

The perjury aspect of this case begins when Flynn changes his story under oath, during his trial.

But there was no perjury trap.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 17th, 2020 at 10:47 PM
Title: Re: Aaron Mate and Glenn Greenwald on Gen Flynn/Russian collusion
Content:
Queequeg said:
Yeah. TL;DW.

Watched enough to get the general gist. The whole thing (Russiagate) was stupid.

Which is too bad, because it overshadowed a real problem that needed to be addressed - Russian interference in the 2016 election.

Russians and Chinese probably looked at both sides of the political divide and thought, "What a bunch of morons."

Malcolm wrote:
Flynn was not arrested and charged with contacting a Russian. He was charged with lying to the FBI, to which he pled guilty. He didn't need to lie. High government officials can and should be held to a higher standard of conduct.

Lying to a federal agent is a felony. No sympathy for Flynn.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 17th, 2020 at 10:32 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
What you can’t escape, unfortunately, is the way that Christian interests (or interests sailing under that flag of convenience) influence federal legislation and jurisprudence. Hobby Lobby was just the beginning. And those people only believe in states’ rights when it happens to be their states, their rights.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, New England is the source of American Democracy, however imperfect it may be. The reason the Bay Area, Portland, and Seattle are as liberal as they are has a great deal to do with the cultural connections of those cities to the East Coast. Come what may, New England will continue to observe our own traditions of direct and representative democracy. If the rest of the country become too insane, we will secede.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 17th, 2020 at 8:59 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
I don’t deny the possibility of benevolent Christians.  I have just encountered too many unpleasantly intolerant ones in many different countries, and the common thread is that they want you to change your practices and beliefs - completely consistent with their belief that you are going to hell and they have a duty to save you. This drives their organized political activities. These activities are very well documented in the US, less so elsewhere but they are socially malign wherever you encounter them.

I have never encountered a scientist, engineer, doctor etc who wanted to change my practices or beliefs, beyond the occasional casual conversation over drinks where they ask if I really get a lot out of visualizing myself with multiple heads and arms drinking blood from a skull cup.  Which, to the uninitiated, is actually a pretty reasonable question.

I just think attacking the straw man of secular ideology is extremely Quixotic - in the true sense of the word. We’ve had centuries of organized religions persecuting non-believers.  Why would we ever want to make common cause with them.

tobes said:
I don't think it's a strawman: secularism is definitely a rising force in many western-industralised nations. And there is a kind of nascent power in it, of the kind where if you are of a more religious persuasion, you are considered irrational or stupid. I'm not particularly 'religious' but I have had countless experiences of secularist people trying to change my beliefs.

But like Wayfarer, I'm in Australia - it is clearly more secular than the US, the numbers shows this.

PeterC said:
I agree geography matters here.

But look at it this way.  Are The Secularists trying to physically stop people going to medical procedures because they think those procedures contravene their beliefs?   Are they lobbying legislatures trying to get business exempted from civil rights obligations due to their scientific beliefs?   Are they protesting anime conventions because they disrespect physics?  Are they condemning gay people to imprisonment or condoning their killing because homosexuality is contrary to accepted biological reproductive practices?  Did they burn people at the stake for claiming that the earth was flat?  Did they enslave religious people because they thought it would improve them?

I could go on but I’m sure you see my point.  It is pretty absurd to claim oppression of religious people by secular viewpoints.  Australia is for the most part a fairly rational society.  However if you go to not just the US but large parts of Africa, the Middle East, Eastern Europe, bits of Latin America even, religious majorities imposing their views on others is a real and ongoing problem.

Malcolm wrote:
The East and West coast are largely secular, churches are empty or closing, etc. the Deep South and the Midwest are where Christians have a stronghold. I personally have no reason to spend time in places in America dominated by Christians/GOP. It might be hard to believe from someone who is not from here, but I have virtually no interaction with rabid Christians or Republicans. One benefit of living in Massachusetts. However, there are limited numbers of places I would live elsewhere in the US:  Northern NM, HI, VT, CO, and CA, that’s about it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 17th, 2020 at 8:50 PM
Title: Re: Dzam Ling chi sang
Content:
Toenail said:
Always wondered what the history behind this holiday is. I know it is where offerings to local deities etc are made, but is this a 'new' holiday or is there some story etc behind it?

Malcolm wrote:
It is connected with Gesar. There is a Gesar ballad with this as a theme


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 17th, 2020 at 3:51 AM
Title: Re: Counting mandala mudra offerings
Content:
pemachophel said:
climb-up,

So we're talking about the Yuthok Nyingthig ngondro? I've done that ngondro four times. First time I did it by the numbers. Other three times I did it by 7-day retreats. In all cases I offered a physical mandala. It never occurred to me to do it any other way.

Malcolm wrote:
Most people do not realize that the reason for the brevity of the Yuthog Nyinthig Ngondro is that it is written for busy doctors. It is not a short cut, like some people imagine. It is short, because the merit of practicing medicine is so great, doctors do not need to practice longer ngondros, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 16th, 2020 at 2:35 AM
Title: Re: I'm on
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
How would you know there are fewer? I'm not at all saying I'm one: I'm not. But the world is full of surprises.

Mirror said:
Traditional buddhist cultures are more and more materialist. Even Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche said, that in Bhutan young people are looking for happiness in a career and Jetsunma Tenzin Palmo said something like that about India. Japan, Thailand.... People choose rather comfort, than an ascetic way of life in monasteries. We can also see it in other religions. The faith of christians is weaker, than it was a few decades ago here in Europe. I was told by a Polish priest, that there are lesser people studying theology every year.

Malcolm wrote:
This is because the promise of religious salvation turned out to be a bogus lie, and Christian Theology is really just a house of cards.

In Dharma, the only person who can save you is yourself.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 15th, 2020 at 10:31 PM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Wayfarer said:
I have been researching space travel, and I’m convinced it will never happen, certainly not in our lifetimes, in any meaningful way.

Malcolm wrote:
Elysium is a somewhat dumb movie, but it shows one a possible future. Hint, the rich lose.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 15th, 2020 at 5:49 AM
Title: Re: I'm on
Content:
Mirror said:
I have a question. Why are there fewer and fewer highly advanced yogis or dharma practitioners? Why aren't there any yogis like Tilopa, Naropa, Marpa, Milarepa, etc. ? Is it because hedonism and materialism or that people lack love and compassion or wisdom?

Malcolm wrote:
Actually, there never are that many in any given generation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 15th, 2020 at 1:02 AM
Title: Re: Emptiness
Content:
shanyin said:
I have read Allan Carr's book. It didn't lead to myself quitting smoking or any progress on quitting smoking..

Sunrise said:
Sorry to hear that method didn't work for you. I really hope you find a method that works for you. Quitting smoking is really hard, but worth it a million times over. I found quitting smoking helps improve meditation as well, because smoking produces a subtle restlessness in the mind. Best of luck and never quit quitting.

Malcolm wrote:
Quitting smoking is easy. You just stop, throw away your cigs, and cease. That's what I did, 31 years ago. Cold turkey, no regrets, no trauma, no cravings, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 14th, 2020 at 11:35 PM
Title: Re: Question on role of samaya in multiple empowerments
Content:
tsultrimtarchin said:
Hello everybody!

Thank you so much to anyone who can help me with this question. This is a powerful doubt monster that has really been distracting me today.

Some history - Last year I took refuge with a lama and later did an Amithaba empowerment. There were very few requirements, but one was to try to recite the mantra, if nothing else, every day. I was in a pretty rough state during the time, and was mostly driven to do the practice through fear. As I came out of that state, I dropped the practice, as I associated it so strongly with my emotional state at that time.

Over the past few months, I have had the good fortune to connect with Green Tara practice, receive empowerment, and now do the Green Tara Sadhana practice I was taught everyday - with joyful enthusiasm! I received this from a different lama. Along with this, I practice vajra recitation as I was taught and objectless shamatha/nature of mind practice.

Today this doubt monster reared it's head while I was practicing my Green Tara sadhana - that I should be also fulfilling my requirement to do Amithaba. By taking refuge in Green Tara and practicing her Sadhana, as understand it, I am taking refuge in all the Buddhas and walking the path. But am I doing something wrong by not doing Amithaba as well? By approaching Green Tara with joyful enthusiasm, generating boddhicita, and attempting to understand her and my practice from the absolute view, I hope this is enough. My practice of Amithaba was a little tainted by my mind state at the time and I'm a little afraid to bring it into my daily practice again. Any suggestions or thoughts here are welcome!

Malcolm wrote:
When reciting one mantra, one is reciting all mantras. One should have this confidence.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 14th, 2020 at 11:28 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:


smcj said:
Hence the teachings on no-self and emptiness. The tetralemma tells us that our direct observations are completely deluded—including how we believe ourselves to be.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, no-- direct perceptions themselves are nonconceptual and generally, if one has health sense organs, nondeluded. The inferences drawn from direct perceptions can be mistaken, for example, mistaking mist for smoke and concluding there is a fire somewhere, or that the sun rises and sets, etc.

smcj said:
The lotus flower symbolizes purity arising out of filth. The yuck and muck that symbolism is referring to is our present awareness, right?

Malcolm wrote:
No, I would put it differently. The “muck” is the state of afflictions, which is not inherent to the lotus, and yet is the basis on which the lotus grows and blossoms. as Garab Dorje puts it in one tantra, “ The fire of pristine consciousness burns the fuel of affliction.”


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 14th, 2020 at 11:21 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
tobes said:
I agree Nemo - neoliberalism is the cause. Interestingly, Australia, under a very conservative govt, basically jettisoned the whole neoliberal caper in one stroke. Doubled unemployment benefits and....well......actually started governing. Haven't seen this since the 90's.

I'm sure it will return though.

Nemo said:
Ever the optimist. I'm not so sure. The last recessions were financial hiccups that trickled down to main street. Often a financial hiccup in a single country. This time main street has been decimated in every country on earth. This has never happened before. Generally it takes 6 to 18 months for the full extent of the damage to manifest. Many countries are over 20% unemployment today. In a year that could be 30%. There are no precedents or models for this kind of collapse. It's either socialism or barbarism and many neoliberals are already choosing socialism.

Malcolm wrote:
The only sensible choice.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 13th, 2020 at 4:26 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
smcj said:
What we consider as direct observation is a lot less reliable than we generally believe it to be.
Hence the teachings on no-self and emptiness. The tetralemma tells us that our direct observations are completely deluded—including how we believe ourselves to be.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, no-- direct perceptions themselves are nonconceptual and generally, if one has health sense organs, nondeluded. The inferences drawn from direct perceptions can be mistaken, for example, mistaking mist for smoke and concluding there is a fire somewhere, or that the sun rises and sets, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 13th, 2020 at 12:51 AM
Title: Re: Shingon: the Tibetan and Nichiren connection?
Content:
Meido said:
Also hope not to hijack this revived thread, but in skimming it I'm surprised to not yet see a clear refutation of the statement that "Shingon is the Japanese branch of Tibetan Buddhism," or of the idea that there was any Tibetan Buddhist connection to the formation of Nichiren's teachings.

I am hardly qualified to be the history police. But it bears repeating: the early esoteric teachings transmitted to Japan and preserved there today did not come from, or first pass through, Tibet.

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, they were brought by Vajrabodhi and Amoghavajra to China directly from Southern India via the sea route in the late 7th and early 8th century, and it is quite likely that the influence of Chinese Buddhists at the court of the Tibetan King stimulated his interest in importing Mantrayāna to Tibet during the latter half of the 8th century. The main shrine at Samye was in fact devoted to Mahavairocana, the same Buddha called Dai Nichi Nyorai in Shingon, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 13th, 2020 at 12:43 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Bad analogy. The sun does not rise in the east and set in the west. The sun does not rise or set at all. Instead, the earth rotates on its axis, giving one the perception that the sun rises and sets. morning and evening. It does neither. Thus, this is an instance where direct perception alone is not sufficient as an authority.

PeterC said:
True - bad example.  What we consider as direct observation is a lot less reliable than we generally believe it to be.

And if we want to take things to the extreme skeptics’ position - we could be brains in vats of chemicals in Alpha Centauri being manipulated by an evil alien. Though I’ve always found that argument a little unconvincing: the extreme skeptical position is irrefutable, but it’s also pointless.

Malcolm wrote:
My point is simply this: materialists only accept direct perception as authoritative, much like the modern Secular Buddhists. But in Buddhadharma, there are three separate yet mutually dependent authorities: direct perception, inference, and testimony.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 13th, 2020 at 12:40 AM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:
Wayfarer said:
But it does remain the case that the Buddhist conception of dharmas is momentary - arising and ceasing in rapid succession, rather than as enduring substances, doesn't it? Because the point about atoms in that sense, is that they are, first of all, permanent and unceasing, and secondly, not created, which I think would conflict with core Buddhist principles.

Malcolm wrote:
"Atoms" are called paramanu in Sanskrit. They are the smallest forms of matter. There are a number of interesting arguments concerning their nature and function; but in general, in Sarvāstivāda, they are considered to be partless, irreducible, and momentary.

The notions of substance/characteristic is found in the various arguments we see about water and its characteristics, wetness, where wetness is conceived as the svabhāva of water, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 11:44 PM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:
Nemo said:
If we are talking about failures then the possibility this was leaked from a lab in China doing gain of function experiments funded by America because it was too dangerous to do at home should be seriously considered. There is no proof it came from a seafood market near the Wuhan Institute of Virology in mid January and the CCP has been proven to have lied repeatedly to the point they have zero credibility. The circumstantial evidence for a leak is becoming quite significant.

Malcolm wrote:
Whatever the case may be, the horses have already left the barn.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 11:37 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
Yes.  But it is dangerous to be too certain of one's conclusions in epistemology. As Russell said in his introduction to the Tractatus, "as one with a long experience of the difficulties of logic and of the deceptiveness of theories which seem irrefutable, I find myself unable to be sure of the rightness of a theory merely on the grounds that I cannot see any point on which it is wrong."  I guess this is really my point. One can still live one's life and practice recognizing that there is a certain element of doubt.

Grigoris said:
If you want to relate to Buddhism as a philosophy/epistemology, yes.  If you want to approach Buddhism as a means of true liberation from suffering, then doubt is a serious obstacle.

PeterC said:
I agree, eventually you have to overcome doubt, but I personally think the way to achieve that is through experience rather than reliance on authority or reasoning. But different people will view this differently

Edit - doubt isn't something you can simply tell people to discard ex ante.  To do so would actually most likely cause them to doubt more: it's not particularly helpful to tell someone who doubts a point of doctrine that they just need to believe and then everything will make sense. In some cases you can gain understanding through practice, for instance in the four common preliminaries. But you can't *make* yourself believe something. You don't believe that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west because someone with a PhD has explained astrophysics to you.  You believe it because you have observed this day after day and gained confidence that it is the case. Then when the astrophysicist comes and explains to you the mechanism by which eclipses happen, you find it easier to accept because you have gained confidence in another part of his general description of how objects in the solar system is arranged. That way you have gained confidence in the system and the explainer of the system.  I know this isn't a great analogy but you see what I mean.

Malcolm wrote:
Bad analogy. The sun does not rise in the east and set in the west. The sun does not rise or set at all. Instead, the earth rotates on its axis, giving one the perception that the sun rises and sets. morning and evening. It does neither. Thus, this is an instance where direct perception alone is not sufficient as an authority.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 10:11 AM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:
Wayfarer said:
I have read a little about Sarvastivada - reality of past/present/future dharmas was how it was glossed to me.

But the broader point is this: that abhidharma arises from the analysis and contemplation of the constituents of experience. All of the steps of the 12-fold chain pertain to the elements of being or consciousness, do they not?

Malcolm wrote:
While it is the case that the Vibhanga, the most important Abhidhamma text, portrays dependent origination as being strictly a process of consciousness, Abhidharma presents dependent origination in cosmological terms, as well as experiential terms.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 9:48 AM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The word "dharma" derives from "dhṛ," "to hold, to bear," and generally, among ten definitions of "dharma," the one relevant here is "bearer of characteristics."

Wayfarer said:
So they are comparable to the ‘substance and attribute’ model of Aristotelian metaphysics? I had always been told that Buddhism eschewed such notions.

Malcolm wrote:
If you study Indian Abhidharma, you will discover that substance/attribute correspondence is a tenet of the Sarvastivadin school, the dominant Indian Buddhist school of metaphysics (Abhidharma).


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 9:39 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:



PeterC said:
I'm giving him a small loophole and it's not what he's saying but: there are things in which we have at most inferential knowledge before we have developed abilities on the path of seeing. We can't *know* them in the sense of knowledge being justified true belief. Even if I believe in rebirth I can't assert that I know it.

Malcolm wrote:
This implicitly negates inference and testimony of unimpeachable witnesses as pramāṇas. Just sayin'.

PeterC said:
Not really.  Just recognizes that the modern definition of “knowledge” differs from the definition of valid inference at the time.  One can say that one infers things without knowing them.  Small point but a source of much confusion.  I don’t know, for instance, that the earth goes around the sun.

Malcolm wrote:
Only if you give in to the definition of truth which is derived from materialist schools.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 3:41 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Aemilius said:
Oil that fries your burger can run your car

Malcolm wrote:
Diesel engines only.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 3:38 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


Pero said:
Why not? Plenty of people come to the teachings from other religious backgrounds.

Malcolm wrote:
So there is  a causal link to praying to god and then getting direct introduction? How does that work? Basically Pero, if you go to receive Dzogchen teachings, you are an Ex-whatever. Oh, sure, you can maintain outward form of a Christian, etc., but if your view does not change, you will not realize the meaning.

Nemo said:
Lately I wonder if creator Gods are demons.

Malcolm wrote:
Gnostics certainly thought so.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 12th, 2020 at 12:33 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
I personally think that the whole 'secular buddhism' idea is nonsensical and collapses quickly into ersatz psychotherapy.  A bit like a high-end spa with a statue of the Buddha in the corner.  But Batchelor does have a valid argument in his response to Wallace where he (sort of) says that it's possible to practice the Dharma without having taken a definite position of belief on certain questions.  I think there's something in that, there are topics on which one can remain in doubt and still practice. Moreover reading Wallace criticizing Batchelor for projecting ideas onto the words of the Buddha...we are all on very thin ice when we start doing that, including Wallace himself.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, one can certainly practice the brahma viharas. One can certainly practice śamatha. Insight? Well, since we know already that the Buddha declared rebirth denial or doubt a wrong view, that does not really seem possible.

PeterC said:
I'm giving him a small loophole and it's not what he's saying but: there are things in which we have at most inferential knowledge before we have developed abilities on the path of seeing. We can't *know* them in the sense of knowledge being justified true belief. Even if I believe in rebirth I can't assert that I know it.

Malcolm wrote:
This implicitly negates inference and testimony of unimpeachable witnesses as pramāṇas. Just sayin'.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 10:55 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
smcj said:
...the Buddha declared rebirth denial or doubt a wrong view..
The Buddha said doubt was wrong view? That mean conviction is a necessary prerequisite? Denial as wrong view I understand fully, but ‘conviction‘ has multiple shades of gray. It seems problematic to require a certain shade of gray before you start.

Malcolm wrote:
"Conviction" aka faith, means you have to take someone else's word for it. Buddhadharma recognizes three sources of authority, not merely one, as some modern interpreters of Buddhism maintain. What are the three? Direct perception, inference, and testimony of reliable witnesses. These days, many people interested in Buddhism have been mislead to believe that only direct perception is a valid authority. However, this is actually the position of the Ancient Indian materialist school, the Carvaka/Lokayatis.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 10:15 PM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:


Wayfarer said:
Daniel Dennett's first book, Consciousness Explained, was commonly parodied - by other philosophers!  - as 'Consciousness Ignored', or 'Consciousness Explained Away'.

Malcolm wrote:
How about, "Mansplaining Consciousness."?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 10:12 PM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:


Wayfarer said:
Bolds added. The crucial point is, the dharmas refer to 'experience' - they are elements of experience, not of an external or 'mind-independent' object, like the atoms of Greek philosophy.

Malcolm wrote:
Try telling that to the Sarvāstivādins and Sautrantikas. All these definitions are not predicated upon native definitions of the term "dharma," and none of the authorities cited for their translation equivalents using native definitions in formulating their equivalents.

The word "dharma" derives from "dhṛ," "to hold, to bear," and generally, among ten definitions of "dharma," the one relevant here is "bearer of characteristics."

So, in fact, when it comes to things like the constituents of the material aggregate, indeed, the five material objects of the five material senses are indeed held to be external or "mind-independent" objects. And, beyond the four elements, there is a further derivation of the elements into secondary or derived matter. This is all explained in the Dhātu chapter of the Kośabhaṣya.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 10:01 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
PeterC said:
I personally think that the whole 'secular buddhism' idea is nonsensical and collapses quickly into ersatz psychotherapy.  A bit like a high-end spa with a statue of the Buddha in the corner.  But Batchelor does have a valid argument in his response to Wallace where he (sort of) says that it's possible to practice the Dharma without having taken a definite position of belief on certain questions.  I think there's something in that, there are topics on which one can remain in doubt and still practice. Moreover reading Wallace criticizing Batchelor for projecting ideas onto the words of the Buddha...we are all on very thin ice when we start doing that, including Wallace himself.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, one can certainly practice the brahma viharas. One can certainly practice śamatha. Insight? Well, since we know already that the Buddha declared rebirth denial or doubt a wrong view, that does not really seem possible.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 9:59 PM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:


jmlee369 said:
There are probably no records of beings taking birth as plants, however there are plenty of stories of beings taking birth as plant spirits.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes. But this was never in dispute.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 4:56 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
Minobu said:
To see Buddhists this uptight about the other political party is amusing to watch.

