﻿Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 3:28 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Heimdall said:
This book is foundational in Western Academia, read it.

Malcolm wrote:
No it isn't. I for one have never heard of this book until today.

I think you are confusing this with Zinn's People's History of the United States, which is very wide spread in schools in the US. You should read it. It's a thought provoking book.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 3:24 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
nightbloom said:
I tried to respond to this a moment ago, and it got lost in the void. Anyway, no, I'm not going to give you an annotated bibliography on the subject. But see Johnny's post above - it's true that the old class-based Marxist orthodoxy gave way to a much broader critique of power (with its own strengths, but also many weaknesses). And what has happened, in the long run, is that capitalism has in some sense "recuperated" all of these hazier criticisms. Thus today we see many attempts to "address" various oppressions within the context of capitalism, leaving capitalism intact as the dominant mode of social relations. E.G, "we need more black CEOs," corporate inclusivity, a whole industry of activists selling books and seminars and so on.

Norwegian said:
OK got it. No names, no nothing, just vague generalizations and accusations.

Brunelleschi said:
Ok, come on. To claim that there has not been a shift from a focus on class to a wider focus on issues such as race (I take it you're familiar with the term intersectionality) is not correct.

Malcolm wrote:
And what's the problem with that, other than it makes old schools Marxists uncomfortable. After all, Black people were seriously marginalized in the Socialist movement in the United States as well. Nevertheless, there are many Black leftists who wish to tone down the topic of race, people like Cornell West, etc.

Other black intellectuals, like Keeanga-Yamahtta Taylor, point out that in America:'

Brunelleschi said:
“Not only do Black people suffer class oppression,” said Professor Taylor of Princeton, “they also suffer racial oppression. They are fundamentally more marginalized than white people.

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/14/us/adolph-reed-controversy.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 3:11 AM
Title: Re: The Myth of Progress
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, he really didn't........Sapan did not approve of termas, which Jampa Thaye practices (Konchog Chidu). Hence, hoisted in his own petard.

Dharmasherab said:
So this is based on the disagreement between whether termas are approved or not? Is it? How does that change one's understanding? In this instance what is your understanding of what Sakya Pandita mentioned?

*HH Sakya Trichen is my main teacher in Vajrayana (I am new to Vajrayana and joined in 2016).

Malcolm wrote:
Well, I have been around in 1989.

My point was and is, one needs to be careful in invoking Sapan when complaining about "progress," if you yourself are engaged in practices which Sapan scoffed at——in Jampa Thaye's case, both Kagyu Mahāmudra and the terma tradition. Trying to position yourself as a Buddhist conservative using Sapan as an authority when yourself engage in practices of which Sapan plainly rejected, well, a little inept. Otherwise, I am sure Jampa Thaye is a nice fellow. I never met him.

Dharmasherab said:
In this instance what is your understanding of what Sakya Pandita mentioned?

Malcolm wrote:
One should rely on a doctrine taught by the Buddhas, realized by mahasiddhas, commented upon by panditas, and translated by the lotsawas. That's it. All of Thaye's other remarks are just so much conservative whinging that have nothing to with Buddhadharma. I mean, what are we to make of Aśoka murdering 18,000 Jains over a satirical cartoon? Continue to revere him as the ideal Dharmarāja? Come on.

This, "The rejection of progress as incompatible with the very nature of dharma...," is a ridiculous assertion, as ridiculous as those people whom Salya Pandita chided for rejecting medicine because some people imagine, foolishly, that accepting medicine to cure illness means one has no faith in Dharma.

He directly contradicts himself in the very next passage:

The Mahayana notion of universal enlightenment should not, however, be misunderstood as a claim that progress toward Buddhahood is somehow structured into the very nature of the world, and that we are always reaching ever closer to it. Instead, its sense is that all beings will obtain enlightenment because they are primordially pervaded by buddhanature, the true nature of reality itself.

If the true nature of reality is buddhanature (it isn't, only sentient beings have buddhanature, not rocks and trees) then progress towards buddhahood is structured into the nature of the world.


This is also poorly written, "Buddhism offers a contrary idea of history. It teaches us that history, as the manifestation of samsara, is essentially cyclical in nature." Buddhism does not teach anything at all about history. History is a modern, empirically-based discipline, which did not exist in the time of the Buddha. At best, during the time of the Buddha, there was only "Itihasa," that is, just so stories.

The funny thing, he could be criticizing the right wing author, Francis Fukuyama here, "The notion of inevitable progress has been so tenacious that today’s dominant liberal and Marxist ideologies, which have in one way or another sought to replace Christianity, have swallowed its historical narrative without demur. They have merely recast it in terms of an inevitable social and intellectual progress culminating in the end of history itself."  Of course, Fukuyama retreated from his neoconservative ideals in the wake of the Iraq war:

https://www.spiegel.de/international/interview-with-ex-neocon-francis-fukuyama-a-model-democracy-is-not-emerging-in-iraq-a-407315.html

Finally he says, in contradiction to his whole spiel, "The task before us in the 21st century is not to alter the timeless message of the Buddha, but, once we have received it fully (a process which may well have some way to go!), to present it in the language and organizational forms most appropriate for the contemporary situation."

This happens organically anyway. There is no need to contrive this, especially by going off like some Buddhist William F. Buckley Jr. on the supposed tragedies of "liberalism." What people have to do is learn Tibetan, receive the teachings, do the retreats, and pass on the teachings. Personal politics has very little to do with this process. But when people begin citing people like Sapan, who was a strict formalist when it came discerning which teachings were of valid provenance as opposed to Tibetan innovations, they had better make sure they are not hoisting themselves on their own petards.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:42 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Norwegian said:
Care to share with us the names of the leftists who are guilty as charged, as you accuse them, and mention which texts they wrote related to this? Especially since you say "so much of 21st century leftism", as that comes across as a rather serious and significant amount. There must be a lot, so names and titles would be helpful.

nightbloom said:
I tried to respond to this a moment ago, and it got lost in the void. Anyway, no, I'm not going to give you an annotated bibliography on the subject. But see Johnny's post above - it's true that the old class-based Marxist orthodoxy gave way to a much broader critique of power (with its own strengths, but also many weaknesses). And what has happened, in the long run, is that capitalism has in some sense "recuperated" all of these hazier criticisms. Thus today we see many attempts to "address" various oppressions within the context of capitalism, leaving capitalism intact as the dominant mode of social relations. E.G, "we need more black CEOs," corporate inclusivity, a whole industry of activists selling books and seminars and so on.

Norwegian said:
OK got it. No names, no nothing, just vague generalizations and accusations.

Malcolm wrote:
The technical term was coined by Peter C: "fact free opinions."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:41 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
nightbloom said:
Thus today we see many attempts to "address" various oppressions within the context of capitalism, leaving capitalism intact as the dominant mode of social relations. E.G, "we need more black CEOs," corporate inclusivity, a whole industry of activists selling books and seminars and so on.

Malcolm wrote:
As long as we have capitalism (for the long term), yes, we need to have more black ceo's, inclusivity, and so on. That requires no thought at all. We live in a capitalist world, for the time being, and so we have to deal with these issues in the context of capitalism. In what other context can we deal with them?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:32 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



nightbloom said:
Why does thinking/saying "oh noes SJWs in Buddhism" necessarily reflect "white rage" and not, for instance, simply an observation that the ideological framework of her argument is faulty and harmful? I don't understand why scorn for her argument is different from scorn for any other argument that the scorner thinks is bad.

Malcolm wrote:
You did not address any substantive part of her post. You and our friend Heimdall have committed at last these two fallacies: hasty generalization and genetic fallacy.

nightbloom said:
Which part(s) did you think was most substantive? If I've been unfair, I'll do it justice.

Malcolm wrote:
Try reading it again. Genjo Conan already gave you a hint.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:30 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
nightbloom said:
Her article is basically "people on twitter rejected my critique of their cultural niche and made fun of me." It reeks of narcissism.

Malcolm wrote:
Let's add to that fallacies in which you have indulged: the ad hominem.

nightbloom said:
But this is a bad critique embedded in a very specific ideological paradigm.

Malcolm wrote:
Two points you have failed to demonstrate. So again, more fact free opinions from nightbloom.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:28 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Genjo Conan said:
They're just "oh noes SJWs in Buddhism."

nightbloom said:
Why does thinking/saying "oh noes SJWs in Buddhism" necessarily reflect "white rage" and not, for instance, simply an observation that the ideological framework of her argument is faulty and harmful? I don't understand why scorn for her argument is different from scorn for any other argument that the scorner thinks is bad.

Malcolm wrote:
You did not address any substantive part of her post. You and our friend Heimdall have committed at last these two fallacies: hasty generalization and genetic fallacy.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:22 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



nightbloom said:
Anyway, the point I'm trying to make here is that your mockery of Heimdall...

Malcolm wrote:
I did not mock anyone.

nightbloom said:
and your treatment of his remarks as indicative of a psychological affliction, rather than a viewpoint rooted in his own observations, is abusive and illustrates exactly how this kind of political rhetoric gets weaponized in personal disputes.

Malcolm wrote:
Sorry, but his response was a series of complete and total quixotic non sequiturs. But go ahead and ride to his rescue, Sancho Panza...which brings to mind the fact that the Cervantes novel was set right after the expulsion of the Moriscos, the Moors, for well, their identity. By whom? By a bunch of racist, xenophobic white guys:

https://www.jstor.org/stable/2953315


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 2:13 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


nightbloom said:
The ones in the OP? No, I didn't, I admit.
I skimmed them. I thought the second one had some substance, though I agree with Heimdall that the framing reflects an ideological orientation that has many serious problems. It's unfortunate, because what's legitimate in the critique will ultimately be dragged down with the political movement that currently monopolizes discussion of these topics.

Malcolm wrote:
Another fact free assertion.


nightbloom said:
The first article, on the other hand, was terrible, and a good example of what I described in my above post. Someone expressed contempt for the author's ideas - she took this as proof that her ideas are valid and any poor reception of them reflects pathological defensiveness.

Malcolm wrote:
Pretty clear you did not read the article carefully.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:30 AM
Title: Re: The Myth of Progress
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
Heh, I can agree with his general tone here but it is a funny quote to use when someone is practicing an “innovation” of sorts I.e. Terma. Maybe he just wrote it with his Sakya hat on.

Malcolm wrote:
No, since he cites Padmasambhava in the end. For early Sakyapas like Sapan, Padmasambhava was an important imperial period figure, but he and others in his milieu were very resistant to the nascent mythopoeia about Padmsambhava by Nyangral, Guru Chowang, and others in the late 12th and the 13th century Nyingma scene connected with the burgeoning treasure tradition.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:28 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


nightbloom said:
The ones in the OP? No, I didn't, I admit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:26 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Heimdall said:
I'll throw the "non sequitur" back at you because this isn't me refuting a claim you made. I simply said that it's highly probable that your purpose here was to morally shun by virtue of Buddhadharma, otherwise you wouldn't have posted it here.

Malcolm wrote:
No, my purpose was that I thought Ann Gleig's experience with white men in Buddhist studies was interesting, and that it should be shared.


Heimdall said:
Non sequitur—please me where I once invoked Hegel or Marx.
Any time you use contemporary Liberal Western socio-political models that posit one identity group "systemically oppressing" another by virtue of identity alone and the amorphous "social structures" in place, you necessarily imply Marx and Hegel because that "class binary" of "oppressor" and "oppressee" is simply the Marxist dialectical structure except the "classes" are swapped with identity groups.

Malcolm wrote:
Umm, ever hear of racial covenants? Black slaves being counted as 3/5ths of a person for electoral demographics. The 1830 Indian Relocation Act? Apartheid?

Heimdall said:
Non sequitur—please show me where I implied that Buddhist countries are free from wars and bloodshed.
Again, throwing the non sequitur back at you, because that wasn't my claim. My claim was that you can apply this same dialectical structure to Buddhist countries imposing religion and oppressing minority groups too, albeit to a lesser extent than the Catholic and Protestant West.

Malcolm wrote:
Your comment remains a non sequitur. And, the notion that one class might oppress another certainly did not begin with Marx, or Hegel. The Buddha was quite concerned about it as well, which is why he rejected varna, the idea that birth made you a better person.

Heimdall said:
Non sequitur—please show me where I made that claim.
In your original post and in this post, where you claim the problem of "angry whiteness" and that I'm a "defensive white guy". You are necessarily rooting moral aptitude and political opinions in identity. You don't know anything about me, much less that I am an "angry white guy", yet you are presuming so because you necessarily connect moral aptitude and political opinions with identity.

Malcolm wrote:
No, actually I don't claim the problem of angry whiteness. I posted an article about a women in academia's real world experience with angry white guys, who sound an awful lot like you. It'ss both funny and sad. I think that amounts to tragedy.

Heimdall said:
Non sequitur—please show me where I advocated interpreting Buddhism through a western lens.
By advocating for an interpretation of Buddhism through Western Liberal socio-political ideology, you are necessarily doing so, whether you claim otherwise.

Malcolm wrote:
But I wasn't, which is why your responses are so hilariously off the mark. I was talking about a WESTERN ACADEMIC DISCIPLINE called BUDDHIST STUDIES which often has nothing to do with Buddhism at all. But please, continue on your quixotic campaign.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:14 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
nightbloom said:
This tends to look like a specific set of things when we're talking about upper-middle class whites, and especially upper-middle class white liberals (who dominate Buddhist Studies).

Malcolm wrote:
That is why is so ironic that they, upper middle-class, liberal, white men are the ones who are the most reactive to this point.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:13 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
nightbloom said:
For example, this:

Malcolm wrote:
What are you so mad about? Try reading the articles rather than behaving like another defensive white guy who privilege is being questioned.

nightbloom said:
The point is to represent your opponent as a hysterical cry-baby, while indicating that one has risen above such crude defensiveness and attachment to privilege oneself. It's manipulative and underhanded.

Malcolm wrote:
More reaction rather than addressing the issue. It's amazing how accurate Ann Glieg is on this subject. White guys get questioned on their privilege, they react defensively.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 1:11 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
Is that why there is so much white rage in Buddhist studies?

PadmaVonSamba said:
Is there!??

nightbloom said:
No. "White rage" is an abusive rhetorical weapon

Malcolm wrote:
Pretty clear you did not read the articles as well. Sigh.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 12:55 AM
Title: Re: The Myth of Progress
Content:
Dharmasherab said:
So I can reassure he did take care when quoting Sakya Pandita.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, he really didn't. I am Loppon Kunga Namdrol, also of the Sakya school. HH Sakya Trichen is one of my main teachers too, from whom I have received all the main teachings of the Sakya school. I have also received the transmission for Sapan's Three Vows, so I am intimately familiar with its contents. Sapan did not approve of termas, which Jampa Thaye practices (Konchog Chidu). Hence, hoisted in his own petard.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 12:51 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
That's a fantasy. There is no way you can practice Buddhadharma in a hermetically sealed environment that ignores where you are.

Heimdall said:
Cool, so why are you claiming that those who are different than you, and come from a different environment than you, are morally inferior by virtue of Buddhadharma? If not by Buddhadharma, then what's your intent posting this on a Buddhist forum.

Malcolm wrote:
Non sequitur—please show me where I made such a claim.

Heimdall said:
A "Cultural" Hegelian dialectic is not one of those features, and to shun Western corruption of Buddhism while using Western ideas disguised as Buddhism is hilarious,

Malcolm wrote:
Non sequitur—please me where I once invoked Hegel or Marx.

Heimdall said:
See my other post, don't think Buddhist countries aren't without bloodshed. There's a reason why Koreans hate Japan.

Malcolm wrote:
Non sequitur—please show me where I implied that Buddhist countries are free from wars and bloodshed.

Heimdall said:
Yes, because the grouping of an entire group of people by virtue of their skin pigmentation, and then using that grouping to draw socio-political moral truths, is absolutely stupid.

Malcolm wrote:
Non sequitur—please show me where I made that claim.

Heimdall said:
I agree that Westerners should not be re-interpreting Buddhism through Western eyes, including Judeo-Christian (especially American Protestant, "Protestant Work Ethic") normative behavior, but those who subscribe to Liberal sociopolitical should realize they stand in glass houses.

Malcolm wrote:
Non sequitur—please show me where I advocated interpreting Buddhism through a western lens.

Heimdall said:
Their own interpretation of the world is purely Western, so who are you to stone Angulimala?

Malcolm wrote:
Your reponses consists of nothing but non sequiturs. What are you so mad about? Try reading the articles rather than behaving like another defensive white guy who privilege is being questioned.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 12:16 AM
Title: Re: The Myth of Progress
Content:


Dharmasherab said:
These questions of adaptation were a matter of intense debate in the 13th century when Sakya Pandita cautioned his fellow Tibetans,  “Since there is nobody in the three realms wiser than the Buddha, one should not adulterate the sutras and tantras that he taught. To do so is to abandon the doctrine and disparage the Noble Ones.”

Malcolm wrote:
People who quote Sakya Pandita need to be careful, lest they be hoisted on their own petard.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, October 5th, 2021 at 12:10 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Heimdall said:
However, the truth is, many of us prefer to practice the religion how it was historically practiced, disconnected from Western ("white") interpretations that use Buddhism as an insipid front to advance certain Western sociopolitical opinions.

Malcolm wrote:
That's a fantasy. There is no way you can practice Buddhadharma in a hermetically sealed environment that ignores where you are.

Heimdall said:
The narrative of "majority" identity groups oppressing "minority" identity groups and the oppressed identity groups, by virtue of being oppressed, have morally correction sociopolitical opinions, is a Western theory that has nothing to do with Buddhism, and to the extent that it's affected Asian Buddhism, that's by virtue of Western corruption.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no such thing as an ideal-type, pure Asian Buddhism. Demonstrably, Buddhism has been affected by ideas from the west nearly from its inception, for example, the adoption by the Bactrian branch of Sarvāstivādin school of Aristotle's four causes, as well as Greek atomism, etc.

What is new, for Buddhism to deal with in the West is the West's history of imperialism, genocide, and slavery, and how this is has negatively impacted people of non-European ancestry, for example, the near-extinction of Buddhism in Śrī Lanka under the British, the purge of Buddhism in Japan, following nationalist and modernist impulses when Japan was engaged in a process of assimilation to modern capitalism, and so on. This continues as  westerners of European descent— blind to their economic privilege which they received as the inheritors 500+ years of Western imperialist expansion and oppression—adopt Buddhism without seeing that their privilege, when it goes unrecognized, can serve to limit the participation of people of non-European descent in Buddhist teaching and practice in the United States, Canada, England, France, Germany, and so on, including people of descent from Buddhist countries.

For example, when I was in China, many Tibetans were quite jealous of the amount of teachings I had received, and I experienced the same comments from monks from India. White people in America and Europe are given special privileges and access to teachings often unobtainable for common, average Tibetans.

Heimdall said:
By the way, if "whiteness" was such a problem that we should dismiss social opinions by virtue of genetics, we should disavow Buddhism altogether, considering the Buddha, according to the 32 marks, had blue eyes.

Malcolm wrote:
There are many people who have blue eyes who are not "white." "Blue eyeness" is a recessive gene, which has only existed in human populations for 6,000 to 10,000 years or so.

Of course, we do have to keep in mind that people with blond hair were forbidden to ordain as monks at one time. So there is that.

But you seem to think this is about dismissing social opinions on the basis of genetics. By your statement, I can see you spent absolutely no time with the articles cited. So, react away, since that what reactionaries do.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 11:46 PM
Title: Re: What are texts in the Agamas that are not in the Nikayas?
Content:


ronnymarsh said:
On Nagarjuna's part, when you read his major works, you realize that his entire foundation is only the Agamas, particularly those of the Sarvastivada school.

Malcolm wrote:
No. His foundation was Mahāyāna, which is made clear in the Ratnavali.

In the MMK and its branches, he criticized views found in all the śrāvaka schools. Āryadeva was himself also clearly a Mahāyānī.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 10:56 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Zhen Li said:
I am suggesting that the dichotomy between literalism and symbolism is not manifest in premodern Buddhism.

Malcolm wrote:
The distinction between literalism and symbolism is an extremely important part of Vajrayāna exegesis, especially in the tantras.

But we see it in the sūtras too, where we find the Buddha exhorting people to kill, steal, etc.

So, I think you cannot make argument you are proposing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 10:53 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Queequeg said:
If Catholicism with its Roman mysticism, unmolested by the Protestant revolution had encountered Japanese Mahayana, the conversations between Tendai acharyas and Catholic monks - if we could suspend the missionary impulses of the Catholics - might have been an interesting encounter between two catholic approaches that each entertained great intellectual flexibility and comparable mysticism.

Malcolm wrote:
We already have an example this. A Jesuit priest went to Tibet:

Mission to Tibet recounts the fascinating eighteenth-century journey of the Jesuit priest ippolito Desideri (1684 - 1733) to the Tibetan plateau. The italian missionary was most notably the first european to learn about Buddhism directly with Tibetan schol ars and monks - and from a profound study of its primary texts. while there, Desideri was an eyewitness to some of the most tumultuous events in Tibet's history, of which he left us a vivid and dramatic account.

Desideri explores key Buddhist concepts including emptiness and rebirth, together with their philosophical and ethical implications, with startling detail and sophistication. This book also includes an introduction situating the work in the context of Desideri's life and the intellectual and religious milieu of eighteenth-century Catholicism.




And Jesuits were in Japan, but it seems Francis Xavier took no pains to learn about any form of Buddhism. And as you know, the Catholics attempted to purge Buddhism from Kyushu, beginning in 1562.

Queequeg said:
I wonder if things would have been different if the Jesuits had arrived in Japan by themselves without armed trade missions? I'm guessing the isolation of Tibet limited the efforts of Europeans to open direct trade, and so Jesuits like Desideri showed up pretty much on their own and were forced to navigate individually, whereas the Jesuits in Japan came with some imperial power that maybe enabled their missionary arrogance and closed their mind to more open engagement, and conversely, got them greater suspicion from the samurai who would see them not as relatively harmless nerds but rather the apparatus of those greedy traders with dreams of colonization.

Malcolm wrote:
It as not all roses:
However, it would appear that about the time that Gioachino reached Rome, persecution of the Capuchins broke out in Lhasa. The jealous Tibetan monastic community viewed the open patronage of the missionaries by Polhanas and other highly placed secular officials with increasingly intolerable disfavor. The tension increased until one day in May 1742 when several hundred furious Gelugpa lamas invaded the royal palace and upbraided Polhanas for his partiality. The Tibetan ruler, terrified of meeting the same fate as his unfortunate predecessors, immediately declared that the Capuchin priests had fallen from his favor. The frightened king of Tibet also forbade the missionaries from preaching Christianity in the country, except to outside traders. The Tibetan government further ordered that local converts be hunted down, placed in Chinese wooden collars (cangue), and flogged. Tremendously frustrated by this turn of events, the Capuchin fathers began to realize that the time had arrived for them to abandon their work. A momentary compromise was reached between the Capuchins and the Lhasa authorities when Polhanas reluctantly allowed the priests to preach only on condition that they should declare Tibetan Buddhism to abound in goodness and perfection. The friars lingered on in Lhasa for another two and a half years until April 1745 when the valiant Father Orazio della Penna finally acknowledged himself beaten, and resolved to abandon the mission.
https://www.usfca.edu/sites/default/files/pdfs/report-36-dec-2004.pdf


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 10:27 PM
Title: Re: What are texts in the Agamas that are not in the Nikayas?
Content:
Aemilius said:
And thus Paul Harris or anyone else would be completely, or at least to some extent, free from the grasp of limited, distorted, false, and materialistic view of history.

Malcolm wrote:
Modern historical method is not false, it is, as much as possible, empirical and evidence-based. It is limited in so far as the evidence that can be mustered is limited.

Assertions by the ancients that cannot be empirically verified or disproven are left aside as unproven— not false, not true, just unverified. Things like the geocentrism, etc., which are demonstrably false, given the evidence, of course ought to be left in the dustbin of mistaken notions. Axial mountain myths are understandable and inspiring, but in the end they are just myths.

Also ancient scholars weren't dummies. For example, Sakya Pandita shows, based on textual sources, namely the Mahābharata, that identifying Kailash as Mt. Meru is impossible. Ancient scholars too had their empirical standards of evidence, especially ancient Buddhist scholars. The thing about empirical knowledge is that it changes with the evidence, as it should.

When one is writing history, one must adhere to what can be empirically shown with evidence. Otherwise, it is not history at all. It is just opinion and conjecture. The very real inability to distinguish between opinion and conjecture on the one hand, and evidence on the other, is one of the great failings of the modern educational system, which has largely abandoned rationality in favor of technology. Some of the stupidest, most gullible people I have ever met are really good at math, engineering, and applied science. But when it comes to anything else, dumb as rocks.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 10:03 PM
Title: Re: What are your thoughts on DMT and the entities people claim to encounter?
Content:
SilenceMonkey said:
I listened this this interesting interview today with the author of "The Body Keeps the Score," Bessel Van Der Kolk. Among other alternative therapies, he talks about the benefits of MDMA in healing trauma and personal limitations.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/24/opinion/ezra-klein-podcast-van-der-kolk.html

Malcolm wrote:
There is no doubt that these kinds of drugs, when used as MEDICINE, can be beneficial. It is when they are used for pure recreation, for example, in hot sweaty dance clubs, that things become more dicey, or as "therapy" by unscrupulous new agers who have no clue what they are doing:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 9:59 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
Well, the Bodhisattva is trying to save beings too.

Malcolm wrote:
Is that why there is so much white rage in Buddhist studies?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 9:27 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Queequeg said:
If Catholicism with its Roman mysticism, unmolested by the Protestant revolution had encountered Japanese Mahayana, the conversations between Tendai acharyas and Catholic monks - if we could suspend the missionary impulses of the Catholics - might have been an interesting encounter between two catholic approaches that each entertained great intellectual flexibility and comparable mysticism.

Malcolm wrote:
We already have an example this. A Jesuit priest went to Tibet:

Mission to Tibet recounts the fascinating eighteenth-century journey of the Jesuit priest ippolito Desideri (1684 - 1733) to the Tibetan plateau. The italian missionary was most notably the first european to learn about Buddhism directly with Tibetan schol ars and monks - and from a profound study of its primary texts. while there, Desideri was an eyewitness to some of the most tumultuous events in Tibet's history, of which he left us a vivid and dramatic account.

Desideri explores key Buddhist concepts including emptiness and rebirth, together with their philosophical and ethical implications, with startling detail and sophistication. This book also includes an introduction situating the work in the context of Desideri's life and the intellectual and religious milieu of eighteenth-century Catholicism.




And Jesuits were in Japan, but it seems Francis Xavier took no pains to learn about any form of Buddhism. And as you know, the Catholics attempted to purge Buddhism from Kyushu, beginning in 1562.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 9:11 PM
Title: Re: Vajrasattva root text/tantra
Content:
Toenail said:
Always wondered about what the root tantra of Vajrasattva is. Where the mantra etc is first mentioned. Is it translated? Is there an empowerment for it?

Malcolm wrote:
Sarvatathagata-tattvasamgraha, the root tantra of yoga tantra. Originally, there was no separate empowerment for this deity.

Toenail said:
What does it say about the mantra?

Malcolm wrote:
It’s used for purifying misdeeds and downfalls.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 8:39 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
tobes said:
.

The thing that changed in me was connected to developing bodhicitta from extremely slight to a little less slight. And I kind of realised that politics always = asura mentality. It is always about victory, and about vanquishing "those immoral" others. This can be coarse to the degree of actual violence, or extremely subtle, to degree of the merest thought of righteousness justifying moral-political superiority. If one retains this in the mindstream, one will part from bodhicitta.

Malcolm wrote:
The Asura mentality means being jealous of what others have and feeling cheated by them. The deva mentality means being proud of one’s status and entitled to one’s possessions, without caring for others.

The lesson of the destruction of the city Tripura for us is not that devas should overcome the asuras in a vicious class struggle, but rather, the devas should contribute to the welfare of the asuras because the trunk of the wishfulfilling tree grows through their land, so they have rights to its fruit also. Politics done right, like FDR, Johnson, etc,  keep this in mind. Politics done wrong, the GOP since Hoover, ignore this to our collective peril.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 8:27 PM
Title: Re: Vajrasattva root text/tantra
Content:
Toenail said:
Always wondered about what the root tantra of Vajrasattva is. Where the mantra etc is first mentioned. Is it translated? Is there an empowerment for it?

Malcolm wrote:
Sarvatathagata-tattvasamgraha, the root tantra of yoga tantra. Originally, there was no separate empowerment for this deity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 9:31 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
"The term professional–managerial class (PMC) refers to a social class within capitalism that, by controlling production processes through superior management skills, is neither proletarian nor bourgeois. This group of middle class professionals is distinguished from other social classes by their training and education, typically business qualifications and university degrees,[1] with occupations including academics, teachers, social workers, engineers, managers, nurses, and middle-level administrators.[2] The professional–managerial class tends to have incomes above the average for their country.[3]"

…
Edit: this thread went off the rails a long time ago, and probably ought to be split off from the original one and moved somewhere else. I don't like the idea that people come here looking for information about Buddhism and discover that every thread devolves into a 5 page long political flame war.


Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this exactly who,I am talking about. All of them. They voted for Trump,in large numbers.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 3:06 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
We publicize our events where we can, use the Buddhanet email list for intra-sangha communication type stuff back in the days that we had in person retreats yearly, people put flyers at the college, etc. I feel like specific "outreach" events targeted to racial and other demographics  get ethically dicey in all sorts of ways.

Malcolm wrote:
I see your point, since we do not, in general, evangelize. However, I believe there are many young people of color who are doubtless looking for an alternative in their spiritual life to theism. Both the young men I referred to earlier were involved with Vaishnavism prior to abandoning that and becoming interested in Buddhism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 2:26 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
So, the question is, what is the reason why a Buddhist center which is open and welcoming to everyone would mostly/only attract people from a certain demographic?

Malcolm wrote:
Generally, because they do not reach out.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 2:24 AM
Title: Re: Ordination in Tibetan Traditions and Being Vegan?
Content:
James84 said:
Is it possible to ordain in any of the Tibetan traditions and stay vegan? I have debated on posting this since I know the vegan/vegetarian topic can spark a lot of debate and controversy, but I can not find any information about it online so I wanted to ask here since many seem knowledgeable. Coming from the East Asian traditions I know it is possible there, but unsure on Tibetan traditions. Metta

Könchok Thrinley said:
Absolutely no problem. Here is a good bunch of resources. http://www.shabkar.org/vegetarianism/index.htm

All I would only advise is to realise that dharma should be a priority not some dietery prefference. I personally try to be vegan as much as possible, however when food with meat is offered I take it as it creates a link between me and the person and they are being generous in however small amount and since I am on the path (however badly and trust me I am very bad at this) sooner or later I will attain enlightenment hopefully (probably in billions of eons, but still that is something) and so I will be able to benefit them.

Also during tsok I take the meet if it is there as thems the rules.

We have to realise that veganism is still seeing things through materialistic viewpoint. They care only about the animals current life not other lives. While dharma cares also about the future lives. So try to make connection with the animals, say mantras infront of them and msot importantly do not create bad views of masters and disciples based on what they eat or not eat.

Few months back I saw vegans bashing a theravada monk for saying when monks are allowed to eat food, citing one "quote" from Buddha and completely ignoring the rest. That is bad, he did nothing wrong just shared the teachings.

So yeah... to end my ramble. Ofc you can be vegan buddhist, there is a plenty of us. Also whatever I wrote is just my view. No need to take it too seriously.

James84 said:
Thank you for your reply. How would it work if a monk was vegan and the monastery was having tsok? I understand that if they were offered meat they would have to accept it, but not consume it themselves.

Malcolm wrote:
As long as you never become a practitioner of Highest Yoga Tantra, this will never be a problem and you will never have to participate in a tsok.

James84 said:
Although with meat being a part of tsok, how would that work for a monk trying to be vegan or vegetarian? Could they simply visualize themselves eating it, or must consumption of meat be taken during these rituals? If it is required that leads me to believe one could not be fully vegan and a Tibetan monastic.

Malcolm wrote:
You are generally required to just taste it, at minimum. Otherwise, it is a serious infraction. However, these days, Karma Kagyu monasteries are favoring meatless tsoks, even though I don't agree with this practice.

The best way to avoid this issue in Tantric teachings is to pursue only the lower tantras.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 2:06 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
But a good teacher should know when and how to break that egotism and pull the rug out from under you.

Malcolm wrote:
The best teachers let you break your own ego, then it never comes back.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, October 4th, 2021 at 12:38 AM
Title: Re: Ordination in Tibetan Traditions and Being Vegan?
Content:
James84 said:
Is it possible to ordain in any of the Tibetan traditions and stay vegan? I have debated on posting this since I know the vegan/vegetarian topic can spark a lot of debate and controversy, but I can not find any information about it online so I wanted to ask here since many seem knowledgeable. Coming from the East Asian traditions I know it is possible there, but unsure on Tibetan traditions. Metta

Malcolm wrote:
Sure. There is no requirement to eat meat in Buddhism. However, in all schools you are not allowed to reject food which is donated to you. The exception to this are those bhikshus who adopt the ten ascetic vows.

In East Asian traditions, monks are generally expected to be vegetarians.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 11:38 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
. But how different is that from saying “all lives matter”?

Malcolm wrote:
If Black lives don’t matter, then not all lives matter. Case in point Gabby Petitto, as opposed to the hundreds of black and native women murdered every year.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 11:37 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
Just saw an ad on Facebook for an A. H. Almaas talk about Dzogchen: https://online.diamondapproach.org/a-h-almaas-lecture-series-dzogchen-understanding-garab-dorjes-three-vital-points-or-ahls5-fa21

It doesn’t mention it here, but the Facebook add said that he will talk about why “Norbu’s” approach didn’t really work in the west, and there’s a great deal of misunderstanding in western students. He will apparently share how westerners can understand it more like Tibetans.

Anyone know the history here? I’ve heard of Almaas spoken about respectfully a few times in the DC, I thought I remembered hearing that he’s a student of ChNN.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 10:54 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Queequeg said:
Just be a kind human being. A supportive friend. Reach out to let people know they are cared about and appreciated.



PeterC said:
Discussions about race in any context seem always to degenerate into white people offering all sorts of opinions about non-white people. A lot of non-white people in the US experience obstacles that white americans don't really understand. They would do much better just to be welcoming, to listen and to be helpful, and not to overthink it.

Malcolm wrote:
The point is that there is a huge amount of effort to erase thus fact, by white people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 9:37 PM
Title: Re: What are texts in the Agamas that are not in the Nikayas?
Content:
MiphamFan said:
Actually it’s still present in Tibetan Buddhism, termas are still being discovered and practitioners experience dag nangs.

Malcolm wrote:
And termas are not universally accepted, for example, most Gelukpas, Sakyapas of the Ngor tradition, and I would hazard, Jonangpas (since Taranatha took a dim view of termas) are skeptical of the terma tradition. Pure vision teachings are acceptable in these traditions, however, not entirely so.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 9:14 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
But anyway, what did you take issue with above, in that case?

Malcolm wrote:
I don't think midlevel, corporate managers wield much power, frankly. They are not brahmins in any sense at all.

They are just cogs in the corporate machine. They certainly do not wield anything like the power the bourgeoisie did in the mid-19th century.

Otherwise, managers are just paper pushers locked in a hell of endless meetings to schedule more meetings for projects that are always over-budget and never come in on time.

As for the Kochs, their dad was a founder of the John Birch Society—those people have been trying to dismantle the New Deal from day one, the pricks. Libertarians suck. Their doctrine goes right back to John Calhoun...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 8:51 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
But everyone knows perfectly well that Buddhists in the U.S tend to come from a specific stratum of our society: often well-off, educated, white, left-leaning.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes. We know. This is not the fact-free assertions to which Peter was referring. In my personal experience, left-leaning people (as opposed to radical leftists) are more open-minded and accepting of cultures differing from than their own. Education also has great deal to do with this—but not STEM education, rather humanities education— because people study things like literature, anthropology, philosophy, etc., tend to be more flexible thinkers. People educated in STEM programs are as likely to tack right as left, because STEM programs do not teach humanities. The great sadness I feel in the American educational system is the lack of comprehensive humanities education in grade 1-12 education. So many of our kids arrive in college barely able to read and write. They are good at filling in circles with graphite pencils though.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 8:44 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
Anyway Cormac MacCarthy writes mainly about the West, which is IMO it's own thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Depends on where you are in the West. The Northwest had a lot of white settlers who were refugees from the Confederacy, which is why, as you know, Oregon was founded as a White ethnostate—no Blacks allowed.