Tlalok said:
I rejoice that some people have the good fortune to see American politics as a kind of team sport, and not a constant battle with people that regard you as subhuman savages and relish stories of your brothers and sisters being murdered, violated, and humiliated. Must be great...

Malcolm wrote:
Minobu must be white.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 12:59 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
PeterC said:
He even opposed anti-lynching legislation when it was first suggested.

Malcolm wrote:
Speaking of lynchings, it still happens in Georgia:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 12:54 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
Minobu said:
Until america gets over  it's never ending divide and conquer politics racism will always be.

The republicans don't like the Dems and the dems as seen on this site seethe when it comes to republicans.

Malcolm wrote:
Not a Democrat, actually. However, the GOP is most dangerous and destructive political party on the planet right now, and have been for some decades.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 11th, 2020 at 12:45 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
I would say we have gone way way way off topic...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 11:56 PM
Title: Re: Vesak 2020
Content:
tobes said:
Yeah, so maybe it also about increasingly liminal boundaries between previously very disparate traditions...

Quite intentional perhaps, in many cases.

But basically: Vesak is usually May, Saka Dawa is usually June.

Malcolm wrote:
Unless you are following the Tshurlug system, in which case Saga Dawa is generally in May.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 11:44 PM
Title: Re: Jang-chog / Neydren
Content:
mandog said:
Are Jangchog and Neydren the same ritual?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 11:42 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
But I was talking about Dzogchen. Starts with Three Statements, no?

Malcolm wrote:
If I landed on an alien planet, where there was no knowledge of Buddhadharma, say somewhere like North Dakota, I would start where ChNN always started: suffering. That's just me, however. YMMV.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 11:28 PM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:


Fa Dao said:
Apparently you are not familiar with US history. It was the republicans that freed the slaves, and the democrats that started the civil war, the KKK and also attempted to ban blacks from having 2nd amendment rights. This was going on up until the 60's when they tried to shut down various civil rights movements.

Malcolm wrote:
First of all, it was only the Southern Democrats that led the secession. Among Northern Democrats there were two factions: War Democrats who supported Lincoln's military policies, and Copperheads, who opposed them. Already, during the formation of the Republican party in the 1850's, many Northern Democrats joined it. Not only this, but in 1864, the Republican Party and the War Democrats formed a Unionist Party, called the National Union Party, to re-elect Lincoln. It fell apart right after the Civil War when most Republicans abandoned it.

So, are we living in the era pre-1965 or post 1965? The reason I ask is that as far as I know, there was a realignment in the late 60's, causing racist Southern Democrats to switch their allegiance to the GOP, which in turn allowed Nixon to succeed in his election bid by using the so-called Southern Strategy. This of course means that now the GOP is the party with the most KKK in its DNA.

That being said, since the 1930's, Northern Democrats were the union party, liberal, and devoted to FDR's New Deal. Republicans on the other hand were the business party, and largely in opposition to the New Deal, and later, the Great Society.

The KKK was generally opposed to unions, especially integrated unions, and generally opposed the New Deal. Under FDR, the Democratic Congress passed the National Labor Relations Act in 1935. We can understand that Southern Democrats were generally opposed to the New Deal.

Prior to Reagan, there were conservatives in both parties, who formed what was known as the Conservative Coalition, which dominated Congress until the 1970's, and who opposed and undermined the New Deal as much as they were able.

Since Reagan, conservatives have largely moved into the GOP silo, while liberals have moved into the Democratic silo.

So, characterizing the modern Democratic and Republican Parties in terms of their pre-1965 and 1980 history is excessively misleading, since it is complicated, and cannot be simply quantified into two sections: Democrats = KKK; Republicans = 13th Amendment.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 8:57 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
Wayfarer said:
It seems a stunt to me. Maybe it would be a real news item if shooting broke out.

Malcolm wrote:
It wasn’t a stunt. I don’t think you grok racial relations in the US.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 4:45 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:


Tlalok said:
The U.S. Army's definition of a Low-Intensity Conflict (LIC):
... a political-military confrontation between contending states or groups below conventional war and above the routine, peaceful competition among states. It frequently involves protracted struggles of competing principles and ideologies. Low-intensity conflict ranges from subversion to the use of the armed forces.  is waged by a combination of means, employing political, economic, informational, and military instruments. Low-intensity conflicts are often localized, generally in the Third World, but contain regional and global security implications.
The situation of racial violence in the US absolutely meets this definition.

Also America is engaged in like 30 wars at any given moment lol, they're just terrible at it.

Malcolm wrote:
Under this definition, the President of the United States is waging a LIC against America.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 3:46 AM
Title: Re: Historically, how did people deal with severely disabled babies? How did they interpret the karmic consequence?
Content:



LhakpaT said:
What?! Next, you're gonna tell me the Greeks didn't all fight in slow motion and kick ambassadors into wells either!

Grigoris said:
The only thing that is true in "300" is that all Greek men have six packs...

fat greek guy.jpg

Dan74 said:
I don't think a Dharma forum is an appropriate place to post semi-nude pictures of yourself. I mean you may be looking for love and that's fine, but is this really the right venue?

Malcolm wrote:
How can you call that man half-nude? I mean, look at the Jesus bling.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 1:39 AM
Title: Re: [Video] Walking Around Mt.Hiei-zan Enryaku-ji Temple（Kyoto, Japan）
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The place I realized I was a Buddhist, August, 1986.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 1:01 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
Tlalok said:
'd also say that America has been in a race war since at least 1861,

tingdzin said:
Fringe leftist hyperbole. If you think that America is engaged in a war, you have never been within anywhere near a real one.

Malcolm wrote:
In fairness, you should read Heather Cox Richardson's How the South Won the Civil War:
While the North prevailed in the Civil War, ending slavery and giving the country a "new birth of freedom," Heather Cox Richardson argues in this provocative work that democracy's blood-soaked victory was ephemeral. The system that had sustained the defeated South moved westward and there established a foothold. It was a natural fit. Settlers from the East had for decades been pushing into the West, where the seizure of Mexican lands at the end of the Mexican-American War and treatment of Native Americans cemented racial hierarchies. The South and West equally depended on extractive industries-cotton in the former and mining, cattle, and oil in the latter-giving rise a new birth of white male oligarchy, despite the guarantees provided by the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments, and the economic opportunities afforded by expansion.

To reveal why this happened, How the South Won the Civil War traces the story of the American paradox, the competing claims of equality and subordination woven into the nation's fabric and identity. At the nation's founding, it was the Eastern "yeoman farmer" who galvanized and symbolized the American Revolution. After the Civil War, that mantle was assumed by the Western cowboy, singlehandedly defending his land against barbarians and savages as well as from a rapacious government. New states entered the Union in the late nineteenth century and western and southern leaders found yet more common ground. As resources and people streamed into the West during the New Deal and World War II, the region's influence grew. "Movement Conservatives," led by westerners Barry Goldwater, Richard Nixon, and Ronald Reagan, claimed to embody cowboy individualism and worked with Dixiecrats to embrace the ideology of the Confederacy.

Richardson's searing book seizes upon the soul of the country and its ongoing struggle to provide equal opportunity to all. Debunking the myth that the Civil War released the nation from the grip of oligarchy, expunging the sins of the Founding, it reveals how and why the Old South not only survived in the West, but thrived.
Richardson is a professor of American History at Boston University. She writes daily letters which are really amazing, to be perfectly honest. https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com.


And Democracy in Chains by Nancy Maclean:
Nancy MacLean is the William H. Chafe Professor of History and Public Policy at Duke University, and the award-winning author of several books. Her scholarship has received more than a dozen major prizes and awards, and has been supported by fellowships from the American Council of Learned Societies, the National Endowment for the Humanities, the National Humanities Center, the Russell Sage Foundation, and the Woodrow Wilson National Fellowships Foundation.

Her most recent book is Democracy in Chains: The Deep History of the Radical Right’s Stealth Plan for America. Booklist called it “perhaps the best explanation to date of the roots of the political divide that threatens to irrevocably alter American government.” The Guardian said: “It’s the missing chapter: a key to understanding the politics of the past half century.”

A New York Times bestseller, Democracy in Chains was a finalist for the National Book Award, and the winner of the Los Angeles Times Book Award in Current Affairs, the Lannan Foundation Cultural Freedom Award, and the Lillian Smith Book Award. The Nation magazine named it the “Most Valuable Book” of the year.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 12:27 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
tkp67 said:
It seems to me that this plant does not suffer from the delusion of a projected self

Malcolm wrote:
Generally, insentient things do not suffer, since they have no mind with which to experience pain.

tkp67 said:
generally, however not all insentient things are living and an essential part of the fabric of one's existence.

Malcolm wrote:
All insentient things, living or dead, lack consciousness, which is the point. The point is not whether they are essential for our own existence.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 12:12 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
haha said:
Current scientific understanding has shown that plants do communication through their roots.

Malcolm wrote:
Machines communicate through wires.

haha said:
They communicate about hostility and friendship. They do read the soil nature/information, etc.

Malcolm wrote:
As living beings, albeit, nonsentient, plants respond to the conditions present where they grow.

I have already provided a citation above where the Buddha defines plants as nonsentient.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 10th, 2020 at 12:10 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
tkp67 said:
It seems to me that this plant does not suffer from the delusion of a projected self

Malcolm wrote:
Generally, insentient things do not suffer, since they have no mind with which to experience pain.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:55 PM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:


ItsRaining said:
Just a brief google says Paul Reps was a student of a Shaivite mystic, doesn't seem like a good representation of what more "orthodox" Zen is like.

Malcolm wrote:
Reps encountered Zen while he was stationed in Japan after WWII. His book was one of the very first book on Buddhism I ever read, apart from Three Pillars by Kapleau, as well as Meditation in Action (which contains the first Dzogchen text by Jigme Lingpa I ever read) and the Myth of Freedom by Trungpa. But frankly, in 1978, there were not a lot of books on Buddhism yet.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:51 PM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:


Queequeg said:
Anyway. I'll check that Park out.

Malcolm wrote:
There is a very funny remark by Kumarajiva on Chinese translations, including his own, "[W]hen we translate Indian languages into Chinese, we lose the rhythm of the sentences. Although the overall meaning may be delivered, there is a great difference in literary flavor. It is like giving chewed food to others: the food not only loses its taste, but also makes them vomit." How Buddhism Acquired a Soul on the way To China, pp.5

That's pretty much how I feel about all Buddhist translations from any primary Dharma language into English, including mine.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:40 PM
Title: Re: Uploading the ego to the cloud
Content:


Kim O'Hara said:
I know, and that's basically where I came in, saying that we don't know enough to rule out the possibility of fully sentient AI.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure we do. Sentient beings are self-organizing. AI's can never be, because they are manufactured. Supposing a machine/network achieved sentience, it could not be called an "artificial intelligence" because its property of being sentient would be emergent, not fabricated.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:30 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Let's say you go somewhere there is no religious tradition, like an alien world with no history of any Faith. What are you going to talk about to explain Dzogchen? What would be the source of those words and actions?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, the natural thing would be to start with suffering, its cause, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:27 PM
Title: Re: Emptiness
Content:
shanyin said:
What does emptiness have to do with meditation?

Viach said:
Emptiness is what arises from your practice of meditation, and not what you should meditate on.

LastLegend said:
We can also start with non-dual emptiness (what’s already present).

Malcolm wrote:
"Nonduality" is just a meaningless slogan.

Emptiness is neither dual nor nondual, since it is something uncompounded. The notions of unity and multiplicity do not apply to emptiness, space, or cessation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:26 PM
Title: Re: Historically, how did people deal with severely disabled babies? How did they interpret the karmic consequence?
Content:
Boomerang said:
If a baby had a disability that made independence impossible, for example severe mental retardation, how would Tibetans deal with it?

Malcolm wrote:
As kindly as possible.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 11:01 AM
Title: Re: Vesak 2020
Content:
tobes said:
I always get confused by this. I know the Theravadins have a different date, a month earlier. I checked the FPMT calendar a while back, and they have it locked in for June. But it seems a lot of other Tibetan Buddhists are celebrating it today. What's the deal?

Malcolm wrote:
Vesak is the Theravadin holiday. Their calendar follows the Chinese lunar calendar, which is a month ahead of the Phuglug calendar in Tibet (the Tshur lug corresponds with the Chinese lunar year). The Phuglug is followed by everyone In Tibetan Buddhism but the Karma Kagyus. We call our holiday Saga Dawa, as the fourth month is called Vaisakha in Sanskrit.

Internationally, most Buddhists follow the Theravadin date.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 10:54 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
All of what you say may be true, but I have run into Zen and Chan Buddhists whose views could be differentiated from atmavada if you had a crowbar. Indeed Reps’ Zen Flesh, Zen Bones contains in its appendix a translation of a brief shaivaite tantra.


ItsRaining said:
The book while I haven't read the whole thing, seems to have a lot a problems in the later section on Chan Buddhism. He quotes Zongmi and Yanshou

Zongmi
[This true] nature is like space; it is not to be added to or reduced. There is no need to add [virtues]. Once one stops karmic action but fosters shen at every time and everywhere, the embryo of sainthood develops and manifests its natural mystery. This is true awakening, true practice and true realization.

The author says Zongmi can be read as either advocating for a self like some pre 5th century Buddhists or one that is more in line with post Zhiyi Buddhists that understand the more orthodox position on self but I don't since the former reading is possible if Zongmi's other works are cited.
Zongmi's own explanation of the "true nature" which in his commentary on the Awakening of Faith he clarifies is not a "self" but rather emptiness. Here's one section where he uses the Three Natures to explain the true nature. (True is also a way of saying Suchness since they are written the same way in Chinese) Since Zongmi explains the true nature to be emptiness and permanence is said to be non-changing as the emptiness doesn't arise or perish I'm not sure how it could be in line with the author's view on how Self is exppained by earlier Buddhists.

Also, fostering shen is a stock phrase in Chinese that means to be at rest, the author didn't seem to mention this.

Why is the deluded nature said not to neither arise or perish? It is because there is no dharma to arise nor perish like the snake imputed on a rope. The dependent nature arises yet does not arise and perishes yet does not perish like the rope  imputed on hemp. The perfected nature is the middle without the two kinds of dharmas previously mentioned like hemp with neither rope or snake imputed.... From leaving the previous attachments of self and dharms this perfected is suchess so it is said to not be arising or perishing.....

So the Perfect Awakening state: the nature of extinction of the Tathagatas is without start or end. Hence the next line state: The nature of mind is neither arising or perishing and it neither arises in a previous moment nor perishes in the next and it permanent. This is the explanation on the non-change of the true mind.

Yanshou:
Being attached to illusory suffering, one seeks liberation; wishing forthe [intellectual] capacity of saints, one attempts practice. However,
all these are actions of the illusory self, i.e., discrimination by sensory consciousnesses. For this reason, when the Great Hero appeared
[in this world], he showed only the correct tenet: destroying the illusory self, [he] revealed the gate towards the true self; rejecting sensory consciousness, [he] directed [living beings] to the way towards pure consciousness. The true self and pure consciousness are equality [as taught in the *Ratnakàrandaka-vyüha\. By means of pure consciousness, one eliminates discrimination; [by means of] the true self, one is not attached to the senses. Since discrimination has gone, differences disappear by themselves; since there is no sensory attachment, equality appears by itself.19 In short, the concept of self in Chan Buddhism
The book says in Chan realising true nature or Buddha is the same as realising a real self that is the essence of mind and the agent of though and creation here citing Yanshou, however, this is not what Yanshou or Zongmi previously defines essence of mind or Buddha Nature. Previously Zongmi defines the true nature as emptiness - a lack of arising and perishing in dharmas so it can be that this is a agent of mind. Unless the quality of not arising could think. Yanshou defines essence of mind the same way.

To say the essence of mind is a kataphatic explanation. Since all dharmas are without essence, this is the true nature of mind. Essence is therefore essencelessness, this is a apophatic explanation.

So Yanshou does not define nature of mind as something that can be said to be Self unless having a lack of svabhava is defined as self. In the Zong Jing Lu he rarely brings up the terms True Self or Shen the author seems to be cherry picking one paragraph from the whole text. He only brings it up since he was explaning on Buddhas teach according the attachments of the students so that he teaches no-self but also self at times, Yanshou then uses it creatively as descrbing the true mind since the Buddha used it to describe Nirvana.

Had Yanshou actually been concerned with a true self or shen he would have written about it in the other fasicles of the text but instead in the areas focusing on true nature, mind or "pure consiousness" he wrties about how it is empty, withou svabhava, fixed characeristics, etc


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 5:07 AM
Title: Re: Countdown to a race war?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/y3zmj5/the-boogaloo-bois-are-bringing-their-ar-15s-and-civil-war-ideology-to-the-lockdown-protests

Unknown said:
The younger, shitposting face of the armed far-right — often called “boogaloo bois” — have been showing up at anti-lockdown protests across the U.S., toting AR-style rifles and wearing their trademark Hawaiian shirts and leis.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 4:10 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
inferential reasoning...

He basically claims that differences in understanding in Indian Buddhism and Sino-Japanese Buddhism boil down to acceptance or rejection of ontological reductionism, with the Indians employing ontological reductionism as their principal approach, and Chinese Buddhists largely rejecting the ontological reductionism of the Indian Buddhist tradition in toto.

Queequeg said:
Can you give an example of inferential reasoning as found in Indian Buddhism? Just curious what sort of arguments this refers to.

Malcolm wrote:
the old smoke behind a hill indicates fire.


Queequeg said:
And examples ontological reductionism?

Malcolm wrote:
The five aggregates negate the idea that there is a whole. He uses this example specifically as an instance of ontological reductionism.


Queequeg said:
He also states in the book that Chinese Buddhists unwittingly imported an atman back in Buddhism because of the Daoist underpinnings of Chinese civilization, pinning a complex of arguments on this notion, which he defends through an interesting walk through translation theory, comparative analysis and review of Indian Buddhism with Buddhism as it was translated into Chinese and so on. It is a very interesting book.
I recall reading medieval primary texts (in translation), can't remember if Chinese or Japanese, but they seemed to be aware that transmission was confused in the earlier centuries of Buddhism's introduction to China particularly because translations often relied on Daoist terminology, and also because the translators were self consciously presenting Buddhism as a contrast to Daoism. IIRC, the argument went that the encounter with Buddhism actually provoked Daoist thinking to become more sophisticated in response to Buddhism, surreptitiously adopting Buddhist ideas in the process - I think the language used was to accuse Daoists of stealing the ghee. I think the comments were made more generally as a way to praise Kumarajiva and his translations into Chinese, which the author argued was a correct transmission.

Malcolm wrote:
Park is making the argument that assumptions embedded in Chinese choices of equivalents were never actually corrected, despite attempts by Kumarajiva, and others such as Zhiyi, to do so. He points to instances which follow Zhiyi, etc. where Chinese translators were still using terms like shen and so on. You will want to read this book.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 2:27 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:



Queequeg said:
I could have written that more clearly. Yes, this.

Malcolm wrote:
While there are problems with Sino-Japanese concepts of self, as eloquently illustrated by the late Jungnok Park in his How Buddhism Acquired a Soul on the Way to China, the idea of all phenomena possessing buddhanature that we see frequently mentioned in Sino-Japanese Buddhism is not a problematic at all, if understood as Nāgārjuna states it in the MMK, "Whatever is the nature of the Tathāgata, that is the nature of the world. As the Tathāgata has no nature, the world has no nature."

Queequeg said:
That's how I've taken these assertions of universal buddhanature - its the "positive" language of tathagatagarbha teachings. Emptiness is also the case. That said, I am aware that buddhanature is in some streams of thought tantamount to a soul - the true Atman some see in the Parinirvana Sutra, for instance (disregarding all that denial of such substance throughout the text).

Anyway. I'll check that Park out.

Malcolm wrote:
Pp. 223-224 summarize his whole argument very neatly.

The basic argument he makes is that while Indians relied upon both direct perception (which he calls empiricism, though he mistakenly claims that Indians reject direct perception with respect to perceiving emptiness, etc.) and inferential reasoning (which he simply calls "reasoning"), the Chinese, according to him, generally rejected inferential reasoning with respect to understanding ultimate truth.

He basically claims that differences in understanding in Indian Buddhism and Sino-Japanese Buddhism boil down to acceptance or rejection of ontological reductionism, with the Indians employing ontological reductionism as their principal approach, and Chinese Buddhists largely rejecting the ontological reductionism of the Indian Buddhist tradition in toto.

He also states in the book that Chinese Buddhists unwittingly imported an atman back in Buddhism because of the Daoist underpinnings of Chinese civilization, pinning a complex of arguments on this notion, which he defends through an interesting walk through translation theory, comparative analysis and review of Indian Buddhism with Buddhism as it was translated into Chinese and so on. It is a very interesting book.

Similar issues arise in Tibetan Buddhism too, where Tibetan scholars articulate arguments that would be outright rejected by their Indian forbears, based on how words translated into Tibetan are read by Tibetans, and their consequent assumptions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 12:32 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:



Queequeg said:
I could have written that more clearly. Yes, this.

Malcolm wrote:
While there are problems with Sino-Japanese concepts of self, as eloquently illustrated by the late Jungnok Park in his How Buddhism Acquired a Soul on the Way to China, the idea of all phenomena possessing buddhanature that we see frequently mentioned in Sino-Japanese Buddhism is not a problematic at all, if understood as Nāgārjuna states it in the MMK, "Whatever is the nature of the Tathāgata, that is the nature of the world. As the Tathāgata has no nature, the world has no nature."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 12:14 AM
Title: Re: What possible reason could there be to study or practice Buddhism if arising and ceasing do not occur?
Content:


LastLegend said:
So the main purpose of Madhyamaka is a response towards antagonists and not pointing towards non-dual wisdom?

Malcolm wrote:
Nāgārjuna's purpose to clarify the Buddha's central teaching: dependent origination.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 9th, 2020 at 12:01 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:


Queequeg said:
My point is, what we think of as consciousness that we think makes us so different from plants, is, on closer analysis, not all that different from a plant turning toward light in many respects. What we think distinguishes us is a very narrow category of actions.

Malcolm wrote:
Consciousness distinguishes us from plants, rocks, and so on. Sentient beings have volition, thus, they possess karma. Plants have no consciousness, thus they do not possess karma.

The Buddha himself drew a clear distinction between sentience and non-sentience.  For example, in the Ratnakaraṇḍa Sūtra, the Buddha says:

With respect that, while the cessation of ignorance may not occur in the past, future, or in the present, nevertheless, any improper thinking produces ignorance. On the other hand, if there is discerning thinking because of proper thinking, [ignorance] will not be produced. That absence of production is a total cessation, therefore, it is called "cessation of ignorance." In that case, proper thinking with respect to this body, which is produced from the four great elements, is as follows: This body is inert, discerned to appear like grass, trees, walls, and stones. Whatever is called mind, intellect, or consciousness is immaterial, cannot be shown, is unimpeded, cannot be cognized, and is like an illusion or a dream. [The mind, etc.,] cannot be perceived inside [the body], outside [it], or both.

Thus, drawing a conclusion that because plants exhibit the same kind of autonomic functions as an animal's body, and therefore plants must have consciousness too, is not a good argument to make for the sentience of plants. The Buddha treated the body itself as inert, insentient, and so on. This point is really brought home when you look at the Tibetan term for body, "lus," which means "leftover," in this case, the body (rūpa skandha) is left over when the five aggregates disintegrate at the moment of death.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 8th, 2020 at 11:18 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


Pero said:
Thank you for your translation but other than the misreading you mention I can't see a difference in meaning between two translations since the main point of both is that taking mind as the path does not lead to liberation.

Malcolm wrote:
The point is not that there is a huge difference in the translations, the point is the assumption Wallace draws from the text. The assumption he draws is this: it is absolutely necessary for beginners to take the impure mind as the path. But that is not what Dudjom Lingpa is saying at all. He is, characteristically, describing what certain people, people of inferior capacity ( dbang po dman ) must do, before they can enter the actual path of Dzogchen, which is taking pristine consciousness ( ye shes ) as the path.

Wallace's interest in śamatha predates his forays into Dzogchen by many years, which one can observe in his 1992 translation, Calming the Mind: Tibetan Buddhist Teachings on the Cultivation of Meditative Quiescence.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 8th, 2020 at 3:53 AM
Title: Re: Essential & Useful Reading on Abhidharma and Prajnaparamita/Madhyamaka
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
Thanks, this is great. Could anyone comment on starting with Chim Jampalyang rather than Vasubandhu's original text?

Malcolm wrote:
Very difficult.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 10:43 PM
Title: Re: What possible reason could there be to study or practice Buddhism if arising and ceasing do not occur?
Content:
Dgj said:
If no arising nor ceasing occur then the twelve links are meaningless, reduced to nonsense.

Astus said:
It should always be kept in mind that many of the Mahayana ideas developed from or against Sarvastivada doctrine. In this case, the Sarvastivada abhidharma teachings say that production/birth (jati), duration/staying (sthiti), deterioration/death (jara), and impermanence (anityata) are characteristics (laksana) that are dharmas themselves, and dharmas are what have self-existence (svabhava), and it is the Sarvastivadin interpretation - or what its opponents, the Mahayanikas understood the Sarvastivadin teaching to be - that for instance Nagarjuna argues against when saying that arising, duration, etc., do not exist, i.e. not really, not on their own as unique entities.

Dgj said:
Okay! Thanks! So he wasn't saying:

Arising, duration and cessation absolutely never occur in any way, shape, form, nor under any circumstances, ever.

But rather:

Arising, duration and cessation of ultimate entities as incorrectly posited by the Sarvastivadins does not occur.

?

Malcolm wrote:
Arising, duration, and cessation are merely conventions we use to describe the appearance and disappearance of entities; but ultimately, "arising from causes and conditions" cannot be established as being anything other than a convention. For example, the MMK it is said, "Since arising, abiding, and cessation cannot be established, the compounded cannot be established. Since the compounded cannot be established, how can the uncompounded be established?"


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 10:41 PM
Title: Re: What possible reason could there be to study or practice Buddhism if arising and ceasing do not occur?
Content:
haha said:
For meaninglessness and flatly incorrectness, here are some remarks from MMK 24:
11a. A wrongly perceived emptiness ruins a person of meager intelligence.

13. Furthermore, if you were generate any obsession with regard to emptiness, the accompanying error is not ours. That [obsession] is not appropriate in the context of the empty.

15. You, attributing your own errors to us, are like one who has mounted his horse and confused about it.

18. We state that whatever is dependent arising, that is emptiness. That is dependent upon convention. That itself is the middle path.

37. For one who contradicts emptiness there would be nothing that ought to be done; activity would be uninitiated and an agent would be non-acting.

40. Whoever perceives dependent arising also perceives suffering, its arising, its ceasing and the path [leading to its ceasing].
Kalupahana, David J. (1996) Mulamadhayamakakarika of Nagarjuna


Malcolm wrote:
Oh man, this is really deprecated translation, It is very inaccurate and the translator has a real axe to grind. Better to cite the Sidrits' translation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 8:59 PM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
Ayu said:
I hope you respect this specific subforum and refrain from disparaging speech against other people's venerable teachers.
Please accept if other members disagree.

On my search I found at least one article about the specific role of trees in Buddha's life. It doesn't dare to talk about sentience though.
But if a plant is that important, it might imply a certain form of intelligence at least. Wherever this originates. When the Buddha was born, he assumed his human, material form; when he attained enlightenment, he achieved a higher spiritual level; when he died, he shed his physical form and fully entered the spiritual realm. A tree was present at each of these moments, serving as an arboreal bridge between our material realm and enlightenment.
https://www.buddhistdoor.net/features/the-tree-in-buddhist-symbolism-and-art

Malcolm wrote:
Sorry, but you won’t find a single sutra where the Buddha discusses the rebirth of a plant’s consciousness.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 8:55 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Queequeg said:
Those having realized the deathless... I believe that number is quite higher.

boda said:
Who?

Malcolm wrote:
All arhats, etc., as well as Arya bodhisattvas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 4:55 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
Könchok Thrinley said:
I have seen this idea explained that plants acted as "houses" to various spirits, however the relationship between spirit and "house" are so loose that we cannot talk about the plants being sentient. Just like our houses are not sentient, despite us living in it.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, that is what yakṣas are, in part, "spirits" that become attached to certain kinds of trees.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 2:03 AM
Title: Re: A More Precise Teaching on Emptiness?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
I didn’t just sit down and read Vasubandhu...well I tried, but it did not work to well. So after Khenpo Migmar Tseten was stationed in the Boston, MA, area in 1989, I gave him a copy of Pruden’s translation and asked him to teach it. He did so, for one year. He repeated that course two more times.

Grigoris said:
That's the four volume series of translations, correct?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, May 7th, 2020 at 1:55 AM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
tkp67 said:
He specifically mentioned Hsuan Hua’s teachings in an east Asian ...

Malcolm wrote:
So what? Just because some Chinese guy claims that plants are sentient, "because they are old," ( ) does not mean that the Buddha taught this idea. Nowhere in the Agamas, the Sūtras, or the Tantras has the Buddha taught that plants are sentient or part of the cycle of rebirth. But if you wish to accept the authority of Hsuan Hua's crazy idea, please go ahead.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 6th, 2020 at 7:27 PM
Title: Re: A More Precise Teaching on Emptiness?
Content:
Tenma said:
Where can one start out with Abdhidharma then (especially for beginners)? Which text, commentary, etc.?

Grigoris said:
You could start with Glimpses of Abhidharma by Chogyam Trungpa.

tobes said:
It is very undernourished terrain, in terms of western translations/commentaries/publications etc. You can't just sit down and read Vasubandhu....unless you're Malcolm or have similar dispositions.

Alongside the Prajnaparamita, I really, deeply wish that the next generation of Dharma scholars, translators, publishers etc will make a big contribution in this area. At the moment we're all a bit stuck.

Malcolm wrote:
I didn’t just sit down and read Vasubandhu...well I tried, but it did not work to well. So after Khenpo Migmar Tseten was stationed in the Boston, MA, area in 1989, I gave him a copy of Pruden’s translation and asked him to teach it. He did so, for one year. He repeated that course two more times.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 6th, 2020 at 7:19 PM
Title: Re: Plants Acquiring Sentience
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
It’s not what the Buddha taught.

ShantiM said:
Please excuse my ignorance and persistent inquiries about Master Hsuan Hua’s teachings. I have had my doubts, and may have misunderstood what he’s preaching, but looking to see if I can get this cleared. This time, assuming I understand it correctly, the teaching is about plants being sentient and are part of the rebirth cycle? There were actual anecdotes below in regards to this teaching. The Master himself also provides an explanation of this phenomenon mentioning that “Because the trees were old and they had experienced much, and because they had lived among people in the world, gradually they acquired the nature of humans. They had life-energy. After they had life-energy, then they acquired a little feeling.” and that “both those with and without feelings can accomplish the Way.”

http://www.drbachinese.org/online_reading/drba_others/memory1/life4b_english.htm On October 23, a 1989-year-old camphor tree at Puji Monastery on Potola Mountain in Zhejiang Province, China, took refuge with the Venerable Master.
http://www.advite.com/sf/assm/assm2-5.html Plants want to take refuge too? In the courtyard of Universal Salvation Monastery on Potola Mountain of Zhejiang Province, a 1,989-year old camphor tree, through a person with spiritual power, requested to take refuge with a high monk in the United States, the Venerable Master Hsuan Hua. The tree was given the Three Refuges by proxy at Long Beach Monastery in south Los Angeles on October 23, 1994.
http://www.dharmasite.net/HowBuddhismChangedMyLife.pdf
Plants want to take refuge too?
In the countyard of Universal Salvation Monastery on Potola Mountain of Zhejiang Province in China, a 1989 - year old camphor tree, through a person with spiritual power, requested to take refuge with the Venerable Master.
Long Beach Monastery, facing the Pacific Ocean, is the second Buddhist Way-place that the Master established in southern California, after Gold Wheel Monastery in Los Angeles. On October 23, l994, the weather was ideal. At 8:00 am twenty-one Buddhist disciples who were preparing to shave their heads, along with 300 other Buddhists, participated in a bowing ceremony, which preceded the ceremony for entering monastic life.
Among the twenty-one people who resolved to leave the home life, four were male and seventeen, female. They came from Finland, Canada, the United States, China, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia, and Vietnam. Their ages ranged from six to seventy-two.
Following the ceremony for entering monastic life, the transmission of the three refuges, five precepts, and ten novice precepts were held in the afternoon. During these ceremonies a special overseas call came from China
52

Page 52
A CAMPHOR TREE WAITS 1989 YEARS TO TAKE REFUGE
to the Master. The Master’s disciple, Upasaka Yang, related the following true account:
When my father and I were visiting Potola Mountain, at Universal Salvation Monastery, we saw a camphor tree that was so huge it would have taken ten people hand-in-hand to encircle it. That tree spoke to me, saying it wanted to take refuge with the Venerable Master Hsuan Hua. I found this quite odd and asked the tree, “You’ve been in this monastery for so many years. Haven’t you met a true cultivator and taken refuge? Why do you want to take refuge with the Master?” The tree said that he had never met a real cultivator with whom he could take refuge, that the conditions had not ripened before, and that now he hoped to take refuge with the Master. I said, “Fine! Wait until I ask the Master. I’ll let you know.”
Later, I went back to my room and fell asleep, exhausted. When I woke up, I had forgotten all about this matter. I had neither told my father nor asked the Master about it. We were going to visit other monasteries in the afternoon. When we got downstairs, I turned around to talk to my father. All of a sudden, I sprained my neck. Fortunately, it did not break. I was immediately alert, “What did I do wrong?” Just as I was pondering, I turned around and saw the big camphor tree and instantly realized that I had forgotten to do what he had asked me to do. Just then, the tree said to me, “How could you be so careless and forget what I asked you to do?”
“I’m so sorry! My memory is very poor. Please don’t be upset. I will ask the Master now.” So I asked the Master for instruction.
The Master said, “Whether or no he becomes my disciple is not important, but he should diligently cultivate precepts, samadhi, and wisdom and put to rest greed, hatred, and delusion.”
I relayed the message to the camphor tree and added, “As long as you can observe the Six Principles of the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas: no
53

HOW BUDDHISM CHANGED MY LIFE!
fighting, no greed, no seeking, no selfishness, no pursuit of self-benefit, and no lying, then even if you don’t have the affinities to meet the Master, you will still be the Master’s disciple. The tree promised to do as told. He further vowed to imitate Guanyin Bodhisattva in making the resolve to universally save living beings in the future. Right then, I saw the tree turn into a monk, kneeling on the ground with hands folded, and Guanyin Bodhisattva appeared above him and anointed the crown of his head with pure water from a vase. I was deeply touched. I reported this matter to the Master after we got home. The Master took it seriously and asked me to get more details about the tree. His name is Ren Neng (Humane and Able). I asked him what his method of cultivation was. He said he has been reciting the Heart Sutra and investigating the principles in that Sutra. However, since he lacked the guidance of a good teacher, he had not fully understood it.
Since Upasika Yang is a sincere Buddhist who possesses the spiritual power to communicate with other species, the camphor tree made the request to take refuge with the Master through her. From now on the tree will receive guidance from a bright-eyed wise advisor. Upasika Yang asked the tree how he knew about the Master and why he wanted to take refuge with the Master. The tree said it was very simple: all living beings can hear the Master speaking Dharma. When the Master speaks the Dharma, all living beings throughout empty space and the Dharma Realm can see and hear the Master. However, people who are burdened by wealth, worldly things, fame, and desire for riches may look and listen, but they fail to see and hear. All other living beings are quietly cultivating, steeped in the sound of the Master’s Dharma, nurturing their seeds of Bodhi. So the tree had been listening to the Master’s Dharma for a long time.
http://chinabuddhismencyclopedia.com/en/index.php/The_Flower_Adornment_Sutra:_A_Commentary_by_the_Venerable_Master_Hsuan_Hua:_Chapter_Forty

Today someone asked me if flowers are not sentient, ow can they make sounds? This is a good question, so now I will explain it clearly. Trees and plants have no feeling. Although they are without feeling they do have a nature, the nature of life. What is the nature of life? It is the life-energy (jen) discussed in Confucianism. This life-energy is a nature, and this nature can be said to be the Way. It can also be called the mother of the ten thousand things. Do humans have life-energy? Of course they do. If they were without it, then they would not be called humans. If they were not called humans, then what would they be called? You can call them anything you wish. For a human to have life-energy means to be human, or to speak it more correctly, “to be of the Way.” The phrase “life-energy” was coined by Confucius, and all plants and trees possess it. How can you say that plants and trees have life-energy? In the spring their limbs, branches, and leaves grow, flowers blossom and fruits come forth. This is because they have the nature of life. Not only do they have the nature of life, all plants, flowers, and trees have a minute amount of knowledge. So someone asked me, “When you cut a flower it emits a sound which we cannot hear, but if you use scientific means, then it can be heard.” This is really common.

Why is it that plants and trees can make sounds? It is because they have a nature. This nature is not full, but only exists in a minute amount. For example, if a person were said to have one hundred pounds of nature, the flowers, plants, and trees by comparison, would not have even an ounce, but would have about as much as a hair. Now this is a comparison, so do not take it literally. Basically, plants, flowers, and trees do experience some kind of sensation. I have said this before.

In China, a camphor and gingko tree received the precepts. You ask, “How is it that they could take the precepts? Since they are not sentient, how is it that they can have the nature of humans and receive the precepts? This is too contradictory.”

This is not the least bit contradictory, because if you understood it, you wold see it is very ordinary. Because the trees were old and they had experienced much, and because they had lived among people in the world, gradually they acquired the nature of humans. They had life-energy. After they had life-energy, then they acquired a little feeling. Because of this feeling, they wished to take the precepts. For a long time they did not realize how many improper things they had done, but after a while, they recognized their mistakes, took the precepts, and even thought about leaving the home-life. We should be aware of this point. Not only does he cross over sentient beings, but he also crosses over those without feelings. So it is said, “both those with and without feelings can accomplish the Way.” All of them can accomplish the Buddha’s Way. It is for this reason that he is called Universal Worthy; not only does he want to save people, but he also wants to cross over all flowers, plants, and trees. How can we not admire the vastness of his practices? At their best, most people are only aware of crossing over other people, crossing over other sentient beings, but Universal Worthy Bodhisattva even crosses over those without life, and so he is called Universal Worthy Bodhisattva.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 6th, 2020 at 12:38 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Grigoris said:
Of what value is practice without Right View?  Somehow, I do not think that it is the first factor of the Eightfold Noble Path by chance.

Dan74 said:
That just brings us back to what is essential for practice to be Right Practice? Is someone with a materialist world view inherently incapable of this Right Practice? Or are there stages of practice and people with many obscurations and ignorance can still practice and relinquish them? Therefore the wrong views, such as materialism are also relinquished at some stage of the path?

Sunrise said:
Those are really good questions to think about.

For Right View, there is Mundane Right View and Superior Right View. Mundane Right View requires at least the acceptance of the law of karma. For Superior Right View, the wish to escape samsara is part of it.

Where does that place Secular Buddhists? Perhaps they have Mundane Right View?

Malcolm wrote:
Not even close.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, May 6th, 2020 at 4:27 AM
Title: Re: Lost texts
Content:
avatamsaka3 said:
I'll rephrase: Do we have any evidence suggesting they might be in a certain area, rather than another? I'm not familiar with the state of academic research on these kinds of texts.

Malcolm wrote:
The best place to find lost Sanskrit Manuscripts is a) the Library of Sakya, which has thousands of manuscripts that are just mouldering 2) Bejing, where whole libraries were carried after the Tibetan Diaspora.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 10:04 PM
Title: Re: A More Precise Teaching on Emptiness?
Content:
tobes said:
Start with chapter 24, and do not go beyond it until your understanding develops.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't agree. The MMK is a dialogue that builds from the beginning. One needs to start at the beginning, and work chapter by chapter through each topic.

Before beginning the MMK, however, you need to have some familiarity with Abdhidharma. Without understanding precisely what Nāgārjuna was critiquing, it is easy to get lost. The Siderits translation is probably the best right now.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 8:01 PM
Title: Re: Is there a pure classical Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Aemilius said:
Besides the Yogacarabhumi of Asanga there are two other works with that same name! Etienne Lamotte writes in his History of Indian Buddhism, page 696 :
"Among the Indian masters who contributed  to the  formation of  the Indo-Chinese school of Yoga or Dhyana, we should  mention Samgha- raksa, Dharmatrata, Buddhasena and Buddhabhadra. Samgharaksha was a  native of Surashtra; he  was born there in the second century  A.D.; he was well-travelled and reached Gandhara where King Candana Kaniska made him  his master. He composed, among  other works,  a Yogacarabhumi, at present known through two Chinese translations (T 607, made by An Shih Kao between 148 and 170; T 606, carried out by Dharmaraksa in 284). - Dharmatrata and Buddhasena seem to have taught in Kashmir around  the beginning of  the fifth century; Dharmatrata composed  a Yogasamasanasutra, lost today; Buddhasena  wrote  a Yogacarabhumi which was translated into Chinese (T 618) by Buddhabhadra in about 413."

This too suggests that the Buddhist school of Yoga or Yogacara was larger and earlier than the one identified with Asanga and Vasubandhu.