The Dust bowl folks mostly moved to SOCAL, where they became migrant workers until WWII, but actually, many of those Dust bowl people were also post-confederacy refugees.

Then you had folks like my mother's maternal great grandfather, who moved to North Dakota from Norway when he was 11, and became a very successful Norwegian cowboy in the latter half of the 19th century, after the Civil War.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 8:37 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
When people here talk about "whiteness" in the US and mention specific cultural factors - in fact that chart that posted earlier is illustrative actually, they are mostly talking about a specific flavor and tendency of Anglo-Saxon protestant culture here.

Malcolm wrote:
A strong motivating factor for latinos and asians to join protestant evangelical churches is to associate with the privilege they perceive in white society.

Its different for Blacks, they have a strong and independent form of Christianity, which unsurprisingly, is very focused on social justice issues.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 8:34 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Zhen Li said:
Also, white people, especially liberal white people who are inclined to be open to non-Abrahamic religions, have a guilt complex and feel like it is part of their practice of openness and cultural appreciation to be a member of a foreign group—especially that of an oppressed minority like Tibetans.

Malcolm wrote:
This is not a description of the white Americans who are Tibetan Buddhists, or Zen Buddhists, etc., that I recognize.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 8:16 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:



PeterC said:
Now you’re just being ridiculous.  Atheists absolutely do not enjoy a position of disproportionate social influence.  The Christians do.  What is the representation of nominal Christians in Congress, or state houses, vs the professed representation in the general population?  How does that compare to those professing other religions or no religion?

nightbloom said:
I didn't claim that Christians aren't still able to wield political power. Recent legislation in Texas proves that. But there are forms of power besides explicit political power. The secular "caste" I'm referring to overlaps heavily with what people sometimes called the "PMC" (professional managerial class), tends to be educated, concentrated in management, journalism, education, entertainment, the arts and so on. Tends to be wealthy, but not always... and ultimately, status and virtue/piety are often prized above raw wealth. It's largely, but not entirely, white. Tends to be "irreligious" (though I think politics substitute for religion in this case), if not outright hostile to religion. Leans (further and further) left.

It's not the sole power in our culture, but it's influential, despite its small size. It's not a perfect comparison, but I think it's better described as a kind of informal caste (with initiation largely conferred through education) rather than a class. In fact, I think that one could learn a lot about it by studying the history of caste in India. I'm thinking of the way brahmins historically held onto their power (which waxed and waned, of course) via their *purity* codes and control over knowledge.

I also suspect that the reason why this thread has been so heated is because many western Buddhists belong to this caste, share its attitudes, material concerns, and so on. Hard to leave behind one's conditioning entirely, but Buddhists should make an effort, in my opinion.

PeterC said:
More fact-free assertions.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup. Only a matter of time before George Soros gets invoked.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 11:51 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
. It has changed some but I still see Christianity all over the place, and outside of liberal enclaves, it still appears pretty "in your face" at times to me.

Malcolm wrote:
Where I live. Most of the churches have BLM signs, etc up., and most of the Christians seem to be “social” rather than devout Christians.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 7:29 AM
Title: Re: Accumulated merit urgent
Content:


Bikkhu87 said:
Can some powerful being like Amida Buddha help me…

Malcolm wrote:
No.

Bikkhu87 said:
do I need to accumulate merit for myself?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 5:57 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
DGA said:
debt

Malcolm wrote:
Interesting book:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt:_The_First_5000_Years


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 4:22 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
It is, but there is a legitimate cultural gulf to contend with, not only racism.

Malcolm wrote:
We traversed that gulf. No reason other people cannot, if shown genuine welcome. But people are clueless. Another Black student of mine complained to me recently about the casual racism he regularly experiences in other dharma groups he participates. I responded to him directly about his feelings, and clarified, that as a white guy, there were things he was experiencing that I was not able to truly appreciate, having never experienced such things, but that I was glad he brought to my attention, and that he should not let such instances slide.

He said:
It’s odd trying to understand karma as someone on the receiving end of racism.
Imagine that.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 4:09 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Johnny Dangerous said:
At this point it’s almost looks like I’m saying “black people only like devotional practices” or something, Which is not true at all, and actually would reflect the exact bias that Malcolm was complaining about were I to believe it. I mean, no people are a monolith. I see approaches in other groups with similar makeup that just seem ..pandery, rather than effective.

Malcolm wrote:
Just to be clear, this is an issue in American and European Buddhism as a whole, not only Tibetan Buddhism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 3:25 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Brunelleschi said:
I don't know what the situation is in America - but aren't most black americans christian (protestant)? See: https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/racial-and-ethnic-composition/

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, that but that is not likely to remain that way. Black church attendance is also declining in the US:

https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2021/february/black-church-african-american-christians-pew-survey.html


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 2:29 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Yes and my friend being an activist to promote Arabic rights which I now understand better

Malcolm wrote:
Thank you.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 2:23 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Yes I understand your point

The US was built on the destruction of the Native Indians and so on

Malcolm wrote:
As was Spain, Holland, England, and France, indeed all of Western Europe, one way or another, beginning with the Crusades.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
I had a friend in my town who was British Moroccan he was bullied at school because of it.

He said it was so hard to be bullied about the colour of your skin

Malcolm wrote:
There, now you have begun to discover your privilege. Of the many things about which you may have possibly been bullied, which are legion amongst cruel school children, you were not bullied because you were brown.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Main thing I’ve been discriminated about is being a serious Buddhist in the West by other westerners who don’t understand it

Malcolm wrote:
And that's only because you volunteered this information. Had you kept silent, people would have no cause to discriminate against you. But, did this discrimination extend to employment opportunities, etc.? Or were you socially ostracized?  These distinctions are important. Being discriminated against because of conscious choices we have made sucks. Being discriminated against because of things we have no control over, like the color of our skin, disabilities, etc. well and truly sucks in ways that being discriminating against because we did not get into a club because we did not look fashionable enough to a doorman will never be.

You see, if you do not recognize a form of suffering, you cannot have compassion for the person experiencing it. This is why the discussion of privilege, etc., as well as the absurd lengths white conservatives (and some PoC too, like Dinesh Desouza, etc.) go to rail against the idea, as well as try to discredit things like CRT, etc. is important for Buddhists to acknowledge and engage. It exposes to us a level of suffering which we have been insulated from, because of structural disadvantages baked into our system, especially in America. Structural disadvantages such as the racial covenants in real estate, millions of which still exist in the language of many deeds to houses, especially in communities in the Midwest through California that were built after the WWI.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 2:04 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Yes I understand your point

The US was built on the destruction of the Native Indians and so on

Malcolm wrote:
As was Spain, Holland, England, and France, indeed all of Western Europe, one way or another, beginning with the Crusades.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 1:41 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Personally I’ve always lived grown up in a multicultural area so I’ve never really felt white privilege.

Malcolm wrote:
You have it, just because you have not felt it, it is there and it is real.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Maybe there are privileges? In other ways I’m not privileged.

Malcolm wrote:
Privilege in this sense means never having to worry that if you are pulled over by the police, it will result in your unlawful death. It means not having to deal with racist Karens who call the police because you happen to be walking on a public street in your own neighborhood. There are so many ways in which, as a white person in America, or England for that matter, you are privileged. Waking up to your own privilege is the first step to helping black and brown people overcome the racism they experience daily and you experience, well, never.


Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
May all beings attain peace whomever they are for me it’s not really a strong issue because of where I’m from.

Malcolm wrote:
You are dreaming.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Bodhicitta doesn’t discriminate anyway and nor do I

Malcolm wrote:
You don't need to, people have already done it for you, and for centuries. That's part of what it means to recognize your privilege. Refusing to recognize your privilege means refusing to acknowledge the exploitation and suffering that allows you, a white person, to be a Buddhist, to have a precious human birth. You have freedom and endowments because you live in a place built on the suffering of others. You don't have to feel guilty, like you personally did something wrong, you just need to recognize it, and acknowledge that this is fact.

And as far as the subject of this thread goes, this brings us right back to the issue of white rage in the Buddhist academy, and among Buddhists. We have already seen plenty of it in this thread. Accusations heaped against the scary "other" that wants to remind us that there are real disparities among people, and that they will not be resolved by pretending we have gone beyond racism in America, or for that matter, Buddhism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 1:14 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Queequeg said:
Whenever this discussion comes up, I am compelled to point out - SGI is the most racially diverse Buddhist community that I know of.

Malcolm wrote:
That is a fact, actually. The vast majority of Black Buddhists are Nichiren Buddhists.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 1:00 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
ismael said:
If you think that direct introduction meant an empowerment in the eyes of CNN, that means you didn't listen very often to his webcasts

Malcolm wrote:
It means you listened with your ears closed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 12:57 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Johnny Dangerous said:
What is the Academy or a given sangha supposed to do though, some form of affirmative action, or? I gave the example earlier of groups of white Buddhists buying the right signs, or having committees etc. that are really just ‘look we are not racist’ backslapping.

Malcolm wrote:
I agree.

Johnny Dangerous said:
I genuinely don’t know what insular white sangha should do about this problem. Then again, none of the people I practice with a racist or reactionaries, just liberals who mean well.

Malcolm wrote:
They should reach out, they should extend themselves. For example, I have one student and understanding that he was isolated, etc., I visited him personally, because I had communicated with him for many years and I had an opportunity to do so when I was in his part of the country. I am acquainted with his family. He was invited by other white teachers to visit them. But no one actually went to visit this person in their home, to see who they were. If you don't make people feel welcome, they will not show up.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 12:44 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Zhen Li said:
Mind sharing? The problem presumably is that people don’t know this side of the story because no one is telling it.

The focus is on white people, but unless they hear what the problems are and have then clearly laid out, they’re not going to admit they exist.

Malcolm wrote:
This thread started out that way, but was immediately derailed by a white guy who has an attitude about CRT.

Zhen Li said:
In fact so much of this thread just reads as shaming, sometimes with aggressive speech, the refusal to admit racism, but not establishing what the crimes they’re being accused of are.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, if people would address the actual point of the thread...rather than freaking out over whether they are personally being accused being white supremacists, it might get somewhere.

But for some reason, white people feel so guilty about racism, they can never discuss it without feeling shame. Pity. I don't feel shame for being born a white person. I do feel that white people are sheltered from the effects of racism in this country. We did an enormously successful job of instituting apartheid in the US. It was not dismantled in in 1963 and 1965. It still exists. It exists in all of our institutions and in our communities, including Buddhist communities. For example, I was at a teaching in Alameda CA. in 2019. Out of three hundred people, there were a few Chinese people, a few Tibetans, a few Latinos, two or three trans people, some gay people, but mostly whites, and not a single Black person. And this is in a place one mile from Oakland. Now I am not saying there are no Black people who use this temple. There may be. I don't live there. But in CA and elsewhere, most Tibetan Buddhist communities have almost no Black participation. Now, we can rationalize this with things like throwing karma, precious human birth, but that is in some sense bullshit. In my experience, Dharma communities are not welcoming to to Black people, over all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 12:15 AM
Title: Re: Reversing Global Warming - Science and Politics (split from: Reversing Global Warming -Prayers and Aspirations")
Content:
Toenail said:
...until future technology saves us.

Malcolm wrote:
If underlying economic conditions for said technology to emerge exists, which seems unlikely. It seems more likely that we will devote most of those resources to war, as is the case now.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 12:09 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Virgo said:
Again this has nothing to do with anybody here, nor with the specific content of this thread.  I just feel this platform is not the best for me.

Malcolm wrote:
That's fine, but when the subject it brought up among white buddhists it is either crickets or "why can't we all just get along."

Sad.

People do not realize that casual and systematic racism in the White Buddhist community, including the Academy, in the US has real impacts on Black people interested in Buddhism. Ask my Black students. They will tell you this very clearly.
The point of this thread is to expose this in the Buddhist Studies world.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, October 3rd, 2021 at 12:03 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Seems to me to be a lot of white people objecting to the idea that there is actually a problem:
While studying for my Divinity degree at Naropa University, a professor of mine asked me in Zen kōan fashion the question: “Does a Bodhisattva get Angry?” Now, why I, a Black man, was given this kōan is questionable, however, I would like to think in my respect for this teacher, that they were very aware of the potential for anger for a person of color in this society and not simply stereotyping me as another “angry Negro.”

I can’t remember my exact answer, but I am sure that it was a load of bull about experiencing anger vs. acting out of anger. I gave the common liberal religious response that I was expected to give, my assimilation was confirmed with a smile. However, that answer is misleading and a non-sequitur, klesha, by definition, takes over your mind, your well being, your identity and you can’t simply and dispassionately experience klesha, i.e., powerful emotions, such as, passion and aggression.

...

In a recent article posted by Noriyuki Ueda and published in Tricycle, His Holiness the Dalai Lama speaks about anger and his words seem to contradict those aforementioned words of the Buddha, and even His Holiness’ own words on anger. When speaking of anger and social injustice, His Holiness differentiates between an anger that is motivated by hatred and an anger that arises in response to injustice.

In response to the question of whether we can transform anger to something more acceptable like compassion, His Holiness explains that this second anger, anger in response to injustice, doesn’t go away so easily. He says “anger toward social injustice will remain until the goal is achieved. It has to remain.” I, for the life of me, cannot reconcile this with the words of the Buddha, the words of Shantideva in the Bodhicaryāvatāra, not even in my tantric wrathful-compassion practices.

https://www.elephantjournal.com/2014/12/do-bodhisattvas-get-angry-a-response-to-to-the-killing-of-eric-garner/

Personally, I am not angry, but I am concerned. And I think the Trump Presidency has exposed a vein of racism in this country that lay dormant. It's a vein that threatens our democracy. Not sure if you are from the US, but frankly, this is no time to be complacent. If what passes for democracy fails in the US, it will fail everywhere else.

Confronting that racism requires facing it directly, and exposing it where it is. But this makes white people uncomfortable, understandably, especially white buddhists, it seems. Well, good, it should make you uncomfortable. You need to feel uncomfortable. It is necessary for you to feel uncomfortable. Because if you are not uncomfortable you are not paying attention, and your dharma is just pablum to feed your egos.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 11:16 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Yes that’s Samsara as Dharma practitioners however we can work together for harmony we have that in our toolbox if we want it.

Queequeg said:
Can't work out the harmony if we don't figure out who is playing the wrong note.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
That is neverending

Malcolm wrote:
This is also


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 11:15 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
We should give more focus on coming together, the dharma is unifying in and of itself.

Malcolm wrote:
You need to study the history of Tibet. And Japan. And China.

This Shangri-la picture of Dharma is, as it has always been, a fantasy.

Why do you think there were eighteen schools? Because they could not get along even though they had the same teacher. So the Buddha said, "If you cannot get along, go your separate ways."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 11:13 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Virgo said:
All this kind of thread does is create arguments between practitioners.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
That's ok.

Virgo said:
But it can lead to resentment and cause others not to collabarate.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
That's on them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:44 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
PeterC said:
Have you ever wondered who organizes it?  It's not the president or any politician, it's a christian lobbying group that has half the senate in their pocket.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, scary group. Illuminati. not really, but they wield enormous influence.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:41 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Virgo said:
All this kind of thread does is create arguments between practitioners.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
That's ok.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:40 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Queequeg said:
Ah. It's not just distorted... It's completely abstract!

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, he does not seem to realize that CRT was something that emerged in law schools, and that is was noncontroversial until the right wing media decided to make it a controversy by inventing the story, entirely false, that it was being pushed on grade schoolers in all white communities.

In reality, the backlash over CRT is entirely the work of people in the White Identity movement. We know this, because they outed their goals quite publicly.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory

Why is there backlash? For the same reason that in the 1930's schools in the US were forbidden to teach about economic inequality, etc. In reality, the backlash against CRT has resulted in censorship in American schools. Teachers, in many GOP controlled school districts, are no longer allowed to teach about the Civil Rights movement, and many other topics because it might make fragile white schoolchildren feel bad about themselves. F**cking snowflakes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:17 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Queequeg said:
What are you talking about? Clearly you get your news from a discrete, reality challenged echo chamber.

Otherwise you'd know most of these people you are excited about are just bozos with megaphones but no real power - you'll notice with some exceptions, these people don't get elected. Their super power is actually limited to getting in your head and raising your blood pressure.

Malcolm wrote:
I got the impression old Arch is from England. Correct me if I am wrong, but his impressions do not derive from living here and seeing how things really are.

He is also someone who is certainly not Buddhist academy adjacent. He may not actually realize how dominated it is by old white guys. Every Buddhist studies program in America that I can think of is run by old white guys. Which is ironic, considering that in America, at any rate, women outnumber men in Buddhism by significant margin.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:06 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Brunelleschi said:
Then again, what does this have to do with buddhist studies and communities? The problem relates more to Orientalization and impact of colonialism on Asia/Asians(South, East, Southeast) in the US and Europe. This has little or nothing to do with black Americans, no?

Malcolm wrote:
Thanks for trying to keep it on topic. Archie's responses perfectly supports this:
Twenty years later, the same white resistance is all too visible in Steve’s Twitter tantrum about Buddhism and Whiteness, a response which, ironically, performs the very thing he was denying existed. Drawing on similar responses, I want to make visible a specific expression of whiteness—what African American historian Carol Anderson has identified as “white rage”—directed at scholars of and scholarship on religion and racial justice.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 10:04 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Archie2009 said:
I'll give some examples that bother me. I see a Black San Francisco social justice activist working for the local government calling her Asian students house n*****s on Twitter without consequence.

Malcolm wrote:
Not cool.

Archie2009 said:
I see Black males beating elderly Asians to a pulp being blames on White Supremacy (huh?).

Malcolm wrote:
Whoever said that was an idiot.

Archie2009 said:
I hear nonsense repeated that White people have no culture.

Malcolm wrote:
In America? Completely true. Unless by "culture" you mean Hallmark Holidays, sports, strip malls, and Country Western.

Archie2009 said:
That all White people are born racist.

Malcolm wrote:
Idiotic.

Archie2009 said:
I see a need for revenge on the part of a lot of these activists.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, PoC have been pretty f**cked over in America.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce%27s_Beach

https://mappingprejudice.umn.edu/what-are-covenants/

It goes on and on.

Archie2009 said:
Defund the police actaully means abolish the police to the core of true believer activists.

Malcolm wrote:
Defund the police is facially dumb. It almost lost the Democrats the election. But what it actually means is stop having white majority police departments in black and latin majority communities.

Archie2009 said:
The current social justice movement is not a continuation of the Civil Rights movement from the 1960s.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, actually it is.

Archie2009 said:
They are ideologically incompatible.

Malcolm wrote:
Nonsense. It just doesn't conform to your rosy picture of a color-blind society where everyone has equal opportunity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 9:33 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


KristenM said:
The rate of U.S. church membership has declined sharply in the past two decades after being relatively stable in the six decades before that. A sharp increase in the proportion of the population with no religious affiliation, a decline in church membership among those who do have a religious preference, and low levels of church membership among millennials are all contributing to the accelerating trend.

Malcolm wrote:
In GA thus is accounted for by influx of people from the North.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 9:16 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Archie2009 said:
People like Queequeg and Malcolm here are zealots trying to shut down anyone mentioning this.

Perhaps the best way to fight this nonsense is with ridicule?

Malcolm wrote:
Not zealots, just see things for what they are;  unlike you, apparently. The Civil Rights movement did not end in 1965.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 9:15 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


MiphamFan said:
What do you think is so different from how they view their gods vs this definition?

Malcolm wrote:
In Buddhism, devas, yakshas and pretas, and so on, are of importance only in as much as they don’t cause problems for humans.

There is no penalty for not accepting them as real.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 9:12 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
KristenM said:
Religion, in particular Christianity, is virtually dying and close to nonexistent in America. Unlike Dharmawheel may portray it to be. The U.S. is a majority secular country, where people scoff at religion and churches are empty except for the occasional funeral or wedding.

Malcolm wrote:
You haven’t been to Georgia.

KristenM said:
Neither have you.

Malcolm wrote:
I was just there. Had dinner a great Vietnamese restaurant in Buckhead. There are churches everywhere.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:30 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
Who says that white Buddhists are angry anyway? Isn’t the issue that they (we) are complacent?

Zhen Li said:
Buddhism is, by nature, politically complacent.

Malcolm wrote:
You are dreaming. Buddhists is just as politically active as any other religion. Just look at Buddhist history. Come on…


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:28 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Zhen Li said:
When the majority is Latino, how do you know they will share the liberal white attitude on race—or does it matter at that point?

Malcolm wrote:
They do already in Mexico,


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:27 PM
Title: Re: Where is this Medicine Buddha mantra from?
Content:
Constructelf said:
In the Drikung Kagyu's Medicine Buddha sadhana The Drop of Ambrosia, the following mantra is given as the long mantra for recitation:

ТADYATHA / GHUME GHUME / I MINI MINI / MATI MATI / SAPTA TATHAGATA / SAMADHYA / DHISH THATE / A TE MATE PALE / PAPAM SHODHANI / SARVA PAPAM NASHAYA / MAMA BUDDHA / BUDDHOT TAME / UME KUME / BUDDHA KSHETRA / PARI SHODHANI / DHAMENI DHAME / MERU MERU / MERU SHIKHARE / SARWA ANKALA / MRITYU NAWA RENI / BUDDHE SU BUDDHE BUDDHA DHISH THITE NARA KSHAN TUME / SARVA DEWA / SAME A SAME / SAMANVA HARAN TUME / SARWA BUDDHA BODHISATWA / SHAME SHAME / PRASHAMAN TUME / SARWA ITYUPA / DRAWA BHYA DHAYA / PURANI PURANI / PURA YAME / SARWA AHSHAYA / BEDURYA PRATI BHASE / SARWA PAPAM KSHYAYAM KARI SWAHA/

That specific sadhana is the only place I've seen this mantra used. I've never seen it referenced anywhere else, not in an article or teaching, nor in a practice text from outside the Drikung Kagyu school. In all other Medicine Buddha practices I've seen, the long mantra is this, or some variation of it:

OM NAMO BHAGAVATE BHAISHAJYE / GURU BAIDURYA / PRABHA RADJAYA / TATHAGATAYA / ARHATE SAMYAKSAM BUDDHAYA / TADYATHA / OM BHAISHAJYE BHAISHAJYE MAHA BHAISHAJYE [BHAISHAJYE ] / RAJA SAMUDGATE SVAHA

Does anybody know where the first mantra is from, and if it's specific to the Drikung Kagyu or if other traditions use it as well? Every other source I've seen so far uses the second mantra.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s the long dharani from the sutra.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:26 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
At this point, I would say that there's something of a "caste" of people who are overwhelmingly secular…

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, and I hope that population increases, because their influence is not broad enough. America is secular nation. The present motto was only installed in the 50’s as part of the red scare.

This directly relates to the point. Once I was with relatives and the question of god came up. I said I don’t believe in god, they replied, well you believe in the Buddha. As you can imagine, they had no idea who the Buddha actually was. Their expressions were priceless.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:19 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


MiphamFan said:
Powerful pretas, the kings of the pretas, are said to be as powerful as devas….

Malcolm wrote:
Both are just sentient beings on the wheel. You can become a deva too. Or a preta.

That’s quite different than gods like the Olympic pantheon. The only god who really behaves like that in Buddhism is Papayin Mara, aka Kamadeva. And his actions are more on the deceiver end of things.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 8:14 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
KristenM said:
Religion, in particular Christianity, is virtually dying and close to nonexistent in America. Unlike Dharmawheel may portray it to be. The U.S. is a majority secular country, where people scoff at religion and churches are empty except for the occasional funeral or wedding.

Malcolm wrote:
You haven’t been to Georgia.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 9:29 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


tobes said:
What is the God you believe in or reject?

Malcolm wrote:
Have you been reading the thread?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 5:36 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Sherab Rigdrol said:
If anyone wants to buy me a copy of the Ati Treasury of Contemplation it would mean the world!!!

Malcolm wrote:
It's an SMS book.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 3:50 AM
Title: Re: Do you need initiation / transmission of the Longchen Nyingtik Ngondro?
Content:
Padmist said:
You can't just read WOMPT? Do you have to have an initiation/transmission for it?

Malcolm wrote:
its better of you have the transmission for the uncommon ngondro section. The common ngondro section is all sutra based.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 3:48 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Unknown said:
That means deconstructing and disrupting what was the dominant narrative for a long time, which was the Founders’ regime of natural rights. One of the institutional vehicles for it was the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which was meant to fulfill the promise of the Declaration of Independence for Black Americans coming out of segregation. But the courts and administrative agencies quickly turned against the color-blind, equal-opportunity vision of the founding

Malcolm wrote:
What a joke, did he somehow forget that Native people had no rights under the constitution and that slaves were counted as 3/5's of a person? What a douche.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 3:44 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
I’ll also add, controversially I’m sure, that the present anti-racist paradigm is very capitalist-friendly...

Malcolm wrote:
Market forces...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 2:17 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
Praying or making offerings to locals deities, etc. has no soteriological purpose in Buddhism and in fact one breaks their refuge vows should one do so.

nightbloom said:
...I assume that you are distinguishing this from, for instance, offerings granted to yakshas or nagas and so on in the context of pacifying/enlisting obstructors.

Malcolm wrote:
He means that of you take any of these worldly beings as a refuge it breaks your refuge vows, not that one is prohibited from making offerings to them. Making offerings to them does not have any soteriological value, apart from whatever merit one gains from doing so. When we offer a gektor, for example, it is to banish sentient beings that would have a negative reaction to the Dharma and try to cause problems for the Dharma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 2:16 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
Or to be more direct, even if we acknowledge the imperfect nature of translation, do you think that describing a bikshu as a "monk" metaphorically distorts the terrain badly?

Malcolm wrote:
Literally it means "beggar."

bhikSu	m. a beggar , mendicant , religious mñmendicant (esp. a Bra1hman in the fourth A1s3rama or period of his life , when he subsists entirely on alms) Mn. MBh. &c. (cf. RTL. 55 n. 1) ; a Buddhist mendicant or monk Katha1s. Lalit. (cf. MWB. 55) ; a partic.

The Tibetans translate the term a dge slong, the one dedicated to virtue, the one in whom virtue has arisen, depending how the term slong ba is read.

It is not at all an accurate translation of bhikṣu. But it is what it is.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 2:10 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
Praying or making offerings to locals deities, etc. has no soteriological purpose in Buddhism and in fact one breaks their refuge vows should one do so.

Malcolm wrote:
Sadhu sadhu.

Johnny Dangerous said:
That point really can’t be overemphasized and exists from the Pali Canon on up “they go to shrines and forest for refuge, this is no secure refuge” etc…

Malcolm wrote:
Indeed. Seems like some people here need a refresher on refuge.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 2:08 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Caoimhghín said:
"Oh, you think this is because you're black? Why are you so obsessed with your race? The Buddha teaches us that human beings have no intrinsic natures like 'black' and 'white or 'oppressor' and 'oppressed.' Have you read the Dharmapada? It can help you get out of this kind of thinking."

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is a problem, and how women, Black people, etc., are routinely treated by white, hetero, male Buddhists who have no idea the privilege they possess. And no idea how easy it is to lose that privilege in their next life.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 1:56 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


MiphamFan said:
But e.g. animists, shamans, and many other folk religions (Chinese, Indian, Japanese, etc etc) which are labelled "polytheist" do pretty much the same thing in apoptropaic relationships, no? It's unlikely that many of them have "creator deities" in the Abrahamic sense too. Polytheists don't necessarily grovel in front of deities too, they might sometimes "punish" deities by hitting their images or different things.

Malcolm wrote:
But we are not polytheists in this sense at all.


MiphamFan said:
So the Buddhist worldview is similar to them or at least has space for such relationships with sentient beings that we can't normally physically perceive.

Malcolm wrote:
The Buddhist world view is only similar in that we have an expanded notion of what kinds of possibilities there are for sentient beings to take birth as. All these "gods" are for us just mundane sentient beings. Hence, we really are not polytheists, strictly speaking. We do make allowances for animist customs and so on, however, and always have from the time of the Buddha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 1:41 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



oldbob said:
Who today in the Dzogchen Community is so realized that they can challenge someone’s claim that they have received permission in a dream from ChNN?

Malcolm wrote:
We are not going to challenge it, but it is unlikely we will believe it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 1:38 AM
Title: Re: Can the five elements be considered metaphysics?
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
He’s probably not very well known here. He’s an Aro guy called David Chapman, I think he’s mostly known in tech/science circles rather than traditional Buddhist ones.

Malcolm wrote:
He is very well known around here.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 1:35 AM
Title: Re: What to do with Tsok alcohol
Content:
Toenail said:
Is it Ok to eat/drink the guru plate/cup the next day

Malcolm wrote:
It's ok to eat consume it on the same day. Five minutes after you are done.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 1:26 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
There are all kinds of atheists interested in existential problems. It seems you utterly discount this.

nightbloom said:
No, of course not. I'm not talking about Nietzsche here.

Malcolm wrote:
I hope not, and he was not at all who I had in mind. But whatever.

nightbloom said:
For this whole conversation, I've been trying to make the point that atheism has become almost unavoidably entangled in popular consciousness with an extremely crass materialism that forecloses on the possibility of anything we might describe as 'liberation' on the final level (and instead looks toward technology, for instance, to extend worldly existence and eliminate pain).

Malcolm wrote:
I don't agree. And we are not talking about Joe Shmoe's opinion of atheism.

And materialism does not foreclose the possibility of liberation. It merely defines it differently, just as Hindus, Christians, etc. define liberation differently we do. This is where looking at Epicurean thought is useful.

Materialists (and not all atheists are materialists) are looking to alleviate their existential anxieties in this life, before they die. The Secular Humanist movement is an example of materialist atheists who are not merely money-grubbing Walter Gecko types, or futurists, etc:

https://secularhumanism.org/a-secular-humanist-declaration/

Of course they do not accept rebirth, and so on. But I find this far more palatable that Christianity, or any other form of theism.

I short, I am happy to a be godless atheist, who also happens to accept rebirth and karma aka Buddhist. YMMV.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 12:17 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
The real 'acid test,' for this entire discussion is whether you could even get a typical "atheist"

Malcolm wrote:
Define "typical atheist" please?

nightbloom said:
to talk or think about Buddha-nature to begin with (without even getting into the question of whether it possesses or lacks genuine existence).

Malcolm wrote:
There are a lot of Zen people who are confirmed atheists who do not even believe in rebirth who happily talk about buddhanature.

nightbloom said:
Because so much of all of this really has less to do with the existence or non existence of the deity, or with realism vs. nominalism than it does a kind of basic orientation toward the underlying problems & potential of human life. That is where all of this starts.

Malcolm wrote:
There are all kinds of atheists interested in existential problems. It seems you utterly discount this.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 12:11 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Caoimhghín said:
The identitarians, by which I mean far-right conservatives and alt-righters who call the kettle black, need to be dealt with before the actual ground-level racism and white supremacy in Buddhist studies can be dealt with.

Zhen Li said:
How do we deal with them? To win someone over, you have to allow them to see your point of view from their point of view. Do you continue to frame it in antagonistic terms or try to find a new way of approaching the matter?
Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.—In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. But we should claim the right to suppress them if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant. We should claim that any movement preaching intolerance places itself outside the law and we should consider incitement to intolerance and persecution as criminal, in the same way as we should consider incitement to murder, or to kidnapping, or to the revival of the slave trade, as criminal.

Malcolm wrote:
-- Karl Popper


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, October 2nd, 2021 at 12:03 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yes, but some people apparently are so freaked out by secular modernism, they react very badly to the word "atheist". Probably a symptom of having read too much Evola and so on.

nightbloom said:
No, I'm not a perennialist or a "Traditionalist" or any of those things, and in invoking the perspective of humanistic analysis (e.g, anthropology, etc), I don't think I sounded like one. It really should be uncontroversial to recognize that if alien scholars or whatever showed up, they would recognize that what's going on in the Christian monastery and what's going on in a Buddhist monastery are similar in important ways and quite distinct from what's going on out there in Dawkins-land.

Malcolm wrote:
If Aliens arrived from space, and saw Christians, Atheists, and Buddhists meeting in three large buildings, they would be unable to distinguish at all the difference between the three groups.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:21 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
There is no white culture. Just as there is no Western Civilization. These are all myths of white supremacy.

PadmaVonSamba said:
A funny thing about that: if you tell a conservative that America is biased towards Christians, whites, they will deny it, but if you tell them that America should become more culturally diverse, they will say no, this is a country based on western culture.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:17 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=8318&p=102251&hilit=advaita%20greg#p102251
Malcolm wrote:
Now, again, I am not saying that if you practice Advaita you will become a buddha -- I honestly do not know. But I am saying that when you study these things, philosophically, at any rate, it is very hard to show the difference between Advaita and Madhyamaka. The main difference between them is that Hindus accept the Vedas as self-originated and Buddhists do not.
Right, because Shankara via Gaudapada, used Madhyamaka arguments to defeat his Hindu colleagues. So context.

But in Dzogchen we accept that Dzogchen tantras are self-originated, that they arise directly out of the sound of dharmatā. So, this is not really very different than what the Vedic scholars believe. For example, the Song of the Vajra is just the intrinsic sound of dharmatā, the state of realization of Samantabhadra and Samantabhadri in union.
Yes, from the point of view of mere words, not much different; from the point of view of meaning, very different.
Though Dzogchen tantras do take pains to differentiate themselves from Upanishadic doctrines of the atman, these very same ideas get used in Dzogchen in a very similar way -- which is why there is a rebuttal in Dzogchen tantras of certain ideas we find in the Upanishads so we don't run out and say "The Upanishads teach the same thing as Dzogchen".
Yes, Indian Tantras and Dzogchen tantras occupy a milieu that shares a myth space with nonBuddhists. But the ways in which these myths are employed are completely different from one another.
So we can find a lot of parallels in Dzogchen and non-Buddhist teachings.
Sure, we can find a lot of parallels in Buddhism and nonBuddhist teachings in general: they have śila; we have śila; they practice compassion, we practice compassion. They have a version of karma, we have a version of karma. This is all true, but what distinguishes us from them, is that we are insiders, our liberation comes from understanding our condition, and we reject external liberation of any kind. Of course, some will argue that the nondual Hindu traditions, and even Samkhya, is similar-- they also find their liberation inside, however, they are eternalists and reject dependent origination, so they do not really find their liberation inside.

The one main difference between Dzogchen and most non-Buddhist traditions is that in Dzogchen there is a definite rejection of creation by a creator. Even in Advaita, on a relative level, they accept Ishvara as a creator. So this is an important difference.

Don't beleive it when people say that Kun byed rgyal po is a Buddhist creator myth. It is not true. Kun byed gyal po refers to the mind. It does not mean Samantabhadra is a primordial creator deity or a kind of Buddhism theism. People who claim this like Alan Wallace and Eva Dargyay-Neumier are mistaken.
And here is the rub. We are atheists.
But as Chogyal Namkhai Norbu says, "God" can be understood as a symbol of one's primordial state. So we do not necessarily have to reject "God" if we are Dzogchen practitioners, if by "God" we mean our own primordial potentiality and the primordial potentiality of everything.
And this so-called "god" aka basis [gzhi] is just a nonexistent mere appearance, that is, our primordial potentiality also has no real existence, which is stated over and over again in countless Dzogchen tantras.

For those whom emptiness is possible, everything is possible.
For those whom emptiness is not possible, nothing is possible.

-- Nāgārjuna.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:05 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
MiphamFan said:
Offerings to Dharmapalas, local guardians etc in sang and serkyem are basically what an anthropologist would call "do ut des" kinds of relationships no?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, Serkyems are just a Tibetan custom. Placating local entities is for the purpose of staving off problems. But these are aprotropaic relationships with other sentient beings, who are on the wheel of samsara, no different than paying taxes to the town, state, feds, to keep them off your back.

Dharmapālas like Mahākāla are manifestations of bodhisattvas on the stages. So they are included in our refuge. Making offerings to them increases our merit. Merit has the effect of preventing obstacles, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:03 PM
Title: Re: What to do with Tsok alcohol
Content:
Toenail said:
You are saying also the remaining tsok on the table is now free for all, people outside the mandala etc? What about heretics? Should they still have faith or could we present it as ordinary food to them?

Malcolm wrote:
You can give it to a beggar in the street, you just present it as ordinary food, which, now the feast is over, it is again. Technically, according to Sapan you can even eat drink the serkyem and eat the protector offerings since this is HYT, but most people don't do that.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:00 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Svalaksana said:
My only qualm with the term "white rage" is the classification of "white", for this appears to single out a racial group as exclusively responsible for the behaviour and thought. In my mind this sounds divisive and not very correct, and I wonder if it would make more sense to classify it perhaps as "anti-black rage", "reactionary rage" or "retrograde rage".

Malcolm wrote:
“White” is pretty accurate, since whites in the US are suffering from demographic anxiety, and tend to react with rage at the concept that maybe, just maybe, we don’t deserve the privilege that white supremacy has deeded us.

Zhen Li said:
Is it just demographics?

Malcolm wrote:
It is now.

Zhen Li said:
Was what happened to the indigenous Americans a result of demographic anxiety?

Malcolm wrote:
Nope, that was white supremacy in full force. That's what we have inherited.

Zhen Li said:
What American authors characterise as white rage is another term for tribalism. It is a manifestation of rage, and when coming from the dominant group, it is particularly threatening and ethically problematic. In this sense, white rage is a real thing and is an issue. But there's no gene for it.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, just as there is no "gene" for whiteness. Whiteness is a constructed identity. Why? Because people who formerly were not considered "white" (mostly Catholics) keep being moved up the "Caucasian" ladder.  There is no white culture. Just as there is no Western Civilization. These are all myths of white supremacy.

Zhen Li said:
I think the latter scenario is more likely in Canada, but let's see.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh, there is a lot of white rage in Canada, and it is increasing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:51 PM
Title: Re: What to do with Tsok alcohol
Content:
Toenail said:
Now with this tsok alcohol, I dont really want to drink it on other days, because of what I said before, but I also cannot throw it away, because it is tsok/holy or whatever.

Malcolm wrote:
You can disposed of it in a clean place.


Toenail said:
I also feel hesitant to give it to visitors, because they dont have Samaya. Sometimes I admit, for example with my superstituous polish friend who is not a buddhist, I offered her some saying it is blessed by the buddhas. I feel like she has some kind of superficial faith and she is respectful. But she is not a tantric practitioner. Any tips?

Malcolm wrote:
After a feast has been blessed as remainders, you can give the food to others. Many people do not understand that when the remainders are blessed, everything is now a remainder. But it is also no longer really consecrated for the feast.


Toenail said:
Happy dakini day by the way!

Malcolm wrote:
Happy Dakini Day to you too.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:39 PM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Toenail said:
What are good and sound reasonings for giving donwangs online?

Malcolm wrote:
They are based solely on visualizations, no substances are involved at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:38 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


Nicholas2727 said:
Looking at this made me realize there has been a lot of deep dives into some topics listed here. Reading it all has been very useful, but I would be curious to hear some more posts based on the original intention of the post, clearing up misconceptions/misunderstandings about Buddhism.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, the number one misconception is that we have anything remotely in common with Theistic religions, other than valuing compassion.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:05 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Norwegian said:
I am not sure for how long you've been a student of Chögyal Namkhai Norbu, but it cannot have been for that long.

Malcolm wrote:
Matthias, Bob was there at the big bang. The first time ChNN ever came to the US.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:00 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


MiphamFan said:
However, it seems to me that some non-mainstream Abrahamic sects have more democratic views, e.g. Quakers, Mennonites etc.

Malcolm wrote:
The Quakers are interesting phenomena. Keeping track of these new religions in America though, gives me a headache.

MiphamFan said:
Also, I still feel that we have common ground with realist polytheists. Not sure it's in the Bodhicaryavatara or another text but there is at least one Indian Buddhist text that says that between realism and annihilationism, it's better to be a realist.

Malcolm wrote:
There is a statement in the Ratnavali where it is held that it is better to be an eternalist than an annihilationist (Of course, in the Yuktiṣaṣṭika, Nāgārjuna declares that having negated nonexistence, the source of faults, one must then reject existence). But this can be seen as defensive move on the part of Buddhists, because the actual works of Indian materialists have been erased from history. We have no Lokayati texts. What we known of them comes from parodies and lampoons. But to be an ucchedavadin means really, to negate rebirth. But it does not mean one affirms powerful divinities as having any role at all one's liberation.

MiphamFan said:
From another PoV we are polytheists, we just don't have a supreme deity.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, we really are not. Polytheism attributes control of the world through various functions of external deities. We certainly give lip service to such concepts, but again, the Buddhist thought about such beings is much like that of Epicurean thought:

Lucretius presents Epicurus’ chief achievement as the defeat of religio. Although this Latin word is correctly translated into English as ‘religion’, its literal meaning is ‘binding down’, and it therefore serves Lucretius as a term, not for all attitudes of reverence towards the divine, but for those which cow people’s spirits, rather than, as he thinks such attitudes should, elevate them to a joyful state of tranquility.

......

Either way, what is not in doubt is that the gods’ role as moral ideals is paramount in the Epicurean system. And this is the function Lucretius too gives them, especially in the proems to books 1, 3, 5 and 6. The gods live a supremely tranquil life, never disquieted by either favour or anger towards us. By contemplating them as they truly are we can aspire to achieve that same blissful state within the confines of a human lifespan. But Lucretius adds another dimension to this theology: What Lucretius effectively asserts is that, on a Euhemeristic ranking, Epicurus is a far greater god than Ceres or Bacchus, held to have originally been the institutors of, respectively, agriculture and wine, and also a far greater god than the divinized Hercules. For Hercules rid the world merely of literal monsters like the Hydra, but it’s not as if there aren’t plenty of wild beasts left in the world to terrorize us today. Epicurus on the other hand has offered us real and permanent salvation from monsters, namely those truly frightful monsters that haunt our souls, such as insatiable desires, fears, and arrogance.

.....

Lucretius was both admired and imitated by writers of the early Roman empire, while in the eyes of Latin patristic authors like Lactantius he came to serve as the leading spokesman of the godless Epicurean philosophy. His poem subsequently survived in two outstanding 9th-century manuscripts (known as O and Q), which following the poem’s rediscovery by the papal secretary Poggio Bracciolini in 1417 (for this fascinating story see Greenblatt 2011) became the basis of the Renaissance editions. It was through Lucretius, along with the Latin translation of Diogenes Laertius’ Life of Epicurus, that Epicurean ideas entered the main philosophical (especially ethical) debates of the age. However, despite his extensive impact in literary and philosophical circles—he is, for example, among the writers most assiduously cited by Montaigne—Lucretius struggled for two centuries to shake off the pejorative label of ‘atheist’.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/lucretius


The impact of the Epicurean thought on the Enlightenment is much neglected.

As I have often mentioned, if I were to select a western philosophy to emulate, it would be that of Epicurus and Lucretius.

Here is another tidbit:

Epicurus rejected the conventional Greek view of the gods as anthropomorphic beings who walked the earth like ordinary people, fathered illegitimate offspring with mortals, and pursued personal feuds.[111] Instead, he taught that the gods are morally perfect, but detached and immobile beings who live in the remote regions of interstellar space.[112] In line with these teachings, Epicurus adamantly rejected the idea that deities were involved in human affairs in any way.[110][113] Epicurus maintained that the gods are so utterly perfect and removed from the world that they are incapable of listening to prayers or supplications or doing virtually anything aside from contemplating their own perfections.[112] In his Letter to Herodotus, he specifically denies that the gods have any control over natural phenomena, arguing that this would contradict their fundamental nature, which is perfect, because any kind of worldly involvement would tarnish their perfection.[113] He further warned that believing that the gods control natural phenomena would only mislead people into believing the superstitious view that the gods punish humans for wrongdoing, which only instills fear and prevents people from attaining ataraxia.[113]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:12 PM
Title: Re: Which of Sheng Yen's Dharma Heirs recieved yinke?
Content:
Aemilius said:
If you only trust a formal Inka or transmission, it means that you do not trust your own mind, your own perception, your own mind's capacity to see and recognize enlightenment.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, it's done such a great job of recognizing "enlightenment," whatever that is, since beginningless samsara, who needs any help?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:10 PM
Title: Re: Ice is melting on the North Pole
Content:


Aemilius said:
Seriously, if you can photograph the ice-sheet on Antarctica from space, you should be able to that on the North Pole also.

Malcolm wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arctic_sea_ice_decline


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:08 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
Of course, but in order to not waste privilege, one has to recognize one possesses it, no?

PadmaVonSamba said:
Actually, I don’t think so. White left/progressives actively supported, and were involved in the civil rights movement for decades without any sense of self-guilt. But, admittedly, the keyword term was “addressing the needs of the under privileged”. In other words, they didn’t (and most white Americans still don’t) see themselves as above the bar, even though they may recognize that others are below the bar.
Is there even such a concept as overprivileged?
I don’t think so. Maybe there should be.

Malcolm wrote:
There is such a concept as "overprivileged."

As far as guilt goes, recognizing that one has privilege does not involve guilt at all. People who feel guilty for having it often then wish to dispel their feelings of guilt by negating the fact that they are privileged. Alternately, there are some who feel entitled to their privilege, and believe in their blessed, little hearts that they are better than other people.


PadmaVonSamba said:
Angry is one thing. Defensive is another.

Malcolm wrote:
Strange how often they go hand in glove.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:54 PM
Title: Re: Can the five elements be considered metaphysics?
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
Read this recently from a Buddhist writer:
Vajrayana five element system: keep it or chuck it? For a contemporary presentation.

(It’s amazing useful considering that its factual basis is just false, plus it’s metaphysics and metaphysics is always Bad.)
Do you consider the claim that the five elements don’t have a factual basis, and are metaphysics to be valid?

Malcolm wrote:
No, the five elements are a phenomenology of matter, and are described that way in Abhidharma through Vajrayāna.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:49 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
The reason why dependent origination is so pivotal to why Buddhist is essentially atheist, is because belief in a god or gods is, ultimately, a direct reflection of a belief in a self/soul/atman.
In short, if nothing can be found to contain a “self”, then no “self” truly exists. And if no self truly exists, then no god is needed in order to create  one.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, but some people apparently are so freaked out by secular modernism, they react very badly to the word "atheist". Probably a symptom of having read too much Evola and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:47 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
“White” is pretty accurate, since whites in the US are suffering from demographic anxiety, and tend to react with rage at the concept that maybe, just maybe, we don’t deserve the privilege that white supremacy has deeded us.

PadmaVonSamba said:
Perhaps not, but white or black, we all enjoy the same privilege of coffee, fruit, rice, and other “third world” products in the United States.

Malcolm wrote:
But we don't, actually. Ever heard of a food desert? Yes, they exist in white communities as well, but they overwhelmingly dominate the landscape of PoC, cities, etc.


PadmaVonSamba said:
Just as vegans can’t help but depend on meat-eaters in a society, Everybody in the United States, like it or not, benefits from imperialism. That’s the inconvenient truth of dependent origination.

Malcolm wrote:
Some people (white people) benefit more than others (black, brown) etc.

PadmaVonSamba said:
Yes, try to make the world a better place. But keep in mind, it takes having some privilege in order to do so. None of us has perfectly clean hands.

Malcolm wrote:
Of course, but in order to not waste privilege, one has to recognize one possesses it, no?

The point here of course, is that white men in Buddhist studies do not seem to recognize their privilege at all. And when questioned about, they become angry and defensive.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:12 PM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Svalaksana said:
My only qualm with the term "white rage" is the classification of "white", for this appears to single out a racial group as exclusively responsible for the behaviour and thought. In my mind this sounds divisive and not very correct, and I wonder if it would make more sense to classify it perhaps as "anti-black rage", "reactionary rage" or "retrograde rage".

Malcolm wrote:
“White” is pretty accurate, since whites in the US are suffering from demographic anxiety, and tend to react with rage at the concept that maybe, just maybe, we don’t deserve the privilege that white supremacy has deeded us.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:50 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
And by the way, the "we" you're talking about isn't as united as you'd like to think. I'm happy to know many who feel other than you and would dismiss you as a bigot in this conversation.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, people feel all kinds ways about all kinds of things, but we, unlike you, back, our assertions with Buddhist facts, not feelings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:47 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


MiphamFan said:
Politically I am really not sure that his claims are accurate. There are plenty of atheist dictatorships,

Malcolm wrote:
Stalinism just replaces God with the State. But in reality, they don’t encourage free thinking, which is a hallmark of atheist thought, from Kapila, through the Buddha, right up through today.



MiphamFan said:
and I think a lot of these esoteric groups have always been more tolerant of political and religious diversity even in the West — quite a few of the American colonists, besides the Puritans, came from various Hermetic-influence, the products of the Radical Reformation rather than the Magisterial Reformation that came to dominate Europe.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh dear, the Freemasons, who were largely deists, which was a polite way of saying one was an atheist, back in the day.

MiphamFan said:
I am not saying that any religious group is pre-disposed to any kind of politics,

Malcolm wrote:
Theism shows a marked trend towards imperialism and oppression of others views, that stretches back millennia, and even Communism is an offspring of the Abrahamic religions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:40 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
PeterC said:
If you don’t realize that interdependent origination is the distinctive point of Buddhist philosophy then I’m afraid you need to go study the basics before you start offering opinions on the Dharma.  You’re not in any sort of majority on this one

nightbloom said:
To clarify, I'm not disagreeing that dependent origination is the heart of Buddhism. What I'm taking issue with is this part of the statement:

Malcolm wrote:
If one is going to compare Buddhadharma with any other thought, it has to be in light of dependent origination. Any other comparisons are at best superficial and trivial.

nightbloom said:
The soteriological impulse driving Buddhism, the experience of the 'unsatisfactory' nature of ordinary worldly experience, from the 4 noble truths onward, is not unique to Buddhism. Neither is the desire to share 'salvation' with others. Neither is its attempt to effect the total transformation of the practitioner via gnostic insight and discipline. Nor is the notion that "As it is without, so too is it within," and so on, or the emanationist flavor of tantric cosmology/physiology (so conspicuously overlapping with its Indian sibling traditions such as Shaivism, etc), or the alchemical logic of its ritual, etc.

Malcolm wrote:
All of these, in Buddhism, are articulated through dependent origination. Buddhist tantric cosmology? There isn’t one. The cosmology of Buddhist tantras is just the same as  sutra, barring Kalacakra, which offers some minor spins.

I suspect, as above, that you require atheists to be physicalists, but that’s far too narrow a definition. For example, like Buddhism, Early Samkhya is also atheist.

nightbloom said:
None of those things…*require* shunyata.

Malcolm wrote:
Without shunyata, none of things work, that is, lead out of samsara. But it seems you are of a fan of perennialism. No winder you are confused on the subject.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:30 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Dependent origination is the Buddha’s central insight. If one is going to compare Buddhadharma with any other thought, it has to be in light of dependent origination. Any other comparisons are at best superficial and trivial.

nightbloom said:
I couldn't disagree more, and happily, I think I'm in the majority opinion in this regard.

Malcolm wrote:
Your be wrong, again. “Whoever sees dependent origination, see the Dharma. Whoever sees the Dharma, sees me.”

And as usual you offer no reasonings, merely opinions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:38 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Pema Rigdzin said:
I’d hazard a guess that Malcolm’s point about beginners turning to longer sadhanas is for people for whom the path of transformation is their main approach.

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, but Dzogchen practitioners can benefit by understanding these in detail and experientially too.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:24 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Where are your getting your info?

Malcolm wrote:
Oxford. There is a pdf copy of a letter circulating from 2019, in which Oxford states it has no record of his enrollment or attendance at any of its colleges for the period of 1963-1967.

Further, the Spalding Trust Visiting Fellowship in Comparative Religion is at Cambridge, not Oxford. However, there could have been one.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 11:00 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
You mean to say Eckhardt talks about dependent origination?

nightbloom said:
No. My point is that it's not important that he doesn't talk about dependent origination.

Malcolm wrote:
Dependent origination is the Buddha’s central insight. If one is going to compare Buddhadharma with any other thought, it has to be in light of dependent origination. Any other comparisons are at best superficial and trivial.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:41 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
And we should trust Trungpa’s judgement because…?

Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Because at the time he was studying Comparative Religion at Oxford. And of course he was educated as a tulku.

Those are some pretty impressive credentials.

nightbloom said:
In my view, his academic credentials are irrelevant - you should read Eckhart in light of the Vajrayana-Mahayana because there are genuine sympathies between the two,(

Malcolm wrote:
You mean to say Eckhardt talks about dependent origination? News to me.


nightbloom said:
People should read Eckhart and find out for themselves.

Malcolm wrote:
I have, there are no similarities.

Eckhardt is a theist. Mahayana in toto rejects Theism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 10:03 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
We used to have someone post here that knew him in those days. Too bad this didn’t come up while he still participated. Maybe next time he checks in we can ask him about it.

Malcolm wrote:
There is actually no record of him being matriculated into Oxford, at any of its colleges. It does not mean he didn’t attend some classes. It’s would be like me saying I went to Harvard (did not matriculate) when in fact I just took some courses in a program I lost interest in matriculating into.

However, there is literally no record of Trungpa at Oxford.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:48 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Simple fix. Actually practice Buddhism. You know... leave home. Go homeless. Wander in foreign lands. Be a foreigner. Be poor. Learn to negotiate your own otherness... It's humbling.

Malcolm wrote:
Generally the fix for Buddhist Studies is to practice  Buddhism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:44 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
At least for me the backstory and justfications are not important. What matters is what happens at the empowerment and the following practices. Guhyagarbha has this long story about Rudra taking over the universe. It's not important that it be true. What's important is the meaning about karma. Guhyagarbha is pretty neat bc it explicitly says it was taught in Akansitha which in the commentary is inside one's body.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is the common theme in Nyingma tantras, for which Guhyagarbha is original template.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 9:18 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
In the ‘60s when Shenpen Hookam asked Trungpa what she should read to better understand Buddhism, he said “Meister Eckhart”.

Malcolm wrote:
And we should trust Trungpa’s judgement because…?

Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Because at the time he was studying Comparative Religion at Oxford. And of course he was educated as a tulku.

Malcolm wrote:
I take it you are aware there is no record of Trungpa being enrolled at Oxford? That it is an unsubstantiated claim he made, just as he also falsely claimed be the supreme abbot of Zurmang.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:44 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
In the ‘60s when Shenpen Hookam asked Trungpa what she should read to better understand Buddhism, he said “Meister Eckhart”.

Malcolm wrote:
And we should trust Trungpa’s judgement because…?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:35 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Svalaksana said:
I don't see how, really. The concept is mentioned in the thread title, one would assume that an understanding of it would be relevant for engaging with the discussion. Can you please explain what white rage is more specifically, so that I or other users unacquainted with it may provide their input and further add to the development of the issue in here?

Malcolm wrote:
I suggest you read the articles. I think they frame the issue quite well.

Svalaksana said:
Is it a fair categorization to say then that white rage is a reactionary ideological trend that seeks to undermine the social progress and justice among black communities and to limit or dispell the dialogue concerned with those subjects?

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, pretty much. We’ve already seen some stellar examples in this thread,


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:26 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
Anyway, I didn’t mean to stir political shit up in this thread, but it seems to be unavoidably headed in that direction, so I think I’ll just excuse myself from further argument.

Malcolm wrote:
No, we are talking about is philosophical similarities between Buddhists and materialists which cause us to share a common atheistic outlook.

What I have observed, having been in the Dharma for 30 years, is that people with theistic tendencies fit uneasily into Buddhadharma, and tend to reify theism in their understanding of Buddhadharma. For example, I first studied Madhyamaka etc., with Malcolm David Eckle, who is an expert on Bhavaviveka. I was very surprised to learn he as a Christian, and as much as he admired Madhyamaka, he was relieved he was not a Buddhist. Or Paul Williams, who wrote a popular book on Mahayana, and after a long career as a Buddhist academic, converted to Catholicism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:24 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
positioning Buddhism alongside contemporary atheism is very frequently a social/cultural move, and not just a philosophical claim.

Malcolm wrote:
Umm, no, I identified a couple of westerners philosophers, who I think bolster my point quite well.

The problem here is that you seem to believe that being an atheist entails adhering to logical positivism.

It fact, the essence of atheism is denying supernatural causation to explain natural phenomena. Like modern atheists we reject first cause, prime movers, and creators. Like modern atheists, we assert ethics should be grounded in rationality, rather than divine ordinances. As Candrakirti pointed out, the only difference between us and materialists is that we accept karma and rebirth. Otherwise, our points of view are more similar than they are different.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 8:11 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:



Svalaksana said:
But I really meant my question, because I'm trying to understand the concept. Are those black people displaying white rage as well?

Malcolm wrote:
This whole line of inquiry is off topic for the thread. I guess people just don’t want to deal with the issues raised, which ironically confirms Ann Gleig’s thesis.

Svalaksana said:
I don't see how, really. The concept is mentioned in the thread title, one would assume that an understanding of it would be relevant for engaging with the discussion. Can you please explain what white rage is more specifically, so that I or other users unacquainted with it may provide their input and further add to the development of the issue in here?

Malcolm wrote:
I suggest you read the articles. I think they frame the issue quite well.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:55 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Svalaksana said:
What about the black people who agreed, supported and voted for Donny Trumpet? Are they displaying white rage as well?

Malcolm wrote:
What about Jews who collaborated with Nazis in the Warsaw Ghetto, and the French in Vichy France, Blacks who collaborated with the Apartheid regime, etc? Who can understand the thinking of people who collaborate with their enemies, other than the perception they will personally benefit.

Svalaksana said:
But I really meant my question, because I'm trying to understand the concept. Are those black people displaying white rage as well?

Malcolm wrote:
This whole line of inquiry is off topic for the thread. I guess people just don’t want to deal with the issues raised, which ironically confirms Ann Gleig’s thesis.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:52 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yes. And the alternative was putting an elderly, senile conservative…[/quote]

Well, joe isn’t senile, and  he did make a deal with Bernie. Joe also has more experience in the Federal gvt. Than any other president in American history. That may or not be an advantage, but it’s undeniable.

Archie2009 said:
Democrats get to do nothing but vote conservatives into the WH, yet love labelling anyone who dissents alt-right. Even if they have voted for actual socialists and greens their entire life. Pretty funny, right?

Malcolm wrote:
It’s a two party system. Not by design, but practically speaking that’s how it has worked out. Voting for third parties is a wasted vote, but what does any of this have to with the topic, Archie?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:45 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:


Svalaksana said:
What about the black people who agreed, supported and voted for Donny Trumpet? Are they displaying white rage as well?

Malcolm wrote:
What about Jews who collaborated with Nazis in the Warsaw Ghetto, and the French in Vichy France, Blacks who collaborated with the Apartheid regime, etc? Who can understand the thinking of people who collaborate with their enemies, other than the perception they will personally benefit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:40 AM
Title: Re: Reversing Global Warming - Science and Politics (split from: Reversing Global Warming -Prayers and Aspirations")
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
The Chestnuts are gone, extinct. They were the dominant hardwood species.

Genjo Conan said:
The American Chestnut isn't extinct, but it is critically endangered.

Malcolm wrote:
You are familiar with functional extinction, I am sure.

Genjo Conan said:
My mom grew up Pittsfield and East Lee; your neck of the woods, I think.  The house she lived on in East Lee is on Chestnut Street, just up the hill from the Turnpike.  There haven't been any chestnuts there in a long time.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, about 45 minutes and an hour and ten minutes west, respectively.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 7:36 AM
Title: Re: Is Ichinen Sanzen still valid with current knowledge of the Lotus Sutra?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
That's how the Christians did, at the council of Nicea. The ones still on the table were then considered canonical.

ronnymarsh said:
That's not the subject of the topic, but the Christian canon has not been decided in Nicaeajjjjjjjjjj

Malcolm wrote:
Voltaire’s story is pretty good though.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 6:27 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Svalaksana said:
What is white rage?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 6:26 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Archie2009 said:
Of course not. This is critical race theory and its ilk.

Malcolm wrote:
Ummm no, not in the least. But it also has nothing to do with the articles I posted. So why don't you keep it on topic and stop trolling the thread.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 3:54 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Brunelleschi said:
Yeah, I don't oppose the idea of de-colonization and de-orientalization of Buddhist studies and it would be good if sanghas were more mixed - especially with majority population and people with roots in buddhist countries.

Malcolm wrote:
Personally, I don't either. Its pretty boring reading paper after paper reading some white guy's opinions of other white guys opinions on some brown guy's composition.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 3:19 AM
Title: Re: Rupa
Content:
Arnoud said:
Don't want to speak for Malcolm but I think he translates Rupa as matter so that can't "exist" in the dream state. That's all mind.

Malcolm wrote:
Depends, but matter is for the material aggregate, which is made of the four elements; form on the other hand is the object of an eye consciousness. But since one is asleep, its all mental consciousness and objects, so not form either.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 3:18 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
Anger is because of self grasping

Malcolm wrote:
Do tell...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 3:08 AM
Title: Re: Is Ichinen Sanzen still valid with current knowledge of the Lotus Sutra?
Content:



Queequeg said:
LOL. I can't read that fast.

Malcolm wrote:
That's how the Christians did, at the council of Nicea. The ones still on the table were then considered canonical.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 2:53 AM
Title: Re: Is Ichinen Sanzen still valid with current knowledge of the Lotus Sutra?
Content:


Queequeg said:
As for those ten factors, they are such an important set of principles in Tiantai that they've received a lot attention. I've never read any suggestion that they were inserted by anyone other than Kumarajiva. Rather, as pointed out, they are found in the Dazhitulun, attributed to Nagarjuna and translated by Kumarajiva also, so its pretty certain this was Kumarajiva's doing.

Malcolm wrote:
I would vote for a margin note that migrated into the text. I see this all the time in my work with Tibetan texts.

Queequeg said:
What's the canon but the set of texts you assert is official? What is canonical? These are fuzzy subjects. Like I said, err too conservative and we might just be left with some aphorisms about the golden rule attributed to the Buddha.

Malcolm wrote:
I like the table strategy myself. Put all your scriptures on a table in a room. Lock the door (make sure you have the only key). Come back the next day to see which ones are on the floor.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 2:49 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Brunelleschi said:
Ok. Some of it sounds good, other things sound more performative and reminded me of Rob Henderson talk about luxury beliefs:

Malcolm wrote:
I would say that Buddhism is very much a luxury belief system, which is why there are barriers to inclusion. Precious human birth and karma being two of the main barriers.

If there is a fault in these articles, they do not take this into account. They are treating Buddhism like it is an evangelistic religion.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 2:33 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
What you get from buddhism depends a lot
on what you want from Buddhism.

Malcolm wrote:
Oh, but we are not talking about Buddhism, we are talking about Buddhist studies, which is dominated by old white guys like me (cringe).


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 2:30 AM
Title: Re: Is Ichinen Sanzen still valid with current knowledge of the Lotus Sutra?
Content:
Queequeg said:
The gist I get from questions like this is that fundamentalism is a loser's game.

Malcolm wrote:
Denying textual facts is kind of a fundamentalism, don't you think?

I mean we know that Kumarajiva's translation is not even completely his. It was augmented by others. Anyone after him could have added these ten items to his recension of the Lotus before it reached its present form.

It does not invalidate the whole Tendai strand of thinking, necessarily. It just undermines its canonical basis. But there is not reason to assume anyone was creating exegesis on this text in bad faith.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 2:18 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
The problem with letting things be as they are and caveat emptor is that abusers and their enablers hide their abuse until it's often too late. We cannot continue to put all the responsibility on students. Dharma organizations need to be proactive.

Malcolm wrote:
Many teachers, most I would hazard, do not belong to Dharma organizations.

Knotty Veneer said:
And sorry I no longer buy that striking anyone is a valid means of purifying their karma or pointing out the nature of mind. That's Tibetan BS based on mythical namthars and we should reject it without exception.

Malcolm wrote:
So you reject Patrul's own testimony with Do Khyentse? That is not mythical, not even slightly.

There is another lama, a famous Sakya lama by the name of Dezhung Ajam, who lived in the early part of the 20th century in Derge, a student of Adzom Drukpa. He reports a similar incident with a stonemason he met in Kham, again, personal testimony, not myth. The incident was that there was this man who was building a wall on the side of the road. But as soon as the wall was built on one side of the road, he would tear it down stone by stone and build it on the other side. Dezhung Ajam got the idea that the man might be a practitioner of separation of samsara and nirvana, so he asked the man what he was doing, and the man struck him on the head with the stone he was carrying. Deshung Ajam reports that right there he had vivid experience of the nature of his mind, and even though he never knew the name of the mad stonemason, he always referred to this man as one of his root gurus.

And then of course there is my friend.

So according to you, this is all invalid.

Knotty Veneer said:
I can't see why a teacher cannot refuse to teach anyone he is in a relationship with.

Malcolm wrote:
Sorry, but that's ridiculous. So a person should refuse to teach a person they are in a long standing relationship with? A spouse for example? A life partner? Sorry, I have to repeat it, that's just ridiculous.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 1:43 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Another one:

https://www.lionsroar.com/the-maras-of-privilege/

Unknown said:
“Are you studying the religion of wokeism or the religion of Buddhism?”

“Perverting the dharma with identity politics.”

“Keep playing the victim.”

“Sheer nonsense.”



Malcolm wrote:
I have heard exactly the same tropes here.

She continues:

This is some of the blowback I’ve got from my work challenging racism and promoting diversity, equity, and inclusion in Buddhism. While much of the response to my research has been positive, it has also been the target of defensiveness and derision from some white Buddhists, and resentment and rage from others.

I have been attacked personally and accused of being a “pseudo-scholar” and of “attempting to pervert the dharma by means of identity politics.” Self-identified alt-right Buddhists (yes, there is such a thing) have gone as far as creating a podcast ridiculing me and two other Buddhist Studies scholars for our work on racial justice in American Buddhism.
Yup, and we have a thriving community of Alt-right Buddhists over on DW engaged, and some right here on our own forum. You know who you are, so I don't need to name names.

This is good, sure to provoke howls of outrage:
Joy Brennan, a fellow Buddhist scholar–practitioner, and I recently gave a collaborative workshop on “Collective Liberation: Theory and Practice,” at Zen Mountain Monastery, which explored racial justice work from a Buddhist perspective. We identified whiteness as a manifestation of the demon Mara, the personification of the three poisons.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 1:27 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Seems to be a real thing. We see a lot of here in DW, sadly.

Archie2009 said:
Indeed. Punctuality is White Supremacy culture as the National Museum of African American History and Culture rightly pointed out in a now sadly retracted jpeg chart posted on their website. And DW is so punctual, every time I press the Submit button my contribution is immediately added to the thread in question.

Malcolm wrote:
Pretty accurate chart. Describes most of the things I find cringy about US culture and white people here.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 1:25 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


Knotty Veneer said:
Don't sleep with your students. Don't physically or sexually assault them. Make sure your finances are transparent. It's not really so difficult?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it is a little difficult.

Let's start the last item, obviously money run through nonprofits has to be transparent by law. Personal gifts, dana, is private, not subject to taxation, etc., nor should it be.

Moving on the first item, there is no actual reason it is necessarily wrong for teachers to sleep with students, as long as it is consensual. There are some people who will argue that it can never be consensual. I don't buy that argument.

As for the second item, these are legal terms. If someone assaults someone this is either a misdemeanor or a felony, depending. If a student, for example, receives a blow from a teacher, and declines to press charges, that will generally be the end of it and should be the end of it. If they are beaten to a pulp, that is a different matter. Sexual assault is more serious, because that is always a crime. You neglected to mention verbal assault, BTW.

For example, in America, in the 1960's, it was permissible for elementary school teachers to slap students. I got slapped once, in second grade. Parents generally felt this was ok. By the 1980's, this was no longer ok. These things are never so cut and dry as people want to make them.

In some states in the US, it is illegal for licensed minister to sleep with a parishioner.  In most, it is not. At this point, very few Buddhist teachers are licensed members of the clergy. Generally, it is because such licensure depends on some kind of ordination and endorsement by a religious body which shows the member is in good standing, etc., and the vast majority of Buddhist teachers are not ordained and do not belong to these kinds of organized religious groups. So, it is really not as simple as you want it to be, with your reductionist set of guidelines. Many Tibetan male lay teachers active today pursue relationships among their students, if they are not married (and sometimes, even if they are, sometimes even if they are ordained). I could give you a list but in the interest of people's privacy, I am not going to. Frankly, what people do in their private lives is none of our business, as long as it is not criminal. I know a lot of people who are disappointed that Sogyal did not live long enough to be taken to court again. People point to the San Francisco Zen Center as a place which gives a good road map, but Richard Baker never stopped teaching, not ever. People still excuse Seungsahn's behavior, though, frankly, again, what people do on their own time is their own business. His Kwan Um centers are widespread in America, they are all over the place. It's such old news though, I think most new students have no idea. Maybe they are entrance counseled about it, I don't know. NKT, still going strong, after myriad sex and ethics scandals. Shambhala will continue. Diamond Mt. shut down, but Michael Roach is still out there, even being implicated in the death of one of his closest students did not stop him.

So, the only course is to make sure you examine the teacher.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 12:28 AM
Title: Re: Reversing Global Warming - Science and Politics (split from: Reversing Global Warming -Prayers and Aspirations")
Content:
Genjo Conan said:
...mindless planet-killing virus...

Malcolm wrote:
That would be our present economic system, free-market capitalism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 12:26 AM
Title: Re: Reversing Global Warming - Science and Politics (split from: Reversing Global Warming -Prayers and Aspirations")
Content:
Queequeg said:
That said, I don't know about the mix you have up in the northern Berkshires, but here, we have tulip and various red and white oaks that grow really tall - 150'+. Not as big as the chestnuts used to grow, but still pretty massive. Ailanthus and other weed trees don't survive in those stands. Even the norway maples seem to be in check.

Malcolm wrote:
Sugar Maple, Oaks, Pines, Hemlock, Ash, Locust, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 12:24 AM
Title: Re: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Buddhist Studies Has a Whiteness Problem

https://contendingmodernities.nd.edu/global-currents/buddhist-studies-whiteness/

Unknown said:
Decolonizing Buddhist Studies

Religious studies is finally beginning to come to terms with its colonialist past. Discussions related to decolonizing religious studies are becoming increasingly prominent, not only in forums like this blog, but also in places like the annual meetings of the American Academy of Religion, the main academic gathering for scholars of religion in the US. We still have a long way to go, but the fact that these conversations are even happening is promising.

Within religious studies, however, scholars of Buddhism have remained largely absent from these discussions. Buddhist studies, on the whole, has not acknowledged, let alone addressed, issues of colonization, white supremacy, and the erasure of Asian people and cultures within the field. And with the news of a white man murdering Asian women on March 16, 2021, an attack that followed in the wake of increased anti-Asian violence related to misinformation about the coronavirus pandemic, scholars of Buddhist studies need to acknowledge where we stand in all of this, beyond simply expressing our outrage at specific incidents of explicit hate.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 12:20 AM
Title: Why Are White Buddhists So Angry? White Rage And Buddhist Studies Scholarship
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Ann [Glieg] reflects on her experiences as a Buddhist scholar on the receiving end of white rage:
Steve: “Scary, postmodern virus infects North American Buddhism.”

Me: “Thanks for showing us what PoC Buddhists have to deal with every day in their sanghas, Steve.”

Steve: “Keep playing the victim.”

Me: “I notice your Twitter profile says “Zen Beginner,” maybe you could learn something from the Zen teachers in this book, who have been practicing for decades. Stretch that Zen Mind, Beginner’s Mind, Steve!”

Steve: deletes thread and blocks me.[1]

The preceding was a short exchange I had with Steve, a stranger, on Twitter, after I tweeted about the publication of George Yancy and Emily McRae’s 2019 edited collection Buddhism and Whiteness. The book contained essays by Buddhist scholars and scholar-practitioners examining both how whiteness operates in Buddhist practice and academic communities, and what resources Buddhist thought and practice offer for challenging whiteness. While this was the first academic collection to attend to whiteness in Buddhism, Buddhists of Color have been confronting whiteness in American Buddhism for over two and a half decades. The landmark 2000 compilation Making the Invisible Visible: Healing Racism in our Buddhist Communities, for instance, shared that for many years the white Euro-American sangha has been resistant to efforts by People of Color to raise awareness of racism in Buddhist communities.
https://www.shilohproject.blog/why-are-white-buddhists-so-angry-white-rage-and-buddhist-studies-scholarship/


Seems to be a real thing. We see a lot of here in DW, sadly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, October 1st, 2021 at 12:06 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
DGA said:
Examples:  I don't mix with white supremacists, but many of my peers seem to take a "both sides have good points" approach to, say, holocaust denial

Malcolm wrote:
Me either, and and the both-siders are full of shit. Same goes for anti-vaxxers or people who will not do the responsible thing and get vaxxed, whatever their excuse may be, barring a medical waiver.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 11:43 PM
Title: Re: Reversing Global Warming - Science and Politics (split from: Reversing Global Warming -Prayers and Aspirations")
Content:
Kim O'Hara said:
The BBC is running a series called "Life at 50C". Here's one episode, with others in the sidebar.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/science-environment-58724297

I thought I should put it in this omnibus thread rather than keep multiple climate-change threads cluttering up the board.