Malcolm wrote:
That is the not issue I had with your statement. The issue I had with your statement was that you are conflating shravakas called yogacarins with mahayanis.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 5:24 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


smcj said:
...meaning I don’t think the others are as complete. However that’s the same as saying Sakyamuni’s teachings are the expression of Buddha Activity that best suits my karma. It is how things seem from my karmic ignorance. That’s all. It’s not as if I’m standing on “the other shore” as I say this.

Malcolm wrote:
It is a nice idea that all things beneficial are a result of buddha activity, but it is a pretty buddhist idea, unlikely to be shared by Muslims or Hindus.

smcj said:
We call it Buddha Activity.

Malcolm wrote:
The problem is that according to your definition, buddha activity is limited by karma. For Christians, etc., God's power has no limits. So they will never agree.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 5:19 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


smcj said:
...meaning I don’t think the others are as complete. However that’s the same as saying Sakyamuni’s teachings are the expression of Buddha Activity that best suits my karma. It is how things seem from my karmic ignorance. That’s all. It’s not as if I’m standing on “the other shore” as I say this.

Malcolm wrote:
It is a nice idea that all things beneficial are a result of buddha activity, but it is a pretty buddhist idea, unlikely to be shared by Muslims or Hindus.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 4:38 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
smcj said:
Different basis, different path, different result. That's all there is to it. You are clearly coming from a perennialist perspective, to which you are entitled, but the idea that all religions lead to the same goal is just silly.
The last chapter of the Uttaratantra talks about how Buddha Activity happens without any discernment or effort. It simply happens wherever and whenever the karma of sentient beings allows for it to happen. Just like the sun has no intentions to light up the room when you open the shades, the Buddha Nature manifests in a way that is appropriate for the karma of a certain time and place. There’s absolutely no restriction on this activity as to affiliations. It is not a considered response to prescribed prayer, although I assume some prayer is usually in the mix of karma that allows the Activity to happen.

Malcolm wrote:
From this it does not follow that the paths of nonbuddhists lead out of samsara. In fact this idea is explicitly denied in all Buddha's teachings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 4:29 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Ummmm...here is where the real inconsistencies in your thinking are exposed. Federalism requires a state.

Grigoris said:
No.

Malcolm wrote:
"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet."

-- Shakespeare.


Grigoris said:
https://www.google.com/search?q=anarchist+federalism&oq=anarchist+federalism&aqs=chrome..69i57j0.5167j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Malcolm wrote:
The arguments on this page are incoherent and self-contradictory.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 3:19 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


heart said:
Buddhism is the only religion I ever had, thanks to my parents. I don't see anyone practice even shamata in monotheistic religions so you would have to invent something new even on that level.

/magnus

loktibrada said:
You don't see because you choose not to see. Christianity has shamatha, mantra recitation as well as mindfulness-of-thoughts practices, and that's just the
public stuff. I am sure hardcore practitioners in the cloisters are working with more advanced practices. [Edit]


If you want to know more, you can research Hesychasm as the starting point.

Malcolm wrote:
Different basis, different path, different result. That's all there is to it. You are clearly coming from a perennialist perspective, to which you are entitled, but the idea that all religions lead to the same goal is just silly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 3:16 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
So a barter system. But a barter system will not scale to meet the daily needs of 8 billion people.

Grigoris said:
No, not a barter system.  They inevitably lead to the development of currency, changing values by tweaking supply, etc...

Malcolm wrote:
We already have currency. Basing currency on real assets is an error that has been demonstrated in economic history again and again.

Credit preceded money, actually.


Grigoris said:
From each according to their ability, to each according to their needs.

Malcolm wrote:
And who decides that?


Grigoris said:
Phasing out of private ownership.

Collectivisation/socialisation of the means of production.

That sort of nonsense.

Malcolm wrote:
We tried that. It failed alongside capitalism.


Grigoris said:
Your idea, like all stateless utopianism, sounds wonderful on paper, in practice, it cannot succeed beyond a local and limited scale.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes it can.  Via federalism. [/quote]

Ummmm...here is where the real inconsistencies in your thinking are exposed. Federalism requires a state.


Grigoris said:
As I pointed out, I live in New England, which is a strong history and cultural ethos of mutual aid, from barn-raising to you name it. But mutual aid is not going to put food on the table of everyone, guarantee their healthcare, educate their kids, train professionals, etc.

Malcolm wrote:
Why not?I mean, we know Capitalism doesn't do it, so why shouldn' mutual aid be able to do it. [/quote]

I just don't think that you are going to convince 8 billion people to trust that other people have their best interests at heart.

Grigoris said:
Centrally-planned economies simply do not supply demand as well as regulated market economies.
A regulated market requires central planning.

Malcolm wrote:
Market regulation merely enforces what kinds of transactions are allowable, and what kind are not, without deciding who gets what, how, and when. In a crisis, Market regulation allows for limited central planning in times of severe economic crisis, but that's about it.

Anyway, you clearly believe in market economies and states since you explain that a) in a mutual aid economy currency will be developed, and b)  you admit that states are necessary in order to scale up the benefits of mutual aid, via what you term "federalism," which is just another term for a "state."

Accept the pervasion.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 2:54 AM
Title: Re: Origins of Vajrayana
Content:



tingdzin said:
There is lots and lots, taking a variety of different approaches. It recently seems to have become a hot topic again, and a few books have been recently published on the subject, most of which I haven't seen, however. The earliest documentary evidence, from Dunhuang, seems to be a brief manuscript describing Guru Rinpoche's encounter with the obstructing spirits at the Asura Cave. Recently, scholars such as Mayer, Dalton, and Doney have been publishing on this subject. You might want to look at (Robert) Mayer's Tibetological blog for several articles, and his references for others. A usual approach is to differentiate between Kama and Terma biographies, although it's not easy or necessarily valid to draw conclusions from this differentiation.

As Terma said, though, if your faith in Guru Rinpoche or in the efficacy of the Nyingmapa practices is likely to be compromised by what academic researchers (some of whom are IMO dead wrong) write, you may be better off not dipping your toe into the water. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


Malcolm wrote:
I make a distinction between myth, legend, and history.

A historical character like Padmasambhava is interesting because of the way myth, legend, and history intersect in the traditions around him. He most certainly was a real person who visited Tibet for a period of time in the 8th century, during the decade between 770-780. His departure to Camara was also mentioned by Vajrāsana (c. mid-eleventh century) in the Supplication to the 84 Mahāsiddhas ( grub thob brgyad cu rtsa bzhi'i gsol 'debs (D 3758))

།དགེ་སློང་ལུས་ཀྱིས་ཕྱག་རྒྱ་བསྟེན། །ལྷོ་ནུབ་སྲིན་པོའི་ཁ་གནོན་མཛད། །
པདྨ་ཀཱ་ར་ཞེས་བྱ་བའི། །བླ་མ་དེ་ལ་ཕྱག་འཚལ་ལོ།

With the form of a bhikṣu, reliant on a consort 
[the one who] suppressed the rakṣasas in the southwest 
I prostrate to that guru
called Padmakāra.

Now, it is very possible that Vajrāsana heard about the legend of Padmasambhava from Tibetans, and penned this verse influenced by that. But if this is actually an Indian tradition, this confirms three facts about Guru RInpoche: one, he was a bhiḳsu; two, he made of use of consorts, even though maintaining the garb of an ordained person; three, he is reputed to have gone to the southwest to tame rakṣasas (indigenous people dwelling where?). It is also interesting to note that "rakṣasa" is also a poetic name for the southwest.

I have not seen any mention of the Supplication to the 84 Mahāsiddhas in the academic literature on the subject of Padmasambhava, so this source seems to have been overlooked by scholars researching the topic. So it is an interesting question, likely unanswerable, as to whether this brief verse impacted the Tibetan concepts of Guru Rinpoche or not.

However in my personal practice, I allow the mythic dimension of Guru RInpoche to take precedence, since for me, that is where the juice is found.

mandog said:
What is the distinction between Myth and Legend here? I think of the two as being roughly synonymous with the former holding more negative connotations and the latter holding more positive connotations.

Malcolm wrote:
Myths are totally beyond any ability to verify, often involving figures whose existence can never be verified empirically; whereas legends are about historical people, but can't really be backed up by any source.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 2:24 AM
Title: Re: Nyasa
Content:


Grigoris said:
I am not asking for a long debate comparing Hindu and Buddhist tantra rituals, I am merely asking if the specific practice exists in Buddhist tantra.

Malcolm wrote:
No. It does not exist, other than touching forehead, throat, and heart center.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 1:22 AM
Title: Re: Origins of Vajrayana
Content:
yagmort said:
do you know of any academic research into Guru Rinpoche biography?

tingdzin said:
There is lots and lots, taking a variety of different approaches. It recently seems to have become a hot topic again, and a few books have been recently published on the subject, most of which I haven't seen, however. The earliest documentary evidence, from Dunhuang, seems to be a brief manuscript describing Guru Rinpoche's encounter with the obstructing spirits at the Asura Cave. Recently, scholars such as Mayer, Dalton, and Doney have been publishing on this subject. You might want to look at (Robert) Mayer's Tibetological blog for several articles, and his references for others. A usual approach is to differentiate between Kama and Terma biographies, although it's not easy or necessarily valid to draw conclusions from this differentiation.

As Terma said, though, if your faith in Guru Rinpoche or in the efficacy of the Nyingmapa practices is likely to be compromised by what academic researchers (some of whom are IMO dead wrong) write, you may be better off not dipping your toe into the water. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


Malcolm wrote:
I make a distinction between myth, legend, and history.

A historical character like Padmasambhava is interesting because of the way myth, legend, and history intersect in the traditions around him. He most certainly was a real person who visited Tibet for a period of time in the 8th century, during the decade between 770-780. His departure to Camara was also mentioned by Vajrāsana (c. mid-eleventh century) in the Supplication to the 84 Mahāsiddhas ( grub thob brgyad cu rtsa bzhi'i gsol 'debs (D 3758))

།དགེ་སློང་ལུས་ཀྱིས་ཕྱག་རྒྱ་བསྟེན། །ལྷོ་ནུབ་སྲིན་པོའི་ཁ་གནོན་མཛད། །
པདྨ་ཀཱ་ར་ཞེས་བྱ་བའི། །བླ་མ་དེ་ལ་ཕྱག་འཚལ་ལོ།

With the form of a bhikṣu, reliant on a consort 
[the one who] suppressed the rakṣasas in the southwest 
I prostrate to that guru
called Padmakāra.

Now, it is very possible that Vajrāsana heard about the legend of Padmasambhava from Tibetans, and penned this verse influenced by that. But if this is actually an Indian tradition, this confirms three facts about Guru RInpoche: one, he was a bhiḳsu; two, he made of use of consorts, even though maintaining the garb of an ordained person; three, he is reputed to have gone to the southwest to tame rakṣasas (indigenous people dwelling where?). It is also interesting to note that "rakṣasa" is also a poetic name for the southwest.

I have not seen any mention of the Supplication to the 84 Mahāsiddhas in the academic literature on the subject of Padmasambhava, so this source seems to have been overlooked by scholars researching the topic. So it is an interesting question, likely unanswerable, as to whether this brief verse impacted the Tibetan concepts of Guru Rinpoche or not.

However in my personal practice, I allow the mythic dimension of Guru RInpoche to take precedence, since for me, that is where the juice is found.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, May 5th, 2020 at 12:39 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
So, I just don't buy into your "let it all burn down" ethos.

Grigoris said:
Which is another straw man.

What I have sad is that an economic system based on mutual aid is the solution.

Malcolm wrote:
So a barter system. But a barter system will not scale to meet the daily needs of 8 billion people.

Grigoris said:
One initiative which has (finally) taken off in the refugee camp here, for example, is a group based on the volunteer ethic of the Syrian "white helmets".  A self-organising group of refugee volunteers that has taken charge of sanitation in the camp instead of waiting for the government to do something (and people getting sick in the meantime).

Malcolm wrote:
Which is why authoritarian governments generally take a poor view of NGOs. They challenge the authority of ineffective states. They also can inhibit the development of social apparatus. We see this in Haiti, where the Haitian government has basically ceded many of its responsibilities to various NGOs.

Your idea, like all stateless utopianism, sounds wonderful on paper, in practice, it cannot succeed beyond a local and limited scale.

As I pointed out, I live in New England, which is a strong history and cultural ethos of mutual aid, from barn-raising to you name it. But mutual aid is not going to put food on the table of everyone, guarantee their healthcare, educate their kids, train professionals, etc.

I'll stick to my original conclusion. There is no alternative to the present dominant, global economic system. I do not say this out of some allegiance to capitalism as an economic system, far from it, I just don't see any alternatives that can function alongside capitalism. The Marxist-Leninists tried this in the USSR and China, and their attempt failed utterly. Centrally-planned economies simply do not supply demand as well as regulated market economies.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 11:02 PM
Title: Re: Origins of Vajrayana
Content:


PeterC said:
I’d like to know what Padmasambhava had for breakfast.  Unfortunately knowledge has limits.

The 84 Mahasiddhas were from a specific person’s pure vision.  There were plenty of other important figures not included in that particular list

Malcolm wrote:
There are two versions of the 84 Mahāsiddhas. The earlier one is a text written by Vajrasāna in the 11th century, which mentions Padmasambhava, specifically as someone who appears as a bhikṣu with a consort. The lists only partially match between the two versions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 10:31 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The collapse of civilization will hit America last, etc., not first. So I was really referring to places outside the first world.

Grigoris said:
Places outside the first world are already living what first worlders merely dream (have nightmares) about.  The "civilisation"that you are so scared of losing, is the cause of their current nightmare.

Malcolm wrote:
I have spent a lot of time in so-called second and third world places. I have relatives in Haiti (extended family through my son in law). During a complete global collapse, it can get a whole lot worse for people living these place than it is now. So, I just don't buy into your "let it all burn down" ethos.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 10:22 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:



heart said:
Buddhism is the only religion I ever had, thanks to my parents. I don't see anyone practice even shamata in monotheistic religions so you would have to invent something new even on that level.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
And, all Buddhists are born Buddhists.

LhakpaT said:
Could you explain some more, please?

Malcolm wrote:
You cannot "convert" to Buddhism, you either already have the merit accumulation to meet the Dharma or you don't.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 8:43 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:



heart said:
perhaps my understanding monotheistic religions is lacking.

Pero said:
What do you mean? You weren't born a Buddhist either.

heart said:
Buddhism is the only religion I ever had, thanks to my parents. I don't see anyone practice even shamata in monotheistic religions so you would have to invent something new even on that level.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
And, all Buddhists are born Buddhists.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 8:40 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You can express empathy, however.

Grigoris said:
Currently outside my "office" (a large tent with wood-chip boards for walls) there is a line of about 100+ refugee men and women and their sick crying children (plus a couple of my patients, mainly victims of torture) waiting outdoors in a spring rain shower, fighting with each other about who will be treated first.

You will have to excuse me for not being empathic to the needs of spoiled Amerikans, scared of losing their first world privileges.

Malcolm wrote:
The collapse of civilization will hit America last, etc., not first. So I was really referring to places outside the first world.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 6:01 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


Pero said:
Ok it is still the first stage of practice according to Dudjom Lingpa's tantra the Sharp Vajra Of Conscious Awareness (this Wallace's translation).

Malcolm wrote:
The commentary says in this section that since this practice of making the two aspects of the mind, stillness and movement, into the path for the inferior student, is divorced from insight of the understanding the nature of reality, it will never approach the path of omniscience, etc., even if one practices this very diligently.

Wallace's translation also misreads this passage, his rendering is on pg. 56-57 (provided by dharmafootsteps above after I finished this post): /mdor na sngar bstan gzhi gnas nas gsal rig gi shes pa dang kun gzhi'i rnam shes kyi bar 'di dag ni rnam pa sems la lam byed pa'i skabs te gnas lugs rang bzhin shes pa'i lhag mthong dang bral bas srid pa'i sdug bsngal las grol ba'i thar pa dang/ mtha' gnyis las grol ba'i rnam mkhyen gyi lam la spu rtse tsam yang nye ba ma yin pa'i phyir na, yun ring por brtson 'grus drag pos nyams su blang bar byas na 'khor ba'i bsnon ma tsam las med pas na/ mi tshe stong zad chud du za ba nges pa yin tshul shes pa gyis shig/

Pero said:
In brief, these that were explained already, from the abiding basis ( gzhi gnas, not zhi gnas, śamatha) up to the clear-knowing consciousness and the all-basis consciousness, are the section of making mental aspects into the path. However, since they are divorced from the vipaśyanā that understands the nature of reality, they do not even approach the path freedom of liberation from the suffering of samsara and omniscience free from both extremes by even a hair tip, even if one practices with intense diligence for a long time. Because this will do nothing other than bolster samsara, one must understand with certainty that one will waste a thousand human lives!

Malcolm wrote:
The commentary goes on to say that this is all for just making the process of giving introduction to inferior students a little easier by calming their conceptuality.

So, kind of a different read than Wallace's take on the same text.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 4:40 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Sunrise said:
the Secular Buddhists already do more than the typical lay people of the Buddha's time, because they practice morality and make an effort to meditate??

Malcolm wrote:
Meditation is also not really a practice recommended for householders. If we look at this from the point of view of the six perfections: the ordained are supposed to focus on discipline and dhyāna. Householders are supposed to focus on generosity and patience. Both are supposed to focus on diligence and wisdom.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 4:13 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Pero said:
Of course but Wallace isn't saying otherwise as far as I can see.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure he is. He is saying, for example, that the Jesus prayer can be a preliminary practice for Dzogchen.

Also, if he actually said this, "such than someone from any background could in theory take the mind as the path, attain shamatha, and realize the nature of consciousness and the truth of reincarnation. And so on for the rest of the path," this just does not work in Dzogchen teachings.

It is a complete abortion of an idea.

Pero said:
That is not apparent from the quote in the OP. As for taking the (impure) mind as the path, that is the first stage in one of Dudjom Lingpa's teachings.

Malcolm wrote:
Taking mind as the path is the path of the eight lower yānas. It is never the path of Dzogchen.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 4:12 AM
Title: Re: Peeing in a lake
Content:
Toenail said:
But where to pee then? Is a tree better? I am really asking practically. It can become potentially very neurotic, no? There are not just water nature spirits. Also Nagas do not just dwell in water. When on a 5 hour hike, what to do if one has to pee?

Malcolm wrote:
Just use common sense and respect where you are.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 3:29 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
PSM said:
He cites the examples of this in the Bon tradition of Tibet...

Malcolm wrote:
Bonpos consider themselves "nang pa", Buddhists, the only significant difference from their point of view is who the original teacher is. But there is no difference in meaning, just slight differences in terms.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 3:25 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


Pero said:
Of course but Wallace isn't saying otherwise as far as I can see. You practice whatever and then you get yourself to an introduction and then apply lineage master's teachings. Although the more I think about it the more unsure I am if anyone would even want to do this.

heart said:
You pray to god for a long time, then get the direct introduction?

Pero said:
Why not? Plenty of people come to the teachings from other religious backgrounds.

Malcolm wrote:
So there is  a causal link to praying to god and then getting direct introduction? How does that work? Basically Pero, if you go to receive Dzogchen teachings, you are an Ex-whatever. Oh, sure, you can maintain outward form of a Christian, etc., but if your view does not change, you will not realize the meaning.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 3:22 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:


Pero said:
Hmmm, while I personally am not too sure about such an approach, I have to ask - why, if the view is experiental? And all that "post meditation view doesn't matter" thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Jesus was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Muhammed was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Mose was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Lao Tsu was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Confucius was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Shankaracarya, etc. were not Dzogchen masters and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings.

At base, if you want to practice Dzogchen, you need to rely on Dzogchen lineage masters.

Pero said:
Of course but Wallace isn't saying otherwise as far as I can see.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure he is. He is saying, for example, that the Jesus prayer can be a preliminary practice for Dzogchen.

Also, if he actually said this, "such than someone from any background could in theory take the mind as the path, attain shamatha, and realize the nature of consciousness and the truth of reincarnation. And so on for the rest of the path," this just does not work in Dzogchen teachings.

It is a complete abortion of an idea.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 3:06 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
There are many reasons, not least of which is that this would amount to the ruination of Dzogchen teachings. it would be a tradition that was neither fish nor fowl, and just as impotent.

Pero said:
Hmmm, while I personally am not too sure about such an approach, I have to ask - why, if the view is experiental? And all that "post meditation view doesn't matter" thing.

heart said:
It is such weird thing to me, the idea that Dzogchen would make sense within an other religious system, I don't get it.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
It's just marketing for perennialists.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 2:38 AM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Finally, he says that while Dzogchen is certainly imbedded within the context of Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism, there is no reason why people from other traditions could not have their own preliminary purification practices, their own devotional practices, and then engage in the main Dzogchen practices and achieve all the same realizations as a Buddhist Dzogchen practitioner.
There are many reasons, not least of which is that this would amount to the ruination of Dzogchen teachings. it would be a tradition that was neither fish nor fowl, and just as impotent.