Kim

Queequeg said:
A lot of that story about the river has to do with idiotic water laws in the US, as GC has touched on recently. That said, the drought affecting Western N. America is real.

Meanwhile, I'm having to figure out how to keep soil on the slopes in my back yard in the face of high rainfall.

...

I just found out that the knotweed that has invaded the area was originally introduced to control erosion. I guess they didn't realize that it would outcompete almost everything else, except the various fast growing vines that now blanket disturbed landscapes here - also invasives. The thought did cross my mind that maybe I should reintroduce knotweed into my yard and let it grow on the slopes, but my gut loathing of that plant snuffed that line of thought.

I often wonder what the landscape will look like when humans stop tending it.

Malcolm wrote:
What time frame are you talking about? RIght now, there is a lot of shitty underbrush in NE forests. If there is a drought here, we are all doomed by fires, which will be apocalyptic.

Queequeg said:
Will the giant hardwoods native to this area of N. America slowly recover?

Malcolm wrote:
The Chestnuts are gone, extinct. They were the dominant hardwood species. Maples were farmed, grown as sugar bush.

So no. And there is no controlled burning anymore, which is how the native people used to keep underbrush down so it was easier to hunt and travel.

Queequeg said:
I'm exposing them to ideas about frugality, balance, harmony, coexistence and stewardship with an anthropomorphic, spiritual flavor.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 11:33 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
I do not think the point of view your espousing is useful anymore, Malcolm. And to be honest, is redolent of the kind of excuses one often hears from those "senior students" who turned a blind eye to Trungpa, Osel Mukpo, Michael Roach and so forth.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, then come up with a list of professional standards for Vajrayāna gurus, Zen masters, etc., which they have to meet in order to teach Buddhism in your country, along with remedies when they violate professional codes of conduct. Because otherwise, these kinds of things will just continue. The problem is a little thing we have in democracies, called "freedom of religion."

Knotty Veneer said:
And I don't think Sogyal was a great guru - I think he just had a really good editor.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't either. Neither was Trungpa, in my opinion. But thousands of people still think so. And many people who studied with Trungpa also have good understandings of the Dharma at present and are good practitioners. Are we going to throw them under the bus because we don't like their teacher? Are we going to claim that whatever they may have realized is bogus? That just does not work in Vajrayāna. In Vajrayāna, what matters is regarding your teacher to be a Buddha, period. Not like a buddha, but a Buddha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 11:22 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Thus it further lends weight to the notion the Pali Canon is not a reliable source of historical facts about Buddha's life.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, agreed. Good thing we don't practice history, though. The Mahāyanīs had a transcendent view of the Buddha as a person. But we also do not practice text criticism.

But I do understand your point. If we are going to talk about empirical history, we have to be honest about things like the repurposing of legendary Indian persons like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vararuchi (Bramze mchog sred), considered on of the most highly educated panditas in India, into the manifestation of Padmasambhava called  Loden Chogse (blo ldan mchog sred) or Brilliant Vararuci, etc.

If we are going to go by tradition, then these are two different persons.

We need to be able to shift between these two perspectives.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 11:08 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



Knotty Veneer said:
Here's a report of the incident I was referring to - what do you informants say happened differently?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, for starters, he did not punch her very hard, it was a kind of a running joke between them, nevertheless he was mad. Second, he and she hugged and giggled immediately after the famous punch. And there is the third point, which is that the nun in question completely disagreed with how this was covered by the media, is still a loyal student of Sogyal, and refused to press charges of assault. But of course her point of view is brushed off as being a mere cult member cluelessness and blind devotion.

Now, let me clarify, Sogyal did have a penchant for hitting his students with his famous backscratcher. He hit someone I know in the head with it quite solidly once. My friend claims that this blow allowed him to understand the nature of the mind. It cut right through all his bullshit. I believe him, because this person has a very good understanding of Dzogchen teachings. I am pretty confident that Sogyal had a very good understanding of Dzogchen teachings as well. Having a good understanding of Dzogchen teachings does not necessarily make one a nice person to be around.

Now, I myself would be prefer to humiliated in front of 300 people by being yelled on a hot mic for being a young, arrogant scholar (as happened with Chogyal Namkhai Norbu in 1992, which by the way sealed the deal for me about ChNN), some people get it by being hit in public, others by being hit with sandals, backscratchers, etc. I am not saying that we have to stay with gurus who we feel are abusive or appear abusive. I am saying we need to be careful about how we judge the interactions of other people with their teachers. The people who wrote the letter, and the people who have come forward about their experience of Sogyal, felt abused. Others, experiencing just the same conduct at the same time, did not, and defended their teacher. I cannot condemn either side for the way they behaved.

In the end, it is caveat emptor, on the part of both the teacher and the student. The teacher has to examine the student well. The student has to examine the teacher well. It is clear that many Rigpa students did not examine the teacher well; it is equally clear the teacher did not examine the students well. So, in the end, they both suffered. While I would not blame his ex-students, it is pretty clear to me that Sogyal died in a state of profound sadness, and died earlier than he would have otherwise as a result of the whole thing. And people cannot give it up, still they incessantly criticize Sogyal as the Tibetan Guru Bogeyman, honestly, there are worse teachers out there, in the past and also still active, I am quite sure.

Many Asian teaches, from a Western point of view, have very poor boundaries. It's ok to have boundaries, but one should understand that in the traditional guru disciple relationship in Vajrayāna Buddhism, those boundaries can be sorely tested. Most of the problem these days arises from this kind of misunderstanding. Some of it is cultural. In old Tibet, if a renowned guru wanted to sleep with someone, it was regarded as an honor, bringing fortune to everyone, for obvious reasons which are not spiritual at all and totally patriarchal and sexist. Here, if a guru wants to sleep with someone, he or she is immediately a creep, a pervert, a libertine, a scoundrel, because we have a different set of values derived from how we view the clerical trade in West, and what kind of boundaries should be observed. If one is priest, celibacy; if one is minister, one should be in a strictly monogamous union.

In the end, we need to be careful about who we take as our teachers, just as they need to be careful about who they choose as students.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 9:38 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
Someone I know once jokingly referred to Buddhism as “Atheistic Hinduism”

Malcolm wrote:
That might be true, but only if Buddhism’s theory of karma and rebirth even remotely resembled the Hindu concepts of the same, but it doesn’t.

MiphamFan said:
Can you point to any sources on this?

Malcolm wrote:
It is super weird, actually:
Life does not end at the death of the physical body. The body dies but the soul does not. It lives on in a counterpart of the physical body which is called the astral body. The astral body is made of astral matter and resides in a world not unlike this one, called the Devaloka or Second world. In other words, in order to perfect itself, to spiritually unfold and evolve, the soul lives on in another body after death, the astral body. At the right time, according to its karma, it is reborn into a flesh body. Thus the astral body, with the soul within it, enters a new physical body. This same cycle is repeated many times until the soul spiritually unfolds and reaches a certain state of perfection or mature evolution. These repeated cycles of births and deaths are known as samsara. The soul passes from one physical body to another. Each time it does so, the Hindu says, the soul has reincarnated. This is the process to which the name “reincarnation” is given.

Therefore, the Hindu does not believe in a single life on earth, followed by eternal joy or pain. Hindus know that all souls reincarnate, take one body and then another, evolving through experience over long periods of time. To a Hindu death is not fearsome. Like the caterpillar’s metamorphosis into the delicate butterfly, death does not end our existence but frees us to pursue an even greater development. The soul never dies. It is immortal. Physical death is a most natural transition for the soul, which survives and, guided by karma, continues its long pilgrimage until it is one with its creator, God. Reincarnation is the natural cycle of birth, death & rebirth, called samsara. When we die, the soul leaves the first world physical body, it lives for a while in the Devaloka, the Second World, before returning again to earth, the Bhuloka or First World.
https://www.hinduismtoday.com/hindu-basics/karma-and-reincarnation/

This devaloka is the moon, actually. And according to Shankara, one's atman becomes vapor which rains down on plants, and then this soul gradually moves through the plant and animal kingdoms, eventually one becomes human again. I am sure the metaphor is based on the monsoon seasons in India.

MiphamFan said:
Thus, according to Hinduism, life in the ancestral heaven lasts longer, but it still is a temporary because eventually every soul that goes there has to return to the earth to continue its mortal existence. A soul may enjoy great pleasures in the ancestral heaven, but eventually its enjoyment has to end like any pleasant dream. Once its karma is exhausted, the individual soul falls down from the heights of heaven through rain and returns to the earth to participate once again in the turmoil of the unstable earthly phenomena and the ocean of births and deaths (samsara).

The scriptures explain how each soul, having the size of an atom, enters a new body in the mother’s womb upon conception and begins its rebirth. The suggested return journey starts with the falling down of the individual souls to the earth along with rain drops from the ancestral heaven, which is located in the moon. When they fall upon earth along with rain, each soul becomes deposited in the earth along with the seeping rainwater. There, they enter plants or trees through the water they absorb and become part of their sap. When those plants or trees are consumed by humans or animals they enter their bodies. Those souls which enter animal bodies may either take animal birth or await until they are consumed by humans to take human birth according to their karma. When a soul enters a male body through the aforesaid process, and if that person is destined to be its father, it becomes part of his semen (retas). From there it enters the body of female through sexual intercourse, if she is destined to be its mother, and settles in her womb inside the fertilized egg awaiting its rebirth.

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.hinduwebsite.com/reincarnation.asp

MiphamFan said:
I think in general reincarnation-accepting religions are still closer to us than mainstream Abrahamic religions though.

Malcolm wrote:
Superficially only. Hindus use karma and reincarnation to enforce the caste system. Buddhists don't.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 9:26 PM
Title: Re: Why not cross the Guru Bead?
Content:
lelopa said:
Here the big bead is called Mt. Meru:

https://www.mahamala.com/the-indian-tradition/

Malcolm wrote:
However, in Buddhadharma we count with the left hand, not the right.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 9:05 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
Because he is not the same person, probably not even the actual rebirth of Trungpa.


Padmist said:
Thank you.

In the case that it is the reincarnation of CTR, we can say that he is not the same person. He is a different guy.

heart said:
Please understand that this is Malcolms opinion on this particular tulku and his well known opinion on tulku system as it is today, not a general statement on reincarnation.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, rebirth is one thing, tulkus quite another.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 9:05 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
Because he is not the same person, probably not even the actual rebirth of Trungpa.


Padmist said:
Thank you.

In the case that it is the reincarnation of CTR, we can say that he is not the same person. He is a different guy.

heart said:
Please understand that this is Malcolms opinion on this particular tulku and his well known opinion on tulku system as it is today, not a general statement on reincarnation.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, rebirth is one thing, tulkus quite another.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 9:04 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
The humiliation of a nun at a public teaching was impossible to cover up...

Malcolm wrote:
Unless you personally know someone who was there, how sure are you of your understanding of the episode?

I do know people who were there, and well, let's just say, according to them, this is not what others claim it was.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 7:50 PM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
Were the Jonangpas realist? If not, why are their assertions so easily mistaken for realism? If so, are they still Buddhist? Rhetorical questions, but I'm sure you take my point.

Malcolm wrote:
The Jonangpas are Buddhist because they go for refuge to the three jewels and engage in Buddhist training.

They are “realists, vastuvadins” because they are a subspecies of Yogacara attempts to interpret Nagarjuna through the treatises of Maitreya. Their nearest Indian exponent is Ratnakarashanti, who asserts the ultimacy of gnosis, etc.

There are three realist Buddhist tenet systems: Sarvastivada, and other shravakayana schools, Sautrantikas, and Yogacara. But here Buddhist realism means something different than the assertion of universals as real, like the Nyaya school, etc. it means asserting that disparate particulars are real or ultimate.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 7:39 PM
Title: Re: Why not cross the Guru Bead?
Content:
Chenda said:
[Mod note: This topic was split from "Can I use a mala?"] https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?p=600405#p600405

Knotty Veneer said:
A few things I was told:
Don't cross the guru bead when reciting mantras.
Don't show off your mala - it's not jewellery.
Don't take it into the bathroom.

A practical point:
Best to use a simple wooden or bodhi seed mala, IMO. Beads made from semi-precious stones tend to break easily if your drop your expensive fancy mala!

Chenda said:
While we're at it, is it really important not to cross the guru bead? I always did, and it never made sense why we should not cross it nor why it's considered disrespectful.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s mainly to accurately count sets of 100.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 7:37 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
So now you're saying Buddha was a Kshatriya?

Virgo said:
Yes, he was.  And  also at that time in India Kshatriyas and Brahmins were pretty equal in the caste system.  Only later were they eclipsed by Brahmins.

Virgo

Crazywisdom said:
You will have to prove that with evidence. The evidence supports the contrary that the Buddha's land had no exposure to Brahminism, and that the Vedic culture was still isolated in the Punjab with no diffusion into Magadha.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is what Bronkhorst concludes. His arguments are compelling, but not conclusive.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 11:08 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Padmist said:
So about the reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa, how come he doesn't seem to have the same continuation of Chogyam Trungpa's favorite pastime? What happened to the memory, habits, etc?

Malcolm wrote:
Because he is not the same person, probably not even the actual rebirth of Trungpa.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 10:48 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
That might be true, but only if Buddhism’s theory of karma and rebirth even remotely resembled the Hindu concepts of the same, but it doesn’t.
My understanding is that the only difference between the two is Hindus believe the continuity between lives has an unchanging identity, and Buddhists do not.

Malcolm wrote:
No, the Hindu concept of reincarnation is much stranger, much more like Pythagorean metempsychosis than the Buddhist understanding of dependent origination and karma. It’s pretty strange. Also different Hindu schools have different ideas about the specifics but they all, in the end, assert a permanent, ultimate  entity, and we do not.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 10:04 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
To be crystal clear, I do not intend to conflate all of these things. There is a reason why I chose to practice Buddhism and not something else. But the attempt to distance Buddhism from other traditions and place it close to contemporary atheist materialism is hard to see as anything more than an opportunistic rhetorical move designed to preserve the appearance of Buddhism's "appropriateness" within modern society. In other words, it's branding, and a rather pernicious form of branding, in my opinion...

This is even more obvious when one reflects that Buddhist practice is overflowing with things that resemble practices in other traditions (prayer, renunciation, magic) that are explicitly reviled and mocked by materialist culture.

For the record, I find the term "Spirituality" distasteful and avoid using it because of its vagueness.

Malcolm wrote:
Everyone mocks each other’s nonfalsifiable beliefs, movement atheists have many nonfalsifiable beliefs also. But that’s not the point, Buddhists offer natural mechanisms which explain all of theirs, and none of them involve relying any external force. These system, Trika, Advaita, no need to mention Samkhya, etc., are all  realist schools. Thus they are limited because they do not understand dependent origination.

Among western schools, Buddhism most closely resembles Epicureanism, then after that, Hume. Of course, we tear them apart too, but they are the closest.

I forgot to mention it, Epicurus is the father of modern, Western atheism.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 8:50 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
One thing that is cut and dry is that Buddhism has far more in common with atheism than theism. So much so, it is basically a form of atheism. But many Buddhist are attached to Ideas of spirituality, and so atheism makes them uncomfortable..

PadmaVonSamba said:
Someone I know once jokingly referred to Buddhism as “Atheistic Hinduism”

Malcolm wrote:
That might be true, but only if Buddhism’s theory of karma and rebirth even remotely resembled the Hindu concepts of the same, but it doesn’t.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 8:26 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
DGA said:
Reframing part of the conversation:

if you can't respect that people you disagree with on some issues are people you can learn from, then you're really going to struggle with Buddha Dharma.  And nearly everything else.

nightbloom said:
I agree entirely. I think few of the things that are really important in life are cut and dry, obvious, accessible to "common sense." I'm completely happy to practice the dharma and work with people with different politics, so long as this is reciprocated and we try to avoid treating one another as bad faith actors.

I regret accusing Malcolm of cynicism, and retract it.

Malcolm wrote:
One thing that is cut and dry is that Buddhism has far more in common with atheism than theism. So much so, it is basically a form of atheism. But many Buddhist are attached to Ideas of spirituality, and so atheism makes them uncomfortable..


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 7:44 AM
Title: Re: Vajrayana. How do I begin my path?
Content:
ElenaTheo said:
Hi dear forum members,


And...the question is: where the heck should I start?


Malcolm wrote:
First find a qualified guru. Then, receive empowerments. Then follow their instruction carefully.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 5:07 AM
Title: Re: Vehicle of the gods and humans
Content:
naljor said:
What is actually the vehicle of gods and humans in dzogchen teachins of nine vehicles? Just low of karma or non buddhist spiritual practices?

Malcolm wrote:
It is the practice of the ten virtues and the four brahma viharas, which lead to rebirth in higher realms.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 4:46 AM
Title: Re: Rupa
Content:
Viach said:
The rupa (form) in the so-called waking state and the rupa in the lucid dream state are the same rupa or is there no rupa at all in the lucid dream state?

Malcolm wrote:
None at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 4:45 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


conebeckham said:
If you learn Tibetan and read and study, participating in rituals can be a very transformative experience, and I have yet to hear any English (or other Western language) version of such rituals that is as powerful and affecting.  But this could just be me.

Malcolm wrote:
It doesn't help that a lot of sadhanas use words like "holy" and "sacred" and so on, bringing to mind a Catholic or Episcopalian mass, etc.

conebeckham said:
Sure.  Heck, even calling Kundun "HHDL" is somewhat fraught, IMO.  I think all translations are approximate.  Including Tibetan translations from Sanskrit.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, and all translations are commentary, as an article I was reading by Jonathon Silk this morning pointed out.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 4:28 AM
Title: Re: How difference between Chan and Zen.
Content:
KeithA said:
So, I am not sure why some native Asians seem to struggle with our practice.

Malcolm wrote:
They (lay Asians) generally do not practice meditation. They light incense, bow, and do a little chanting. That's about it.

Meditation is the job of religious professionals. And, I read an interesting book recently, Zen Ritual: Studies of Zen Buddhist Theory in Practice. It emphasized the fact that in many respects, in Zen temples in Japan, there was a lot of less meditation than one might expect, and that a large portion of temple activities were oriented towards ministering to the needs of the lay population with various kinds of rituals.

SeekNothing said:
Is this really true? My experience has been with one of the Taiwan Chan groups, but they certainly emphasize meditation, and their origin is in Asia (and in the US the majority of the lay sangha is Asian, and all the monks I have seen). If you mean Japanese Zen specifically then I have no idea. But I also know devout people in mainland China that mediate frequently as well.

Is it the case that it depends more on the organization or tradition than the country?

Are people making a distinction here between Chan and Zen but then lumping Seon and Thein together with Zen?

Malcolm wrote:
The largest group of Asian Buddhists in the US are pure landers. And among the Thai, etc., Theravadin communities, mostly lay people use the Sangha as a support for dana.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 3:23 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


conebeckham said:
If you learn Tibetan and read and study, participating in rituals can be a very transformative experience, and I have yet to hear any English (or other Western language) version of such rituals that is as powerful and affecting.  But this could just be me.

Malcolm wrote:
It doesn't help that a lot of sadhanas use words like "holy" and "sacred" and so on, bringing to mind a Catholic or Episcopalian mass, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 3:06 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Uggghhh:

https://www.audible.com/pd/Podcast/B08JJQL65R

In episode 9 of this podcast, Una Marera reports seeing Trungpa french-kissing a thirteen year old girl in a Boulder Dharmadhātu event with other adults present.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 2:58 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
I don't believe this at all.

Malcolm wrote:
Ok. You don't have to. It is not a requirement.

Crazywisdom said:
Apparently you didn't either. You were formerly into historical analysis vis a vis Duckworth's(SP?) books, but now you've decided to go with traditional religious renditions.

Here's what you said...

https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?p=591623#p591623

Malcolm wrote:
Different paradigms for different occasions. Historically speaking, it is unlikely Buddha taught Mahāyāna, let alone the tantras, etc., was a kṣatriya, etc. But from the point of view of tradition, he did all these things. I don't worry about the contradictions between these points of view.

Now we are really off topic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 2:04 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:


nightbloom said:
Funny how it just so happens to work out that the Dharma is compatible, in every way, shape and form, with progressivism as it exists in 2021.

Malcolm wrote:
You should read the Ratnavali. Nāgārjuna had very progressive views about health care, social safety nets, prison reform, elimination of capital punishment and so on. Buddha himself was anti-caste, anti-militarism, etc.


nightbloom said:
This is a naked attempt to bring the Dharma in under the umbrella of the current political and social zeitgeist, and nothing more. Totally transparent.

Malcolm wrote:
It is not an attempt. Western Buddhists tend to be left-wing progressives, except in Eastern Europe, where they are tend to lean right, because of their experience with Stalinism. The first time I met a Republican Buddhist I was honestly very shocked. I personally do not see how you can square right wing politics with bodhicitta. Why do you think we were so hard on you about vaccinations? You are going to be very unhappy in the Dharma in America if you can't deal with progressives.

Tibetans themselves tend to be a bit reactionary, because most of them are monarchists.

Noted that you did not deal with the actual content of the post.


Mod note: Between this post and the next post by DGA, a whole bunch of off topic or ad hominem posts have been removed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 2:01 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



Varis said:
I disagree. The Gayatri mantra during the time of the Buddha was not an openly known thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure it was, the Buddha talks about it openly, in one passage declaring it is the supreme of all mantras, and so on.

Crazywisdom said:
I don't believe this at all.

Malcolm wrote:
Ok. You don't have to. It is not a requirement.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 2:00 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
Therefore Buddha would not have known the Gayatri since it was reserved for initiated Brahmins.

Malcolm wrote:
No, for anyone who was twice born, not just brahmins.

Crazywisdom said:
So now you're saying Buddha was a Kshatriya?

Malcolm wrote:
According to tradition, yes, that is the point of view.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 1:47 AM
Title: Re: Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra
Content:



Queequeg said:
In your opinion, is Asanga's critique correct or is this a polemical position? Is this directed at a particular school of Madhyamaka or is this a critique of Nagarjuna himself?

Malcolm wrote:
I think Asanga's point is incorrect, and it may not be directed at Nāgārjuna directly. The reason for this is that Yogacārins have always tried, without success in my opinion, to reconcile their very technical doctrine with Madhyamaka, even composing commentaries texts like 400 Verses of Aryadeva to explain where Madhyamakas get it wrong.

Queequeg said:
Thank you. That makes sense.

Malcolm wrote:
That's "composing commentaries on texts like..."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 1:37 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
adherence to progressive/left politics, and so on.

Malcolm wrote:
Unsurprisingly, I am a left-wing progressive. I feel much more at ease in the company of atheists than I do in the company of Christians. I least I know the former are pro-democratic. In this I stand in good company with men like Ethan Allen, Jefferson, Franklin, Washington, and other notable atheists of the American revolution.

Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc are anti-democratic by nature, whereas Buddhism is not. It probably has to do with the Platonic and Neo-platonic origins of their philosophy and theology. Qabala, for example, is just reheated neoplatonism.

It is also not surprising in the least that Buddhists, in ancient India were lumped together with the carvakas by other schools, since we reject śruti, varna, etc, basically everything in the "Laws of Manu." The only difference between us and materialists, even today, is that we accept rebirth and karma, they do not.

As I mentioned before, Buddhism in all it forms is a kind of nominalism; we reject that pādārthas aka universals are real. The acceptance of the real existence of universals is a characteristic of right wing philosophy everywhere.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 30th, 2021 at 1:31 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
In CW's defense, I know the Gayatri Mantra, and I never studied the Vedas.

Varis said:
I disagree. The Gayatri mantra during the time of the Buddha was not an openly known thing. The traditional rule for reciting the Gayatri is that it is never supposed to chanted aloud to prevent non-initiates from hearing it.
During the upanayana ceremony the Gayatri is whispered directly into the ear for the same reason.

Crazywisdom said:
Therefore Buddha would not have known the Gayatri since it was reserved for initiated Brahmins.

Malcolm wrote:
No, for anyone who was twice born, not just brahmins.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:50 PM
Title: Re: Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra
Content:



Queequeg said:
I've gotten around to following up on this reply.

This rebuke of Asanga is kind of a strawman, is it not? As I understand this might apply to emptiness as an analytical tool applied to dharmas, but does not apply to the so-called emptiness of emptiness.

Moreover, while the emptiness described in the sutta is sort of comparable to madhyamaka, its really describing progressive meditative practice through the four dhyanas up to insight. Its not exactly comparable to emptiness analysis.

Malcolm wrote:
Asanga is saying that emptiness, correctly understood, is like that emptiness in the Cullasuññata sutta, and the Madhyamakas go too far and negate too much.

Queequeg said:
In your opinion, is Asanga's critique correct or is this a polemical position? Is this directed at a particular school of Madhyamaka or is this a critique of Nagarjuna himself?

Malcolm wrote:
I think Asanga's point is incorrect, and it may not be directed at Nāgārjuna directly. The reason for this is that Yogacārins have always tried, without success in my opinion, to reconcile their very technical doctrine with Madhyamaka, even composing commentaries texts like 400 Verses of Aryadeva to explain where Madhyamakas get it wrong.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:05 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
The lesson of understanding what's being taught is a good lesson. If one learns which lesson is being taught in a Vajrayana sadhana it's obvious one must visualize, which cannot be done in a language one doesn't understand. Same with prayers like Bodhicitta and 7 Limbs. The meaning is what matters.

Anyway, Indians recited these sadhanas in languages they understood, obviously. So did Tibetans. Accurate translation is essential.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this is my point. I have actually made this point over and over again over the years. The Sakyapas started this trend, in fact. HH Sakya Trichen translated the main Sakya sadhanas (Middle Length Hevajra and Vajrayogini) into English in 1968. It was furthered by CTR in Vajradhātu.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:55 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
It's not mere details that the texts were not said by Buddha. Maybe they were blessed by Vajradhara.

Malcolm wrote:
They are the same person.

Crazywisdom said:
Vajradhara is not a person. A person is a sentient being. Sentient beings have afflictions. Vajradhara is the dharmakaya. Siddhis who recognize that can bless mantras with dharmakaya connection, unless one wants to believe Sanskrit itself emanates from primordial space like Vedantins do.

Malcolm wrote:
The Dharmakāya is not separable from the rūpakāya, just being the mind of a buddha.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:49 PM
Title: Re: Bhumis in context
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
How should one regard the bhumis in an applicable sense in terms of one’s own practice?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, until you are on the bhumis, they are of no relevance at all. While one is not on the bhumis, one is either on the path of accumulation or the path of application, and most of us are on the first one, the path of application.

PadmaVonSamba said:
Right. So why is it even taught?
My understanding is that the Buddha didn’t teach things that had no relevance to practice.
Is it supposed to inspire practice?
Has anyone ever known of a practitioner even getting close?

Malcolm wrote:
The Buddha always taught the whole path, whatever path he was teaching, in sūtra and tantra, so that people would understand their experiences on the path. One of the main reasons is that so that people will not mistake their experience, thinking they have realized something they have not, for example, emptiness.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:44 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



Varis said:
I disagree. The Gayatri mantra during the time of the Buddha was not an openly known thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure it was, the Buddha talks about it openly, in one passage declaring it is the supreme of all mantras, and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:15 PM
Title: Re: Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra
Content:



Queequeg said:
For the less learned, can you explain that?

Malcolm wrote:
For Yogacārins, emptiness exists, it is strictly defined as an affirming negation; a village is empty of a city, and so on. Asanga explicitly invokes the emptiness described in the Cullasuññata sutta in a rebuke to Madhyamakas.

Queequeg said:
I've gotten around to following up on this reply.

This rebuke of Asanga is kind of a strawman, is it not? As I understand this might apply to emptiness as an analytical tool applied to dharmas, but does not apply to the so-called emptiness of emptiness.

Moreover, while the emptiness described in the sutta is sort of comparable to madhyamaka, its really describing progressive meditative practice through the four dhyanas up to insight. Its not exactly comparable to emptiness analysis.

Malcolm wrote:
Asanga is saying that emptiness, correctly understood, is like that emptiness in the Cullasuññata sutta, and the Madhyamakas go too far and negate too much.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:08 PM
Title: Re: Bhumis in context
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
How should one regard the bhumis in an applicable sense in terms of one’s own practice?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, until you are on the bhumis, they are of no relevance at all. While one is not on the bhumis, one is either on the path of accumulation or the path of application, and most of us are on the first one, the path of application.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:06 PM
Title: Re: Can I use a mala?
Content:
bodhiye said:
I haven't received Vajrayana empowerments. Can I buy and use a mala for chanting the name/recollection of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas?

Malcolm wrote:
Of course.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:05 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Well you’re aware of these varied specific terms quite well, are you not?

Could you give us a crash-course on their subtle distinctions, in laymen’s terms at least?

Malcolm wrote:
The five kośas are from the Taittīriya Upanishad.

They simply do not relate at all to anything in Buddhism.

Sādhaka said:
Perhaps also related to the Eight Consciousnesses?

Malcolm wrote:
Not even remotely.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:00 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
It's not mere details that the texts were not said by Buddha. Maybe they were blessed by Vajradhara.

Malcolm wrote:
They are the same person.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:57 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Varis said:
Based off the fact that he knew the Gāyatrī mantra we can assume that at some point in his life he studied the Vedas and therefore could speak Sanskrit.

Malcolm wrote:
In CW's defense, I know the Gayatri Mantra, and I never studied the Vedas.

However, the reason I say he knew Sanskrit is that he regular chatted with Brahmins in Sanskit, and twitted them on their arrogance toward the speech of low caste bhiḳsus, causing him to declare his teachings should be taught in local vernacular. Hence my insistence that serious sadhana practice should be done in one's own language.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:54 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Surely he could have gathered oceans of Bodhisattvas to Vulture's Peak.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, in someone's samadhi, there are no limitations to what may appear, depending on the depth of that samadhi. But there are definitely some physical limitations from the point of view of view of ordinary conventional perception. Since that is the base line for communicating with people, in general, we should confine ourselves to that and not expect people to believe in miracles.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:31 PM
Title: Re: What are texts in the Agamas that are not in the Nikayas?
Content:


Zhen Li said:
Also, going back to the character of Vajrapāṇi, he is often characterised as being a product of a Buddhification of Herakles, but I don't see this anywhere in the textual references to him.

Malcolm wrote:
In the Pali canon, a figure named Vajrapāṇi is described as a yakṣa:

Now at that time the yakkha Thunderbolt-bearer, taking his iron thunderbolt which was aglow, ablaze, on fire, came to stand above the ground over Saccaka, the son of Jains, and said: “If this Saccaka, the son of Jains, does not answer when he is asked a legitimate question up to the third time by the Lord, verily I will make his skull split into seven pieces.”

https://legacy.suttacentral.net/en/mn35

Here we see Vajrapāṇi in his early role as dharmapāla. He is not, as some people erroneously claim, a form of Indra. Indra is never a yakṣa.

There is a continuity with this identification of Vajrapāṇi in lower tantras as Guhypati, lord of secrets,  meaning lord of the Guhyakas, a class of Yakṣas who live in the north. In Kriya tantra, for example, one notes that only Vajra family deities require secrecy in their practice.

Also in the tantras, Vajrapāṇi, in his form known as Bhūtaḍāmara, is also considered the general of the dharmapālas, as he was able to successfully subdue Yakṣa Mahākāla where Hayagriva was unable to do so (which may be throwing shade on Hayagriva as an important Vedic deity, a preserver of the Vedas), in the Buddhist version of the destruction of Tripura, which resulted from an epic class struggle between the asuras and devas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 8:22 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
Because otherwise, what need is there for formal
Sadhana practice at all?  I certainly don’t need to sit on a cushion and chant a cake recipe in order to visualize what the cake should look like and to take it through its beginning, middle, and completion stage. I just have to follow the recipe.

Malcolm wrote:
As I mentioned, sadhana recitation, for beginners, is a form of shamatha.  This is how it is presented by mahasiddha Padmavajra.

Yes, it’s a recipe, which has stages, etc., as well as precise bases of purification, purifiers, and results of purification.  For serious personal practice, a beginner should seek to do the middle length or long version of a sadhana. Sadhanas are not just “how fast can I get to the mantra”. Actually, mantra recitation is a post-equipoise practice, which generally comes AFTER the two stages, though thus not universal. The various stages in a sadhana, as mentioned above, have various specific functions related to purifying traces of the past life, conception, gestation, birth, and so on. They also epitomize the attainment of buddhahood in a single lifetime, from the initial thought of awakening to nonabiding nirvana, which normally takes three uncountable eons to achieve. So, there are important reasons to both understand the words and not rely on shorter sadhanas, as well as carefully reciting the words of the text so they trigger the appropriate visualization-clearly, quickly, and with focus. Short sadhanas do not have all these features, and are just for commitment maintenance, not liberation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:49 AM
Title: Re: What are texts in the Agamas that are not in the Nikayas?
Content:


Zhen Li said:
Anyway, I think Analayo is correct that the original BDK Dīrghāgama translation is not reliable. This is just a small example. But having Theravādans who also have an "early Buddhist" revival agenda to translate Āgamas can end up distorting things too. Like I pointed out with regard to Buddhaghosa, the traditional Theravāda perspective on things is closer to Mahāyāna thinking than many of these modernists like to imagine.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s a great pity Ralpacan ordered translation of the Agamas to cease.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:40 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


Sādhaka said:
According the ‘Theosophical Septenary’, just above the Five Koshas (Five aggregates(?)), you have Buddhi (blos) and Atma. And above those Seven (after the ‘Ring Pass-not’), you have the Three Kayas.

Also, there is:

Sattva, Jnana, sems (Citta), blos (Buddhi), and yid (Manas)....

Malcolm wrote:
Who gives a flying f**k what those Victorian grifters, amateurs, and dilletantes had to say?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:38 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
How are the Five Skandhas related to the Five Koshas (if at all)?

Malcolm wrote:
They are not at all related.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:12 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
And it's not a healthy one.

Malcolm wrote:
Nonsense. Why should I believe in anything? Beliefs are crutches. However, dependent origination is not a belief. It’s what you directly experience, whether you know it or not. And dependent origination is all you can experience. And nothing can be correctly explained in absence of dependent origination. This is atheism to the core.

Nicholas2727 said:
First, thank you for your earlier reply which explained more on the athiest view of Buddhism. But aren't there some beliefs we take in Buddhism? And especially in Mahayana/Vajrayana?

Malcolm wrote:
No. Vajrayana is an understanding of a kind of profound dependent origination which also requires no belief in anything. For that matter neither does rebirth, karma, etc. All of these are automatically validated when dependent origination is properly understood. So if you want to understand all these, understand dependent origination. It’s the Buddha’s most subtle teaching, and explicating it, with varying degrees of success is whole point of Abhidharma, Yogacara, Madhyamaka, and Vajrayana.

These four should be understood in ascending order.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 11:02 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Padmist said:
So the mechanics of this aggregates. Where are they? Where are these aggregates? Are they in our mind, outside, in some metaphysical space/domain?

Malcolm wrote:
Where to begin. If you don’t know what the aggregates are, you do not understand what you are from a Buddhist point of view. At base you are mind/matter.

One of your aggregates is material, made of the five material sense organs and five material senses objects. It’s called the material aggregate.

The other four aggregates are consciousness and the mental factors.

The aggregates of mental factors are three: sensation, perception, and formations. Sensation is the mental factor of the sensations of pleasure, pain, happiness, sadness and indifference. Perception is the mental factor that coordinates discernment of one object from another. There are 51 mental factors in the aggregate of formations. That list can be sought elsewhere.

Consciousness, the knower, is the mental subject perceiving all this. That subject lacks all true identity, any identity it possesses is a mere, designated identity imputed on a false conceptual construct, I-am, which has no lore existence than an illusion. It’s present moment of cognition is nonconceptual, the handling of that immediate perception by mental factors is conceptual, both in terms of memory consciousness and speculative consciousness.