Pero said:
Hmmm, while I personally am not too sure about such an approach, I have to ask - why, if the view is experiental? And all that "post meditation view doesn't matter" thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Jesus was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Muhammed was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Mose was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Lao Tsu was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Confucius was not a Dzogchen master and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings. Shankaracarya, etc. were not Dzogchen masters and did not transmit Dzogchen teachings.

At base, if you want to practice Dzogchen, you need to rely on Dzogchen lineage masters.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 1:41 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Grigoris said:
I cannot concern myself with things that are beyond my control.

Malcolm wrote:
You can express empathy, however.

Grigoris said:
One thing I draw inspiration from was the response to the refugee crisis here on the island.  Thousands of people flocked here as volunteers to help the refugees.  The right-wing push back which is currently happening is actually backed by the current state and it's supporters.  And even with the violence etc there are still hundreds of volunteers here risking their personal safety and their lives (with the virus).

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is admirable. Under a collapsed global civilization, we would not even know about it.

Grigoris said:
Syria was not a failed state, any more than North Korea is a failed state.

Malcolm wrote:
Of course they are.

Grigoris said:
Syria was purposefully destabilised and the Syrian state (with all it's flaws) is unfortunately bouncing back as strong as ever.

Malcolm wrote:
Syria did itself in when Assad starting murdering farmers who were protesting against drought conditions and Syria's unwillingness to support them.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-climatechange-conflict-arabspring/climate-stress-drove-wave-of-arab-spring-refugees-researchers-idUSKCN1PH23B


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 1:34 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
It is necessary, but it won't prevent a collapse of civilization...

Grigoris said:
You keep saying this, but it is not going to lead to the collapse of civilisation, it is going to lead to the collapse of one type of civilisation.

Civilisations have collapsed before and will continue forming and collapsing.  It is only painful if we keep grasping at them.

Malcolm wrote:
It is possible some kind of libertarian municipalism can insulate some communities for a time against the economic shock of decline, but what you are fundamentally arguing for, and not without reason, are small communities that band together with common interest in order to stave off the chaos that such collapse entails.

We already see fascist militias banding together in the US and openly flying Confederate flags and swastikas in our State Capitals:





In absence of a strong federal government, these people will ride-rough shod over anyone who stands in their way, and will kill anyone who does not go along with their Guns and Jesus insanity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 1:17 AM
Title: Re: Peeing in a lake
Content:
Toenail said:
Maybe i am ignorant, but I don't get why this is so bad.

Malcolm wrote:
Would you want some stranger peeing on your head in your own home?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 1:15 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
It is necessary, but it won't prevent a collapse of civilization...

Grigoris said:
You keep saying this, but it is not going to lead to the collapse of civilisation, it is going to lead to the collapse of one type of civilisation.

Civilisations have collapsed before and will continue forming and collapsing.  It is only painful if we keep grasping at it.

Malcolm wrote:
With the collapse of this civilization will go all the knowledge and science we've developed up to this point, billions will die. Somehow, that prospect does not seem to concern you at all, intellectually, despite the fact that I know you live near the edge of a failed state and see the harm and suffering that entails daily in your quite admirable occupation. Imagine Syria on a global scale.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 1:10 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Dan74 said:
Dependent origination is something we can observe in the here-and-now.

Malcolm wrote:
No, actually, it isn't. Dependent origination is not that simple. It is profound, and not easy to understand, as the Buddha said to Ananda:
I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was living among the Kurus. Now, the Kurus have a town named Kammasadhamma. There Ven. Ananda approached the Blessed One and, on arrival, having bowed down to the Blessed One, sat to one side. As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: "It's amazing, lord, it's astounding, how deep this dependent co-arising is, and how deep its appearance, and yet to me it seems as clear as clear can be."

[The Buddha:] "Don't say that, Ananda. Don't say that. Deep is this dependent co-arising, and deep its appearance. It's because of not understanding and not penetrating this Dhamma that this generation is like a tangled skein, a knotted ball of string, like matted rushes and reeds, and does not go beyond transmigration, beyond the planes of deprivation, woe, and bad destinations.
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn/dn.15.0.than.html

Dan74 said:
Past lives for most of us is merely belief and if you are fortunate enough to believe in past lives ardently so that it propels your motivation to practice, good for you. How many of us are like this?

Malcolm wrote:
Awakening (bodhi), for most of us, is merely a belief too. It makes no sense to believe in bodhi, on the one hand, and reject belief in karma and rebirth, on other other, since the whole point of bodhi is overcome karma and rebirth.

Dan74 said:
But fortunately, there are other motivators to practice apart from the selfish concerns for a better life for oneself.

Malcolm wrote:
The Buddha has said that a bodhisattva must care for themselves before they are able to care for others.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 12:57 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Grigoris said:
You think mutual aid is just about being nice to each other???

Malcolm wrote:
No, Greg, but it isn't a plan, either. I live in rural community, where there is a lot of mutual aid, so to speak. It is necessary, but it won't prevent a collapse of civilization and the inevitable wars and nuclear conflicts, epidemics, and so on which are the consequence of that.

Mutual aid generally results in the creation of protective associations, which are the precursors to states. This is all laid out in the sutras. We are fully in the age of strife at present, and it only gets worse from here. But we try to apply palliatives as much as possible in hopes that it will stem some of the acute misery all humans will face as a result of continued, world-wide capitalist hegemony and the class-based society necessary to the functioning of capitalism. Capitalism will do just fine during the collapse, until it doesn't.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 12:48 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Danny said:
Yeah I get that, but again how does the market establish gold reserves to back fiat cash? What's the price discovery? No central bank would ever let known what reserves are on its books. They're cannot be any audit of such.

Malcolm wrote:
Gold reserves do not back cash and they shouldn't. A brief study of history of money will demonstrate that tying the value of currency to a solid asset is perilous at best, for example, the collapse of silver prices in 1640 which led to a fractious period in European history and toppled several gvts.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, May 4th, 2020 at 12:29 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Grigoris said:
I have pointed out an alternative...

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, you have said that everyone should be nice to each other, and it will all work out.

But things rarely work out that way.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 10:43 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Dan74 said:
What we considered Right a few years ago, we don't necessarily consider right now.

Malcolm wrote:
There is only one right view in Buddhadharma, and that is the view of dependent origination, of which karma and rebirth are subtopics.

That was the insight that led the Buddha to awakening. His insight was based on his recollection of his past lives.

Your understand of right view may have changed. Mine hasn't.

Bhikku Bodhi notes:

Our motivation acquires the requisite maturity by the cultivation of right view, the first factor of the Noble Eightfold Path, which as explained by the Buddha includes an understanding of the principles of kamma and rebirth as fundamental to the structure of our existence.
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/bodhi/bps-essay_06.html

Dan74 said:
I am yet to hear a single Buddhist teacher (with a possible exception of your good self) to say to beginners, if you don't accept rebirth and karma, get out of here, you are wasting your time.

Malcolm wrote:
This is not a discussion amongst beginners.

Dan74 said:
On the contrary I've heard quite a few say that understanding of these matters comes in due course and is not something one must swallow hook, line and sinker like a dogma at the outset, in order to be able to commence Buddhist practice.

Malcolm wrote:
If someone does not accept rebirth and karma based on the understanding of absence of self and dependent origination, they are not ready to really seriously study and practice the Dharma. Why? Because they have not understood what the Dharma is (right view) so how can they practice the Dharma if they do not possess even mundane right view? So what these folks need to do is study under authentic teachers in authentic traditions which are faithful to the Buddha's teachings, and not the speculations of modern people who wish to fabricate a false dharma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 8:23 PM
Title: Re: Alan Wallace: Dzogchen, COVID-19 & the prophecy received by Dudjom Lingpa
Content:
Unknown said:
Finally, he says that while Dzogchen is certainly imbedded within the context of Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism, there is no reason why people from other traditions could not have their own preliminary purification practices, their own devotional practices, and then engage in the main Dzogchen practices and achieve all the same realizations as a Buddhist Dzogchen practitioner.

Malcolm wrote:
There are many reasons, not least of which is that this would amount to the ruination of Dzogchen teachings. it would be a tradition that was neither fish nor fowl, and just as impotent.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 8:14 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Dan74 said:
At the end of the day, I don't really care if SB asserted boldly that my beliefs were a crutch and they are the ones with intellectual honesty to only assert what they know and can verify. Good for them and I hope they practice earnestly.

Grigoris said:
Of what value is practice without Right View?  Somehow, I do not think that it is the first factor of the Eightfold Noble Path by chance.

Dan74 said:
That just brings us back to what is essential for practice to be Right Practice? Is someone with a materialist world view inherently incapable of this Right Practice?

Malcolm wrote:
If we understand this materialist view to be a denial rebirth and karma, then yes.

Dan74 said:
Perhaps these may be an obstacle in developing a deep Bodhicitta, but I would argue that there are many Dharma doors, not one with this ostensible non-negotiable and very comprehensive Right View.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, you can argue that, but I suspect your notion of many doors is not what the Buddha taught.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 8:09 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
If they are so good at planning, why do their regimes always end in death and flames, with a violent transfer of power?

Grigoris said:
Seems you are quite misinformed on the topic:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francisco_Franco

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ant%C3%B3nio_de_Oliveira_Salazar

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1976_Argentine_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augusto_Pinochet

Etc...

Malcolm wrote:
Each one of these governments sided with the US during the cold war, since our government had a policy of supporting right wing authoritarians against “the commies.” This favorable relation with US lent them a measure of stability.  But planning? Not so good.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 10:50 AM
Title: Re: sang and serkyem practice
Content:



Lukeinaz said:
so you would have a drink from cup on altar and then put it outside?

Malcolm wrote:
No, you have a serkyen cup for the alter, and you have your own cup, When you are done, you drink your tea; and after take the shrine tea out.

mandog said:
Is the drinking with the protectors a DC specific thing? Do other sanghas actually do this?

Malcolm wrote:
No. Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 10:49 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Dan74 said:
Regarding Batchelor, I don't really know what all the fuss is. There is a wide variety of schools and teachers available these days. According to our karmic dispositions we find one or another. He tries hard to be very honest with his claims, is no cult guru or manipulator, and I am sure some people genuinely benefit from his work, while more traditional schools would rub them the wrong way.

Johnny Dangerous said:
As I said (and Mikenz post goes into more detail on) the issue people have with Batchelor is his intellectual dishonesty, same with Secular Buddhism in general. It is dishonest to act like the things they are viewing as "supernatural" (Karma and Rebirth) are some footnote to the Pali Canon, when clearly they are quite central, regardless of one's personal conclusions.

I've personally witnessed this become an issue with newer Buddhists who have never actually cracked open a Sutta (I'm assuming, it's the only real explanation) and will insist that "magical" or "superstitious" stuff is something that is just kind of ornamental addition in the Pali Canon...even saying things like "But the Buddha never really said that much about rebirth"..or something similar.

It boggles the mind that there is someone out there helping this mistaken impression to be a thing. I've read just enough of Batchelor's work to see how someone interested in Buddhism but tending towards the skeptical generally would take it and run with it, without having the basic context to make sense of just how polemical Batchelors positions are, and how poorly they match up with...almost anything in traditional Buddhism. I mean, have you read his stuff on how the Four Noble Truths are just articles of faith?

What you end up with is people claiming that a very outlier position in the Buddhist world is somehow "more correct" than thousands of years of tradition, "because superstition". I suspect that this is what annoys people about Secular Buddhism. I doubt it's Batchleor's specific intention that people use his positions in this way, but in my experience they do.

The funny thing is, I'm all for people using Buddhist meditation and ethics "secularly", especially the therapeutic aspects. I just don't know why they'd insist on calling it "Buddhism" and getting all polemic about What The Buddha really Meant.

Malcolm wrote:
The real problem with secular Buddhists is that they mistakenly believe buddhadharma is about meditation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 10:36 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Grigoris said:
It is going to collapse anyway, so why not plan for something better?



Queequeg said:
As Mike Tyson said, "Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth."

If the collapse you're talking about comes, all those beautiful plans will go to shit fast. It will be a world of warlords with nuclear weapons - basically what we have now, with less responsibility, more ruthlessness, and no semblance of a global order. The idealists will be the first ones hunted down and shot.

Grigoris said:
You've been watching too much Mad Max.

History has shown that idealists, with guns, do quite well.

Malcolm wrote:
Depends on what one defines as “good.”


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 10:32 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
"Fascist planning" is a contradiction in terms.

Grigoris said:
Actually Fascists have proven historically to be really good at organising and planning.  Especially at a mass level.  Authoritarians in general have that ability.  Mainly because they don't rely on discussion and consensus.  One person decides and everybody else is mobilised around the decision.  It is efficient, although not always effective.

Malcolm wrote:
If they are so good at planning, why do their regimes always end in death and flames, with a violent transfer of power?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 4:01 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Grigoris said:
t is going to collapse anyway, so why not plan for something better?

Malcolm wrote:
Probably not in our lifetime. But yes, it is good to plan for eventualities. Pandemics kind of show that, no?

Grigoris said:
You want to leave the planning up to the Fascists?

Malcolm wrote:
"Fascist planning" is a contradiction in terms.

Grigoris said:
Anyway, I think you are seriously underestimating human willingness to find solutions in the face of tragedy.  All you gotta do is convince them that it will aid in their survival.

Malcolm wrote:
No, I just think you and me are like everyone else; full of ideas with no way to implement them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 3:33 AM
Title: Re: Responding to praise and compliments
Content:
Kamshan said:
How can we respond to praise and compliments in a healthy, polite, and respectful way, without adding fuel to pride and arrogance?

Malcolm wrote:
Look at your faults and respond with humility.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 3:27 AM
Title: Re: How has being a Buddhist changed you?
Content:
krish5 said:
Supposedly, the Buddha offered thousands of approaches to helping ourselves. There is no one path for all, but has to be suited to each persons temperament and individual makeup.

Malcolm wrote:
The origin of this 80,000 gates to the Dharma (sometimes given as 84) is that the Buddha taught 20,000 dharmaskandhas of Abhidharma (Vajrayāna is generally included here) to counteract ignorance; 20,000 dharmaskandhas of Sūtra to counteract anger; 20,000 dharmaskandhas of Vinaya to counteract desire; and 20,000 mixed teachings to counteract all three. Each of these dharmaskandhas, something like "sections of dharma," were taught to a specific person or groups of people based on specific needs at specific occasions. We are tasked with finding the correct teaching for our own condition among these three groups of teachings. Since it is a lot to take in, a teacher is a desiderata.

It certainly does not mean that Buddha was saying that some people can gain liberation through Advaita; others Christianity, and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 3:16 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Grigoris said:
You are being hysterical.

Malcolm wrote:
Hardly.

Grigoris said:
I imagine that people that benefited from feudalism believed civilisation would collapse when their system of economy and governance started to collapse.  But even during feudalism people exchanged products, or worked on the principles of mutual aid, just like they did and do within the existing global capitalist system.

Malcolm wrote:
Uh huh.

Like I said, you don't have any solutions at all. None of us do. To alter our world economy from the present capitalist system to ? without global chaos, war, famine, and economic collapse will take decades at minimum, requiring global mutual cooperation at an unprecedented scale. Frankly, given our record, I think we would destroy ourselves and the planet long before there will ever be some idyllic, anarchist utopia.

And if you are volunteering the world for economic collapse, well, I protest.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 2:38 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You still offer no alternatives to capitalism other than the complete collapse of global civilization.

Grigoris said:
The collapse of capitalism =/= the complete collapse of global civilisation.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, I am afraid it does, practically speaking.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 1:40 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
I don’t care about empires, I care about people. You’re just trading one kind of suffering for another.

Grigoris said:
That is what samsara is all about, isn't it?

Or is it that you want the suffering to stay as far away from you as possible?

The U$ empire, like all empires is slowly and surely crumbling.  Empires have crumbled before without bringing about the end of the world and they will crumble again.

It is possible that human domination of the Earth is also starting to fall apart.  Like it did for other previous dominant species.

rudra.jpg

Malcolm wrote:
You still offer no alternatives to capitalism other than the complete collapse of global civilization.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 1:34 AM
Title: Re: Does the Bön tradition believe we have a self/soul?
Content:
tomdzogchen27 said:
I have seen that there are many similar concepts between Buddhism and Bön. Nevertheless I was wondering, does the Bön tradition posit that we have individual souls? I saw that Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche has a book called 'The true source of healing' which speaks of 'Soul retrieval'. If he does indeed speak of individual souls, how does that fit in the Dzogchen view? Thanks!

Malcolm wrote:
This has been discussed before. The concept under discussion is called in Tibetan bla 'gug.

The term bla does not correspond to what we understand by the term "soul" in English. The term has a fairly wide range of meanings in Tibetan, but in this context it refers to the life-force sustaining energy of a person.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, May 3rd, 2020 at 12:19 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure classical Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Aemilius said:
The point has been made before, long ago, that there have been ascetics from the beginning of the Dharma and the group of ascetics is logically the meaning and origin of the yogacara and yogacarins. Practice of yoga is mentioned already in the Dhammapada, in the sense of ascetism. The dhutangas were allowed and taught for the ascetically inclined bhikshus, like Mahakashyapa.

Malcolm wrote:
You run the risk of conflating practitioners called "yogācārins," with the Yogācāra school and its sūtras.

When Vasubandhu refers to yogācārins here, he is not referring to followers of the Lankāvatara, etc., sūtras.

We can understand these so-called "yogācārins" to be different than the Yogācārins following Asanga, because for instance, Samghabhadra's commentary mentions yogācarins exactly four times, and only the context those who are meditating the impure dhyānas, as does Dignāga. Sthiramati only mentions these past masters called yogācārins eight times, and without any indication this refers to the school we presently know as Yogācāra.

And my point still stands that there is no evidence of the Sūtrasammucaya attributed to Nāgārjuna mentioned in any text prior to the 6th century.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 8:02 PM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:



shankara said:
Yeah sure, it isn't a Vinaya downfall, if it was nobody could become a monk. But there must have been at least one school who considered that ceasing nocturnal emissions is necessary to become an Arhat...

Malcolm wrote:
The other way around: becoming an Arhat entails no longer having NE. But who cares? It's not important.

shankara said:
So this is just my own perspective, but from my experience in meditation I've found that we tend to rationalize behaviors we are unwilling to give up.

Malcolm wrote:
Whether arhats have NE’s or not is unimportant, not only intrinsically, but because there are no arhats anymore.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 7:55 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Again, no recommendations about how to get from point a to point b. It may not be possible under capitalism at all.

Grigoris said:
I've got plenty of recommendations, none of them involve capitalism.  Actually most of them involve completely dismantling capitalism. But there are no viable alternatives to capitalism that do not necessitate catastrophic failures of civilization, billions of deaths from famine, disease, and war, inevitable nuclear conflict, and so on.

So, I pretty much think we are screwed no matter what we think, or what our pet theories are on how to save humanity from itself.
What's up man, things look bleak from the vantage point of the empire?

Don't worry, you would not believe how many of us out here are looking on joyfully.

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t care about empires, I care about people. You’re just trading one kind of suffering for another.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 7:52 PM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:


Aemilius said:
I don't believe that the widely held opinion is true that Yogacara school or thought arose at the time of Asanga and Vasubandhu. Vasubandhu uses in the Abhidhamakosha bhashyam the expression "ancient masters" and this is understood to mean yogacara masters.

Malcolm wrote:
No, he is generally referring to other Abhidharmikas.

Aemilius said:
On page 462 of the Abhidharmakosha bhashyam: " But according to the ancient masters, the Yogacarins, the manner of its moving is such that sometimes the moon appears complete, sometimes incomplete."

Page 562:" The Yogacarins say that in the Dhyanas, through the force of absorption a rupa arises, which is the object of absorption, ..."

On pages 711.. 712 there is a longish footnote:" ... Vyakhya: 'According to the Yogacarins there are one hundred and twenty-eight kleshas.'
The definition of the avarabhagiyas attributed to apare. These "other masters" are the yogacarins (Vyakhya).
The ascetics (yogacarya) who practice ashubha are of three types, Adikarmika ...
The Vyakhya: In the system (darsana) of the Yogacaras, the manodhatu is distinct from the six vijñanas ... "

Malcolm wrote:
These are not the only ancient masters he refers to. And, yes, they are still abhidharmikas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 5:16 AM
Title: Re: How has being a Buddhist changed you?
Content:
krish5 said:
Thought provoking post Malcolm, sort of like a koan, but i have no idea what Dharma is, if it has nothing to do with any of those things i brought up.

Malcolm wrote:
The Buddha put it pretty simply, "Whoever sees dependent origination, sees the Dharma. Whoever sees the Dharma, sees me."

Nāgārjuna added:
I prostrate to the best of teachers,
the Sambuddha,
by whom dependent origination—
not ceasing, not arising,
not annihilated, not permanent,
not going, not coming,
not different, not the same—
was taught as peace, the pacification of proliferation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 5:07 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
I used to go to a meeting group for awhile with Joan Tollifson, which i enjoyed, but when i shared what we were doing in the group with others online, in a different spiritual forum, some put her approach down, saying it is watered down Zen and Americanized, and not real.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, whatever she is teaching, it is not Buddhadharma.


krish5 said:
For she would tell us we can keep our eyes open or closed during meditation, sit or lie down or any position we are comfortable in, etc. There was no rules and no formal approach to practice, it was very loose and informal. To her meditation, can happen without formalizing it. I do see the points though of others, some of these teachers are throwing out the tradition, the traditional, and catering to Americans, and basically stripping these practices of all forms that have been carried over for years via tradition and made it suitable to us Americans/Westerners who do not want to work hard at this, haha.