That’s it. That’s all you are. Five aggregates.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 10:41 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
And it's not a healthy one.

Malcolm wrote:
Nonsense. Why should I believe in anything? Beliefs are crutches. However, dependent origination is not a belief. It’s what you directly experience, whether you know it or not. And dependent origination is all you can experience. And nothing can be correctly explained in absence of dependent origination. This is atheism to the core.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:40 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
After all, Tibetans NEVER recited transliterated Sanskrit sadhanas. Why should we be expected to do so. It’s bullshit. Just lazy.

n8pee said:
frak thank you. This has been my belief since day one (20 years ago) and yet I still encounter dharma centers that haven't translated their texts/prayers. Why?!

PadmaVonSamba said:
In the English/ Tibetan-language sadhanas that I am familiar with, The Tibetan syllables fit the meter of the melody nicely (along with the occasional run-on line).  For me, it’s ‘read and learn about the meaning of what is being expressed in the text. Then when “singing” it, just sing it in Tibetan”
…and then, not worry about it.

Malcolm wrote:
Actually, we (not me) need to have the literary talent to compose sadhanas in English that can set to melody, etc. for group practice. This shit of westerners “reciting” “Tibetan” they can’t properly pronounce much less understand must end. This is not an issue for personal,practice, we don’t need verse for that.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:26 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
After all, Tibetans NEVER recited transliterated Sanskrit sadhanas. Why should we be expected to do so. It’s bullshit. Just lazy.

n8pee said:
frak thank you. This has been my belief since day one (20 years ago) and yet I still encounter dharma centers that haven't translated their texts/prayers. Why?!

Malcolm wrote:
Laziness plus superstition,


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 9:01 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
nightbloom said:
We are in many respects much more closely aligned with these people than we are with "atheists."

Malcolm wrote:
You may be. I am not. Not into all that derivative Platonic and Neoplatonic bullshit. It’s actually the opposite of Buddhist teachings, which are nominalist, not realist,

Your assertion above is indefensible. You should study tenet systems more carefully before spouting such nonsense.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 8:59 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Sādhaka said:
In contemporary common parlance, an atheist is an materialist who rejects out of hand any possible continuity of consciousness after physical death.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, I am a lifelong atheist who accepts rebirth and things that go bump in the night. YMMV.

You do realize the theists in India classified us as nastikas, along with carvakas, right?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 8:54 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


nightbloom said:
But you must have seen some of these Indian practices that consist almost solely of such instructions in conjunction with mantras, right? Some of them are in the scriptures themselves, and some are sadhanas generated on the basis of the scriptures (e.g, Sadhanamala).


Malcolm wrote:
I have to ask, do you have the empowerment for any sadhana? The Sadhanamala is not commonly given and actually requires training to understand how it is practiced, since it is series of sadhanas that follow a standard template


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 8:10 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:



Nicholas2727 said:
I was listening to the Wisdom Podcast and Robert Thurman as the guest and there was a small segment where he came out and said the opposite. That Buddhism is nontheistic, not atheistic since it accepts the idea of many gods. I remember this comment from awhile ago and went back to see if you or anyone could clarify since it seems you and him are saying the opposite, but both are very well studied.

Malcolm wrote:
An atheist is someone who rejects a creator god. We may accept that there are many kinds of sentient beings.

Nicholas2727 said:
: belief in the existence of a god or gods
specifically : belief in the existence of one God viewed as the creative source of the human race and the world who transcends yet is immanent in the world

Malcolm wrote:
In Buddhism, devas are just other sentient beings in samsara, no big deal.

We are atheists, as we reject utterly the idea outlined in red. To call ourselves non-theists is just a cute way to avoid plainly stating the fact that we reject the central tenet of all Abrahamic religions, and a number of Indian ones as well.

Arnoud said:
Isn’t that a very narrow definition of atheism? Most common definitions include not believing in any supernatural being. Not just a creator god.

Malcolm wrote:
Do we  actually believe in any gods, that is, take refuge in any samsaric being. I contend that is what “belief” entails in the notion that theists believe in god or gods. Strictly speaking, if Buddhist believe in “gods”, narrowly speaking, that’s makes us theists.

Funnily. Definition of a nontheist is:

: a person who does not believe that there is a god or gods : a person who is not a believer in theism


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 7:59 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
At some point, As Zong RInpoche pointed out, one can discard text and just do the visualizations, and if you can remember then, the offerings, praises and so on from memory.

treehuggingoctopus said:
Ha. I started doing it on my own, kinda spontaneously (and only with the practices I know half by heart). Loppon-la, how popular is such a view among Tibetans?

nightbloom said:
I would like clarification on this as well, because I very much prefer to do it this way.

Malcolm wrote:
You need to follow the instructions of your guru. In general, much more emphasis is placed on reciting every word (which are meant to recited) in Nyingma sadhanas, which is why they are universally in verse, from beginning to end, (including the parts not meant for recitation).


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 7:55 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


nightbloom said:
To cut to the chase, is there something specific that makes you think sanskrit sadhanas were meant to be recited...

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, reading them in the bstan 'gyur as well as commentaries on them, and the way these translations were practiced as such by early lotsawas in Tibet, for example Rinchen Zangpo and Drokmi, before Tibetans started writing their own sadhanas based in Indian material.

nightbloom said:
You could be right, but this puts us in the position of believing that Indian yogins were saying things like “On a full moon, in a lonely place, construct the mandala out of such-and-such, and say this mantra 100x while gazing at the sky” while they are actually doing these things.

Malcolm wrote:
No one recites such instructions in Tibetan sadhanas.

nightbloom said:
I know that most Tibetan sadhanas also contain a few such instructions and that these parts get read aloud, obviously, but it’s also clear that many parts are meant to be recited.

Malcolm wrote:
No, they don’t.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 7:03 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Buddha did not speak Sanskrit.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure he did. He was educated.


Crazywisdom said:
These are utterances by awesome yogis a thousand years later. We talked about this. You affirmed.they are not imposters if the information is Buddhisty.

Malcolm wrote:
Mere details. The point is that they were uttered by the Buddha or blessed by the Buddha to do so. Time doesn’t matter much here.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 5:46 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:


nightbloom said:
To cut to the chase, is there something specific that makes you think sanskrit sadhanas were meant to be recited...

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, reading them in the bstan 'gyur as well as commentaries on them, and the way these translations were practiced as such by early lotsawas in Tibet, for example Rinchen Zangpo and Drokmi, before Tibetans started writing their own sadhanas based in Indian material.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 5:45 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
]
Because of lack of secrecy to the detriment of Secret Mantra?

Malcolm wrote:
Among other things.

Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
I suppose we are in the third phase of Vajrayana now it’s global and online and in the west so to say.

I wonder how long it can survive

Are the other issues related to say poor samaya?

Malcolm wrote:
I am just not sure how sound it is to give full empowerments over the web. There are some problems with this, and no agreement about what is correct and not correct. But it really cannot be the case that it is "whatever my lama says is correct."

Meaning empowerments are a different story, there are good and sound reasonings to think these are fine over the web. Even so, being in the same space as the teacher is better, in my opinion.

More importantly, I think that the online empowerment thing makes the whole thing a bit cheap. Then there is the issue of some teachers indiscriminately streaming live teachings to facebook with absolutely no restrictions on who can see them, and so on. There are a whole lot of issues with so called Facebook Dharma Teachings.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 5:05 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
]
Because of lack of secrecy to the detriment of Secret Mantra?

Malcolm wrote:
Among other things.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 4:55 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:



Konchog Thogme Jampa said:
On the flip side the technology we have has opened up doors for Vajrayana practice via online teachings and empowerment’s which hitherto wasn’t possible in India and Tibet.

Malcolm wrote:
That may not be a good thing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 4:53 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



nightbloom said:
Can you explain why you think Indian sadhakas recited their sadhanas word for word? Given the way some of these are written, ("Do this, visualize that, if you do not have X and you can substitute Y,") without any metrical structure or anything, this seems doubtful to me. Tibetan sadhanas seem a little different.

Malcolm wrote:
Just how many Indian Sadhanas have you actually consulted?

nightbloom said:
Enough to generalize. I'm thinking of visualizations described at some length in the Vairocana Tantra, and a few of the less cryptic Yoginitantras and others from equivalent classes. It's also been a while, but I think many of the visualizations described in the Sadhanamala lack meter.

Malcolm wrote:
Why do you think meter is imporatant in a sadhana? Many are just in prose.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 3:40 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
That’s a false impression.

nightbloom said:
Can you explain why you think Indian sadhakas recited their sadhanas word for word? Given the way some of these are written, ("Do this, visualize that, if you do not have X and you can substitute Y,") without any metrical structure or anything, this seems doubtful to me. Tibetan sadhanas seem a little different.

Malcolm wrote:
Just how many Indian Sadhanas have you actually consulted? I've looked at very many (in Tibetan translation).


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 2:52 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
But one should also be able to recite a text and have it automatically trigger the required visualizations.

dharmafootsteps said:
Any tips for getting to that point? Or is it just a case of doing it enough?

Malcolm wrote:
Practice makes perfect.

At some point, As Zong RInpoche pointed out, one can discard text and just do the visualizations, and if you can remember then, the offerings, praises and so on from memory.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 2:31 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:



zerwe said:
The approach based on H.E. Zong Rinpoche's advice all depends upon our own capacity, understanding, etc... but, he highlighted that at a certain point reciting words may become a hindrance to our concentration and deepening of our experience of the Yidam. Level 1, we recite everything. Level 2, the we understand enough to be able to recite everything and engage in the practice with enhanced concentration. Level 3 is where with sufficient experience and understanding "certain elements are automatically performed and experienced rather than recited."

Maybe someone else would care to verify or expand upon this, but it seems to make sense from a practice point of view.

Shaun

Malcolm wrote:
Sadhanas are written for beginners, the longer ones are for the least experienced. But one should also be able to recite a text and have it automatically trigger the required visualizations.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 2:27 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Well they say Tibetan has blessings. Can be. What is so special about a Sanskrit syllable then?

Malcolm wrote:
Mantras and dharāṇis are the utterances of the Buddha, uttered for a specific purpose, connected with a path.

As to Tibetan language itself carrying blessings, no, I don't buy that it is any more special than any other language, nor do I buy that Sanskrit is somehow a special language either. If it were, then why are we not all reciting the Gayatri, and so on? The Buddha rejected śruti, and so should we.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 1:54 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Nadereme said:
Some of you are turning into soccer moms. Yes there are always risks with social media but it’s foolish to think just making it go away will solve stuff.

Malcolm wrote:
We don't want to just make it go away, we want to break it up and drown it in a bathtub.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 1:53 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Therefore study the English subtitles of the text to get to understand the meaning, and also learn how to pronounce the Tibetan or Sanskrit.

Would be better than reciting it in English, IMO.

Malcolm wrote:
No, not for most people and certainly not a sadhana of any significant length.

After all, Tibetans NEVER recited transliterated Sanskrit sadhanas. Why should we be expected to do so. It’s bullshit. Just lazy.

Chenda said:
I've been told by some peers that dharanis should be recited in whichever language they were revealed, specifically the Seven Line Prayer which I used to recite in Sanskrit (as translated by DH Narayana Prasad Rijal) but now opted to memorize the Tibetan just because I'm under the impression that it is the proper way to do it.

Malcolm wrote:
If one can memorize short supplications in Tibetan or Sanskrit, this is excellent. Try reciting a 60 folio sadhana in transliteration...ughhhh.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 1:51 AM
Title: Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Another common misperception is that Buddhism is "nontheistic" as opposed to atheistic.

Nicholas2727 said:
I was listening to the Wisdom Podcast and Robert Thurman as the guest and there was a small segment where he came out and said the opposite. That Buddhism is nontheistic, not atheistic since it accepts the idea of many gods. I remember this comment from awhile ago and went back to see if you or anyone could clarify since it seems you and him are saying the opposite, but both are very well studied.

Malcolm wrote:
An atheist is someone who rejects a creator god. We may accept that there are many kinds of sentient beings.

Nicholas2727 said:
: belief in the existence of a god or gods
specifically : belief in the existence of one God viewed as the creative source of the human race and the world who transcends yet is immanent in the world

Malcolm wrote:
In Buddhism, devas are just other sentient beings in samsara, no big deal.

We are atheists, as we reject utterly the idea outlined in red. To call ourselves non-theists is just a cute way to avoid plainly stating the fact that we reject the central tenet of all Abrahamic religions, and a number of Indian ones as well.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 1:45 AM
Title: Re: Description of Akanishta
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yes, there is an extensive literature on the subjecting Tibetan sources.

Seeker12 said:
Are there any English translations available that you know of? Thank you.

Malcolm wrote:
Myriad worlds is one place you can look.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 1:45 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


PeterC said:
I don't really see the DC choosing leaders who happen to be rapists with drug problems, so the odds of that are low.

Malcolm wrote:
That's not the "off the rails" I was referring to. I was referring some strange new interpretations of Dzogchen that are percolating up.

PeterC said:
The risk with the DC is of inability to move on leading it to becoming a retirement home for an increasingly small number of practitioners.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, I was at the Tsegyalgar third memorial ganapuja last night. I was among the youngest there, and I am 59.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 12:54 AM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Therefore study the English subtitles of the text to get to understand the meaning, and also learn how to pronounce the Tibetan or Sanskrit.

Would be better than reciting it in English, IMO.

Malcolm wrote:
No, not for most people and certainly not a sadhana of any significant length.

After all, Tibetans NEVER recited transliterated Sanskrit sadhanas. Why should we be expected to do so. It’s bullshit. Just lazy.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 12:14 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
frankie said:
I am not one who is convinced of everything in sutras, commentaries or from teachers.  My preference is to compare and contrast, both with myself, experience, and also that of others. Ask questions, consider other viewpoints, and not get too sucked into stuff that smells cultish, overly prescriptive and doctrinaire, without full recourse and allowance for honest, open query and questioning.

PeterC said:
Have fun with your DIY dharma

Malcolm wrote:
But Peter, this person worked in BUDDHIST PUBLISHING. I guess this means something. What, I am not sure, but it means they read some BUDDHIST BOOKS. All in all, just another anonymous person on the internet with a boatload of opinions for which they never need take responsibility.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 29th, 2021 at 12:06 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


frankie said:
I am not one who is convinced of everything in sutras, commentaries or from teachers.

Malcolm wrote:
This is the Vajrayāna forum, and so, Vajrayāna rules.



frankie said:
Please take notice of the various sub-fora on the front page and further sub-fora within sub-fora. As a general matter, discussions in sub-fora should relate to their designated subjects. For instance, Tibetan Buddhism should be discussed in the Tibetan Buddhism sub-forum, and East Asian Buddhism should be discussed in the East Asian Buddhism sub-forum. Similarly, in further specialized sub-fora, discussions should be limited to the relevant subject.

Please take further notice that it is not appropriate to question or critique teachings and practices of traditions in sub-forums dedicated to those particular traditions. For example, do not challenge the core Dharma concepts and principles of Pure Land Buddhism in the Pure Land sub-fora.

Questioning and debating the teachings and traditional interpretations of general or specific Buddhist traditions is permitted in the Open Dharma sub-forum only. However, such discourse must be conducted sensitively and reasonably argued and grounded. Unfounded or arbitrary critiques will be subject to moderation.


Malcolm wrote:
That is how things work at DW. If you want to take umbrage at statements in the tantras that assert that only Vajrayāna is an effective vehicle for liberation in this age, that's fine (but do so in another forum, like Open Dharma), but I am not at all clear you understand why such teachings are found in said classes of literature. It isn't mere puffery, as you suggested above. Your critique fails the test of arbitrariness, since you admit above it is all just based on your personal opinion. So even the Open Dharma forum, it might not fly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 11:50 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
tony_montana said:
Is there supposed to be benefit in reciting the sadhana texts themselves, as if they had mantric potency in and of themselves (like stotras)?

and if so, is it therefore preferable to read the sadhanas in Tibetan so as to derive the full mantric benefits or is reading the english (or some other language) translation the same?

Malcolm wrote:
Reciting the text has the function of engaging the lower levels of the nine stages of śamatha, which are perfected when focusing in the deities attributes. This how it is explained by Padmavajra.

There is virtually no benefit in reciting a text in a language one does not understand and cannot pronounce correctly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 11:04 PM
Title: Re: Ice is melting on the North Pole
Content:


Aemilius said:
There is some suspicion around concerning the possible cause for there not being  googlemap pictures or webcame pictures available from the North Pole, when googplemap images are easily found of Antartica. Are they hiding something from us? What?

Malcolm wrote:
No one is hiding anything:


https://climate.nasa.gov/images-of-change

There are just more interesting satellite photos to see than the north pole.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 10:07 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


MiphamFan said:
I remember that ChNN said that he suggested back in the pre-cultural revolution days that monasteries should start contributing to the labour economy before the communists came, so they could adapt to the modern world. They accused him of being a communist and ignored his suggestions.

Malcolm wrote:
At one time, ChNN’s politics were very left wing. Just look at the number of radical leftists among his early group of students, it might not be an accident that Merigar was sited in Tuscany, which is a very heavily socialist region of Italy, where Communist parties are weekend events, seen regularly in Castel Del Piano, etc.

heart said:
I used to live in Italy in the early 80's and Monte Amiata where Merigar is was a region that had many abandoned farms. People felt that picking olives was too difficult and moved to the cities. So buying a place was quite cheap. When it comes to politics often it seemed that half the people where communists and the other half fascist so dinner could become quite heated.

Still I love Italy.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, that’s completely true.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 10:02 PM
Title: Re: Rigpa Shedra East
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
Anyone have experience studying at Rigpa Shedra East, and would be happy to share their experience of it?

Malcolm wrote:
Khenchen Namdrol is one of the most qualified teachers alive today. I am quite sure that the people up under his direction are qualified to teach what they been assigned to teach.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 9:35 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


dharmafootsteps said:
That’s interesting I didn’t realise that. I was surprised to find the prevalence of right wing views among community members these days.

Malcolm wrote:
That’s more of Eastern European trend, post-Stalinism, combined with Western European anti-Muslim sentiments, which have been prevalent in the DC since the second Iraq war. In general, US DC people are bleeding heart liberals.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 8:52 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


MiphamFan said:
I remember that ChNN said that he suggested back in the pre-cultural revolution days that monasteries should start contributing to the labour economy before the communists came, so they could adapt to the modern world. They accused him of being a communist and ignored his suggestions.

Malcolm wrote:
At one time, ChNN’s politics were very left wing. Just look at the number of radical leftists among his early group of students, it might not be an accident that Merigar was sited in Tuscany, which is a very heavily socialist region of Italy, where Communist parties are weekend events, seen regularly in Castel Del Piano, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 8:42 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Do I have to justify Vajrayana teachings in the Vajrayana forum? Seriously? If people want to find out why this is true, they can become Vajrayana Buddhists, otherwise they can piss off.

Lingpupa said:
Yes, you do, for as long thinking people are still allowed into the forum. If questioning is not allowed, the forum should be made closed or secret.

Malcolm wrote:
So you are suggesting an overall change to DW forum rules, I take it. The previous posts were not “questioning,” they were assertions that core statements made by the Buddha in the tantras must be false. Hence my response that debate on the point would not be possible, since there is no common basis for a debate on the issue.

Lingpupa said:
And if your "piss off" was directed at me, then all I can say is "piss off yourself". Otherwise I'll just take it as a rhetorical comment directed at straw men.

Malcolm wrote:
It was directed at those who are not Vajrayana Buddhists who have opinions about it based on nothing more than their opinions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 8:38 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



frankie said:
Think of it as Buddhist advertising.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s not merely advertisement. Or do you think that when the Buddha asserted there was no awakening outside his dharma and vinaya, he was just shilling for business?

frankie said:
Ouch...pulling the boss on me!  No, but if he did say exactly that without further exegesis, discussion, room for movement or dispensation, then... I contend that it's horseshit.  With all due love and respect.

Malcolm wrote:
He asserted that outside his dharma and discipline there were no stream entrants, once-returners, never-returners, and arhats,  and that the doctrines of other teachers were devoid of such persons, that is, awakened persons.

He stated this in more than one sutra.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 7:22 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


Lingpupa said:
did the retreats, etc.,

More theoretically, Malcolm also said: my statement is standard fare in our tradition.
The fact that it is standard fare is clearly true, but it is hardly a justification. It would be rather like saying, "that's my groupthink, so it's true."

frankie said:
Think of it as Buddhist advertising.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s not merely advertisement. Or do you think that when the Buddha asserted there was no awakening outside his dharma and vinaya, he was just shilling for business?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 7:19 PM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Kim O'Hara said:
You might like to read this and compare it with what you're seeing at home.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/01/setting-the-record-straight-on-climate-change-and-arson-in-australias-bushfires/

Malcolm wrote:
Yeah, no. The women in question has an arson record. The prof? We’ll see what the verdict is.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 7:14 PM
Title: Re: When did "recitation" of Sadhanas become the norm?
Content:
nightbloom said:
My impression of tantric practice in India is that sadhanas were not usually recited - or at least, that they were not written with the explicit intent that the sadhaka recite them (with the exception of mantras within them, and so on). Does anyone have a sense of when and why this changed in Tibet? I am relatively new to practice, but it seems to be the norm that the practitioner is expected to *read* the sadhana line by line while simultaneously engaging in visualizations, rather than treat the text itself simply as a set of instructions.

Malcolm wrote:
That’s a false impression.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 7:11 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Lingpupa said:
I have doubts about a couple of things Malcolm has said, one factual and one more theoretical. Regarding Sogyal, he said that he:
did the retreats, etc.,
A close analysis of his known history, and his own claims about himself, strongly suggests not only that there was no time in his early life during which he could have undertaken more than light studies of the dharma, and there is no question of there being any years during which he could have undertaken a longer retreat (such as a three-year retreat). As far as I know, he didn't in any case claim to have done such a retreat, but if I'm wrong it would be interesting to know what exactly were the years in which this was supposed to have happened. He had a good English education, the gift of the gab, a pushy mother and a thirst for admiration. Poor lad!

Malcolm wrote:
Sogyal himself made no pretense towards being a ritual lama or of having done large amounts of retreat, though he did do long retreats, for example, a year long Kilaya retreat, etc in the 1990’s. He generally had other lamas give empowerments to,his students. CTR on the other hand definitely did retreats when he was quite young and in fact gave the entire Rinchen Terzod in Tibet while still a teenager. Many lamas in the Gelug and Sakya school never do three year retreats. It’s not a requirement.

More theoretically, Malcolm also said: my statement is standard fare in our tradition.

Lingpupa said:
The fact that it is standard fare is clearly true,

Malcolm wrote:
Do I have to justify Vajrayana teachings in the Vajrayana forum? Seriously? If people want to find out why this is true, they can become Vajrayana Buddhists, otherwise they can piss off.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 10:32 AM
Title: Re: Description of Akanishta
Content:
Seeker12 said:
I’m aware there are different ways to understand the term Akanishta, but I’m curious if in any of the ways, there are descriptions of a pure land similar to how there are extensive descriptions of Sukhavati. That is, descriptions with characteristics of a certain type.

Are there any sources that discuss this?

Thank you.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, there is an extensive literature on the subjecting Tibetan sources.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 8:01 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
frankie said:
Otherwise, it is pretty narrow-minded and quite dangerously misleading.

Malcolm wrote:
Care to debate the point? The problem with that is that we don’t have a common basis to debate this because you won’t accept the authorities I will cite (the tantras). Therefore you won’t accept the reasonings. But you also can’t refute my position through reasoning for a number of reasons, not least of which there is no authentic Mahayana sutra that teaches a method for a beginner to realize  buddhahood in one lifetime.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 8:00 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



Padmist said:
That the West doesn't deserve Vajrayana

Malcolm wrote:
Of course we do. It’s the only thing that works in the Kali Yuga.

Constructelf said:
So you're saying that Theravadins, Zen practitioners, Pure Landers, and other non-Vajrayana Buddhists are deluded and wasting their time following impotent Dharma? Because without qualification or clarification, it does seem like that's what you're saying.

Malcolm wrote:
No dharma is a waste of time. But some are more relevant than others in this time. We are in the Tibetan Buddhist forum, here, and my statement is standard fare in our tradition.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 4:56 AM
Title: Re: Tenerife center
Content:
Toenail said:
Is it worth a visit? I'm in the south of tenerife right now for holidays.

Malcolm wrote:
Of course.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 4:55 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Karma Dorje said:
Everyone who received the transmission from the Master, practices according to instructions, and achieves the signs of practice can then transmit the practice to others. Organizations don't own the transmission. At best they can set certain standards for who can teach and how the teachers conduct themselves in public.

The real question is who one trusts. Putting trust in organizations to perform due diligence seems perilous out of the gate. If one has already received transmission from ChNNR and understood the central point clearly, one can trust in that.  All that is left is practicing with confidence.

If we want Rinpoche's terma to prosper, it's on each of us to practice with the same enthusiasm we clutch our pearls at each new imagined outrage. We must ourselves become trustworthy guides. All the rest is simply musical chairs.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 4:54 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
tobes said:
The question is: what can we learn from all of these examples?

I'm increasingly coming to the view that lo-fi/ minimal institution is the best way forward. Lama Lena style.

Padmist said:
That the West doesn't deserve Vajrayana

Malcolm wrote:
Of course we do. It’s the only thing that works in the Kali Yuga.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 4:52 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Kurp said:
Maybe Rinpoche saw how the community couldn’t collaborate well and he was okay with things dying out over time.

Malcolm wrote:
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.

Kurp said:
Speaking of My Reincarnation, Malcolm, is this you in the background?:


Malcolm wrote:
Yup


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 12:43 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
(...) semi-Buddhist mystics with wrongs views like Sanggye Kargyal, etc., etc.

Harimoo said:
Acharya,

who is this guy ?

Malcolm wrote:
https://www.jstor.org/stable/43391257?refreqid=excelsior%3A0b3c277f21a64eb223999ffa85bf0a8a


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 12:18 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
So did Sogyal and a lot of other flawed teachers.

Harimoo said:
Hi,

This sentence made me ask myself 2 questions :
-How can we assume that there is no flawed teacher in any given lineage ?

Malcolm wrote:
We can't. In this kali yuga, all teachers are flawed. The goal is to choose teachers with least amount of flaws.

Harimoo said:
-Do flawed lineage always dissapear by their own ?

Malcolm wrote:
The lineage is ultimately more important than the individual teacher, as long as the rules are followed and empowerments are transmitted properly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 28th, 2021 at 12:17 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Nemo said:
I think hierarchy is an add on.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, of course it is. This is Tibetan culture we are dealing with here, not Dharma. At least as far as tantras go, there is no mention of tulku recognitions, etc. This is a 12th century Tibetan innovation.

The point of the tantras is that everyone is initiated to the level of a cakravartin. Everyone is the sovereign of their own mandala.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 11:38 PM
Title: Re: Converting to dzogchen?…
Content:


Johnny Dangerous said:
I would … not take that person as an authority, providing they were even serious.

Kurp said:
They were quite serious by the context of the email. As a matter of fact, she bragged how she was able to convert more than one person. She almost made it sound like a competition; as if she was doing well and the other person receiving the email was far behind in their efforts to convert more, too.

Malcolm wrote:
Whoever she was, she is an egotistical idiot.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 11:37 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Padmist said:
How is it that some Buddhists think that the reborn person would know some details of his or her past?

Malcolm wrote:
It's a continuum. The way one remembers past lives is that in a state of samadhi, one recalls events in reverse. Recollection of past lives is an abhijñā, not special to Buddhism. But it does depend on development of samadhi. For example, when you recall what happened to you 15 years ago, there is no actual presence of any of the events of 15 years ago. They all do not exist. You cannot say they are in your mind, nor can you deny your memory of them. Nor can you claim there is some entity that stayed in your mind which allows you to recall them. But you still recall some events from 15 years ago.

The same applies to past lives. The aggregates are serially connected, so there is some relationship with your past lives. Just the same, they do not exist now, and your ability to access those memories depends on your skill in samadhi, just as your abillity to recall past events in this life depends on your present mental clarity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 10:31 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
I agree that one should try to see their teacher as something special - up to the point where the evidence of the their eyes tells them something different. The problem is people did speak out but were sidelined and ignored.

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, for a whole host of reasons.

Knotty Veneer said:
A lot of people refused to accept the evidence of their eyes and their own common sense where Trungpa's and Sogyal's  and Osel Mukpo's conduct was concerned.

Malcolm wrote:
And now we have the wait and see whether the paternity test for Karmapa OTD proves to be positive or not, should there be one. How many Karma Kagyus will refuse to accept the results if they are positive? And if there isn't one, because that case in Canada is settled out of court, how many Karma Kagyus will insist that the settlement does not prove anything? How can a lineage accept a person accused of rape as a lineage head, as long as there is any doubt as to their innocence or guilt?

This story has huge implications for Tibetan Buddhism, no matter which way it turns out.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 10:21 PM
Title: Re: Converting to dzogchen?…
Content:
Kurp said:
I was thinking of this earlier and thought I’d ask here what it means, since I am unable to ask the original source.

I once read an email where a dzogchen practitioner said, “I’ve converted another one.”

What does that even mean? I’m assuming she was referring to dzogchen, and was implying that she converted a person to… dzogchen??  If that is what she meant, then how does one “convert” someone to dzogchen?

Malcolm wrote:
You can't convert anyone to anything. Either people have the good fortune to meet Dzogchen teachings or they don't. It's a karmic thing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 9:34 PM
Title: Re: using Ashwagandha as incense?
Content:
Toenail said:
I'm on holiday in Tenerife and I bought some Ashwagandha powder for a friend. In case he doesn't like the taste, could it be used as incense? He uses powdery incense on charcoal. Is Ashwagandha aslo burned in traditional use?

Malcolm wrote:
No. not that I am aware.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 9:33 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
Sogyal did not have much in the way of retreat or study experience but he was very well connected and had the gift of the gab. The title did most of the work for him. And his students wanted to believe he was something special.

Malcolm wrote:
Which is important for them, and proper in every respect. The same goes for the students of Trungpa. Despite whatever misgivings I have about both of these teacher's conduct, they knew the rules, did the retreats, etc., even if they may have used the "unconventional behavior" card too much to excuse what was, frankly, gross misbehavior, some of it completely abusive by modern standards.

Knotty Veneer said:
For TBists, until we can learn to identify teachers by the quality of their actions and not just rely on the titles and the praises of their friends and students, we will see more Osel Mukpo's and Sogyal Lakars.

Malcolm wrote:
We will see more of them anyway. As you point out, the history of Indo-Tibetan Buddhism is full of characters whose behavior is quite appalling. It is not like there is going to be a Church of Reformed Tibetan Buddhism, though the Ngorpas and the Gelugpas also tried. Tibetan history is full of warlord gurus like Lama Zhang, sorcerers like Rwa Lotsawa and Milarepa, libertines like Drukpa Kunlay and more recently, Reting Rinpoche, semi-Buddhist mystics with wrongs views like Sanggye Kargyal, etc., etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 9:22 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
I think the point is, there’s not some kind of unbroken entity that moves from one moment to the next, or one lifetime to the next.

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, there is no entity.

PadmaVonSamba said:
But rather, what happens here and now triggers the arising of what will happen there and then.
It becomes the cause of something specific to occur later.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 8:13 PM
Title: Re: Love & Compassion for Bodhisattvas?
Content:
SilenceMonkey said:
. It’s emotion and energy that can be felt by the people involved.

Malcolm wrote:
Buddhist Compassion is not an emotion.

SilenceMonkey said:
It’s not a klesha, but sure it’s an emotion. And others will feel your compassion in their emotions. Same goes for lovingness and kindness བྱམས་པ་ and love བརྩེ་བ་.

In fact, compassion is often described as a sadness when thinking about the suffering of others.

Malcolm wrote:
Compassion (karuna) is the wish that others be free from suffering and the causes of that suffering. That’s all it needs to be. It’s not an emotion. It’s not a mental factor. It’s not an affliction, though in ordinary people, it is afflicted, since it is generally partial. But what it is not is sentimental, since it must be accompanied by equanimity. Buddhist compassion is utterly different than the maudlin sentimentality which passes for compassion among Christians. Buddhist compassion, ultimately, is focused more on the causes of suffering, than the suffering itself, which is a ripened result of karma, and about which not much can be done in many cases.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 8:05 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Wisdom is always needed. If you can't arrive at emptiness through Madhyamaka you have to find an other way.
Madhyamaka is an intellectual construct. What’s needed is the experience of mind’s true nature, which is not an intellectual construct. And there’s a handful of ways to do that. Not all of them utilize discernment.

Malcolm wrote:
No, it is a deconstruction of Buddhist intellectualism, which is why yogacarins and gzhan stong pas dislike it so much. That’s why without proper understanding of Madhyamaka, people reify their experience of the nature of mind into something which is either existent (yogacara/gzhan stong) or nonexistent (gelug). It is for this reason Atisha declared that one must rely on Candrakirti for liberation. An experience of the nature of the mind is not enough for liberation.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 9:39 AM
Title: Re: Thinking about the 7th Root Downfall
Content:
SilenceMonkey said:
. It’s emotion and energy that can be felt by the people involved.

Malcolm wrote:
Buddhist Compassion is not an emotion.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 9:05 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


SilenceMonkey said:
That’s fair. It’s also fair to question whether he was leading people in the direction of enlightenment. Personally, I think he did.

Malcolm wrote:
Maybe. So did Sogyal and a lot of other flawed teachers. And like Sogyal, he alienated a lot of people from the path.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 8:48 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
To me Nagarjuna’s Madhyamaka is provisional.

Malcolm wrote:
That’s because you don’t   Yunderstand it. But you can’t find any fault with it. So you just pout.I’ll

Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Tetralemma, non—affirming negation, yeah I get it. It just doesn’t resonate with me.

Malcolm wrote:
No, you don’t get it at all. If you did, you wouldn’t say such silly things like the above. As I said, you’re just pouting because you can’t actually find fault with Madhyamaka, but it is frightening to,you, because it hits you where you live.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 8:45 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
I don’t think there are many of them left in Shambala.

heart said:
I think you are right, most of them I know had issues with Trungpa jr. long before the current situation.

/magnus

SilenceMonkey said:
I went to an event at a shambhala center last weekend. There were a couple people there who had a palpable spiritual quality, old students of Chogyam Trungpa. But for the most part it seemed the culture was pretty worldly... just my impression (and judgement). I think it’s hard to practice authentically as a Dharma community without the guidance of an enlightened master.

Malcolm wrote:
It’s very totally open to question whether CTR was an “enlightened master.” He got away with far more than Sogyal ever did.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 8:41 AM
Title: Re: Thinking about the 7th Root Downfall
Content:



SilenceMonkey said:
That’s just your opinion.

Anyway, if we’re talking about happiness... your saying there’s no happiness in samsara kind of invalidates the question of whether people are happy or not in the first place. If it doesn’t matter whether people are happy, why make it a subject of debate?

Malcolm wrote:
It matters that people mistake happiness for suffering, pleasure for pain, and so on. Buddhist compassion is not performative. Its free from reference.

SilenceMonkey said:
Yes, our teachings of compassion are incredible. Whether  we have that kind of compassion in our hearts is another question...

Malcolm wrote:
Compassion is simply the wish that someone be free from suffering and it’s causes. That’s it. Nothing more, nothing less. Buddhist compassion has nothing to do with performative sentimentality, etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 7:56 AM
Title: Re: Love & Compassion for Bodhisattvas?
Content:



SilenceMonkey said:
Sure. But we're talking about happiness and love in our hearts, here and now.

Malcolm wrote:
Christian’s compassion is largely performative and not sincere.

SilenceMonkey said:
That’s just your opinion.

Anyway, if we’re talking about happiness... your saying there’s no happiness in samsara kind of invalidates the question of whether people are happy or not in the first place. If it doesn’t matter whether people are happy, why make it a subject of debate?

Malcolm wrote:
It matters that people mistake happiness for suffering, pleasure for pain, and so on. Buddhist compassion is not performative. Its free from reference.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 7:13 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
To me Nagarjuna’s Madhyamaka is provisional.

Malcolm wrote:
That’s because you don’t understand it. But you can’t find any fault with it. So you just pout.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 5:14 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
heart said:
Over the years I met many of Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche's student and they have been utterly serious about their practice. That is worthy of respect in my book.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t think there are many of them left in Shambala.

heart said:
I think you are right, most of them I know had issues with Trungpa jr. long before the current situation.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
Anyway, they seem to have badly gone off the rails. It no longer resembles the organization Trungpa left behind, warts and all. I have concerns that the Dzogchen Community will also go this way.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 4:50 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
But the ones and zeros of my post is not restricted to my own computer either.

Malcolm wrote:
The term used in the text is "dngos po," which means thing, existent, entity, etc.
Basically, the yogacarins assert a carrier medium, the alaya. This is rejected by Madhyamaka.
'nuff said.
The Madhyamakas reject is an unnecessary appendage, since all consciousnesses are just the aggregate of consciousness which is give different names when performing different functions. The reason it is rejected by Madhyamakas is that the yogacarins define the ālaya as a consciousness that engages in no processes of perception. Nāgārjuna II, in the Bodhicittavivarana equates the yogacāra theory with a magnet that just blinding attracts iron fillings. Jayānanda, in his commentary on Candra's Intro to the Middle Way has a novel take on ālayavijñāna that I have mentioned before. He states that the actual ālaya, the storehouse, if you will, is emptiness, and the vijñāna is what perceives it, hence the term ālayavijñāna properly understood, would mean "the consciousness that apprehends emptiness." This is very close to the meaning of mahāmudra and dzogchen when they talk of the dhātu and jñāna/vidya being inseparable.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 3:47 AM
Title: Re: Ice is melting on the North Pole
Content:
Tlalok said:
I can't wait to see what the later 21st century is going to be like!

Malcolm wrote:
One notes that that last year photos are available is 2015.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 3:30 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Virgo said:
Malcolm is a boomer.


Malcolm wrote:
Barely. I am between generations, !962. To young to be a boomer, to old to be a Gen Xer. You can consider me a member of the Blank Generation:

I was sayin let me out of here before I was 
even born--it's such a gamble when you get a face 
It's fascinatin to observe what the mirror does 
but when I dine it's for the wall that I set a place 
I belong to the blank generation and 
I can take it or leave it each time 
I belong to the ______ generation but 
I can take it or leave it each time 
Triangles were fallin at the window as the doctor cursed 
He was a cartoon long forsaken by the public eye 
The nurse adjusted her garters as I breathed my first 
The doctor grabbed my throat and yelled, "God's consolation prize!" 
I belong to the blank generation and 
I can take it or leave it each time 
I belong to the ______ generation but 
I can take it or leave it each time 
To hold the t.v. to my lips, the air so packed with cash 
then carry it up flights of stairs and drop it in the vacant lot 
To lose my train of thought and fall into your arms' tracks 
and watch beneath the eyelids every passing dot 
I belong to the blank generation and 
I can take it or leave it each time 
I belong to the ______ generation but 
I can take it or leave it each time 
I belong to the blank generation and 
I can take it or leave it each time 
I belong to the ______ generation but 
I can take it or leave it each time
--Richard Hell, circa 1975.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 1:43 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
PeterC said:
There were other vajrayana teachers in the west before and at the same time as Mukpo, it’s not like he was the only game in town.

Malcolm wrote:
No, but he was the only person who had a publisher/book store owner as one of his students. CTR's relationship with Sam Bercholz, more than any other single factor, was responsible for his swift rise and success in opening Dharma centers throughout North America. He founded Vajradhātu in 1973, the same year his first major book came out, Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism. Indeed, it was among the first books on Buddhism I ever read, along with  Myth of Freedom, Three Pillars of Zen, Zen Mind Beginners Mind, Zen Bones, Zen Flesh, etc. in 1978. By the time I went to work in bookstore owned by member of Vajradhātu, Trident Books in Boston, in 1987. The Regent scandal was in the making, since Trungpa had died earlier that year. I never did join the local Dharmadhātu. I did do a couple of Shambhala levels, but found the teachers that I encountered in that program extremely unimpressive and pompous. There were also clear problems with rampant sexual harassment of new female students and wide-spread alcoholism in that sangha. But this seems to be a problem in every large sangha that I can think of.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 27th, 2021 at 1:42 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Nothing transfers from this moment to the next moment, but the aggregates are serially connected, all the down.

PadmaVonSamba said:
Can you talk more about this here “serially connected” business?  What does that mean?

Malcolm wrote:
It means that the aggregates are a continuous steam of momentary events, the preceding moment being the cause of the next, hence they are serially connected. This is stated quite clearly by Nāgārjuna in the Verses on Dependent Origination. He writes:

6)	Although the aggregates are serially connected,
the wise are to comprehend nothing has transfers.

Therein, the aggregates are the aggregates of matter, sensation, perception, formations, and consciousness. Those, called ‘serially joined’, not having ceased, produce another produced from that cause; although not even the subtle atom of an existent has transmigrated from this world to the next.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 11:57 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
heart said:
Over the years I met many of Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche's student and they have been utterly serious about their practice. That is worthy of respect in my book.

/magnus

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t think there are many of them left in Shambala.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 10:57 PM
Title: Re: Love & Compassion for Bodhisattvas?
Content:



SilenceMonkey said:
I think the compassion he was talking about is the amount of love we have, not talking about the vows we take. People may take a bodhicitta vow but have little to no love in their heart.

Anyway, I think the teaching the teacher was giving was addressing the difficulty chinese (taiwanese) people have with expressing love and emotion.

Malcolm wrote:
Even when one takes the bodhisattva vow under false pretenses , it results in buddhahood, as the episode with Mara taking the bodhisattva vow in the (authentic) Surangama Samadhi sutra shows. So, I don’t buy it at all.

SilenceMonkey said:
Sure. But we're talking about happiness and love in our hearts, here and now.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no happiness in samsara. Christian’s compassion is largely performative and not sincere.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 10:51 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
What do you mean by “primordial awareness?” It’s not at all clear. Ye shes?

undefineable said:
I meant the quality of being aware - "before" (-behind which-) it becomes awareness/consciousness of some particular thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Doesn’t exist. Even the word does not permit it. Consciousness is always with objects.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:20 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
undefineable said:
https://www.britannica.com/topic/alaya-vijnana

It seems the alaya is also subject to change... {"it's turtles all the way down" if we're not careful I guess[?]}

All this begs the question (given that impression Buddhist doctrine can give of asserting a timeless backdrop to object-consciousness) of where the Buddhist picture of 'primordial awareness' fit into the picture. Skandhas purified of Self-concept perhaps?

Malcolm wrote:
What do you mean by “primordial awareness?” It’s not at all clear. Ye shes?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:18 PM
Title: Re: Love & Compassion for Bodhisattvas?
Content:
SilenceMonkey said:
Although we take vows of bodhisattvas, he observed that Christians often have more love and compassion. Sweeping statement, I know... but it left a lot of us thinking.

Malcolm wrote:
Also false.

SilenceMonkey said:
I think the compassion he was talking about is the amount of love we have, not talking about the vows we take. People may take a bodhicitta vow but have little to no love in their heart.

Anyway, I think the teaching the teacher was giving was addressing the difficulty chinese (taiwanese) people have with expressing love and emotion.

Malcolm wrote:
Even when one takes the bodhisattva vow under false pretenses , it results in buddhahood, as the episode with Mara taking the bodhisattva vow in the (authentic) Surangama Samadhi sutra shows. So, I don’t buy it at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:00 PM
Title: Re: Love & Compassion for Bodhisattvas?
Content:
SilenceMonkey said:
Although we take vows of bodhisattvas, he observed that Christians often have more love and compassion. Sweeping statement, I know... but it left a lot of us thinking.

Malcolm wrote:
Also false.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:58 PM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
This is also one of the reasons why in khumbhaka, one wants to be able retain the hold for at least 2.6 minutes ( if there are 21600 respiratory cycles in a 24 hour period, we breath once every five seconds). If one times it all correctly, with time of day, which nostril, etc. it is possible to breath only jñānavāyus. But don't try this without parental supervision.

Arnoud said:
When you were studying with Ramaswami did he say anything about the length of time of Kumbhaka?

Malcolm wrote:
Overall, no. But in his system, he emphasized antarakhumbhaka, holding out, while mentally reciting the gayatri mantra.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:08 PM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Kim O'Hara said:
. I reckon boomers' kids - even in the affluent countries - are going to have a pretty tough time through the second half of their lives.

Malcolm wrote:
Hence my mention of grandchildren.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:01 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
cky said:
Just letting you know that the tone is disrespectful towards students of Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche. Its not your lineage and you dont like it, we get it.

Malcolm wrote:
I have no problem with students of CTR or of Shambhala.

Shambhala itself, however has become something quite strange under the leadership of Osel Mukpo.

Going for refuge to mythical Rigdens? The obsessive focus on Gesar? Really? How is this Buddhadharma? Then there is Mukpo himself, who is in the process of an ugly divorce from Shambhala International, because the latter recognize that the former is a liability and not an asset.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 7:52 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


PadmaVonSamba said:
3. If a toddler, a suspected tulku perhaps, recognizes a string of beads that belonged to someone else who has died, and says, “these are mine”  how does that work when, without a ‘self’ or truly existent “me” involved as a prerequisite, (something that carries over from one life to the next) that “mine” is an impossibility?

Malcolm wrote:
Even tenth stage bodhisattvas have enough of a trace of the knowledge obscuration to have not discarded the habit of imputing a nonexistent “I” onto their aggregates, when not resting in equipoise on emptiness. This is much stronger on the lower bhumis.

Basically, the yogacarins assert a carrier medium, the alaya. This is rejected by Madhyamaka.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 7:50 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Padmist said:
Great. So characteristics carried through? Can we say then that Padmist is a totally different new persona and not in any way connected to that goat who died except that goats karma/characteristics/habits got transferred to the newly born guy (Padmist)?

Malcolm wrote:
No, you cannot say that.

No entity passes from this life to the next, but the aggregates of the life are serially connected to the aggregates of the next, so there is a continuum.

fckw said:
Buddhists rarely discuss whether the continuum or the aggregates are eternal or not, have an identity or not, or are subjected to time or not.

Malcolm wrote:
That’s just not true. They are beginningless, momentary, identyless, and subject to time.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:56 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Nothing transfers from this life to the next. Not even traces, karma or anything else.

undefineable said:
Does anything even transfer within lives? Might it be 'enlightening' (with a very small 'e' .. ) to imagine the skandhas+nidanas becoming 'shaken up' between lives - or perhaps thawed before freezing again-?

Malcolm wrote:
Nothing transfers from this moment to the next moment, but the aggregates are serially connected, all the down.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:24 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
PadmaVonSamba said:
Then what’s the difference between
Alaya vijnana, and atma?

Malcolm wrote:
Ones part of the aggregates, the other is not.

PadmaVonSamba said:
(Sorry… that was a rhetorical question.
I should have simply said, “otherwise there would be no difference between alaya vijnana and atma”)

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, mistaking alaya as a self is an error.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:20 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
This is included in the aggregates. Nothing transfers from this life to the next. Not even traces, karma or anything else.

undefineable said:
Awareness?

Even if copied continually from moment to moment? As some element of the aggregates?

Malcolm wrote:
awareness is a mental factor, so part of the formations aggregate, and yes momentary.


undefineable said:
Because they're just aspects of parts of a process?

Malcolm wrote:
Because of dependent origination.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:05 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Can we say that there is a continuation of consciousness, mind, memory?
Yes. In Mahayana there’s a storehouse consciousness, the 8th consciousness, that goes from one life to another. Memory, habit, & karma remain.

PadmaVonSamba said:
I’m not so sure about that.
Yes, storehouse consciousness.
Continuous after the body dies?
Then what’s the difference between
Alaya vijnana, and atma?

Malcolm wrote:
Ones part of the aggregates, the other is not.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 9:00 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Can we say that there is a continuation of consciousness, mind, memory?
Yes. In Mahayana there’s a storehouse consciousness, the 8th consciousness, that goes from one life to another. Memory, habit, & karma remain associated with it—but not personality. That gets thoroughly shuffled.

Malcolm wrote:
This is included in the aggregates. Nothing transfers from this life to the next. Not even traces, karma or anything else. But since actions do not inherently exist there is nothing existent to prevent their ripening.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:33 AM
Title: Re: A different kind of meditation on death
Content:


Kim O'Hara said:
Whatever your thoughts about cardboard coffins, thinking about what you will be buried in beats avoiding thinking about death altogether.


Kim

Malcolm wrote:
I don’t care how my corpse is disposed of. It’ll probably be cremated, though.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:27 AM
Title: Re: Re:BDK publication Madhyāntavibhāga-Bhāsya THE DEBATE
Content:
Leo Rivers said:
What do YOU think?

Zhen Li said:
I would have to begin reading from the ABCs of Yogācāra as I am not really conversant any of these terms.

Malcolm wrote:
Yogacara sputtered to a halt partly because it is overly analytical. But it appeals to philosophers. Madhyamaka is actually more yogic than Yogacara.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:25 AM
Title: Re: Two recent BDK publications:
Content:
Leo Rivers said:
Malcolm
do you know with which sutra or teacher the non- pivot theory emerged?  Because Joy found evidence that the pivot theory occasionally showed up in works mostly using the other. That means both metaphors were viewed as situationally useful in the course of an exposition.

Thanks
Leo

Malcolm wrote:
According to a personal conversation with D'amato many years ago, he asserted that the progressive theory can be found the Mahāyānasūtralaṃkāra, resembling the gzhan stong idea that the perfected is empty of the imagined and the perfected.
Correction, empty of the imagined and dependent.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:19 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
DGA said:
I'm just trying to figure out what to do with these lapel pins

Malcolm wrote:
Hang on to them, they’ll be collectible someday. Especially the early bacon and eggs pin of Shambhala level 5.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:15 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:



KristenM said:
Sounds great. Hey, I'd kind of like to move, at least have the option. But no one pays even close to the pay here in California for my line of work. I'll possibly move out of state when I retire. If it's not too late. Or just buy an electric RV and travel the world like some Mad Max Apocalyptic Road Warrior.

Malcolm wrote:
Unsustainable means for our grandchildren. I am sure you will be just fine in CA for the foreseeable. You still have Lake Tahoe to ravish.

Kim O'Hara said:
I really wish I could agree, Malcolm, but I can't.

Malcolm wrote:
I wasn’t joking at all. We are leaving our grandchildren an unsustainable future.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:13 AM
Title: Re: The four causes of rebirth in Dewachen (Sukhavati)
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yes, they are all necessary. And all four of those causes are found in the Aspiration of Samantabhadra, so it is sufficient to recite that. Of course, as mentioned above, there are Vajrayāna methods with supplement those or surpass them.

Mirror said:
Please can you give me some examples of those Vajrayana methods, so that I can learn more about them?  Thank you

明安 Myoan thank you very much for that passage from Honen.

Malcolm wrote:
Transference of consciousness is one such method. Practiced with some diligence, it is not hard to obtain a positive sign.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 8:12 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:



Padmist said:
You meant the 2nd part right?

We can't say this -> "that goats karma/characteristics/habits got transferred to the newly born guy (Padmist)"

But can I say this? -> When you die, you just die, it's over. No reincarnation or resurrection or anything. If "you" are reborn, it isn't you at all. It's a totally different new guy.

Malcolm wrote:
Both positions are wrong.



Padmist said:
Can we say that there is a continuation of consciousness, mind, memory?

Malcolm wrote:
The aggregates are serially connected.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 4:33 AM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
It has to do with the length of a mahājñānavāyu.

Virgo said:
Ah, thanks.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
This is also one of the reasons why in khumbhaka, one wants to be able retain the hold for at least 2.6 minutes ( if there are 21600 respiratory cycles in a 24 hour period, we breath once every five seconds). If one times it all correctly, with time of day, which nostril, etc. it is possible to breath only jñānavāyus. But don't try this without parental supervision.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 4:27 AM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
[
I was referring to the style of three year retreat as composed by Kongtruk in his manual. The institutional
Three year retreat is modern. Originally the idea of a three year retreat comes from kakacakra, which was the elite systen practiced by kagyus,  sakyapas (and Jonang) and Gelukpas during the 13th and 14th century.

Virgo said:
Malcolm would you happen to know what cycle in the Kalacakra the thee year, three month, three day time period is derived from?

Does it have to do with the aspects of body, speech, mind, and the fortress?

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
It has to do with the length of a mahājñānavāyu. Every thirty-second breath is a jñānavāyu, It is asserted somewhere in the text that one can achieve buddhahood inside of one great jñānavāyu. It has to with the number of jñānavāyu in a single day, multiplied by a specific number of days to reach this cycle of a mahājñānavāyu. I am sorry, but I don't recall the precise formula.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 4:26 AM
Title: Re: Two recent BDK publications:
Content:
Leo Rivers said:
Malcolm
do you know with which sutra or teacher the non- pivot theory emerged?  Because Joy found evidence that the pivot theory occasionally showed up in works mostly using the other. That means both metaphors were viewed as situationally useful in the course of an exposition.

Thanks
Leo

Malcolm wrote:
According to a personal conversation with D'amato many years ago, he asserted that the progressive theory can be found the Mahāyānasūtralaṃkāra, resembling the gzhan stong idea that the perfected is empty of the imagined and the perfected.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 2:53 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Virgo said:
The Amazon is actually becoming a carbon source now rather than a carbon sink according to scientists.



Tough times ahead.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
Yup. That's cause so much of it is burning:

https://www.sustainability-times.com/environmental-protection/the-amazon-is-no-longer-a-carbon-sink-its-a-carbon-source/

Other researchers have recently found that tropical forests all around the planet are losing their ability to store carbon effectively with the carbon sink capacity of several African forests alone set to decline by 14% within a decade. At the same time, the carbon sink capacity of the Amazon’s forests will drop to zero by 2035.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 2:17 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


PeterC said:
Au contraire, mon ami…

SilenceMonkey said:
"They're not even a real country anyway."

Malcolm wrote:
It's important to remember this was all brought on the the kid's addiction to the Terrance and Phillip show:



Hence the Blame Canada campaign.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 1:55 AM
Title: Re: Re:BDK publication Madhyāntavibhāga-Bhāsya THE DEBATE
Content:



Leo Rivers said:
What do YOU think?

Malcolm wrote:
Then there is Geoffery Forgue's theory that the three natures actually refer to the three turnings of the wheel, which you can read about in the intro to his new translation of the Samdhinirmocana...

Karl Brunholzl pretty much supports the the idea that the original model was the pivot theory model, and that the progressive model was a later development.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 1:47 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:



KristenM said:
I hope so, but then being an Apocalypse Road Warrior sounds kinda groovy. I already have this thing picked out.

https://www.canoo.com/canoo/

Malcolm wrote:
I don't know, I am still hankering for the Ford 150 Lightening...YMMV

KristenM said:
Oh yeah, that Ford F-150 is cool. I’m in-between wanting a truck and a van. Decisions decisions.

Malcolm wrote:
I know, right? but I think the F-150 will be more intimidating.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 1:46 AM
Title: Re: The four causes of rebirth in Dewachen (Sukhavati)
Content:
明安 Myoan said:
Yes, no disagreement here.

In Jodo Shu Buddhism, one approaches the matter of fulfilling this Mahayana Vow through the Three Minds and Four Modes of Practice, which center around Amida Buddha.
Those who make this heartfelt aspiration for the bodhisattva way Will be free of all lower rebirths,
Free of harmful companions,
And will quickly see Amitabha, Infinite Light.

............................

When the moment of my death arrives,
By eliminating all obscurations
And directly perceiving Amitabha,
May I go immediately to Sukhavati, Pure Land of Great Joy.

Having gone to Sukhavati,
May I actualize the meaning of these aspirations,
Fulfilling them all without exception,
For the benefit of beings for as long as this world endures.
Born from an extremely beautiful, superlative lotus In this joyful land,
the Buddha’s magnificent mandala,
May I receive a prediction of my awakening
Directly from the Buddha Amitabha.

..............................................

Through creating limitless positive potential
By dedicating this prayer of Samantabhadra’s deeds,
May all beings drowning in this torrent of suffering,
Enter the presence of Amitabha.

Through this king of aspirations, which is the greatest of the sublime,
Helping infinite wanderers in samsara,
Through the accomplishment of this scripture dazzling with
Samantabhadra’s practice,
May suffering realms be utterly emptied of all beings

Malcolm wrote:
https://fpmt.org/wp-content/uploads/prayers/king_of_prayers_c5.pdf

The aforementioned four causes of birth in Sukhavati are complete in this aspiration prayer, which is found at the end of the Gandhavyuha, and provides the overall framework for all Tibetan Buddhist liturgies and practices.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 1:40 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:



KristenM said:
Sounds great. Hey, I'd kind of like to move, at least have the option. But no one pays even close to the pay here in California for my line of work. I'll possibly move out of state when I retire. If it's not too late. Or just buy an electric RV and travel the world like some Mad Max Apocalyptic Road Warrior.

Malcolm wrote:
Unsustainable means for our grandchildren. I am sure you will be just fine in CA for the foreseeable. You still have Lake Tahoe to ravish.

KristenM said:
I hope so, but then being an Apocalypse Road Warrior sounds kinda groovy. I already have this thing picked out.

https://www.canoo.com/canoo/

Malcolm wrote:
I don't know, I am still hankering for the Ford 150 Lightening...YMMV


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 12:55 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Deforestation of the Amazon as of 2019:


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 12:52 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
That's why I selected to live in the area of the United States that has the largest continuous forest. Water. It wasn't just because I was raised here. It was a conscious choice. There are a lot of places "cooler" than New England, but there are not many places in the US with sturdy 200 year old houses,  ample trees, etc. There are 25 million acres of deciduous tree between PA and ME. Where there are trees, there is water. Where trees are cut down, there is drought.

KristenM said:
Sounds great. Hey, I'd kind of like to move, at least have the option. But no one pays even close to the pay here in California for my line of work. I'll possibly move out of state when I retire. If it's not too late. Or just buy an electric RV and travel the world like some Mad Max Apocalyptic Road Warrior.

Malcolm wrote:
Unsustainable means for our grandchildren. I am sure you will be just fine in CA for the foreseeable. You still have Lake Tahoe to ravish.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 12:50 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
It's true the major powers share the blame. But the stats show US dwarfs the rest in pollution historically. Things are changing. China plays a larger role currently. Highly doubtful China helps this situation going forward. And convincing Putin is a nonstarter.

Malcolm wrote:
Indeed.

Crazywisdom said:
Deforestation is certainly terrible. Bolsonaro didn't invent it. He's definitely not helping. His days are also numbered.

Malcolm wrote:
We'll see. Brazil was a dictatorship before, it can be one again, very easily.

Crazywisdom said:
But one hardly can picture the vastness of the Amazon rainforest. It's quite literally an ocean. It's almost as large as the entire USA. It's not just the Amazon either. The amount of fresh water in South America is mind boggling. Doom prognosis of a dry South America is overblown.

Malcolm wrote:
Not really. That's what people thought about forests on the west coast. This article outlines the scope of the issue:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/09/24/argentina-brazil-south-america-drought/

Crazywisdom said:
North America is far drier and in much worse trouble. No doubt there's water in your side. The problems will come from flooding and topsoil runoff leading to deforestation. It's seems nobody is safe.

Malcolm wrote:
That's mostly a midwestern and western problem. But yes, notions of safety need to be redefined.

Crazywisdom said:
Speaking of oceans, destruction of fisheries and the ocean floor by giant dragnets plays a much larger role in global warming than previously known. That is happening at a frightening pace. In essence once the oceans are ruined, everything will be ruined. So reforestation and greenhouse gas reductions won't be enough.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup. Kill the plankton, everything else on top dies.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 12:37 AM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Most of these Vajrayana paths require group practice for accomplishment, which is what you find at a 3 Year Retreat.

Malcolm wrote:
This is strictly a Kagyu and Nyingma thing, and a late development as well. Sakyapas and Gelukpas do these solo, after having received the complete transmission for everything needed to accomplish the retreat. Of course they have consulting teachers who guide them through the material.

Crazywisdom said:
The Guhyagarbha is not a late development.

Malcolm wrote:
I was referring to the style of three year retreat as composed by Kongtruk in his manual. The institutional
Three year retreat is modern. Originally the idea of a three year retreat comes from kakacakra, which was the elite systen practiced by kagyus,  sakyapas (and Jonang) and Gelukpas during the 13th and 14th century.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 26th, 2021 at 12:28 AM
Title: Re: The four causes of rebirth in Dewachen (Sukhavati)
Content:
明安 Myoan said:
Yes, no disagreement here.

In Jodo Shu Buddhism, one approaches the matter of fulfilling this Mahayana Vow through the Three Minds and Four Modes of Practice, which center around Amida Buddha.

Malcolm wrote:
Right. I was only giving support to the OP.

In Indo-Tibetan Buddhism, aspiring for birth in Sukhavati is baked in, encompassed in the Bhadracaryapranidhana, as mentioned, the whole, or portions of which are recited daily.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 11:31 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
I wouldn't want that!

If you say there is absolutely no self, is this not tantamount to nihilism?

Malcolm wrote:
Of course not. There is a “self” which serves as a nominal designation for aggregates, but there is no actual self that is one, all, or separate from the aggregates.

Supramundane said:
But "the nominal designation" you refer to is false, i.e. an illusion.

Malcolm wrote:
Correct, but the Buddha allowed it for the purpose of discourse.

Supramundane said:
You seem to be opting for a no self. Isn't there room for a non-self?

What about our Buddhanature....


Malcolm wrote:
“No self” is non-affirming negation. It does not fall into any extreme, since an existent self is not being negated.

“Non-self” is an affirming negation since it affirms there is a self that remains to proven, hence it falls into both extremes at once.

Buddhanature is a provisional teaching for those who can’t fully accept emptiness.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 11:21 PM
Title: Re: The four causes of rebirth in Dewachen (Sukhavati)
Content:
明安 Myoan said:
As stated above, bodhicitta here is in the framework of Vajrayana teachings and practice.

Malcolm wrote:
Bodhicitta is the defining feature of Mahayana, period.

明安 Myoan said:
In Japanese Pure Land, too, one aspires to be born in Amida Buddha's Pure Land in order to save all sentient beings.

Malcolm wrote:
Thus it is a Mahayana path.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 11:13 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
I wouldn't want that!

If you say there is absolutely no self, is this not tantamount to nihilism?

Malcolm wrote:
Of course not. There is a “self” which serves as a nominal designation for aggregates, but there is no actual self that is one, all, or separate from the aggregates.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 10:15 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Supramundane said:
I stand by my claim that the Buddha never declared that there is no self;

Malcolm wrote:
You would be tragically wrong, in that case.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 10:14 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
Also, the platform Sutra is not a Sutra, why not?

Sort of like the way Pluto is not a planet? LOL

Malcolm wrote:
No, it’s a biography of Huineng. It and other Chinese texts spurious and otherwise are irrelevant in this forum.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 10:12 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
Also, the platform Sutra is not a Sutra, why not?

Sort of like the way Pluto is not a planet? LOL

Malcolm wrote:
No, it’s a biography of Huineng.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 9:47 PM
Title: Re: The four causes of rebirth in Dewachen (Sukhavati)
Content:


Mirror said:
And my question is: Are these four causes really necessary for rebirth in the Pure land (without which we can not be born there)?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, they are all necessary. And all four of those causes are found in the Aspiration of Samantabhadra, so it is sufficient to recite that. Of course, as mentioned above, there are Vajrayāna methods with supplement those or surpass them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 9:22 PM
Title: Re: Two recent BDK publications:
Content:
Svalaksana said:
Thanks for the reply. Seems reasonable to have a look at Xuanzang's translation, expecting a clearer understanding of East Asian Buddhism.

Malcolm wrote:
Xuantsang is a valuable resource for understanding Yogacāra thought in the 6th century India. This is his main value.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 9:12 PM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
It's well established the US's emissions of green house gases over the 20th century until now is by far the largest contribution to global warming, and therefore owes the world damages in the form of enormous investments domestic and internationally. Global industrialization was largely a US project.

Malcolm wrote:
No, it was also a Soviet and Chinese project. One cannot isolate the US in this. Economies have always been global, as are environments. Europe also industrialized, especially England. You can say that the global north, meaning US and Western Europe have a debt to the global south, but that is a different issue and involves a lot more than just climate degradation.

Crazywisdom said:
Given there is about ten years to fix 120 years of damage, the US has a moral obligation to fund this and use it's power to get everyone else to chip in.

Malcolm wrote:
Can't be fixed. Mitigation and preparation, however, that can be done.

Crazywisdom said:
However, the government in the US is weak. Nothing will happen until there's a massive disaster. Which brings us back to California. At least Newsom has a vision.

Malcolm wrote:
There is a massive disaster happening right now. People are not cognitively wired to perceive slow-moving disasters. That's why that fool in Brazil is cutting down rainforests as fast as he can and South America is in an epic drought that is only going to get worse. Things are not going to get better. Climate refugees are already a thing from Africa and Central America. The US and Western Europe are going through fits of authoritarianism because of the fact that people are on the move, and more of them will be on the move for the next 500 years and no one is preparing for that. Syria, for example, is a directly result of climate change. The Arab Spring was originally caused by farmers protesting water shortages. It then turned into a civil war. Much the same thing will happen in the Western US, especially with lunatics like the Bundys. Water wars used to be common in the 19th century, with feuds between farmers and ranchers. This is why there is a complicated water allocations in CA and other western states which are now being upended. It all looks pretty grim to me. That's why I selected to live in the area of the United States that has the largest continuous forest. Water. It wasn't just because I was raised here. It was a conscious choice. There are a lot of places "cooler" than New England, but there are not many places in the US with sturdy 200 year old houses,  ample trees, etc. There are 25 million acres of deciduous tree between PA and ME. Where there are trees, there is water. Where trees are cut down, there is drought.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 8:59 PM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Most of these Vajrayana paths require group practice for accomplishment, which is what you find at a 3 Year Retreat.

Malcolm wrote:
This is strictly a Kagyu and Nyingma thing, and a late development as well. Sakyapas and Gelukpas do these solo, after having received the complete transmission for everything needed to accomplish the retreat. Of course they have consulting teachers who guide them through the material.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 8:58 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
It's mentioned in the Perfection of Wisdom Sutra, Maha Prajna Paramita. I share your misgivings. But there it is.

Malcolm wrote:
No, the term "true self" is not used in any Prajñāpāramita sūtra.

One interpretation could be that there is a trend in Mahayana to speak in positives, even though it is controversial since it could mislead some people.

Supramundane said:
Remember that, although the Buddha rejected an eternal self, he never advocated no self.

Malcolm wrote:
False.


Supramundane said:
The middle way is in between, and I think that's what is meant by the True Self in this sutra: the correct conception of self, which is in between the eternal and the nihilistic.

Malcolm wrote:
Not, this is not correct. There is nothing in the middle which can be termed "a self," true or otherwise.


Supramundane said:
But usually Buddhism expresses itself in terms of negations --- not negatives--- but negations. And thus true self is controversial, but we do see it in certain sutras where Buddhahood is spoken as a 'womb' or an 'embryo'.

Malcolm wrote:
No, there we just see the term "self" used. How? As in the Uttaratantra commentary by Asanga, the term ātmapāramitā refers to a kind of two fold purity: freedom from the taint of general and specific characteristics, posited as freedom from the eternalist atman of nonbuddhists and the annihilationist anatman of śrāvakayānists.

And no, tathāgatagarbha is not "buddhahood." For example, the Lanka equates it with the ālayavijñana.

Supramundane said:
If we speak of it as a womb, it is pure potential, but if we speak of it as an embryo, that means that there is something there. It is a positive.

Malcolm wrote:
No, there isn't anything "there."

Supramundane said:
I think that if we are careful in judicious, it's okay to speak in positives, such as true self and true mind as opposed to false self and false mind.

Malcolm wrote:
All concepts of self are false imputations.

Supramundane said:
In the Surangama sutra --- one which you quote frequently and one which I believe you are currently reading, my friend --- I hate to tell you, but there are 149 references to true mind, true eternity, true bliss, true purity, and yes, true self. Do not mistake true with eternal, however. As I stated above, I believe 'true' refers more to a true conception of self, i.e. a non-self.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't accept that this is a valid sūtra. It is a Chinese pastiche.


Supramundane said:
The other sutras which refer to Buddhanature in the positive are the Platform Sutra, the Queen Srimālā of the Lion's Roar Sutra, the Sutra of Complete Enlightenment, Mahaparanirvana Sutra, among others.

Malcolm wrote:
The Platform Sūtra is not a sūtra.

Nevetheless, the second turning of the wheel is definitive, not the third. This is easily proven through both scripture and reasoning.

With respect to the tathāgatagarbha doctrine, if understood correctly, it can be understood as definitive, understood as you have presented it above, "If we speak of it as a womb, it is pure potential, but if we speak of it as an embryo, that means that there is something there. It is a positive," this is just eternalism, not better than the Hindu concept of self. So no.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 7:19 PM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:
Kelwin said:
Not only that, if you want to reach realization, the 3 year retreat is actually a terrible way to do it. Anytime you feel like you're getting to know a practice, you already have to learn the next one and complete all the related accumulations.

Malcolm wrote:
Unless, like myself, you focus on one sadhana.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 7:17 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Supramundane said:
Perhaps it would be easier to grasp rebirth and self if you tried instead to grasp the opposite, the True Self,

Malcolm wrote:
There is no such thing in Buddhadharma. Suchness is not a self, as the very passage you cite states.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 7:15 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
No entity passes from this life to the next, but the aggregates of the life are serially connected to the aggregates of the next, so there is a continuum.

yagmort said:
i have hard time distinguishing between the meaning of terms like consciousness, mind, awareness and intelligence.. so if i use a loose term "primordial awareness", then when and where it fits into this scheme?

Malcolm wrote:
Well, this is an English word. So it is hard to know what it is supposed to mean unless you give more context.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 7:13 PM
Title: Re: Not sure where to go
Content:


Ardha said:
I can just sit and be while taking in everything around me, not having to be anywhere or do anything. But there is stuff I want to do and like doing, but what I get is that Buddhism would have me just sit blissed out in a room with four walls and never do anything else but eat and sleep.

Malcolm wrote:
No, That’s Samkhya. Buddhism wants you to get out and help people.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 7:10 PM
Title: Re: Skandhas in all schools of Mahayana Buddhism
Content:
Aemilius said:
"In the Samyukta Agama, the Buddha asks the ascetic Shrenika Vatsagotra if the Tathagata (another name for a buddha) is the same as the skandhas, and Shrenika says, "No, Bhagavan." Again the Buddha asks if the Tathagata is separate from the skandhas, and again Shrenika answers, "No, Bhagavan."The Buddha then asks if the Tathagata is inside the skandhas. Again Shrenika answers, "No, Bhagavan."The Buddha then asks if the skandhas are inside the Tathagata. Once more Shrenika says, "No, Bhagavan." Finally the Buddha asks if the Tathagata is not the skandhas, to which Shrenika answers, "No, Bhagavan". Likewise, in the Perfection ofWisdom in Eight Thousand Lines, the Buddha says that enlightenment is neither inside the skandhas nor outside them, nor both inside and outside them, nor other than the skandhas."

The Heart-sutra, Translation and Commentary by Red Pine

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because thus would make the tathagata and bodhi a self.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 9:16 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Padmist said:
Great. So characteristics carried through? Can we say then that Padmist is a totally different new persona and not in any way connected to that goat who died except that goats karma/characteristics/habits got transferred to the newly born guy (Padmist)?

Malcolm wrote:
No, you cannot say that.

No entity passes from this life to the next, but the aggregates of the life are serially connected to the aggregates of the next, so there is a continuum.

Padmist said:
You meant the 2nd part right?

We can't say this -> "that goats karma/characteristics/habits got transferred to the newly born guy (Padmist)"

But can I say this? -> When you die, you just die, it's over. No reincarnation or resurrection or anything. If "you" are reborn, it isn't you at all. It's a totally different new guy.

Malcolm wrote:
Both positions are wrong.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 9:14 AM
Title: Re: Why are sand mandala's actually destroyed?
Content:
Hazel said:
So I was under the impression that sand mandala destruction was meant to be a reminder of impermanence. However, I recently heard (second hand) that a monk said this was not the case.

Is there a meaning other than the one I assumed?

I suspect based on the second hand paraphrasing that it might have been a joke that flew over this person's head.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it’s connected with completion stage.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 4:53 AM
Title: Re: Three Year Retreat Schedule
Content:


Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
I’ve been told that Lama Norlha didn’t give permission for any of his people to do solitary retreats. Apparently he thought you needed other irritating people around to demonstrate to yourself the limitations of your practice. Without them you might think you’re making a lot more headway than you really are.

heart said:
It is a question of logistics, teachings, empowerments and pith instructions should be delivered at the right moment. Solitary retreat is for those that already have experience and no need for a teachings and so on. Also a solitary retreat can be any length so no need for the three year format. Read Jamgon Kongtrul's Retreat Manual.