Malcolm wrote:
Dharma is not about meditating. This is vastly misunderstood point. The Buddha did not meditate in order to achieve awakening. He meditated in order to eliminate the traces of rebirth he had created for himself through his past cultivation of the dhyānas of the form and formless realms. That said, there is right meditation and wrong meditation. It is important to learn the difference.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 3:58 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:


Aemilius said:
I don't believe that the widely held opinion is true that Yogacara school or thought arose at the time of Asanga and Vasubandhu. Vasubandhu uses in the Abhidhamakosha bhashyam the expression "ancient masters" and this is understood to mean yogacara masters.

Malcolm wrote:
No, he is generally referring to other Abhidharmikas.


Aemilius said:
Secondly, both the Chinese and Tibetan traditions hold that the Sutra samuccaya was authored by Nagarjuna. Sutra samuccya is a collection of quotations from the sutras, and Nagarjuna has included several quotations from the Lankavatara sutra in his collection of sutra passages.

Malcolm wrote:
Given that it is cited by name only in post-6th century Madhyamaka and Yogacāra authors, it is unlikely that this text was authored by Nāgārjuna, despite the traditional attribution. Also, you should keep in mind it was first translated into Tibetan by Yeshe De in the 8th century, and only translated into Chinese in the early part of the eleventh century and only in one translation by Dharmarakṣa.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 3:29 AM
Title: Re: How has being a Buddhist changed you?
Content:
krish5 said:
How has being a Buddhist changed you, your life? Are you happier, more at peace, content, less greedy, celibate or proper sexual activity, filled with loving kindness, more tolerance of others, patience, less anger, less jealousy/envy, free from suffering, enlightened?

Malcolm wrote:
These outcomes are all based on notions of self-fulfillment. That's not the point of the Dharma.

If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "happier" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "more at peace" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "content" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "less greedy" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "celibate or properly sexual" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "filled with loving kindness" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "more tolerant, patient, less angry, jealous" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "free from suffering" you are not practicing Dharma.
If you are a "Dharma" practitioner and you are "enlightened" you are not practicing Dharma.

These are all feelings. Feelings are not the Dharma.

So what is Dharma?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 3:20 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
So yes, the marketing seems to have worked in my opinion

Malcolm wrote:
Batchelor might be busy, but he is not busy with the Dharma, whatever else he may be busy with.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 3:19 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The problem here is that when people start naively militating against consumption, they usually have no real plan for how to go about it, other than platitudes about eating less meat and so on.

Grigoris said:
Without global social/political change there will be no reduction in consumption.

The attempt by the German Greens, for example, to institute environmental/ecological change and goals in a capitalist economy failed.  They failed because capitalism values the individual more than society.

Also environmental/ecological goals are for the benefit of society not industry.

Capitalism, on the other hand... The economy is not money.
In capitalism money is the measure of economy.

Malcolm wrote:
Money is one measure, it is not the only measure.

Grigoris said:
Without global social/political change there will be no reduction in consumption.


Malcolm wrote:
Again, no recommendations about how to get from point a to point b. It may not be possible under capitalism at all.

But there are no viable alternatives to capitalism that do not necessitate catastrophic failures of civilization, billions of deaths from famine, disease, and war, inevitable nuclear conflict, and so on.

So, I pretty much think we are screwed no matter what we think, or what our pet theories are on how to save humanity from itself.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 2:14 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
And i agree that Batchelor is using his ex-monk status for his own benefit and smartly found a way to make his career off of Buddhism, selling it to a certain population. That is smart marketing.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because after all, where would the Dharma be without marketing?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 2:09 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
...where we destroy our own economy voluntarily...

Grigoris said:
Oh, are we talking about money again?

Malcolm wrote:
The economy is not money. The economy is "the wealth and resources of a country or region, especially in terms of the production and consumption of goods and services." Don't see money anywhere in that definition (OED) or "the structure or conditions of economic life in a country, area, or period
also : an economic system." (MW)

So, what we are discussing here is the destruction of one set of conditions for economic life and replacing it with another. The problem here is that when people start naively militating against consumption, they usually have no real plan for how to go about it, other than platitudes about eating less meat and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 12:53 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
How do you propose to tell developing nations that they should not want what they perceive as first world advantages?

Mirror said:
I just can't. They won't want it if they understand, that it won't bring them happiness. I would exchange everything I have for being a tibetan monk and having a close relationship with a good teacher.
For all of you, who have a connection to a great teacher, please practice diligently. Don't seek sensual pleasures and do everything you can for the sake of practice. Do it for those, who wish for having same conditions like you have. Don't waste this precious opportunity on frivolous activities.


Malcolm wrote:
Sanctimony really isn't going to help.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 12:52 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Mirror said:
Meat production has the biggest impact on global warming and has the highest pollution of all. From 20% up to 50% is responsible for all pollution.

Malcolm wrote:
Your stats are based on an error published in a 2006 report, whose author admitted the error and submitted a revision. In fact, only 14.5 percent of global GHG emissions come from livestock. This is from the UN's FAO report: http://www.fao.org/3/CA1201EN/ca1201en.pdf. This is a significant amount, but it is not in the stratosphere as someone would think if they just took your stats at face value. It can also be cut by 30%, the report says, by changing certain practices.

In terms of percentages, livestock emit:

Gt CO2-eq of CO2 per annum, or 5 percent of anthropogenic CO2 emissions (IPCC, 2007)
3.1 Gt CO2-eq of CH4 per annum, or 44 percent of anthropogenic CH4 emissions (IPCC, 2007)
2 Gt CO2-eq of N2O per annum, or 53 percent of anthropogenic N2O emissions (IPCC, 2007)

http://www.fao.org/news/story/en/item/197623/icode/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, May 2nd, 2020 at 12:13 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The problem is extremely easy to identify; the solutions, not so easy or obvious.

Mirror said:
The problem is consumption, the solution is reducing consumption.

Malcolm wrote:
That is not so easy or obvious. This is like Jimmy Carter putting on a sweater and putting solar water heater on the roof of the White House. It seems like the obvious answer, but the answer is anything but obvious. You're basically advocating a kind of first-world authoritarianism, where we destroy our own economy voluntarily, which in turn forces the developing world to stunt its growth. How do you propose to tell developing nations that they should not want what they perceive as first world advantages?

In general, human beings, collectively, have always behaved like frogs in a gradually warming pot.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 10:47 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Queequeg said:
Maybe nonsense. Short of collapse, which is possible, I don't see consumption going down. Maybe we switch to electric cars but that's a rather minor improvement in the scheme. I don't know if these are the final numbers but with the slow down of activity, carbon emissions are down about 8% only. The explanation is that power generation hasn't slowed.

I don't see an effective way to reduce energy consumption. No one is turning down heat when it's so cheap. No one is turning off lights or turning off tvs and computers. And I see consumption only going up as the developing world continues to progress. The ideal life of the impoverished third world is not inspiring anyone. China is the model for the developing world now and that requires lots of coal.

The only energy source that can help is nuclear and that's another set of problems.

Population is something we can affect over a couple generations, gently and humanely. We just need the will to talk about it and address it.

Malcolm wrote:
The key to lowering population is the education of women. Also, there seems to be a positive correlation between lower fertility rates and meat consumption.

The real issue is that human beings still think of themselves as belonging to this or that nationality; when in reality we all live on the same planet, competing for same resources, etc. The problem is extremely easy to identify; the solutions, not so easy or obvious.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 10:42 PM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Mirror said:
But it doesn't matter. Technology after all brings more pain and suffering in a global scale. Especially to animals, insects and other forms of life. We have to exploit others in order to develop.

All problems we face in our society such as global warming, wars, discrimination, etc. have the cause in self-cherishing, self-centeredness, cherishing the "I".


Malcolm wrote:
There isn't more suffering. There is always the same amount of suffering, this is why Buddha said, "sarvadukkhaṃ."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 9:39 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
Wayfarer said:
Just to invite a lot of vitriol, to the green left, everyone is racist. It’s the equivalent of Original Sin. The only people that aren’t racist are victims of racism/beleaguered minorities. (Shields UP!!)

Malcolm wrote:
Genocide and slavery are the original sins of America. We have not worked out the complex net of social issues brought about by either. For example, the reservations in the US have yet to receive a single penny of the 8 billion promised them; yet Jared Kushner was approved for a 800 million dollar government loan which will allow him to speculate in real estate.

Black, brown, and native people are dying at much higher rates in the US than the whites, and it is not because of some natural disposition to being killed by corona virus. It is because they live in more polluted communities, with less access to good jobs, good food, and good educations, which all have significant public health impacts.

So while a white person in the US may not be personally racist, we all benefit from a systematized racism. It is very obvious in the US, it may be less obvious in other countries without the kind if colonial history we have.

Now back to Stephen Batchelor, an ex-monk who has made his career off of Buddhism, selling it to white people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 5:23 AM
Title: Re: What are you doing about the coronavirus?
Content:



PeterC said:
The issues of the civil war era remain unsettled. America won't get out of its political mire until they are.

Malcolm wrote:
Two books: Democracy in Chains by Nancy Maclean and How the South Won The Civil War by Heath Cox Richardson.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 3:40 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure classical Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
smcj said:
Gelugpas are not Yogacarins. They teach Madhyamaka as the ultimate view, but as interpreted by Tsognkhapa. The other schools use the Chandrakirti interpretation primarily.
Malcolm trained in Sakya. He's preference understandable.

Dgj said:
Thanks. Do you know of any modern author, teacher or specific temple or school of Gelug that, in addition to teaching Madhyamaka, also teaches zero Yogacara?

Malcolm wrote:
It will be almost impossible to find modern course of Madhyamaka that contains no references to Yogacāra.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, May 1st, 2020 at 3:09 AM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:



shankara said:
Well doesn't such a schism suggest that one of the parties, at least, considered that overcoming nocturnal emissions is something desirable?

Malcolm wrote:
It is not a fault for monks to have NE.

shankara said:
Yeah sure, it isn't a Vinaya downfall, if it was nobody could become a monk. But there must have been at least one school who considered that ceasing nocturnal emissions is necessary to become an Arhat...

Malcolm wrote:
The other way around: becoming an Arhat entails no longer having NE. But who cares? It's not important.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 11:28 PM
Title: Re: Restoring refuge vows
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
You repeat the daily confession, the seven branch prayer.

TMT said:
Malcolm, I havent read the entire book, so Im not sure if you mean theres a specific daily confession and seven branch prayer in it, or if you mean in general, make a daily confession and perform the seven branches. As in would any confession and seven branch prayer be fine?

Malcolm wrote:
The seven branch prayer contains everything, including confession. That confession renews your refuge and bodhisattva vows. In the Sarma schools, there is a specific prayer called "the daily confession":

I go for refuge to the Three Jewels 
and individually confess each misdeed. 
I rejoice in the merit of beings. 
I bear in mind the bodhicitta of the Buddhas. 
I go for refuge until awakening 
to the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Supreme Sangha.
I generate bodhicitta 
in order to truly accomplish my own and others’ benefit.
Having generated supreme bodhicitta, 
I invite all sentient beings to practice the pleasing, supreme conduct of awakening.
May I accomplish Buddhahood 
in order to benefit migrating beings.

This is recited in the beginning of many sadhanas, after one goes for refuge and bodhicitta.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 11:24 PM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Just to clarify, the Sakyas in general hold that it is practice dependent, but not part of the general 14 root downfalls., which, according them are a product of the vajramaster empowerment specifically.

tingdzin said:
Interesting. Thanks.

Malcolm wrote:
Here is the reference:

https://www.tbrc.org/#library_work_ViewByOutline-O01CT00264CZ121894%7CW22271, pg. 297.

The specific refutation begins on pg. 298, line five:

/kunda spangs par smra ba de'ang de lta ma yin te/ de ltar yin na, khyim pa'i phyogs rdo rje 'dzin par mi  'gyur ba'i skyon yod do/ yang byang chub sems kunda spangs 'di ni shes rab ye shes kyi dbang gi bsrung pa'i dam tshig yin pa'i phyir, 'dir smos don med do/

Also, that claim [the fifth root downfall involves] the loss of the kunda is also not so. If it were so, householders would have the fault of not being vajra holders. Further, because this loss of the kunda bodhicitta is a samaya of the wisdom consort's gnosis empowerment to protect, it also makes no sense to mention it here.

In Jetsun Drakpa Gyaltsen's understanding, and consequently, for Sakya in general, the fifth root downfall is strictly related only to the loss of aspirational bodhicitta, but to not engaged bodhicitta, ultimate bodhicitta, or kunda bodhicitta.

So when is it an actual samaya not to lose the kunda bodhicitta? Specifically, it is when one is engaged in the practice related to the third empowerment, and not before hand. If one is not engaged in this practice, this samaya does not apply. This, at least, is now the Sakyapas understand and teach it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 9:25 PM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
shankara said:
Wasn't the first major schism in the Sangha due to a disagreement about whether Arhats continue to have nocturnal emissions?

Malcolm wrote:
That is one of the legends that attends accounts of the Second Council.

shankara said:
Well doesn't such a schism suggest that one of the parties, at least, considered that overcoming nocturnal emissions is something desirable?

Malcolm wrote:
It is not a fault for monks to have NE.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 11:57 AM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
tingdzin said:
Thanks , I'll try to check that. Meanwhile, such a citation would also be appreciated.

Malcolm wrote:
Just to clarify, the Sakyas in general hold that it is practice dependent, but not part of the general 14 root downfalls., which, according them are a product of the vajramaster empowerment specifically.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 8:54 AM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
tingdzin said:
Malcolm, your post saying that the Sakyas think seminal retention is ridiculous is new to me (I haven't studied any Sakya stuff). I don't doubt you on this, but could you supply some (easily accessible) sources that I could read on the issue?

Malcolm wrote:
Jetsun Drakpa Gyaltsen disputes the now commonly-held Kalacakra interpretation of what it means to retain the jasmine-like bodhicitta. He asserts it just means bodhicitta, ala sutra. I’ll look for the citation tomorrow. I am pretty sure he discusses it in his commentary on the fourteen root downfalls.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 6:02 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Dgj said:
I'm also interested in whether or not a pure Madhyamaka school exists today from a strictly academic perspective.

Malcolm wrote:
In that case, Sakya is your best bet, especially the work of Gorampa.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 4:47 AM
Title: Re: Restoring refuge vows
Content:
TMT said:
In "A torch Lighting the Way to Freedom" , Dudjom Rinpoche talks about the specific refuge vows and that they can be broken. He states if this happens you should repair the vows. Anyone familiar with a practice for restoring or strengthening your refuge vows, kind of like the bodhisattva vow is done? Im talking about the 10 refuge vows to be specific. Maybe one could repeat the refuge ceromony lines in front of the shrine.

Malcolm wrote:
You repeat the daily confession, the seven branch prayer.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 4:35 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Dgj said:
Fair enough. But labels aside, the fact that there is no such thing as an independent Madhyamaka school today, and all are combined in varying degrees with Yogacara, means that the two schools have become merged, no?

Malcolm wrote:
No.

When I studied Madhyamaka in the Sakya school, it was pure Madhyamaka. In general, Yogacāra is held to be a lower tenet system than Madhyamaka in most Tibetan Buddhist schools.

The Sakya, Nyingma, and Gelug schools identify their view as Prasangika Madhyamaka, which is the purest form of Madhyamaka with no Yogacāra at all. This Madhyamaka tradition regards the so-called Yogacāra Sūtras, such as the Lanakāvatara, Samdhinirmocana, etc., to be provisional in meaning, not definitive in meaning.

Some Kagyus and the Jonangpa school follow a kind of "Madhyamaka" in which the doctrines of the Yogacāra school are mixed with the Madhyamaka doctrine of two truths. But this synthesis has been subject to severe criticism for the past 600 years.

Dgj said:
Huh! Wow I didn't know that. Thanks for informing me! So one might be able to find a teacher or temple that does not teach Yogacara at all? From reading it sounds like the Gelug still teach it, perhaps I'm getting incorrect information?

Do you have any examples of schools, temples or individual teachers that teach classical Madhyamaka and zero Yogacara?

Malcolm wrote:
Why do you have such an urge to avoid contact with Yogacāra?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 4:18 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Dgj said:
Fair enough. But labels aside, the fact that there is no such thing as an independent Madhyamaka school today, and all are combined in varying degrees with Yogacara, means that the two schools have become merged, no?

Malcolm wrote:
No.

When I studied Madhyamaka in the Sakya school, it was pure Madhyamaka. In general, Yogacāra is held to be a lower tenet system than Madhyamaka in most Tibetan Buddhist schools.

The Sakya, Nyingma, and Gelug schools identify their view as Prasangika Madhyamaka, which is the purest form of Madhyamaka with no Yogacāra at all. This Madhyamaka tradition regards the so-called Yogacāra Sūtras, such as the Lanakāvatara, Samdhinirmocana, etc., to be provisional in meaning, not definitive in meaning.

Some Kagyus and the Jonangpa school follow a kind of "Madhyamaka" in which the doctrines of the Yogacāra school are mixed with the Madhyamaka doctrine of two truths. But this synthesis has been subject to severe criticism for the past 600 years.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 3:49 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:


Kim O'Hara said:
The problem is political, not technological, or at least more political than technological.



Malcolm wrote:
https://www.filmsforaction.org/articles/richard-heinberg-review-planet-of-the-humans/

Richard Heinberg has some interesting things to say on this issue:
I feel fairly confident commenting on the first of these claims, regarding renewable energy, having spent a year working with David Fridley of Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory to assess the prospects for a complete transition to solar and wind power.

We found that the transition to renewables is going far too slowly to make much of a difference during the crucial next couple of decades, and would be gobsmackingly expensive if we were to try replacing all fossil fuel use with solar and wind. We also found, as the film underscores again and again, that the intermittency of sunshine and wind is a real problem—one that can only be solved with energy storage (batteries, pumped hydro, or compressed air, all of which are costly in money and energy terms); or with source redundancy (building way more generation capacity than you’re likely to need at any one time, and connecting far-flung generators on a super-grid); or demand management (which entails adapting our behavior to using energy only when it’s available). All three strategies involve trade-offs. In the energy world, there is no free lunch. Further, the ways we use energy today are mostly adapted to the unique characteristics of fossil fuels, so a full transition to renewables will require the replacement of an extraordinary amount of infrastructure in our food system, manufacturing, building heating, the construction industry, and on and on. Altogether, the only realistic way to make the transition in industrial countries like the US is to begin reducing overall energy usage substantially, eventually running the economy on a quarter, a fifth, or maybe even a tenth of current energy.
Is it true that mainstream enviros have oversold renewables? Yes. They have portrayed the transition away from fossil fuels as mostly a political problem; the implication in many of their communications is that, if we somehow come up with the money and the political will, we can replace oil with solar and continue living much as we do today, though with a clear climate conscience. That’s an illusion that deserves shattering.
He also says:
But the film does make some silly mistakes. Gibbs claims that a solar panel will generate less energy than it took to build the panel. That’s a misleading claim. Many teams of researchers have addressed the question of energy return on energy invested for solar power, and even the most pessimistic results (with which I mostly agree) say that the technology can yield a marginal energy gain. Much of that gain goes away if we have to “pay” for the energy investment entailed in providing batteries or redundant capacity. Wind power generally has a better energy payback than solar, but the location of turbines matters a great deal and ideal sites are limited in number. Assessing solar and wind power calls for complicated energy accounting, but the film reduces that complexity to a blanket, binary dismissal.
And:
I agree with Gibbs, however, that renewables are realistically incapable of maintaining our current levels of energy usage, especially in rich countries like the US. Transitioning to electric cars may be a useful small-scale and short-term strategy for reducing oil consumption (I drive one myself), but limits to lithium and other raw materials used in building e-cars mean we really need to think about how to get rid of personal cars altogether.

Mainstream enviros will hate this movie because it exposes some of their real failings. By focusing on techno-fixes, they have sidelined nearly all discussion of overpopulation and overconsumption. Maybe that’s understandable as a marketing strategy, but it’s a mistake to let marketing consultants sort truth from fiction for us.
And finally:
Planet of the Humans paints environmental organizations and leaders with a broad and accusatory brush. One target is Jeremy Grantham, a billionaire investment analyst who created the Grantham Foundation for the Protection of the Environment in 1997. Grantham was already a mega-rich investor before he “got religion” on environmental issues. I’ve had several face-to-face meetings with him (full disclosure: the Grantham Foundation has provided modest funding to Post Carbon Institute, where I work) and it’s clear that he cares deeply about overpopulation and overconsumption, and he understands that economic growth is killing the planet. He’s scared for his children and grandchildren, and he genuinely wants to use whatever wealth and influence he has to change the world. To imply, as the film does, that he merely sees green tech as an investment strategy is a poorly aimed cheap shot. Bill McKibben, who is skewered even more savagely, also deserves better; he has replied to the film here.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 3:29 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:


Dgj said:
As to the merger, I was referencing this:
Śāntarakṣita founded the philosophical approach known as Yogācāra-Mādhyamika (c.q. Yogācāra-Svatantrika-Mādhyamika), which united the Madhyamaka tradition of Nagarjuna, the Yogacara tradition of Asanga, and the logical and epistemological thought of Dharmakirti.