/magnus

conebeckham said:
I agree with all of this, too.  3 year retreat is sorta like "college" in our lineage.  It's a training ground and requires supervision at various points.

also, some of the practices require more than one person, really--I can't imagine someone doing some of the drupchos on their own.  You just can't cover all the necessities.

Malcolm wrote:
It all depends on the kind of three year retreat.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 4:52 AM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:


Padmist said:
Great. So characteristics carried through? Can we say then that Padmist is a totally different new persona and not in any way connected to that goat who died except that goats karma/characteristics/habits got transferred to the newly born guy (Padmist)?

Malcolm wrote:
No, you cannot say that.

No entity passes from this life to the next, but the aggregates of the life are serially connected to the aggregates of the next, so there is a continuum.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 4:50 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
The US is the worst offender.

Malcolm wrote:
No.

https://epi.yale.edu/epi-results/2020/component/epi


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 4:46 AM
Title: Re: Thinking about the 7th Root Downfall
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
What you do is you recommend a book by a lineage master that discusses these issues in general terms. If they buy it, they are interested. If they don't, they are not.

nightbloom said:
Of the available introductory works, is there one that stands out to you? I bypassed most of these.

Malcolm wrote:
Approaching the Buddhist Path, HHDL.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 12:35 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Crime here is economic, alcohol and drug related.


Malcolm wrote:
And environmental...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 12:32 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Yes I am aware. You run into folks from those Nazi expat colonies who took child brides and crazy stuff. But at least in Cities you never see it. Brazil is a giant party.
This film is fictional.

Malcolm wrote:
Of course it is.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 25th, 2021 at 12:30 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
At this point the Shambhala lineage is not even Buddhist. It has become a strange cult of Gesar, with a bit of Bon and Kalacakra mythos tossed in for good measure.

Knotty Veneer said:
Would agree. Always considered its relationship to Tibetan Buddhism, the same as that of Mormonism to mainstream Protestantism. An American  pastiche of the original. A new religion for a new continent. A bit of hokum.

It has never really taken off in Europe. We are not impressed by absolute monarchies so much any more. It's strange that the US, given its founding myth, would be the seed bed for a spiritual monarchial movement.

Malcolm wrote:
Umm, the Shambhala thing found its home in Canada, because Americans do not like kings in general. Canada is a monarchy, at least, the Queen thinks so:

https://www.royal.uk/canada


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 11:11 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
PeterC said:
Didn't they show up at his monastery anyway and hold some sort of enthronement ceremony for Mukpo Jr.?

Nobody in their right mind would entrust anyone's education to that group

Knotty Veneer said:
I'm not sure - I know Shambhala were late to the party for the XIIth Trungpa (as well as for the 17th Karmapa!). My teacher the late Akong Rinpoche, I believe, was one of his main benefactors for many years (and his organization Rokpa may still be).

Shambhala has little to do with the traditional teachings of the Trungpa lineage and even though some members (and former members like Pema Chodron) practise within the Kagyu tradition to some degree, I think they are their own thing. So while it is good that Shambhala help with some money, their interest is not really with the Trungpa lineage so much as with the teachings specific to the 11th Trungpa. Whether the current Trungpa will take any of those up, we wait to see. I cannot imagine him though requesting a lineage transmission from Osel Mukpo the current holder though, so it's probably unlikely.


Malcolm wrote:
At this point the Shambhala lineage is not even Buddhist. It has become a strange cult of Gesar, with a bit of Bon and Kalacakra mythos tossed in for good measure.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 9:45 PM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Yes I am aware. You run into folks from those Nazi expat colonies who took child brides and crazy stuff. But at least in Cities you never see it. Brazil is a giant party.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 9:40 PM
Title: Re: Thinking about the 7th Root Downfall
Content:
nightbloom said:
But is it acceptable to speak, in very general terms, about the logic of tantric practice? For instance, can I explain what the four activities are, or talk in broad terms about creation and completion stage? The role of the yidam, pure perception, etc?

Malcolm wrote:
What you do is you recommend a book by a lineage master that discusses these issues in general terms. If they buy it, they are interested. If they don't, they are not.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 8:35 PM
Title: Re: On Rebirth - Is it the same guy?
Content:
Padmist said:
Would it be right or wrong to say:

1. The person who died is dead, gone, no more, not going to return or reincarnate.

2. The person who reincarnated is a NEW person, a different person, not the same guy who died.

heart said:
Last life you where a goat and now you are padmist, are you the same guy?

Sentient beings don't have an ego/self that is travelling from one life to an other, this is a basic buddhist teaching. The self is an illusion. Tulkus supposedly don't really have even the illusion of a self their actions are a reflection of their circumstances.

/magnus

Padmist said:
Would you say then that the goat completely died, ceased to exist, vanished and that this new Padmist is a completely different entity?

Malcolm wrote:
Nothings transfers from this life to the next, but aggregates are serially connected.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 8:33 PM
Title: Re: Skandhas in all schools of Mahayana Buddhism
Content:


johnwhi said:
1. Do all modern schools of Mahayana Buddhism believe that every person is made up of skandhas?

2. Do all modern schools of Mahayana Buddhism allow Buddhists, Buddhas and Bodhisattvas to believe that other people consist of skandhas such as form, sensations, perceptions, mental activity or formations and consciousness, or are only Buddhists who have not yet come to enlightenment allowed to believe in it?
Thanks

Malcolm wrote:
1. Yes.

2. The aggregates are a common teaching in Mahayana, taught by Buddhas and high bodhisattvas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 8:25 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Padmist said:
re: Malcolm on Tulku

So either CTR didn't really reincarnate...

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, but no one actually knows where.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 4:12 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


climb-up said:
Something like that right?

Malcolm wrote:
Hopefully, we will do our best.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 3:48 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



Johnny Dangerous said:
This is one of the reasons that I personally always look with some skepticism on claims of "Well Rinpoche said it should be like this" about everything under the sun, particularly when they are not backed up by quotes from Rinpoche himself.

Malcolm wrote:
ChNN said many things to many people, some statements directly contradicting other statements. The notion one can take in a whole gem with a thousand facets by looking at only one facet is a delusion.

Johnny Dangerous said:
I agree with that, even when quotes are provided they tend to be open to interpretation and not directly linked to the claim. At least they are quotes though. I have seen all manner of claims made about the DC, the status and importance of membership, what Rinpoche wanted with this, that or the other thing, with *no* quote attached at all. I find it amazing that anyone would even consider claims framed like that, but maybe that's just me. Personally, I know how organizations work (and well, don't work) and so I am very skeptical about organizational claims made based on hearsay on Rinpoche's words.

Malcolm wrote:
Sat in on a hundred Gakyil meetings, and heard a hundred people claiming this was Rinpoche's vision and that was Rinpoche's vision, all fighting with each other. If you want to truly learn how to break samaya, join a Gakyil.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 3:43 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Padmist said:
So Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche is back?

Malcolm wrote:
That depends on how seriously one takes tulku recognitions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 3:40 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



Johnny Dangerous said:
This is one of the reasons that I personally always look with some skepticism on claims of "Well Rinpoche said it should be like this" about everything under the sun, particularly when they are not backed up by quotes from Rinpoche himself.

Malcolm wrote:
ChNN said many things to many people, some statements directly contradicting other statements. The notion one can take in a whole gem with a thousand facets by looking at only one facet is a delusion.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 3:35 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?p=381061#p381061

It remains for each individual to work out their spiritual path -  with diligence.

Malcolm wrote:
In any case, the whole principle of hereditary lineages is unworkable and not what the Buddha intended at all:

1. Now the Blessed One spoke to the Venerable Ananda, saying: "It may be, Ananda, that to some among you the thought will come: 'Ended is the word of the Master; we have a Master no longer.' But it should not, Ananda, be so considered. For that which I have proclaimed and made known as the Dhamma and the Discipline, that shall be your Master when I am gone.
https://accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn/dn.16.1-6.vaji.html

So it is at present. The method of how to find a teacher and rely on a teacher exists in the sutras and tantras of the Buddha. The words of our teacher, Chogyal Namkhai Norbu are fully in accordance with the words of sūtra and tantra, and there is no contradiction with them at all.

The institutional paralysis of the DC will eventually pass, or not, but even if ChNN's direct lineage dies out, his mark on the world will be noted. Fortunately, there are sufficient numbers of people out there who can properly pass on the essence of the Dzogchen teachings.

And with any teacher of course, caveat emptor. There are many people out there who show a deer tail, but sell horse meat. Every teacher needs to be examined, as does every student.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 2:55 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Virgo said:
Menpa Malcolm,

Is there a reason people can't be relaxed, happy, and collaborative?

Why do people always seem to be aggressive, unhappy and strongly opinionated, so often?

Malcolm wrote:
Self-grasping.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 2:14 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



oldbob said:
Chögyal Namkhai Norbu never authorized any SMS teacher
to give Initiations, Direct Transmission in any form, or Lungs, so such an activity can not be
recognized by ATIF.



Malcolm wrote:
As I said, the DC is dead in the water.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 2:07 AM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:


Knotty Veneer said:
No, that's incorrect, Malcolm.

Malcolm wrote:
ok.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 1:19 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
or 3) from the spirit of ChNNR via the World-wide Transmission of the Guru Yoga of Garab Dorje, on the web, as was done by ChNNR at many times before.

Tongnyid Dorje said:
Seriously? from the spirit of ChNNR?

Malcolm wrote:
Oh, it's going to get a whole lot weirder then this, strange people will start hanging out shingles saying they were authorized by ChNN in dreams and visions to be Dzogchen teachers. And since there is freedom of religion in most places in the "first" world, no one will be able to stop them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 1:16 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
I abandoned that fashion completely in 1985 when I saw a ten year old on a skateboard dressed exactly like me.

Queequeg said:
Sorry. That might have been me.

Malcolm wrote:
Nah, it was probably Ben Affleck.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 1:12 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:



Crazywisdom said:
Cambridge is probably cool, but expensive.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, once they eliminated rent control, that was it.

Crazywisdom said:
I didn't see any ref to Oregon in the article but I know the history.

Malcolm wrote:
DId you know there is a community of Confederate exiles living in Brazil?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederados

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Texas

Belize as well:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_settlements_in_British_Honduras

Mexico:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Virginia_Colony


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 12:40 AM
Title: Re: The Mess at the Texas Border
Content:


Queequeg said:
Of course, a lot of us don't know about this because they just found Gabby Petito's body and the manhunt is on for her boyfriend.

Malcolm wrote:
Apparently, f**cks are only given if you are a white, female blogger. Countless native women and WOC go missing every year, and no f**ks are given at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 12:38 AM
Title: Re: The Mess at the Texas Border
Content:
Queequeg said:
WTF is going on?!!

Malcolm wrote:
Racism in action. White man on horse beats down a Black man on foot. Same old story in Texas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 24th, 2021 at 12:34 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
This is why he taught the way _all_ Nyingma teachers do, extensively teaching on gzhi khregs chod combined with anuyoga transformation practices until people are ready to practice the path, lhun grub thogal, which almost no one does seriously.

fckw said:
Just to understand this sentence - what do you mean, "almost no one does seriously"? What's lacking here, right effort, or right view (and thus understanding of the path), or anything else? In what sense do you mean people are not ready to practice lhund drup thogal?

Malcolm wrote:
In general, people should not practice thogal until they have understood the view, khregs chod, and stabilized it very firmly. That view is not an intellectual view, but is based on the experience of the nature of the mind during empowerment. That experiential view should be very stable. ChNN taught thogal very infrequently, largely because it is clear he had doubts about people's stability in the view.

Now, of course, there is no one who will continue those transmissions in the DC unless or until something changes.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 11:24 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Isn't the punk ethos fundamentally nihilist in view?
I wouldn't say that, as a former punk rock musician from the late seventies/early eighties. It was a rejection, principally, of arena rock and commercialism, attended with a lot of social justice concerns in fact, for example the Pop Group, the Slits, Crass, etc. Sure, a lot of it was just adolescent good fun. Grunge was much more nihilistic than Punk. Punk, if anything, was pretty idealistic, in a disappointed sort of way. The sixties did not work out the way they were supposed to.

Queequeg said:
Good points.

Maybe it would be better to identify different streams in punk. When I think of the Sex Pistols, I don't think of social justice. I just think of a big, loud middle finger to the proverbial man. And I think there is a strain of punk that follows down that stream - I'd say it culminated with GG Allin, running around an NYU student lounge naked and flinging his shit at people.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, this was the Malcolm Mclaren version.

Queequeg said:
And then there are the militant punks who very easily could be transformed into Brown Shirts. I think you can discern those impulses down through the skinhead scene to the present in groups like the Proud Boys. Yeah yeah, Ian McKay and Henry Rollins were progressive skinheads - but they're also overbearing, holier than thou ass holes - a few shades away from leftist authoritarians.

Malcolm wrote:
Gavin Mcleod was musician in punk band in Canada.

Queequeg said:
Ian McKay and Henry Rollins

Malcolm wrote:
Definitely not skinheads. They didn't even have shaved head, apart from McKay and they had no fashion sense at all.

"Skinhead" was a fashion, which ultimately came from merging the hard mod fashion with Jamaican Rude Boy fashion in the late 60's. To be a skinhead required that you wore the right gear, levis, eight or ten-eyelet DMS, skinny braces, Fred Perry, etc., and importantly, football! It started here because people liked the look of Selector, the Specials, Madness, and so on. Then Oi! started getting promoted first in England, then here.

I was a skinhead in the early 80's, because of Ska music and Oi!. I played in a reggae band in Boston, etc. I saw the whole scene go to shit because of the white power assholes, circa 1982 onward. Plus Skinhead fashion was cool in the Industrial Music scene, and that did lead some people into neonationalist territory, like Death in June, etc. West coast punks with leather jackets and Frye motorcycle books were something else, same with Minor Threat, who wore sneakers for lord's sake. And even if these US punks had DM's, they generally never knew how to lace them properly, so they looked pretty clueless.

I abandoned that fashion completely in 1985 when I saw a ten year old on a skateboard dressed exactly like me.  But it was a good look and since I was working in food service the whole time, from 1980-1986 or so, it served me well.

Queequeg said:
One of my Trumpist cousins was a skinhead who with his gang of righteous dudes would fight NeoNazis and White Power skinheads in Trenton. The slip is easier than we might have thought looking at those guys when they were 17.

Malcolm wrote:
Some guys never grow out of the "our gang" mentality.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 10:58 PM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Try that in New England.

Malcolm wrote:
That happened. Weed was legal here before it was legal in CA. And:

https://www.marijuanamoment.net/new-massachusetts-bills-would-decriminalize-all-drugs-and-study-regulated-sales-of-psychedelics/

You can see from this article that this is a country-wide movement, and often supported by Republicans as well.

Crazywisdom said:
I get you're in love with you're homeland. What little time I spent in Boston, I can tell you that you guys have racism issue, as well as people being A-holes.

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, the Boston Irish are pretty racist. But I lived mostly in Cambridge, and Cambridge is more like Berkeley, just smaller.

Crazywisdom said:
Maybe it's better in other places. But overall the East Coast is just not my cup of tea.

Also I'm not in love with CA or the West Coast or the USA for that matter. I'm just saying CA is not about to implode in apocalyptic proportions. That's just your fantasy and rah rah for MA, which ... Meh...

Malcolm wrote:
We all know that Mad Max was set in CA.

Crazywisdom said:
California is a rip off. There's elitism going on there which basically destroys everything that ever made CA cool, especially SF. The state is a giant business meeting. Super boring.

Malcolm wrote:
That's pretty funny.

Crazywisdom said:
I spent my formative years in Southern Oregon around racists that Jim Crowed me. I hate those kind of people. In my opinion that Trump gave those A-holes a great sense of empowerment. With the court appointments, etc., The USA is screwed dude. They basically won. Random killings of Asians coast to coast.


Malcolm wrote:
Oregon is state founded on racism. It was written into their constitution, as you surely know.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/04/08/how-the-south-won-the-civil-war


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 10:08 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:


reiun said:
Instead, let freshmen campaign for social justice and respect.

Malcolm wrote:
It's a good use of their time.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 10:05 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Funny thing is, this guy was always a conservative catholic, remember "Polly, I'm not an animal," the Pistol's anti-abortion song?

Knotty Veneer said:
Lydon was an avid Thatcherite back in the day. The Sex Pistols were never a protest band - their whole plan was to sell out and see how many people bought the records even though they were laughed at openly by the band. All that anti-monarchy stuff was just to garner tabloid inches.

Queequeg said:
Isn't the punk ethos fundamentally nihilist in view?

Malcolm wrote:
I wouldn't say that, as a former punk rock musician from the late seventies/early eighties. It was a rejection, principally, of arena rock and commercialism, attended with a lot of social justice concerns in fact, for example the Pop Group, the Slits, Crass, etc. Sure, a lot of it was just adolescent good fun. Grunge was much more nihilistic than Punk. Punk, if anything, was pretty idealistic, in a disappointed sort of way. The sixties did not work out the way they were supposed to.



Queequeg said:
Isn't Trumpism basically nihilist trolling?

Malcolm wrote:
Yup.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 9:57 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


tinylocusta said:
They seem quite distinct to me, even though they are not labelled as such. Whenever there is a mandala built gradually from the elements etc., you have Mahayoga. Some sadhanas even speak of "Mahamudra" at the end. When you have instant manifestation, usually it means Anuyoga.

Malcolm wrote:
Anuyoga has two systems: one gradual, one instant. Mahāmudra in Nyingma does not mean the same thing as mahāmudra in the gsar ma tantras. But in any case, ChNN affirmed countless times that the result of the two stages and the result of Dzogchen were the same.

tinylocusta said:
As to the tradition of practicing the three inner tantras together, it is omnipresent in Nyingma. Yes, the Nyinghtigs exist, but they are always being practiced in the context of Vajrayana, and some of them have more Mahayoga than Anuyoga.

Malcolm wrote:
And in Dzogchen Community. For example, the medium thun, which combines the system of Mahāyoga with the system of Anuyoga and the system of Atiyoga.

You are confusing "Nying thig," like klong chen snying thig as a fashionable name, with the term snying thig, for example Vima snying thig, which is strictly about the utterly secret unsurpassed cycle of the man ngag sde tantras. They are not the same thing at all.


tinylocusta said:
As for Yeshi, I'd prefer not to speculate about Him or His intentions.

Malcolm wrote:
You are free to take anyone you like as a teacher, and devotionally capitalizing the indefinite pronouns when referencing them. It's fine with me. Weird to do so, but whatever.

We don't need to speculate. Yeshe made his attitude towards the broader community, as well as Buddhadharma, clear as a bell.

The criteria for following a teacher are clearly laid out in the Dzogchen tantras and elsewhere. ChNN hit every one of those marks. Why would I need another teacher? ChNN was a perfect teacher, who I studied and practiced under for 26 years. I don't need another Dzogchen teacher in this life, other than the ones I already have studied with. You have a different idea, and that is your choice. No one is criticizing you or anyone else, or and telling you or anyone else that you or anyone else cannot take Yeshe as a guru. That's strictly between you and him. Any criticism offered to you here concern your  deficiencies of learning, evident in your bombastic pronouncements and misstatements of fact.

tinylocusta said:
My aim writing here was to ask people to reflect before using offensive words against Him. I had honestly thought these were accidental and that people would reflect and adjust their attitude. But it is obvious now that at least in some cases it was not intentional but done on purpose so basically all that I wrote was in vain.

Malcolm wrote:
No one here wrote any thing offensive about Yeshe Namkhai. Not one word. The only person offended here is you. And you decided to be offended, then self-righteous, as if you have any business trying to condition other people at all. This is all on you, not on us.

tinylocusta said:
Or worse, maybe provoked even more slander.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no slander here. No one is saying that Yeshe is a bad or evil person, or that by choosing to leave the community he did something inherently wrong. His actions certainly confuse a lot of people. But he is just an ordinary person in a human body with human problems, just like everyone else. Some people are disappointed he did not don the mantle. Personally, I could care less. But I do think his little dance with the community is harming the community, and that he ought to be in or be out, rather than one foot in the door and one foot out.

tinylocusta said:
I prefer to follow the advice of my teachers and be careful about the consequences of my actions and I feel it will be better if I don't post here anymore because the result seem to be more negative than positive. Again, I'm very sorry if I gave rise to any negative emotions. We are all Vajra brothers and sisters, and I sincerely apologize to all of you.

Malcolm wrote:
You should worry about your own negative emotions, since that is what caused you to post your missives here in the first place. But since you don't believe in karma, it doesn't matter. There are no consequences to your actions at all. Bye.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 9:13 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Funny thing is, this guy was always a conservative catholic, remember "Polly, I'm not an animal," the Pistol's anti-abortion song?

Knotty Veneer said:
Lydon was an avid Thatcherite back in the day. The Sex Pistols were never a protest band - their whole plan was to sell out and see how many people bought the records even though they were laughed at openly by the band. All that anti-monarchy stuff was just to garner tabloid inches.

Malcolm wrote:
Even so, great rock and roll, even if it was a swindle.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 8:54 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
treehuggingoctopus said:
I do not think that it is correct to say that Rinpoche presented Dzogchen as a complete self-contained path, fullstop.

Malcolm wrote:
If he did, he would have only presented trekcho and thogal, following empowerment. In fact, he mostly focused on trekcho, and only _very_ rarely did he teach thogal.

What ChNN understood, finally, from Changchub Dorje was the meaning of the teaching on the basis (gzhi) a.k.a the primordial state a.k.a the nature of one's own mind, in Dzogchen. That was the topic that had eluded ChNN in his previous studies and teachings he had received. If one does not understand the Dzogchen teaching on the basis, one cannot understand the Dzogchen path.

This is why he taught the way _all_ Nyingma teachers do, extensively teaching on gzhi khregs chod combined with anuyoga transformation practices until people are ready to practice the path, lhun grub thogal, which almost no one does seriously. In this respect he was very traditional. He also tried to explain to people that the unelaborate path of Dzogchen, of the Nyinthig teachings, the utterly secret unsurpassed cycle, was beyond the nine yānas, a fact stated in the seventeen tantras themselves as well as all major Nyinthig cycles, and countless commentaries. In fact, ChNN taught Dzogchen in an utterly traditional way, as anyone who has extensively studied the length and breadth of Dzogchen teachings knows, and has not fallen for the bullshit propaganda some people in DC repeatedly drone, which mainly derives from an incorrect understanding of the Kun byed rGyal po and other sems sde texts. ChNN repeatedly stated that sems sde concerned the teaching on the basis, and that in essence, it was about khregs chod. If one does not understand that basis, one can do Ati guru yoga and sing the SOV until the cows come home, but it isn't really Dzogchen practice. Authentic teachers of Dzogchen spend years emphasizing the teaching on the basis to their students until they get it right. ChNN was exactly that kind of teacher.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 8:33 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
There’s just been a few posts that seem to interpret not seeing Yeshi as a viable leader/teacher for the community as being hostile towards him.

Malcolm wrote:
It's the opposite. Yeshi has done nothing but express hostility towards the DC since his father's passing (and for several years prior), blaming people like the D'Angelo brothers for stealing his father from him, when it fact, it was his father's choice with whom he spent time. Rather than being angry at the students his father surrounded himself with and to whom he dedicated his life, Yeshe should direct his unhappiness at its true source. If he wants to left alone, the DC should leave him alone. But he should also get out of the way, and stop this unhealthy tango.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 8:01 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Maybe so. But core generational values tend to stick around. It's demographics and it does matter.

Malcolm wrote:
I've seen a lot of college radicals become middle age conservatives, and even trump voters...just sayin...

KristenM said:
You don't say...


Malcolm wrote:
Funny thing is, this guy was always a conservative catholic, remember "Polly, I'm not an animal," the Pistol's anti-abortion song?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 7:57 PM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
It's a moot point bc zombies are fictional.

PeterC said:
OK I'll bite.  (No pun intended.)  There are examples in nature of sentient beings being taken over by fungi.  Read the link below with caution because it is pretty disgusting.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/article/cordyceps-zombie-fungus-takes-over-ants

Now - does the zombie ant still have Buddhanature?

Malcolm wrote:
One word: Matango


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 7:53 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
I have no ill will towards Yeshi at all...

Malcolm wrote:
None of us do. We just want him to shit or get off the pot so the DC can get on with its life.

dharmafootsteps said:
Your posts about Yeshi seem incongruent with his own words about himself.

Malcolm wrote:
Highly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 7:23 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
tinylocusta said:
The unique approach of Rinpoche that stems from His meeting with Changchub Dorje is the presentation of Dzogchen as a complete path.

Malcolm wrote:
False. This was not unique to Changchub Dorje, etc.

tinylocusta said:
Other teachers have never done that. They were focused on preserving the totality of Buddha's teaching as presented in their tradition, starting with Vinaya (+presenting Tibetan "folklore", seeing it being destroyed and dying out). I have received various Dzogchen teachings from different teachers but they were always presented in the context of Vajrayana, especially the three inner tantras.

Malcolm wrote:
This was also ChNN’s approach. It’s unavoidable.

tinylocusta said:
So the first unique aspect of Rinpoche was to present Dzogchen as an independent path.

Malcolm wrote:
False. Not unique to ChNN. This has been in Nyinthig teachings since the 12th century, and before.

tinylocusta said:
The second - related - was aiming not only at "spiritual people", but the general population. This was not the case in Tibet: Dzogchen was often closely guarded and not taught openly, given only after a long training etc. Giving it openly is a recent phenomenon.

Malcolm wrote:
False, it was one of the most widespread and easily available teachings in Tibet. There are more manuals on Dzogchen than any other single teaching.

tinylocusta said:
Someone mentioned the concept of reincarnation. When you realize the nature of mind, you discover reincarnation doesn't exist, that you have never transmigrated.

Malcolm wrote:
False. Many people have discovered the nature of their mind, and yet they still continue to take rebirth. Thus is why most dzogchen practitioners, as ChNN stated many times, awaken in the bardo of dharmata after their minds separate from their bodies. You should really properly educate yourself before you continue to make yourself look ignorant.

tinylocusta said:
. So I see no conflict here: you could say that dbangs are necessary in order to practice Dzogchen and I can say they are not, and we're both right depending on semantics.

Malcolm wrote:
No, you would be wrong to say Dzogchen does not require empowerment, period.

tinylocusta said:
The third unique aspect of Rinpoche's teaching was going back to the roots.

Malcolm wrote:
Not in the manner you imply.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 6:22 PM
Title: Re: There's a reincarnation of Chogyam Trungpa and emanation of Padmasambhava?
Content:
Padmist said:
Its a different person?

Knotty Veneer said:
Khentin Tai Situpa is a leading figure in the Karma Kagyu lineage. Guru of the 17th Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje. He recognised the 12th Trungpa tulku many years ago. Tai Situpa is considered an emanation of Guru Rinpoche - I don't think he is the only one either. I think many important lamas in the Nyingma and Kagyu schools are considered as such.

Malcolm wrote:
Amitabha, actually, to the Karmapa’s Avalokiteshvara.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 6:10 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
treehuggingoctopus said:
The thing is, part of the DC is a cult

Malcolm wrote:
There, fixed it for you.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 4:09 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.

Virgo said:
You know I forgot about that completely.  This is direct evidence that Rinpoche either knew directly or felt very, very strongly that this would happen, because he fully believed this.

Virgo

Malcolm wrote:
The reality is that people have opinions, some people are threatened by those opinions, and make samaya threats, etc., forgetting that they are just imposing limitations on other people, trying to shut down uncomfortable conversations.

Now, there are certain natural limitations, like for example the one that says that one has to have a living teacher to enter secret mantra, and so on. That's one teacher has to measure up to certain qualifications to be a teacher. And the fact that these days, a perfect teacher is almost impossible to find.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 3:40 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Kurp said:
Maybe Rinpoche saw how the community couldn’t collaborate well and he was okay with things dying out over time.

Malcolm wrote:
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 3:04 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


tinylocusta said:
There are so many things people are confused about here. A simple example: the empowerments for the three inner tantras mentioned in the Precious Vase. When you read that fragment it is clear it is for people following the SMS training, and during this training there is something to learn about each of these.

Malcolm wrote:
And Rinpoche made it very clear that everyone in the DC is to follow the base of SMS. So then?

tinylocusta said:
As entering the way of Mantra without receiving an initiation is negative, of course.

Malcolm wrote:
Dzogchen is part of Mantra. Without empowerment, no Dzogchen. You want citations? I can give you many.

The sgra thal 'gyur is the gold standard here, and the sgral thal 'gyur insists that empowerment, samaya, etc., are all important. So does Longchenpa, which Rinpoche held up as the gold standard of Tibetan masters, no merely once, but many times.

tinylocusta said:
Rinpoche describes it and gives some alternatives for people who can't do that. It is perfectly normal. The suggestion that what Rinpoche was giving to everybody for His whole life works only if you are extremely lucky and that now people should flock to other teachers to receive Dupa Do and Guhyagarbha makes no sense!

Malcolm wrote:
Since Rinpoche never gave the Guhyagarbha or long Anuyoga empowerment, his suggestion that people should receive then could only mean that people should seek out qualified teachers elsewhere, and receive them.

tinylocusta said:
(btw when you go to Blye [???} to receive Guhyagarbha you may want to ask earlier if you receive the whole thing, because normally it's given in parts.)

Malcolm wrote:
It takes three days.

tinylocusta said:
Such statements are in direct contradiction to what He was teaching.

Malcolm wrote:
No, they are not.

tinylocusta said:
Instead of receiving these initiations, people who haven't woken up should repeat what they received and sing the SoV. Of course if someone is doing SMS and studies the three inner tantras, that's a different thing.

Malcolm wrote:
So now you are in a position to tell people what they ought and ought not do? You are just an anonymous voice on the internet, hiding behind a nym. If you had any courage whatsoever, you would post in your real name.

tinylocusta said:
Some things seem to be said just for the sake of being said, I see no other reason. For example that people don't understand the qualifications of the teacher because they prefer to party...

Malcolm wrote:
There are a lot of people in the DC who have been following Rinpoche for years, who still know nothing. It's not his fault. But it's good they have faith in him. At least that much will gain them birth in a dharma family in their next life.

tinylocusta said:
Anyone who follows SMS is well aware of these things, regardless of their leisure preferences. In the Precious Vase Rinpoche quotes several pages about the necessary qualifications of teachers from Adzom Drugpa and Patrul Rinpoche.

Malcolm wrote:
And people never read these things. Or if they read them, they forget them, and so on.

tinylocusta said:
There are many more false things written here but I feel like I would act wrongly by discussing them.



Malcolm wrote:
Then your remarks are kind of pointless, no?

tinylocusta said:
Also, for everything I've written above you can easily find 10 counter-arguments and discuss these ad nauseam. I have no interest in these kinds of discussions; what I'm asking you - that is people blaming everybody outside - to reflect a bit how much of it is a projection of your minds and how beneficial or harmful are the things you write here.

Malcolm wrote:
No one is blaming anyone for anything. We are just observing the real situation. The real situation is that the DC Is dead in the water and sinking fast. All compounded things are impermanent. C'est la vie.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 1:55 AM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Don’t zombies have awareness?

Malcolm wrote:
If they did, they would not be dead people in various stages of decomposition.

zerwe said:
What about Vetalis? And, Vajravetali?

Shaun

Malcolm wrote:
Vetalas are a kind of spirit that reanimates a corpse. It's pretty hard to kill spirits.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 1:44 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Maybe so. But core generational values tend to stick around. It's demographics and it does matter.

Malcolm wrote:
I've seen a lot of college radicals become middle age conservatives, and even trump voters...just sayin...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 1:38 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
Try that in New England.

Malcolm wrote:
That happened. Weed was legal here before it was legal in CA. And:

https://www.marijuanamoment.net/new-massachusetts-bills-would-decriminalize-all-drugs-and-study-regulated-sales-of-psychedelics/

You can see from this article that this is a country-wide movement, and often supported by Republicans as well.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 23rd, 2021 at 12:34 AM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Tlalok said:
In 28 Days Later the Zombies are living humans infected with rabies, they are definitely sentient beings in that case.

Malcolm wrote:
The name of the virus in 28 days later is "Rage", not rabies. In other news:
"Danny Boyle has revealed he's working on a follow-up to 28 Days Later.

The director told The Independent that a third film is in the works with Ex Machina filmmaker Alex Garland, who wrote the 2002 original.

"Alex Garland and I have a wonderful idea for the third part," he said. "It's properly good."

He continued: "The original film led to a bit of a resurgence in the zombie drama and it doesn't reference any of that. It doesn't feel stale at all. He's concentrating on directing his own work at the moment, so it's stood in abeyance really, but it's a you-never-know."

Sequel 28 Weeks Later, directed by Juan Carlos Fresnadillo, was released in 2007.

Tlalok said:
The question of "does a philosophical zombie have buddha nature" is an interesting challenge though.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 8:28 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



Danny said:
There’s precedent...

Malcolm wrote:
Not really, you didn’t understand the point of that story at all.

Danny said:
Yeah I did. The point was Rinpoche said he was totally focused in trechod. That he was committed to that, and eventually was informed, nudged,  hey! What about your togal?
Malcolm
Don’t under cut...

Malcolm wrote:
The point of that story is that ChNN was being too cautious and allowing his instructions to go to waste because he was not applying them.

And appearances in a dream are just ones own mind, nothing else. ChNN had a remarkable mind.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 9:11 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The Predictable Backlash to Critical Race Theory: A Q&A With Kimberlé Crenshaw

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/critical-race-kimberle-crenshaw/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 7:48 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Tenma said:
Lmao, as a freshman here, duly noted!

Malcolm wrote:
Yup, when you get to 60, you’ll understand.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 7:45 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



oldbob said:
This email is to legally certify that I have contacted ChNN in a dream and have received his permission to study and practice all of his Teachings.



Danny said:
There’s precedent...

Malcolm wrote:
Not really, you didn’t understand the point of that story at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 5:00 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
climb-up said:
Aren’t there some empowerments that literally include a permission, or even encouragement, to teach?
I’m blanking on the name of the one I’m thinking of, but I though mr that was an explicit thing.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it is called the bka' gtad, the entrustment of the doctrine.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:48 AM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Don’t zombies have awareness?
If they did, they would not be dead people in various stages of decomposition.
They have appetite.

Malcolm wrote:
So do Venus Flytraps.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:47 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


climb-up said:
Do fully qualified lamas who give teachings and have also received ChNN’s transmission not exist?

Malcolm wrote:
Other than Tsultrim's few practices, and perhaps Lama Denys in France, no one who is doing with the express permission of ChNN. People who do so are taking it upon themselves to do so. It's between them and the Dharmapālas.

climb-up said:
Of course and, if they’re public it’s also between them and their students.
But didn’t you recently post here that permission to teach was a modern political innovation and not a requirement from the tantra?
If someone has received the empowerments, done the retreats and the study and has the necessary level of realization (which is obviously difficult, that’s true with any teacher right?) then they are qualified to pass on the teachings.
Is that not right?

Malcolm wrote:
Its not a modern innovation, per se, but the fact is that most people who start teaching do so when their guru passes away, and usually, to preserve the lineage, not promote themselves. It is ideal if one receives permission from one of one's gurus to teach. It is not necessary to receive permission from each and every one, however. Tulkus kind of have permission built in.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:36 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


climb-up said:
Do fully qualified lamas who give teachings and have also received ChNN’s transmission not exist?

Malcolm wrote:
Other than Tsultrim's few practices, and perhaps Lama Denys in France, no one who is doing with the express permission of ChNN. People who do so are taking it upon themselves to do so. It's between them and the Dharmapālas.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:35 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Good one, bob.


oldbob said:
UNOFFICIAL
Date:  ________________________________

Dear Shang Shung Foundation,

This email is to legally certify that I have contacted ChNN in a dream and have received his permission to study and practice all of his Teachings.

I have his permission to receive a copy of the complete Digital Archive and the complete Transmission Archive in whatever condition of editing they are currently in - at the actual cost of the digital media.  He said that I could have this for my practice use only and that I should not share this with anyone else, and I agree to this.  He said that I should make sure that the Digital Media is returned to SSF after I have finished with it.