-Wiki page on Santaraksita
That and the fact that there doesn't seem to be any such thing as Madhyamaka independent of Yogacara today, but they used to be separate, even in opposition to one another. So it appears that they have been totally merged.

Perhaps you would use a word other than "merger" to describe this?

Malcolm wrote:
You should understand that Śāntarakṣita would have been astonished by such classifications. These are Tibetan classifications dating from late 12th century and later.

Śāntarakṣita is termed a "Yogacāra Madhyamaka" by later Tibetans because he adopted the idea of appearances being mind-only (cittamatra), which occurs in several Mahāyāna sūtras.

However, Śāntarakṣita severely critiques the mind-only perspective advanced by the Yogācāra school in texts such as the Tattvasaṃgraha, and so on, as did his disciple, Kamalaśīla in the commentaries the latter wrote on his master's works. \

So, better not to take such labels at face value.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 2:56 AM
Title: Re: Why is devotion towards the guru so important?
Content:
tomdzogchen27 said:
I am currently practising in the Karma Kagyu lineage and have read some basic articles about the importance of devotion. Nevertheless, I can't comprehend why it is so fundamental towards achieving enlightenment. Couldn't it generate negative power/cultish dynamics? I also practiced in the Theravada and Zen traditions previously and was attracted towards Tibetan Buddhism because of the clarity of the nature of mind practices. Any thoughts?

heart said:
Without a genuine guru it is close to impossible to recognise the natural state.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
It's actually impossible.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 2:55 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:


Dgj said:
Is there any record of Nagarjuna or other classical Madhyamaka teachers, before the Yogacara-Madhyamaka merger, stating that one must understand the point of view of Yogacara to understand Madhyamaka?

Malcolm wrote:
No. Yogacāra really emerged only as an independent Mahāyāna school in the fifth and sixth century CE. Thus, the target of Nāgārjuna's critiques were only Abhidharmikas.

Also, there was never a Yogacāra-Madyamaka merger, so to speak.

Both Mādhyamika scholars and Yogācara scholars were working on the basis of the same sets of sūtras; but their understanding and classification of these sūtras differed.

In any case, the pre-Yogacāra scholars would be Nāgārjuna and Āryadeva. Even though the latter's text has the colophon title " The Yoga Practice of Bodhisattvas (bodhisattvayogacārya) composed in Four Hundred Verses," this has nothing to do with the later Yogacāra School of Maitreya, Asanga, and Vasubandhu.

Dgj said:
Okay, thanks. Since this is the case, we can assume that Nagarjuna and other classical Madhyamaka teachers would not have required their students to learn and understand Yogacara.

Therefore, since I am looking into learning about classical Madhyamaka, it seems reasonable to also assume that I need not learn Yogacara, as classical Madhyamaka, per it's founder and other authorities and masters, does not require a previous study of Yogacara.

Malcolm wrote:
You don't have to learn Yogacāra to study Madhyamaka. However, failing to do so will mean you will automatically be depriving yourself of a significant portion of Mahāyāna thought. But that's up to you.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 2:40 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:


Dgj said:
Is there any record of Nagarjuna or other classical Madhyamaka teachers, before the Yogacara-Madhyamaka merger, stating that one must understand the point of view of Yogacara to understand Madhyamaka?

Malcolm wrote:
No. Yogacāra really emerged only as an independent Mahāyāna school in the fifth and sixth century CE. Thus, the target of Nāgārjuna's critiques were only Abhidharmikas.

Also, there was never a Yogacāra-Madyamaka merger, so to speak.

Both Mādhyamika scholars and Yogācara scholars were working on the basis of the same sets of sūtras; but their understanding and classification of these sūtras differed.

In any case, the pre-Yogacāra scholars would be Nāgārjuna and Āryadeva. Even though the latter's text has the colophon title " The Yoga Practice of Bodhisattvas (bodhisattvayogacārya) composed in Four Hundred Verses," this has nothing to do with the later Yogacāra School of Maitreya, Asanga, and Vasubandhu.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 2:02 AM
Title: Re: Why is devotion towards the guru so important?
Content:
tomdzogchen27 said:
I am currently practising in the Karma Kagyu lineage and have read some basic articles about the importance of devotion. Nevertheless, I can't comprehend why it is so fundamental towards achieving enlightenment. Couldn't it generate negative power/cultish dynamics? I also practiced in the Theravada and Zen traditions previously and was attracted towards Tibetan Buddhism because of the clarity of the nature of mind practices. Any thoughts?

Malcolm wrote:
As it says in the Prajñāpāramitā Saṃcayagātha:

The excellent disciple with devotion to the guru
always relies on learned gurus.
If it is asked for what reason, the qualities of being learned arise from them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 2:01 AM
Title: Re: Celebrities and Buddhism
Content:
Queequeg said:
Steven Seagal was recognized as a Buddhist, so to speak... FWIW. http://www.palyul.org/docs/statement.html

Malcolm wrote:
However, what has largely gone unnoticed is that Chundrak Dorje's treasures were paint. He apparently painted amazing murals in his monastery from paint he discovered in a treasure cache.

Anyway, the whole tulku system is corrupt, and the reason why lamas continue to recognize tulkus is because there is huge demand from faithful lay people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 12:49 AM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
shankara said:
Wasn't the first major schism in the Sangha due to a disagreement about whether Arhats continue to have nocturnal emissions?

Malcolm wrote:
That is one of the legends that attends accounts of the Second Council.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 12:32 AM
Title: Re: Why Bon ≈ Buddhism?
Content:



Viach said:
Give a link to the source, please.

Malcolm wrote:
I just gave you the title of a text from the Bon Canon, which, according to the Bonpos, was taught by Tonpa Shenrab. If you know Tibetan, you can find many references here:

http://xxb.qiongbuwang.com/index/category/id/23.html

Anyway, you seem kind of annoyed by the equation of Bon and Buddhism.

Viach said:
In my personal reference anti-hit parade, you take an honorable first place.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't know what that means. I am trying to help you understand that the Bonpos claim their own sources for these doctrines. I am not defending their point of view.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 12:31 AM
Title: Re: Is there a pure Madhyamaka school in existence today?
Content:
Dgj said:
I am aware that there are many schools which teach Madhyamaka but as far as I know all of them are combined with Yogacara to varying degrees.

Are there any schools that only teach Madhyamaka?

If not, are there any that teach Madhyamaka and other schools combined but do not teach Yogacara?

I am not looking for schools like the Gelug school, for example, which teaches Madhyamaka as the highest teaching but they also teach Yogacara.

Malcolm wrote:
There are four tenet systems. One cannot properly understand the length and breadth of Madhyamaka unless you understand the point of view Abhidharma and Yogacāra, though the latter is only critiqued by Mādhyamika authors after the 5th century.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, April 30th, 2020 at 12:05 AM
Title: Re: Why Bon ≈ Buddhism?
Content:



Viach said:
Sorry for my English. Where did 4TNl come from in Bon?

Malcolm wrote:
According to Bonpos, from Tonpa Shenrab.

Viach said:
Give a link to the source, please.

Malcolm wrote:
I just gave you the title of a text from the Bon Canon, which, according to the Bonpos, was taught by Tonpa Shenrab. If you know Tibetan, you can find many references here:

http://xxb.qiongbuwang.com/index/category/id/23.html

Anyway, you seem kind of annoyed by the equation of Bon and Buddhism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 11:16 PM
Title: Re: Analytical meditation of H.H. Dalailama
Content:
bhava said:
Ultimate reality has the nature of self-awareness...

Malcolm wrote:
If this were true, then this view is no different than Samkhya's purusha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 10:56 PM
Title: Re: Why Bon ≈ Buddhism?
Content:


Viach said:
You did not understand. My post is about something else. Where does Bonpos have, for example, 4TN?

Malcolm wrote:
The four truths are mentioned in many original Bonpo texts. There is not much point in supplying many names of texts, but for example, it is found in the Bonpo Vinaya text, The Volume of the Tantra of Pure Discipline (rnam dag 'dul ba rgyud kyi 'bum), and so on, just as the six perfections, bodhicitta, paths and stages, tantric material, and Dzogchen are all to be found in the Bon canon.

Viach said:
Sorry for my English. Where did 4TNl come from in Bon?

Malcolm wrote:
According to Bonpos, from Tonpa Shenrab.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 10:14 PM
Title: Re: Chod phowa and lifespan
Content:
Toenail said:
I just wanted to add that "Phowa is bad for ones life span" is not the general teaching or the essence on that topic.

Malcolm wrote:
It can be, unless proper care is taken. That is why, after training in transference, we supplement our life force with long life mantras and recitations. It is in fact the general teaching, do you require proof?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 10:08 PM
Title: Re: Why Bon ≈ Buddhism?
Content:


Viach said:
You did not understand. My post is about something else. Where does Bonpos have, for example, 4TN?

Malcolm wrote:
The four truths are mentioned in many original Bonpo texts. There is not much point in supplying many names of texts, but for example, it is found in the Bonpo Vinaya text, The Volume of the Tantra of Pure Discipline (rnam dag 'dul ba rgyud kyi 'bum), and so on, just as the six perfections, bodhicitta, paths and stages, tantric material, and Dzogchen are all to be found in the Bon canon.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 9:57 PM
Title: Re: Chod phowa and lifespan
Content:
Toenail said:
I am not the dharma police etc., but maybe it is better to not say things like this on the internet. Better to take advice from ones own teacher about how life is shortened and extended etc and not read on the internet about it. If I would be new to the dharma and read people warning about life shortening effects of Phowa, I would be really put off the practice. I think it is probably very bad to make broad statements like that and broadcast them to many people one does not know. This will stay on the internet forever and people will probably read it 10 years from now.

For example, Ayang Rinpoche if I remember correctly said during the Phowa course in Bodhgaya some 6-7 years back that it will never shorten ones life and people who say that gather very bad karma and can go to hell. He said it is secterian. Even if there were textual references about it, they should be seen in context and in perspective to their intended audiences and not broadcasted out to a random audience and confuse them.

Malcolm wrote:
The horse has already left the barn. It is a little late to be closing the door now.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 8:28 PM
Title: Re: Chod phowa and lifespan
Content:
AmidaB said:
I try to rephrase and expand the question (in this time not excluding other forum members). So, what makes the difference between the lifespan shortening and non-lifespan-shortening versions of phowa? Thanks.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, for one thing, in phowa, you are using the energy of your vayu, sometimes called wind, to forcibly eject your consciousness. In cho, it’s just visualization.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 8:26 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
"You cannot learn Dharma from books."

This is Malcolms perception. He might or might not be right or partially correct. Yes, i agree it is best to learn from a live teacher, but for some of us it is not possible.

Also, why is there so many Buddhist books if they aren't helpful? If one can only learn from a live teacher?

So what do the others think about this, is it helpful for me to read Buddhist books or not? Do you think you can learn things or not from them?

I honestly thought i was learning things, gaining deeper insights when i was reading for instance Mingyur Rinpoches book about his retreat. I did not have to go on a retreat myself, to learn some of the things he was pointing out, it at least felt like that to me. Again, why write books like that and share it if one cannot learn Dharma from them?

Malcolm wrote:
There are three kinds of wisdom spoken of the Buddha: hearing, reflection, and cultivation.

You cannot hear the Dharma from a book.

I read Buddhist books for several years, took college courses on Buddhism, worked in a bookstore with literally hundreds of books about Buddhism, and so on. When I met my first teacher, His Holiness Sakya Trichen, in 1989, I realized I had not learned Dharma from those books, I had simply learned facts about Buddhism.

One can always tell people who have tried to learn Dharma from books as opposed to those who have properly studied under a qualified teacher from the way the former talk about the Dharma as opposed to the latter.

These days it is easy to gain access to proper Dharma teachings. Hearing the Dharma does not mean you have to attend in person. Online is just fine, if you cannot make it in person.

dharmafootsteps said:
And recordings? Would that count as 'hearing' Dharma?

Obviously there are some things that must happen in person, or at least live. But assuming one has received relevant lungs and wangs in the proper way from ones teacher, would you count listening to recordings of them as being the wisdom of hearing?

Malcolm wrote:
Sure.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 7:23 PM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:



shankara said:
Yeah I heard some things like this. Nonetheless there are a lot of yogis in both the Tibetan and Indian traditions who practice retention, and they seem to be doing alright.

Malcolm wrote:
As far as Tibetan yogis go, this is because they are likely practicing gtum mo, and also living on very restricted diets for long periods of time.

But if one is not doing gtum mo, etc., practice strictly, seminal retention is of no importance. If you try to refrain from ejaculating during normal sexual intercourse, you can cause many problems for your genital-urinary tract. Women  cannot retain their reproductive tissue, why should men bother? Doesn't make sense.

shankara said:
I think it could be unhealthy if one isn't practicing any kind of meditation, the way I see it is like building up a source of energy which becomes useful through the discipline of meditation, providing fuel to open the knots in the subtle winds, but otherwise might prove destructive, fuelling only the fire of fanaticism. It's necessary to transform, not to repress, and meditation is the process of that transformation.

Malcolm wrote:
The only purpose semen retention has in Buddhist yoga is to serve as a basis for the bliss of intercourse I(which is why it is a fault to lose it). It's also completely irrelevant in the system of Dzogchen.

What you want to retain is ojas, not sukra. You have to understand the difference. One is the pure part of one's food, the other is the final waste product of digestion. Retaining semen without need is like holding in your shit and piss. It isn't healthy.

shankara said:
Ok so I know we're still way off topic, but how come retention doesn't cause any problems for monks?

Malcolm wrote:
The body naturally eliminates semen through nocturnal emission. The reason issuing semen is attended with anxiety in Vinaya, for example, is that it is conflated with lust.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 10:14 AM
Title: Re: Classical Madhyamaka meditation?
Content:
Dgj said:
What type of meditation did Nagarjuna and Chandrakirti recommend? The standard dhyanas found in the Agamas?

What about other practices? Walking meditation, following the eightfold path, etc.?

Malcolm wrote:
You should examine what Candrakirti said about the perfection of concentration in his intro to Madhyamaka.

Dgj said:
Where would I find this? Could you post the relevant section?

Malcolm wrote:
Introduction to the Middle Way.

There is also Kamalashila’s bhavanakrama texts, this is where you will find a classical presentation of rage nine stages of shamatha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 9:43 AM
Title: Re: Classical Madhyamaka meditation?
Content:
Dgj said:
What type of meditation did Nagarjuna and Chandrakirti recommend? The standard dhyanas found in the Agamas?

What about other practices? Walking meditation, following the eightfold path, etc.?

Malcolm wrote:
You should examine what Candrakirti said about the perfection of concentration in his intro to Madhyamaka.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 9:32 AM
Title: Re: Renewable Energy
Content:
Kim O'Hara said:
In media interviews over the past week, the energy and emissions reduction minister, Angus Taylor, has called for a “gas-fired recovery” from the Covid-19 pandemic after the collapse of oil and gas prices.

Malcolm wrote:
See, it is hard for renewables to compete with that.

Kim O'Hara said:
Yes.
The problem is political, not technological, or at least more political than technological.
We need a new government - as do lots of other places - and some of us are working towards that.


Kim

Malcolm wrote:
The problem is cultural and systematic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 3:36 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
Thank you for your sharing, it is starting to penetrate and make more sense to me now, why one needs a teacher. Books are helpful up to a point, but a teacher is necessary. I get it now, thank you so much for that.

Malcolm wrote:
The job of a teacher is assist you in discovering liberation for yourself, after which you can then benefit others.

Without a teacher, it is virtually impossible to know if one is practicing Dharma or just some technique you like.

Following a teacher is profound, and also not easy. All good teachers also have teachers.

There is also no fault in examining many teachers, until one discovers one that one feels are genuine connection to. But be careful, there are also some people out there who are not good teachers, but who, nevertheless, for this reason and that, become celebrated. Stephen Batchelor is one of those. Not saying he is a bad person. He isn't. But what he is teaching is not Dharma. That means he is not a good teacher.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 3:32 AM
Title: Re: Chetsun Nyingthig Lojong
Content:
asdfjkl1979 said:
Thanks, Malcolm.

I have seen Khenpo Namdrol's text but wasn't sure I should get it as it is restricted. I have received direct intro from Namkhai Norbu many times (I want a commentary to assist me in reviewing the SMS Base). The LoB website says the following:

" All those who have the fortunate wish to engage with this level of practice must first receive the Nyingtig Yabzhi or the Chetsun Nyingtig empowerment, followed by the reading transmission and upadesha instructions. That is the recommended approach. If this is not possible, disciples must at minimum receive a Great Perfection empowerment for the dynamic strength of awareness from a highly qualified lineage master."

In your opinion, do I meet the minimum requirement?

Malcolm wrote:
No.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 2:40 AM
Title: Re: Waste of semen - split from: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Sādhaka said:
From what I understand, you’ll want to practice retention always during the phase of the waxing moon at least.

Malcolm wrote:
No, this not true.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 2:02 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
"You cannot learn Dharma from books."

This is Malcolms perception. He might or might not be right or partially correct. Yes, i agree it is best to learn from a live teacher, but for some of us it is not possible.

Also, why is there so many Buddhist books if they aren't helpful? If one can only learn from a live teacher?

So what do the others think about this, is it helpful for me to read Buddhist books or not? Do you think you can learn things or not from them?

I honestly thought i was learning things, gaining deeper insights when i was reading for instance Mingyur Rinpoches book about his retreat. I did not have to go on a retreat myself, to learn some of the things he was pointing out, it at least felt like that to me. Again, why write books like that and share it if one cannot learn Dharma from them?

Malcolm wrote:
There are three kinds of wisdom spoken of the Buddha: hearing, reflection, and cultivation.

You cannot hear the Dharma from a book.

I read Buddhist books for several years, took college courses on Buddhism, worked in a bookstore with literally hundreds of books about Buddhism, and so on. When I met my first teacher, His Holiness Sakya Trichen, in 1989, I realized I had not learned Dharma from those books, I had simply learned facts about Buddhism.

One can always tell people who have tried to learn Dharma from books as opposed to those who have properly studied under a qualified teacher from the way the former talk about the Dharma as opposed to the latter.

These days it is easy to gain access to proper Dharma teachings. Hearing the Dharma does not mean you have to attend in person. Online is just fine, if you cannot make it in person.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 1:55 AM
Title: Re: Rigpa calendar alternative
Content:
Grigoris said:
Her is one from the Karma Kagyu tradition.

https://www.karmakagyucalendar.org/current-calendar?fbclid=IwAR1E7imdjA3qOI7sEYW88tK-ONSPLh0JZs6UDpyNTzkUJ5IvOzyIHlgxo9g

I know, you asked for a Nyingma calendar...

There is also a free android app put out by the Drukpa Kagyu.  Search for "Tibetan Calendar" in Google Play.

Malcolm wrote:
The Merigar calendar has features other calenders lack, such as a table for figuring out yearly obstacles by birth year and what kinds of practices one should do to avert these; days for planning or avoiding medical procedures, and so on, based on one's animal year, the meanings of daily major combinations and minor combinations, tables for moxibustion, and so on.

Other calendars mainly have lineage specific anniversaries and feast days. Not as useful.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 1:14 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:


shankara said:
From personal experience, I think it is a good discipline. It gives a certain stability and nourishes practice.

Malcolm wrote:
From a Tibetan Medical and Ayurvedic point of view, it is unhealthy not to release semen. Semen is just the final waste product of the body. Retaining it is like not emptying the trash. What you want to retain is ojas. Releasing semen is only an issue if your diet is nutrient poor, because in this case, you can risk losing some ojas. But if your diet is nutritionally rich, there is no problem with releasing semen, because you will have an abundance of ojas to spare.

shankara said:
Yeah I heard some things like this. Nonetheless there are a lot of yogis in both the Tibetan and Indian traditions who practice retention, and they seem to be doing alright.

Malcolm wrote:
As far as Tibetan yogis go, this is because they are likely practicing gtum mo, and also living on very restricted diets for long periods of time.

But if one is not doing gtum mo, etc., practice strictly, seminal retention is of no importance. If you try to refrain from ejaculating during normal sexual intercourse, you can cause many problems for your genital-urinary tract. Women  cannot retain their reproductive tissue, why should men bother? Doesn't make sense.

shankara said:
I think it could be unhealthy if one isn't practicing any kind of meditation, the way I see it is like building up a source of energy which becomes useful through the discipline of meditation, providing fuel to open the knots in the subtle winds, but otherwise might prove destructive, fuelling only the fire of fanaticism. It's necessary to transform, not to repress, and meditation is the process of that transformation.

Malcolm wrote:
The only purpose semen retention has in Buddhist yoga is to serve as a basis for the bliss of intercourse I(which is why it is a fault to lose it). It's also completely irrelevant in the system of Dzogchen.

What you want to retain is ojas, not sukra. You have to understand the difference. One is the pure part of one's food, the other is the final waste product of digestion. Retaining semen without need is like holding in your shit and piss. It isn't healthy.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 12:56 AM
Title: Re: Animal Activist: Let Mosquitoes Bite You As They Are "Mothers" Trying To Feed Their Babies
Content:


Grigoris said:
Lyme disease is nasty.  Many of the ticks around here carry Lyme disease.  I don't let ticks bite me.  I am racist against ticks.

Malcolm wrote:
The actual reservoir for Lyme's disease are mice, not deer, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 12:22 AM
Title: Re: Chetsun Nyingthig Lojong
Content:
asdfjkl1979 said:
Hello

I'm wondering if anyone knows if there is a detailed commentary on the Lojong section of the Chetsun Nyingthig Ngondro available in English?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, in Khenpo Namdrol's book on the subject, available from Light of Berotsana, as well as Cortland Dahl's translation of Jigme Lingpa's commentary on the seven Nyingthig mind trainings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, April 29th, 2020 at 12:21 AM
Title: Re: Abyss of ignorance
Content:


kusulu said:
Sorry, I am unwilling to submit to hell. Life on earth is bad enough. If I scratch my ass, I know "I am scratching a wonderful ass"


LastLegend said:
It’s also the shadow of self you and I exhibit?

kusulu said:
I have seen people living in the worst possible hell realms.

Malcolm wrote:
No. You need to read the descriptions of hell again. Mental suffering in the human realm, no matter how severe it seems to us, is nothing compared to the unmitigated, terrible suffering described in the 18 hell realms.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 11:52 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
I remembered, i read a lot more Buddhism than i mentioned. I have read so many different teachers and paths, i am all over the place in regards to Buddhist teachings, not focused on one approach, a little bit of a lot of different approaches i read. I have read Dipa Ma, Achaan Chaa, Brad Warner, Noah Levine, Steve Hagen, Pema Chodron, and more.

Malcolm wrote:
You cannot learn Dharma from books.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 10:57 PM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:


shankara said:
From personal experience, I think it is a good discipline. It gives a certain stability and nourishes practice.

Malcolm wrote:
From a Tibetan Medical and Ayurvedic point of view, it is unhealthy not to release semen. Semen is just the final waste product of the body. Retaining it is like not emptying the trash. What you want to retain is ojas. Releasing semen is only an issue if your diet is nutrient poor, because in this case, you can risk losing some ojas. But if your diet is nutritionally rich, there is no problem with releasing semen, because you will have an abundance of ojas to spare.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 10:44 PM
Title: Re: Rigpa calendar alternative
Content:
Toenail said:
Thank you, Malcolm.

https://shop.shangshungfoundation.com/en/books/883-tibetan-calendar-calendario-tibetano-2020-2021-9788878341685.html

Do you know if I am missing a version that only contains the English? Or do all versions also contain Italian language?

Malcolm wrote:
It is in English and Italian.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 10:42 PM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
shankara said:
Nowhere is sex prohibited, however emission is...

Malcolm wrote:
It depends on which school you follow. For example, the Sakyapas maintain that this idea is ridiculous. In Dzogchen, it is irrelevant.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 9:49 PM
Title: Re: Offering bowl water and pets
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
No point convincing anyone of anything.

heart said:
Yeah, true that.

javier.espinoza.t said:
i don't want to convince myself either, i want reasons, arguments, proofs if possible, not blind faith.

Malcolm wrote:
well, the Buddha said it, Nāgārjuna repeated it, and then Vasubandhu repeated. It is not a question of reasons, etc. It is a simple definition: karma is volition and what proceeds from volition.

javier.espinoza.t said:
"Intention, I tell you, is kamma. Intending, one does kamma by way of body, speech, & intellect.

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an06/an06.063.than.html#part-5


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 9:43 PM
Title: Re: Rigpa calendar alternative
Content:
Toenail said:
I am looking for an alternative to the rigpa calendar. Is there another good calendar or source for practice dates? I am not well versed in astrology and calculations etc, I know 10th and 25th Lunar days etc, but it would be useful to have them all together in one source. I also want it from Nyingma tradition, I have heard there are slight variations and different calendar systems.. I have heard some Geluk or Kagyu traditions celebrate Dakini Day a day earlier, so I want to avoid that and follow standard Nyingma.

Greetings

Malcolm wrote:
The Merigar calendar from Shang Shung is the best one out there.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 7:51 PM
Title: Re: Alzheimer's Disease
Content:



PeterC said:
Is it regarded as originating with a particular class of obstructer?  What practices (as opposed to medicine) would one engage in to prevent it?

Malcolm wrote:
If I were to speculate, these conditions would be grouped under the provocation known as unmada, brjed byed, agents of memory loss.

PeterC said:
Interesting - had to look that up, I could only find 'Hindu' references to unmada (calling them Hindu is anachronistic). Are these a class of beings?
Unmāda (उन्माद, “insanity”) is caused by determinants (vibhāva) such as death of beloved persons, loss of wealth, stroke of adversity, derangement of [the three humours]: wind (vāta), biles (pitta), phelgm (śleṣmā), and the like. It is to be represented on the stage by laughing, weeping, crying, talking, lying down, sitting, running, dancing, singing and reciting [something] without any reason, smearing [the body] with ashes and dust, taking grass, Nirmālya. soiled cloth, tags, potsherd and earthen tray as decoration [of the body], many other senseless acts, and imitation of others.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes,they are class of beings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 11:31 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
I would like to ask for some advice at this point. I am not a practicing Buddhist but have over the years read a lot of different books on Buddhism. Just recently, i read and loved Mingyur Rinpoches book about his retreat titled "In love with the world." I just re-read this book by Stephen Batchelor for the 2nd time. I have read over 10 Dalai Lama books, some Western Buddhist Teachers like Jack Kornfield, Joseph Goldstein, and Sharon Salzberg. I have read Walpola Rahulas "What the Buddha taught." I have several books on mindfulness. And several on Vipassana Meditation. A few other Tibetan Buddhist books. A few by Lama Yeshe and Lama Zopa Rinpoche. I read one by Gehlek Rinpoche. One by Sogyal Rinpoche. etc.

So it seems, after reading Batchelors book and reflecting on the replies here and also reading some of the other posts on the forum, i am just a dabbler, not a Buddhist. To be a Buddhist requires a few things it seems. Even though i enjoy reading Buddhism and find some good insights in it and resonate with the Buddha a lot and his teachings, i am not a Buddhist.

Any advice for someone like me, to get the most out of Buddhism without necessarily becoming officially a Buddhist. I probably will not have a teacher in this life, so any advice, what did the Buddha recommend for a householder who doesnt necessarily become a Buddhist? Are books like Batchelors helpful in any way for a secular Buddhist?

Malcolm wrote:
Put your ego aside and find a good teacher. Otherwise you’ve wasted what would have been a precious human birth.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 11:30 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
What interested me was his disillusionment with the Traditional approach and orthodoxy in Tibetan Buddhism, Zen, Theravada, etc. and also i did find it fascinating how he tried to put together the life of the Buddha in context, it made Buddha more real to me, a real human being, having to live in a very violent time, with Kings and spies and what not. I am not saying his portrayal is accurate, it just gets me thinking, that is all, and thinking is good i think

Sunrise said:
Batchelor is like that skeptical part of us that all Westerners have. We do have difficulty with rebirth, orthodoxy, and metaphysics sometimes. It's just part of our Western psyche. Some of us reconcile traditional Buddhist ideas with our background and some of us don't. I prefer a more traditional presentation of the Dharma, but I get where Batchelor is coming from. He's a Western who want to practice Buddhism but still has doubts; I can totally understand that.

Malcolm wrote:
No, he is a westerner who wants to rewrite Buddhism in his own image.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 11:20 AM
Title: Re: Alzheimer's Disease
Content:
Sādhaka said:
I would hazard a guess that alzheimer’s was rare if it existed at all in ancient times.

Now with all the pollution, synthetic-chemicals, pharmaceutical-drugs, radiation etc. we’re currently exposed to....

And bad lifestyle habits, e.g.: the SAD (standard american diet) instead of eating nutrient-dense foods, snacking all day long instead of letting one’s digestive system rest as to get into ketosis-autophagy, monsanto/dow pesticides, stresses of contemporary life, not enough exercise, ad-nauseam.

It could be caused by provocations, but I doubt that in this case  we would have to look much further than the things I just listed.

Malcolm wrote:
Ancient urban life was filled plenty of devastating toxins and bad dietary habits as well, like cups made from lead, poor food combinations, etc. Also, the chance of living long enough to experience full fledged Alzheimer’s in most parts of the world was certainly a low probability until the past 100 years or so.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 10:53 AM
Title: Re: Alzheimer's Disease
Content:


Karma_Yeshe said:
what is the view of Alzheimer's Disease regarding Sutra (and maybe also Tibetan Medicin)?

Malcolm wrote:
It is not a disease that is recognized as such in Tibetan Medicine or classical Ayurveda.

Were it to be recognized as such, in Tibetan medicine it would be included among the 101 karmic diseases for which no cure is possible.

Gerontology is not a strong point of either Tibetan Medicine or classical Ayurveda.

PeterC said:
Is it regarded as originating with a particular class of obstructer?  What practices (as opposed to medicine) would one engage in to prevent it?

Malcolm wrote:
If I were to speculate, these conditions would be grouped under the provocation known as unmada, brjed byed, agents of memory loss.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 5:46 AM
Title: Re: What can we learn from COVID-19?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Do you have time to give a short explanation as to why, and possibly cite some sources?

Urine-therapy has been recognized by most traditional cultures (including Ayurveda i.e. shivambu kalpa), and from what I understand, when you do urine-therapy, homeopathic levels of any sickness in one’s body are introduced to one’s immune system, similar to a vaccine.

It’s anecdotal, but one girl who got it started urine-therapy, and has seemed to kick the illness rather quickly. Maybe she already had a strong immune system, I dunno.
Do you have time to give a short explanation as to why, and possibly cite some sources?

Malcolm wrote:
"Urine-therapy has been recognized by most traditional cultures (including Ayurveda i.e. shivambu kalpa)" is not actually part of traditional Ayurveda.

Now, first of all, you do not starve fevers. Your body has to have food and water in order be able to sustain the high temperatures necessary to cause the fever to break.

Secondly, from a Tibetan Medicine/Ayurvedic point of view, this virus presents many vata symptoms, therefore, one needs to counteract this with proper food. It is basically a fever caused by an external pathogen, which disturbs the blood with heat, that is aggravated by vata. This is the main reason it is causing strokes and heart attacks.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 5:44 AM
Title: Re: What can we learn from COVID-19?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Do you have time to give a short explanation as to why, and possibly cite some sources?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, first of all, you do not starve fevers. Your body has to have food and water in order be able to sustain the high temperatures necessary to cause the fever to break.

Secondly, from a Tibetan Medicine/Ayurvedic point of view, this virus presents many vata symptoms, therefore, one needs to counteract this with proper food. It is basically a fever caused by an external pathogen, which disturbs the blood with heat, that is aggravated by vata. This is the main reason it is causing strokes and heart attacks.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 5:39 AM
Title: Re: What can we learn from COVID-19?
Content:
LastLegend said:
You have a very smart virus without a brain but it’s no ordinary because it kills your cells unlike a common flu virus. Buddhists should know this is a karmic consequence?


Sādhaka said:
I’ve not much of idea; but I wonder what would happen if one tried to ‘fight’ it with autophagy via fasting routines.

There has got to be a ‘reason’ why your body tells you not to eat when you get sick.

Malcolm wrote:
Bad idea with this kind of virus.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 5:35 AM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
"even though being an ex-monastic in Buddhism means that one has miserably failed."

Are you sure about that? If i am not mistaken, people like Jack Kornfield, Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, Osel Hita (Lama Yeshes reincarnation) and many others were Monks at one time, and then disrobed, no longer were monastics.

Malcolm wrote:
The point is that westerners often use the status of being an ex-monastic as a credential of authenticity and authority. If you examine the bios of many famous Western Buddhists, they often say, "X was a monk or a nun for x years..." as if being an ex-monastic was a positive credential.

But the reality is that in Tibetan culture in particular, being an ex-monk is a mark of failure. Therefore, I always chuckle when I see people advertising their status as ex-monastics as if it were part of their C.V.

krish5 said:
Also, if the Buddha were alive today and met him, i doubt the Buddha would have any problems with his approach and would not think he was a failure.

Malcolm wrote:
The Buddha criticized people who left the homeless life, describing them as "hīnāya āvattati," literally, "turning to the lower."

krish5 said:
Then a certain bhikkhu approached the Lord, prostrated himself, sat down to one side, and said: "The Venerable Nanda, revered sir, the Lord's (half-) brother, the son of his maternal aunt, informed a number of bhikkhus thus: 'I am discontented with leading the holy life... I will give up the training and return to the low life.'"

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/ud/ud.3.02.irel.html

krish5 said:
I am also reminded of the book "Siddhartha" by Herman Hesse, where Siddhartha follows his own heart, path, just like the Buddha did. Was Siddhartha in that book a failure? His friend Govinda followed the Buddha and became a monk, while lifes experiences taught Siddhartha the truth about life.

Malcolm wrote:
Siddhartha, a fictional character, was a fool, and wasted his opportunity to train under a buddha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 2:59 AM
Title: Re: Offering bowl water and pets
Content:



heart said:
Yes, so it is not a proof that intention isn't the most important factor in karma. Why intention is so important is because if it wasn't then it was just be moral. For example most Christians don't think killing an animal to eat is a bad action and you don't go to hell for it and there isn't even a law against it in our society.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Actually. Buddha said that intention is karma.

heart said:
You have yo convince Javier about that.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
No point convincing anyone of anything.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 1:57 AM
Title: Re: Offering bowl water and pets
Content:
Könchok Thrinley said:
Okay can anybody here actually cite some credible source if it is actually bad for a cat to take a sip?

Malcolm wrote:
Once it is has been offered, it is just water again. It is not blessed, it is not special. We respect it because it was used in an offering, so we water our plants with it or put it in a clean place.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 1:56 AM
Title: Re: Offering bowl water and pets
Content:



heart said:
"In that past life, the action of chopping the ant’s head actually was intentional ", like I said karma is not simple.

/magnus

javier.espinoza.t said:
the author apparently just took that position.

heart said:
Yes, so it is not a proof that intention isn't the most important factor in karma. Why intention is so important is because if it wasn't then it was just be moral. For example most Christians don't think killing an animal to eat is a bad action and you don't go to hell for it and there isn't even a law against it in our society.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Actually. Buddha said that intention is karma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 1:23 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The Nazis were never left wing, ever.

Grigoris said:
Economically they were (if economic socialism is considered Left-Wing).

Malcolm wrote:
Economic socialism is not necessarily left wing.

Grigoris said:
They were into the socialisation/nationalisation of industry and agriculture, for Germans.  That was what (German)  National Socialism was all about, initially.

Malcolm wrote:
That does not make it left wing. The Nazis were anti-communist/marxist from the beginning. Before Drexler founded the DAP, he was a member of the The German Fatherland Party (German: Deutsche Vaterlandspartei) (1917-1918). After it was dissolved, most of its members (1.2 million) joined the German National People's Party (DNVP), the major right wing party during the Weimar Republic.

So the Nazis were always right wing, antisemites who hated Marx more than capitalism.

The DNVP formed a coalition government with Nazis in 1931, and supported Hitlers appointment as chancellor. It dissolved itself in 1933 in favor of Nazi rule, under considerable Nazi pressure.

As for Marxism:
"The major beneficiaries of the Hugenberg press's anti-Marxist campaign were not the DNVP as intended, but rather the National Socialists who were able to portray themselves as the most effective anti-Marxist fighting force.[117]

The DNVP was declining rapidly as many workers and peasants began to support the more populist and less aristocratic NSDAP while upper-class and middle-class DNVP voters supported the NSDAP as the "party of order" best able to crush Marxism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_National_People%27s_Party

Hugenberg, BTW, was the Rupert Murdoch of Germany during the Weimar Republic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:49 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Tiago Simões said:
National-socialism is nazism and they were not economically left-wing.

Grigoris said:
Actually, initially they were.

Tiago Simões said:
Initially, then the left wing elements were purged.

Malcolm wrote:
The Nazis were never left wing, ever.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:48 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Tiago Simões said:
National-socialism is nazism and they were not economically left-wing.

Grigoris said:
Actually, initially they were.

Malcolm wrote:
No, they never were. The Nazis and the DAP before them were always right wing, antisemitic, and anti-marxist.

You've mixed them up with the Fascists, who started as a left wing party.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:46 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:


Sādhaka said:
It’s not a liberal vs conservative issue. The ‘elites’ on both the left and the right have made it clear that they want most of the financial wealth to themselves.

Malcolm wrote:
You care to back that up with facts?

Sādhaka said:
The problem we face is corporatocracy. Free-market capitalist Ron Paul for example is against corporatocracy, much more-so than Trump or any neoconservative is at any rate.

Malcolm wrote:
Ron Paul?

Sādhaka said:
I’ve noticed that many ‘liberals’ (not saying you Grigoris) speak as if they’re against huge corporations, yet they champion big corporations like google, apple, etc., probably because said corporations push pc-‘liberal’ agendas.  It’s almost like some kind of hive-mind going on, as can be seen here:

Malcolm wrote:
Google and Apple can hardly said to be pushing pc-liberal agendas. BTW, what is the PC-Liberal agenda. Care to remind us?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:41 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Grigoris said:
Left and Right really mean nothing in the main stream Amerikan political context.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, that is false. It is just that to European leftists, the rhetoric that Fox News uses to describe the "far left" meaning Bernie, etc., is describing something a bit to the right of the Labour Party in England, and so to them it seems ridiculous.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:38 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Thank you for the info on that.

I’ll have to use it for some homework on the topic.

Malcolm wrote:
The usual rightwing misinformation is that the Nazis began as a left-wing party because they use the term "socialist." But such assertions ignore the complicated usage of the term socialism in 19th century political thinking. While socialism is, in general, anti-capitalist, there are plenty of reasons for the anti-capitalist sentiments frequently found in nationalist movements. Hence the term "national socialism" was coined to describe a species of right-wing nationalist anti-capitalism that was simultaneously anti-communist, that is, international socialism ala Marx.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:24 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Sādhaka said:
I mean national-socialism.

Malcolm wrote:
National Socialism in general, began as a right wing, anticommunist, anticapitalist, nationalist movement in Austria prior to WWI.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:21 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Then that was something that they came up with, and was never used by anyone else?

Malcolm wrote:
The name was borrowed from a nationalist, anti-capitalist, anti-communist Austian party formed in 1903, called the German Worker's Party; it was mainly about defending German interest in Czech lands. In 1918, it renamed itself, Deutsche Nationalsozialistische Arbeiterpartei (DNSAP).

The Nazis grew out of the anti-semitic, anti-communist and anti-capitalist, nationalist German Workers Party (Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, DAP) founded by Anton Drexler in 1919. In 1920, the DAP was renamed The National Socialist German Workers' Party (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei NSDAP). The latter name was clearly based on the former.

After 1930, the members of the former largely merged with the latter.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, April 28th, 2020 at 12:07 AM
Title: Re: Western Buddhists and politics
Content:


Sādhaka said:
You can’t really flip that on Buddhist conservatives because they don’t want to assimilate to the borg-like pc hive-mind

Malcolm wrote:
That is because they are already in a borg-like conservative hive mind.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, April 27th, 2020 at 11:11 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Fa Dao said:
In the Longde teachings Rinpoche talks about the 11th Buddha Ngondzog Gyalpo and in other places it says Heruka Ngondzog Gyalpo...is there a difference?

Malcolm wrote:
No.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, April 27th, 2020 at 11:09 PM
Title: Re: Stephen Batchelor
Content:
krish5 said:
I wonder if anyone else has read it and what they think about it?

Also, what does anybody think about Batchelor if you ever read him, watched his videos, or seen him in person? Does he seem just as realized as any Monk still within the Buddhist Tradition? Did he possibly go astray by leaving the Traditional Path? Or do you think he found True Buddhism, what the Buddha was really about in his own unique way?

Malcolm wrote:
Batchelor is a just another Westerner who has been marketing their ex-monastic status for decades; even though being an ex-monastic in Buddhism means that one has miserably failed.

There are so many holes in Batchelor's arguments, you could sail aircraft carrier through them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, April 27th, 2020 at 10:51 PM
Title: Re: Conspirituality - the overlap between the New Age and conspiracy beliefs
Content:


Sādhaka said:
Another interesting fact that I stumbled upon, in The Royal Masonic Cyclopaedia by Kenneth Mackenzie, is that Nasi or Nazi means “prince” in Hebrew.

Malcolm wrote:
But that has nothing to with National Socialists.