Please supply a quotation as to what it would cost for a copy of the digital media and for shipping to the following address:

_______________________________________________________________________________________________

_______________________________________________________________________________________________

Sincerely yours,

Name:  ___________________________________________

Gar/Ling:  _________________________________________

Membership Number:  _______________________________

Please send to:

mailto:m.k@shangshunginstitute.org

ob:world


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:34 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Kurp said:
https://www.dzamlinggar.net/en/dzogchen/direct-transmission
DIRECT TRANSMISSION
(...)

mutsuk said:
Ok, so this means direct introduction (ngo sprod). If you attended a teaching (webcast or live) during which the DI was given you have received that transmission but understanding it is different. I read somewhere some DC people saying stuff like "Oh I was there, he gave it, but actually I did not received it" and things like that. Sorry but this is nonsense. The DI is about understanding the nature of the mind. It is easy to understand if you don't expect a magic trick that is going to make you a Buddha right away because understanding Rigpa has never liberated anyone on the spot. So during DI what you should expect is to have a clear understanding of the Emptiness-Clarity of your mind. This understanding is the knowledge (rig-pa) of the natural state. Again, if you don't project unrelated expectations on this,  then it is very easy to understand. In a sense, you cannot "not have received it", in particular since Rinpoche gave it in a very clear and simple way. However, to transmit that DI yourself, you need to have your understanding of it validated by the master and then obtain his formal authorization.

Malcolm wrote:
These are actually Donwangs. They originally fell on the birth anniversaries of Garab Dorje, Guru P and Adzom Drukpa, and on these days we would do gurus yogas at the time of their birth. Then, ChNN switched giving to empowerments of Garab Dorje and Padmasambhava coordinated by video on these dates, and then finally, web casts.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:23 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


climb-up said:
There are lamas who are qualified to pass on ChNN's transmission, and will/are,

Malcolm wrote:
Who?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 4:23 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Kurp said:
and still did not receive transmission

mutsuk said:
What do you mean by this? Transmission is not intransitive in Dzogchen, so it should a transmission of... Are you referring to direct introduction?

Kurp said:
https://www.dzamlinggar.net/en/dzogchen/direct-transmission

Malcolm wrote:
Sadly, this history is completely wrong.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 2:52 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
mutsuk said:
Or you may say you don't need any such authority and in this case, anybody can claim anything. I am really not sure this is what Rinpoche would have wanted.

Malcolm wrote:
It's all subjective, don't you get it? We just need to have a dream and demand any teaching we want or all of them. Whose to say we had the dream or didn't have the dream? It's a perfect system. Who needs a living guru, when we have the Living Sprit of Lord ChNN Christ to guide the way.

Sheesh. Come on. Get with the times, mutsuk.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 2:49 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
but most of the ‘soft censorship’, (in fact nearly all of that I’ve seen) has been a result of this brand of juvenile  wokeness within the discourse on the left.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because people are threatened by freshman in college. Give me a break.

Crazywisdom said:
You've obviously never been the reason for a college sit in.

Malcolm wrote:
I have lived in college towns for my entire life. Ithaca, the Happy Valley (Western Ma), Cambridge, Burlington, VT., Boston, and back to the Valley again. I've seen more sitins than I can remember. Freshman come and go, get on with their lives, forget about their youthful political passions, get married, have families, etc.

What freshman in college think is just not a big deal.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 2:44 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
Of course, the Members of this Dzogchen Community can have complete access to the Digital Archive and the Transcript Archive once they have received ChNN's permission for this.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 2:42 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
So I am proposing a new Dzogchen Community based on the Teachings of ChNN, with the spirit of ChNN being the living Teacher.

Through dreams, visions, and praying with strong faith, many have taken Transmission from Teachers who are no longer in their body.

I think that this will work for many practitioners - both old and new.  If someone claims that they have received a Transmission / permission from ChNN how can anyone say that they did not.  This is an entirely subjective experience. So certainly this works (or should work) for SSF to allow the purchase of practice materials and to allow the replay of recorded material.

ob


Malcolm wrote:
If they can get permission from ChNN in a dream, then they should read all his books and listen to all his teachings in a dream too.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:59 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
but it does make the left wing landscape here amazingly ineffective and self-facing.

Malcolm wrote:
It's always been like that, as far as I can remember.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:56 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Archie2009 said:
I just saw ... on social media

Queequeg said:
I think your problem starts there.

Archie2009 said:
The recordings aren't faked, you know. Also, remember what the George Floyd protests started with?

Malcolm wrote:
Archie, these thefts are by organized by gangs, which means they are felonies, and eventually they will be prosecuted as such.

In the meantime, do you really expect security guards to put themselves in harms way for Walmart?

This is confined to San Francisco, where there is a terrible housing problem. This is not a result of social policies gone awry, this is a result of tech overlords and their hordes of minions driving housing prices through the roof over the past 20 years.

There are 100,000 thousand people living on the street or living out of cars in CA right now. It's pretty messed up, we all agree.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:48 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
"Collaborate"

ChNN

Malcolm wrote:
No connotation of "new" there, Bob.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:29 AM
Title: Re: Regular Caffeine Consumption Affects Brain Structure
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Rhododendron Primuliflorum isn’t so easy to procure.

https://www.etsy.com/search?q=rhododendron+tea&order=most_relevant&view_type=gallery

The other two varieties of Rhododendron that I mentioned found in the above Etsy link, are made for human consumption.

I wonder if either of them are similar enough to Rhododendron Primuliflorum....

Malcolm wrote:
R. Primuliflorum is the species identified by Tibetans for use. I cannot be certain of Dali in other countries, like Mongolia. Sometimes different plants substituted with the same names, like this Sagan Daly (R. Adamsii), which is clear adapted from Tibetan Medicine.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:23 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Archie2009 said:
I'm wondering how much of an issue the current laws/rules on shoplifting in California are. The videos on the internet of thiefs on bikes riding through stores filling their bags unopposed are otherwordly. Is that mostly San Fransico? How do Californians feel about this? Zero punishment for theft below $950. Unreal.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, that's because the prisons are filled with lots of people who got long terms for holding $50 of cocaine.

Archie2009 said:
Yes. That's shameful.

Malcolm wrote:
Under Penal Code 484(a) PC, California law defines the crime of petty theft as wrongfully taking or stealing someone else’s property when the value of the property is $950.00 or less. Petty theft is a misdemeanor punishable by probation, fines, restitution and up to 6 months in county jail.

https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/penal-code/484/

It is not really as horrifying as it sounds. But I am sure the Daily Mail and the New York Post are all riled up about it. Putzes all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 1:20 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
but most of the ‘soft censorship’, (in fact nearly all of that I’ve seen) has been a result of this brand of juvenile  wokeness within the discourse on the left.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because people are threatened by freshman in college. Give me a break.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 12:25 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Archie2009 said:
I'm wondering how much of an issue the current laws/rules on shoplifting in California are. The videos on the internet of thiefs on bikes riding through stores filling their bags unopposed are otherwordly. Is that mostly San Fransico? How do Californians feel about this? Zero punishment for theft below $950. Unreal.

Queequeg said:
The demise of civilization portrayed on conservative media are grossly exaggerated to get your heart rate going. You should thank them for the cardio workout. CVS/Walgreens (or whatever chain on the West Coast) will still report record earnings and the knuckleheads caught on someone's iphone will continue to suffer the life of a knucklehead.

Archie2009 said:
It sounds to me like many have become desensitized to theft, robbery and violence.

Malcolm wrote:
It's also wildly exaggerated by the right wing media.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 12:23 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Archie2009 said:
I'm wondering how much of an issue the current laws/rules on shoplifting in California are. The videos on the internet of thiefs on bikes riding through stores filling their bags unopposed are otherwordly. Is that mostly San Fransico? How do Californians feel about this? Zero punishment for theft below $950. Unreal.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, that's because the prisons are filled with lots of people who got long terms for holding $50 of cocaine.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Wednesday, September 22nd, 2021 at 12:03 AM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Archie2009 said:
The whole US progressive social justice movement pivots on performative hysteria.

Malcolm wrote:
You mean like this?


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 11:37 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Archie2009 said:
NY Times is part of clown world.

When students search the campus with baseball bats in hand for supposed racist professors something is off.

Malcolm wrote:
That did not happen: timeline here:

https://www.theolympian.com/news/local/education/article175061841.html


Archie2009 said:
This happened to Bret Weinstein at Evergreen State College in 2017 literally because he refused to take a day off.

Malcolm wrote:
Only an idiot refuses to take a paid day off.

He was also engaged in performative silliness. It paid off. He and his wife also received 500K for their troubles. Now he is a major player in the Covid Antivaxx movement, so a total idiot. It's also telling that he blames "postmodernism" and "critical theory" for his woes. What a putz.





More performative silliness.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 11:22 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
As I have been saying all along, who is afraid of the opinions of freshman in college?

Queequeg said:
Insecure college professors.

Malcolm wrote:
They need to get over it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 10:40 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
Or -  we can collaborate and create a new Dzogchen Community...

Malcolm wrote:
Where in ChNN's words or writings is it suggested that creating a "new" Dzogchen Community is viable?

Strange.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 10:25 PM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
I would like to read that, Malcolm. In some sutras the two seem to be conflated, but i agree that they are different.

Nirodha is a verb; nirvana a noun, are they conceptually different?

Or just two ways of expressing the same thing?

Malcolm wrote:
They are two ways of expressing the same thing.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 9:32 PM
Title: Re: Fear of Woking
Content:


Queequeg said:
Thought this might offer a nice bookend to the conversation about right wing paranoia about wokeness.

Malcolm wrote:
As I have been saying all along, who is afraid of the opinions of freshman in college?

The whole hysteria around CRT and wokeness has been manufactured by the right, in order to limit the free speech of the left, as the article cogently points out.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 9:29 PM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
This would mean that enlightenment is different from nirodha.

Malcolm wrote:
Bodhi is what leads to cessation. This all very clearly explained in Abhidharmakośa, which is itself a commentary on the four truths of nobles.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 9:16 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


oldbob said:
Perhaps requirements for Wangs and Lungs are put forwards by scholars...

Malcolm wrote:
No, these things are stated very clearly in the Dzogchen tantras.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 9:14 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


oldbob said:
Paging through Richard Barron’s excellent translation of the Precious Treasury of Basic Space and I found NO /NO reference to who can teach Dzogchen.  Not one.  (I enjoyed reading this again!!!)  Maybe someone was using a different translation.  I am old and fuzzy-headed so maybe I missed something.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, it is specified in the commentary in great detail in chapter 11, only very briefly in the root text, in the same chapter.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 9:10 PM
Title: Re: Regular Caffeine Consumption Affects Brain Structure
Content:


Sādhaka said:
Shardza Tashi Gyaltsen Rinpoche recommended rhododendron as an alternative; and even went as far as suggesting that tea caffeine can be an cause for lower realm rebirth. Rhododendron actually seems to be a strong adaptogen.

Malcolm wrote:
Be careful, most rhododendron species are toxic. He was talking about a specific type of rhododendron native to E. Europe through Asia. I did not hear this personally, but he must have been referring to what is known as Dali (ད་ལིས). The leaves (call Ba lu, བ་ལུ) and flowers of the plant Rhododendron primulaflorum are used in Tibetan Medicine. A decoction made of the leaves is very strongly diuretic. The flowers are used in chulen.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 8:54 PM
Title: Re: The Serious Curriculum
Content:


tingdzin said:
Bonpo Kanjur/TenjuR

Malcolm wrote:
Here you are:

http://xxb.qiongbuwang.com/index/category/id/23.html

Mother tantras:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ghrxna22f22cnhx/18%20Mother%20Tantra%20copy.pdf?dl=0


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 5:32 AM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
So yes; Seeing the Lama as pure is about you. Not about them.

Malcolm wrote:
This was a note to the mods that this was a Zombie thread.

Zombies, not being alive, have no buddhanature, no more than a rock has buddhanature.

Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
Don’t zombies have awareness?

Malcolm wrote:
If they did, they would not be dead people in various stages of decomposition.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 5:31 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
treehuggingoctopus said:
It is distressing that these things are not only unknown by most of us DC members but would invite utter disbelief and ridicule when pointed out.

Malcolm wrote:
This is because many times people were more interested in getting to the Meribar and partying after the teachings than paying attention to what the Boss was actually saying.

M


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 4:19 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Suppose someone starts giving empowerments and so on, of Mandarava. How can the DC sanction these? They can't. So, the DC still sinks. etc.
I also want to add, that the qualifications of who can teach Dzogchen are very specifically spelled out by Longchenpa in texts such as the Treasury of the Dharmadhātu, its commentary, based in authoritative Dzogchen Tantra like the Kun byed rgyal po, etc. One has to know how to give empowerments, understand secret mantra in general, have done the retreats, be skilled in the views of the various yānas, be able to answer questions, etc., etc. Its not sufficient to make a loud noise, like scaring a flock of pigeons.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 3:26 AM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Schrödinger’s Yidam said:
So yes; Seeing the Lama as pure is about you. Not about them.

Malcolm wrote:
This was a note to the mods that this was a Zombie thread.

Zombies, not being alive, have no buddhanature, no more than a rock has buddhanature.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 3:18 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
nightbloom said:
An articulate explanation for a healthy person’s rejection of the vaccine and the social policies associated with it. He nails it with his comments on “biopolitics.”

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2021/09/why-i-didnt-get-the-covid-vaccine

Malcolm wrote:
No, he does not. He miscites studies, relies on the opinions of people who do not specialize in epidemiology, lies about what people like Fauci have said throughout this pandemic. Moreover, this man is a fundamentalist Christian. Why you would believe anything this lunatic says is just well, He is an Anti-Lockean, that is to say, his very intellectual impulses are anti-democratic and Christian dominionist.

This man says:
Christians are called to speak the truth to one another and to assume the moral risks of speaking truth in public.
And yet, he is a total liar.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 3:01 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
Yes, the words of ChNN in the two communications of 2016, as to who can teach, mostly relate to the specific situation while he was alive, but they also pointed to the present time, when we are being asked to observe ourselves, work with circumstances, do our best and collaborate.
Please read the actual words of ChNN, in both communications of 2016 as to who can teach, and look for what is applicable to our world today.

https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?p=598719#p598719

Malcolm wrote:
Well, as far as I know, there is basically no one in the community right now, apart from Adriano, who actually has the necessary skills in Tibetan and English to give empowerments.  It is simply not enough to copy the meaning empowerments (don dbangs) Rinpoche used to give, let along the more complicated empowerments such as Longsal empowerment, or the empowerments for SMS, etc.. One has to be scholarly enough to know how to read the texts. Many people imagine that a direct introduction is enough. It may be for a few people with fantastic past life accumulations, but for most people it is not sufficient. This is why Rinpoche recommended that SMS people receive the Guhyagarbha, an Anuyoga empowerment in concise or long form, and the Khandro Nyinthig empowerment.

There are really an endless source of issues here that cannot be addressed in any comprehensive way by the IDC, and they have made it clear that there is nothing they can do.

Suppose someone starts giving empowerments and so on, of Mandarava. How can the DC sanction these? They can't. So, the DC still sinks. etc.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 2:08 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Bob:

We know.



oldbob said:
Please make the effort to read the actual words of ChNN about who can teach and what he allowed his children to teach.

Malcolm wrote:
If one goes by that letter and takes it literally, Dzogchen Community is dead in the water and sinking rapidly. YMMV.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 1:24 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
Hurricanes and floods will also intensify on the other side of the Miss. Anyway, being near one of the largest fresh water supply on Earth, Amazon, not to mention Pantanal, well, at least for now.... Sigh of relief.

Malcolm wrote:
Western New England is too far away from the coast for hurricanes and floods to have much impact. Eastern New England, that's another story.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Tuesday, September 21st, 2021 at 12:38 AM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
Nirodha is not cessation of thought? What is ceased then?

Malcolm wrote:
The causes and conditions for samsara. Hence the constant refrain, 'Birth is ended" and so on.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 11:26 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


Tata1 said:
I prefer not to speculare of a meeting i was not a part of. For example friends who where there had a total different view on what happened that the one held by some forum members here, including the issue of yeshe students.

Kurp said:
Maybe taking this conversation to the Sangha app, where many more IDC members communicate, would be best?

I almost guarantee the conversations there regarding these topics will prove more fruitful than discussing them here in a circular manner with the same 10 (mostly anonymous) people.

Malcolm wrote:
The reason why these issues get discussed here is that there is not point in discussing these things inside community spaces. Nothing changes, people with money make the decisions, everyone else just watches and has opinions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 10:05 PM
Title: Re: What if seeing a lama as pure was less about lifting a lama up and more about bringing purity
Content:
Simon E. said:
Seeing the Lama as pure is about you. Not about them.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 10:01 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


Tata1 said:
And who says yeshi wont lead his students?

Malcolm wrote:
Time will tell, as always. But the thing is, it is the whole DC, not just a select cohort who signed NDA's.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 9:41 PM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
but since cessation of thought

Malcolm wrote:
Error, the third truth is not "cessation of thought."


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 9:38 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


Tata1 said:
Rinpoche thought and stated that yeshi can teach. Thats it for me, regardless of what yeshe said in a meeting or not.

Malcolm wrote:
Leading students is not a simple matter of giving an introduction and then disappearing. It is a commitment to lead them on the path in a proper way. For example, like the commitment ChNN made to his students for decades and 600+ retreats.

It is not some technical issue, which is what everyone treats it as, it is not merely a question of mechanics, "Have DI, then travel."

The DC is, at present, running the risk of becoming a strange thing, unnormal, as the Boss used to say.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 8:49 PM
Title: Re: The opponents, Shantideva refutes first
Content:
Crazywisdom said:
He's trying to prove his point against assumed positions by other schools, all of which are fallacious and silly.

White Sakura said:
that´s what I also thought. The Svatantrikas, how silly.

Malcolm wrote:
"Svatantra" and Prasanga are positions invented by Tibetans. It has nothing to with the facts on the ground in Indian Madhyamaka.

Tsongkhapa is a wonderful teacher, but you should not imagine that his presentation is by any means the definitive one. It is not even the definitive one in Geluk, since there are many different trends in Geluk, and not even all famous Geluk scholars agree with everything Tsongkhapa wrote.

Śantideva does not address other Madhyamakas. He addresses only other tenet systems.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 8:44 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
tinylocusta said:
What they need is someone who can present their real nature in the context of the illusion they are currently living in, from Tik Tok to quantum physics.

Malcolm wrote:
And this is how Secret Mantra, including Dzogchen, degenerates. Apparently you also were not paying attention to Rinpoche, when he chided people for their criticisms of creation stage because of the ancient Indian costumes.

These things, quantum physics to Tiktok, are irrelevant to the question of liberation and freedom from rebirth. If someone does not accept rebirth, they cannot teach Dzogchen, much less Buddhadharma.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 8:39 PM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
I think Biden's latest mandate probably cemented Trump 2.0's victory...

Malcolm wrote:
Doubt it. There are two types of people in America right now, fortunately the sane people outnumber the insane by 20 percent.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 8:14 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
tinylocusta said:
we want such a person to appear, we need to practice ourselves, instead of pushing Adriano and so on.

Malcolm wrote:
No one is pushing anyone. But if one wishes someone to teach, they must be asked.

As for this weekends event, we will never know what happened.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 9:54 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
, you don't understand the issue, there are really good reasons to oppose a "papers please" society -and- what might amount to a form of national ID.

Malcolm wrote:
There is nothing wrong with national ids. They make eminent sense.

Papers please would be an issue if it applied to,interstate travel, but it won’t. Anyway, Real ID is a form of national id, rolled out at the state level.

KristenM said:
How do you feel about undocumented immigrants and a national ID? Do you think we should have any sort of border checks?

Malcolm wrote:
We have border checks already, for this people who cross into the US at ports of entry. Undocumented immigrants who are presently here should be given green cards. Most illegal immigration into this country from Mexico and Central America represents policy failures of the US going back decades and even centuries. With climate change, we are going to have to figure out how to handle increasingly large numbers climate refugees. Personally, I think we just combine Canada down to Panama into a EU-like trade/currency zone with free movement between all citizens of member nations.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 9:02 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


Tata1 said:
Like everyone said, the important thing is that transmission is being given.

Malcolm wrote:
Maybe. Or Maybe it will be a PowerPoint presentation on ChNN’s life and work. We won’t know. It’s not a Dzogchen Community event.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 8:56 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
, you don't understand the issue, there are really good reasons to oppose a "papers please" society -and- what might amount to a form of national ID.

Malcolm wrote:
There is nothing wrong with national ids. They make eminent sense.

Papers please would be an issue if it applied to,interstate travel, but it won’t. Anyway, Real ID is a form of national id, rolled out at the state level.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 5:23 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:


nightbloom said:
I welcome any attempt to demonstrate that I'm wrong about these things.

Malcolm wrote:
Just read the NYT. If you don't believe the NYT, you are a hopeless paranoic.

99 percent of all people in hospitals today are people like you who refused vaccination.

Delta is a far more severe infection than the original covid bug as well. SMH.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 5:21 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:



Malcolm wrote:
Sure, Bob, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

But in any case, these days to new students apparently have to sign non-disclosure agreements in their own blood...

treehuggingoctopus said:
And doing so they ensure that as long as they proceed accordingly they will never be part of the DC that is here already.

Tata1 said:
I think people need to be more patient. Only 3 years had passed since rinpoche passed away. Yeshe is giving transmission which is a good thing, but he is doing it formally for the first time. Expecting him to sit on the throne and tour the world giving DI while also giving it to 6000 people online like some sort of DI vending machine is unrealistic and not fair to impose that on someone.
If Rinpoche had faith in him as well as his daughter thats enough for me personally. But things need time to unfold, for yeshe and for rinpoches other students.

Malcolm wrote:
Yeshe is not a member of the Dzogchen Community, and his event in Merigar to be held shortly is not a DC event.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 5:19 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
nightbloom said:
We're prepared to accept it, because this is what we believe to be right.

Malcolm wrote:
Fools all then. You have no right to expect help from anyone when you become homeless, because of your unwillingness to abandon your very basic wrong views, your ignorance about causes and their effects. Not only are you hurting yourself, but you are dragging other people down with you. SMH.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 5:05 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
nightbloom said:
You're one of the strangest people on this forum, Malcolm. So much knowledge, but such a striking lack of awareness regarding your impact on other people's thought processes. I'm very glad you're here, but I wish you'd chill out.

Malcolm wrote:
I am quite aware of my impact on other people's thought processes, and as long as people like you continue to behave like irresponsible fools, you are going to hear about every time you pipe with your bullshit. Get the goddamn jab. You are supposed to be a bodhisattva, that means putting others ahead of yourself. So far, I see no evidence of that from you at all.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 4:55 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:


Johnny Dangerous said:
This is a completely non falsifiable, pointless claim.

Malcolm wrote:
Delta came from India. The DNA proves it. Covid spread there uncontrolled for months because the Modi gvt. chose to believe their own Trumpian bullshit rather than protect their citizens.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 4:50 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:


nightbloom said:
I appreciate the thoughtful, nuanced argument here, but I don't agree. I don't think it's "grandstanding" to reject vaccination.

Malcolm wrote:
No, it's downright idiotic.

nightbloom said:
it's because people are saying "No," to various measures.

Malcolm wrote:
Because they are selfish idiots.

nightbloom said:
Even if the above wasn't true - I fail to see why I *should* take the vaccine.

Malcolm wrote:
So that you reduce the chance that your body passes on the infection to those with weaker immune systems than yours, oh selfish one.

nightbloom said:
Anyway, the bottom line is that vulnerable people *should* be vaccinated, and everyone else should be left alone.

Malcolm wrote:
No, everyone should be vaccinated. There are no other solutions to pandemics than vaccination.

nightbloom said:
P.S, I've heard the same things you have, regarding the virus being here to stay.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because of idiots like you, specifically. BTW, your bodhicitta is shit, it means nothing. You might as well pack it in as Māhāyāni. You are about as far away from a Mahāyāna practitioner as I can imagine. You are so selfish, you cannot even take a little jab if it prevents one person from becoming ill. Pathetic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 3:24 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


oldbob said:
Wouldn't it be better to responsibly publish everything now with links to lineage holders who can provide DI and LRAs?

Malcolm wrote:
Sure, Bob, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

But in any case, these days to new students apparently have to sign non-disclosure agreements in their own blood...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 1:52 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:


Crazywisdom said:
California will be fine. It will hire out all those Harvard and MIT folks to solve everything as it always has. BTW GN's big initiative is to pass a bill that allows every homeowner to split their lots and build duplexes on them to solve affordable housing. There's going to be a huge home selling rush and probably folks moving to CA.  The water is down now due to drought. The rain will come eventually.

Malcolm wrote:
Forest fires, drought, etc. will only intensify. CA will have to get its water from the Pacific. Doable.

Speaking of MIT folks, the one ray of hope on the horizon is fusion. It's actually happening:

https://news.mit.edu/2021/MIT-CFS-major-advance-toward-fusion-energy-0908

Crazywisdom said:
Someday in a hoped-for future, when there may be thousands of fusion plants powering clean electric grids around the world, Zuber says, “I think we’re going to look back and think about how we got there, and I think the demonstration of the magnet technology, for me, is the time when I believed that, wow, we can really do this.”

The successful creation of a power-producing fusion device would be a tremendous scientific achievement, Zuber notes. But that’s not the main point. “None of us are trying to win trophies at this point. We’re trying to keep the planet livable.”


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 1:45 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:


Arnoud said:
Do you really feel America had a hard lockdown? Compared to my family in Europe, the US was rather lax. I guess it depends on where you were so maybe speaking for the whole of the US is impossible anyway.

Malcolm wrote:
The "lockdown" in the US was a joke.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 1:30 AM
Title: Re: The Nirvana Sutra News
Content:
Zhen Li said:
I don't mean to be so negative about these things, but we need academia to accept translation as legitimate work and allow scholars to shift their attention from churning out these useless articles which say everything about nothing, and start translating texts and building up a good quality English Tripitaka. If they annotate their translations well enough, they can make all the same arguments they make in these articles, while benefitting both fellow scholars who will read the notes and practitioners who will focus on the contents of the text.

Malcolm wrote:
Strongly agree, however, I think academia is not up the task.

I personally don't like translations that are overly annotated. It is because of annotation, actually, that nothing gets translated in a speedy and efficient way. People are too worried about covering their asses.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 1:27 AM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
oldbob said:
Dear all and All,

This is long to read but there is much to put on the table - that is timely.  So please do your best!!!

It should be noted that apparently, the intellectual property rules both in Europe and in the US have only a 35-year life.  That means that perhaps the material from before September 1986, is now in the public domain, and that each year, perhaps more and more material will be in the public domain.   As of now, this includes 7 years of Teaching including Tregchod and Togyal.

Malcolm wrote:
International copyright law specifies a period of 75 years from the death of the author. This includes recordings, videos, etc. You are confusing patents with copyright.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 12:35 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:



Johnny Dangerous said:
It's going to be endemic now. The scientific consensus is trending that way pretty heavily. It makes vaccination that much more important, because we all have a future date with Covid now.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because we were impatient and opened up too early.

Johnny Dangerous said:
No, that's just not correct to the best of my knowledge. New Zealand pretty much admitted it will be endemic now, and they were on super lockdown. The r0 of delta makes endemicity almost a given, without a 100% vaccine, which AFAIK is pretty much impossible with this kind of virus. None of the places that did heavy lockdowns are faring well with Delta, for the reasons I've mentioned, and the fact that they were late to the vaccination party. The UK is doing ok due to the vaccination rate. The places with no immunity (via natural infection and vaccines) are in the worst position following heavy lockdowns. That's of course not an argument for people going out and catching Covid - the dramatic drop in the risk of severe disease and death is the part of the vaccines that is most important, and taking on Covid without being vaccinated is a real crapshoot, one where the dice are more loaded the older one is.

Malcolm wrote:
The very reason Delta happened is because India, under a right wing givernment, did not lock down.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 12:23 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
The most locked down countries are the now the ones that will have the hardest time reaching endemicity or any kind of herd immunity.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no such thing as herd immunity. We don’t want COVID to become endemic.

Johnny Dangerous said:
It's going to be endemic now. The scientific consensus is trending that way pretty heavily. It makes vaccination that much more important, because we all have a future date with Covid now.

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, because we were impatient and opened up too early.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Monday, September 20th, 2021 at 12:12 AM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
The most locked down countries are the now the ones that will have the hardest time reaching endemicity or any kind of herd immunity.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no such thing as herd immunity. We don’t want COVID to become endemic.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 11:51 PM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
The argument is just nonsensical, it’s disconnected.

FYI I was (mostly) opposed to the lockdowns on the grounds of the collateral damage they’ve caused - I still feel this way about them, and I suspect history will prove me right on them.

Malcolm wrote:
Spanish flue: compare Philly with St. Louis. The former never locked down, and suffered long term economic damage. The latter locked down hard, and their economy recovered much more rapidly.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 9:29 PM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
So what about it should be made illegal...

Malcolm wrote:
It needs to be broken up for antitrust reasons, and what remains needs strict federal oversight.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 9:27 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:
Johnny Dangerous said:
Well Oldbob, I agree about the archive for the most part, but I don’t expect it to change.

Malcolm wrote:
To reiterate, Bob's desiderata is all based on a single misconception, that is, a misconception about who owns and is heir to ChNN's intellectual property.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 9:26 PM
Title: Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu
Content:


PeterC said:
No, that is exactly what we do not need, because it would be a waste of time.  All the arguments and potential solutions have been rehearsed above in the thread many times.  The DC will not reach a consensus, all its members will die off first.

Malcolm wrote:
Even if we did, all of this material is not actually owned by the Dzogchen Community proper. It is all owned by family, virtually all of it.

So, Bob's desiderata is all based on a single misconception, that is, a misconception about who owns and is heir to ChNN's intellectual property.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 9:12 PM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:


dharmafootsteps said:
I’m not making a case for social media, I’m just interested to get to the root of what people see as the problematic parts. “Shutdown social media” is too vague for a real policy, there would have to be specific functionality that it banned.

Malcolm wrote:
It is not social media that is the issue, it is Facebook, specifically, that is a cancer gnawing away at social comity.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 9:09 PM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
nightbloom said:
Yes, I know. I think that what you, and some others want, is to drown your doubts, misgivings and pain in expressions of rage and contempt toward socially-approved bogeymen.

Malcolm wrote:
I don't have any doubts. I would have signed up for the Moderna vaccine in March 2020.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 7:55 PM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
Give over @nightbloom, I don't want to hear it.

nightbloom said:
Yes, I know. I think that what you, and some others want, is to drown your doubts, misgivings and pain in expressions of rage and contempt toward socially-approved bogeymen. Frankly, some of you guys are totally poisoned with hatred, and I don't expect to change your minds. But I know there are people lurking who privately agree with at least some of what I've said. I just don't want them to think that they're alone.

Malcolm wrote:
There are all kinds of idiots out there who think the way you do on thus subject. You can find them holding  stupid signs in front of hospitals and government buildings all over the world. Sadly. People like you are killing people. Get a clue.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 7:52 PM
Title: Re: Vaccination Recalcitrance Posing as Compassion
Content:


nightbloom said:
No. And I don't believe you seriously think I'm saying that. I already said that I think we should have concentrated in getting a safe (!) traditional vaccine out the door, so that *nobody* would have to be a test subject.

Malcolm wrote:
Thus statement is complete and total nonsense. The traditional vaccines are far less effective than mRNA vaccines. Modena had a fully functioning vaccine in 48 hours. The FDA was way behind the curve on this one. Now, thus vaccine has been rolled out to literally billions of people. There are virtually no negative effects, and to call people “test” subjects just feeds into anti-vaxxer bullshit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 11:33 AM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:


Archie2009 said:
Crystal meth is also pleasurable.

Malcolm wrote:
Not really.

KristenM said:
Why is it not really pleasurable? (

Malcolm wrote:
If you e ever done meth you will understand why. It’s a rush, but it’s not that pleasurable.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 4:45 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
KristenM said:
And honestly, I'd rather live in the desert than have winters.

Malcolm wrote:
New England winters are awesome. They build character.

In all seriousness though, the water table in the Central Valley has dropped fifty feet in the past 70 years or so (thanks to irrigation), and the infrastructure has suffered badly for it. California cannot sustain the number of people living there, and no, you can't have the Great Lakes... You'll have to drain Lake Tahoe first, at the very least. "This land is my land, this is land is your land" stuff went out with Trump.

Expect the US to split into four major regions in the next 100 years.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 3:29 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Queequeg said:
The recall rule is flawed. Too easy to force a recall vote. Just as it's too easy to have referenda added to the ballot. In theory these are nice democratic ideas but in reality turn into easy tools for obstruction and populism.

As for the rest... People who own $800000 houses might like the idea of affordable housing, but NIMBY. See the Westchester NY housing settlement fiasco. The towns of Scarsdale and Rye will consistently vote blue, but suggest building affordable housing in their neighborhood and you will see all manner of meeting the letter of the law while making a travesty of the spirit, while quietly supporting politicians who promise to obstruct and gut the law.

Draught... State sponsored rain dances?

Malcolm wrote:
People are already leading CA in droves. They are coming east. Central Valley is the new dustbowl. They are mostly moving to AZ, NM, and MT, That should turn TX, MT, and AZ bluer. CA's climate will not recover for a millennia. Toast is about the right word.

Archie2009 said:
Isn't AZ also a candidate for becoming unliveable due to climate change?

Malcolm wrote:
Depends where one is, but yeah, parts are very dry.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Sunday, September 19th, 2021 at 1:11 AM
Title: Re: Newsom Beat the Recall, Now Comes the Hard Part: Governing California
Content:
Queequeg said:
The recall rule is flawed. Too easy to force a recall vote. Just as it's too easy to have referenda added to the ballot. In theory these are nice democratic ideas but in reality turn into easy tools for obstruction and populism.

As for the rest... People who own $800000 houses might like the idea of affordable housing, but NIMBY. See the Westchester NY housing settlement fiasco. The towns of Scarsdale and Rye will consistently vote blue, but suggest building affordable housing in their neighborhood and you will see all manner of meeting the letter of the law while making a travesty of the spirit, while quietly supporting politicians who promise to obstruct and gut the law.

Draught... State sponsored rain dances?

Malcolm wrote:
People are already leading CA in droves. They are coming east. Central Valley is the new dustbowl. They are mostly moving to AZ, NM, and MT, That should turn TX, MT, and AZ bluer. CA's climate will not recover for a millennia. Toast is about the right word.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 9:28 PM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:
Knotty Veneer said:
Why would you mutilate yourself like that??


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 9:25 PM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
I think it must be meaningful that enlightenment and Nirvana are not mentioned at all in the Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold Path.

Malcolm wrote:
Nirodha and nirvana are synonyms.

So you have suffering, its source, and its cessation. These are not prescriptive terms, they are diagnostic terms. Then there is the eight fold path, which is prescriptive.

Awakening means recognizing these four things as truths. When one is not an ārya, these are the mundane four truths. When one has realized them through direct knowledge, they are the ārya's four truths:
"And, monks, as long as this knowledge & vision of mine — with its three rounds & twelve permutations concerning these four noble truths as they actually are present — was not pure, I did not claim to have directly awakened to the right self-awakening unexcelled in the cosmos with its devas, Maras, & Brahmas, with its contemplatives & brahmans, its royalty & commonfolk. But as soon as this knowledge & vision of mine — with its three rounds & twelve permutations concerning these four noble truths as they actually are present — was truly pure, then I did claim to have directly awakened to the right self-awakening unexcelled in the cosmos with its devas, Maras & Brahmas, with its contemplatives & brahmans, its royalty & commonfolk. Knowledge & vision arose in me: 'Unprovoked is my release. This is the last birth. There is now no further becoming.'"


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 8:13 PM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:


Archie2009 said:
Crystal meth is also pleasurable.

Malcolm wrote:
Not really.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 8:10 PM
Title: Re: Why is enlightenment never mentioned in 4NT and 8FP?
Content:
Supramundane said:
One might say that the goal of cessation is to end rebirth, but we may also say that the goal of cessation is to reach enlightenment; and we may also conclude that the goal of cessation is to enter Nirvana.

Malcolm wrote:
The first question is, what do you mean by enlightenment. It is not at all clear.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 3:17 AM
Title: Re: Good source for practice items?
Content:
yagmort said:
...when did bodhi seeds become widespread as mala beads material and why did they get their status.

Malcolm wrote:
In the Kriya tantras, 7-8th century.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 3:16 AM
Title: Re: Bodily possession?
Content:
Humblepractioner said:
Hi there,

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience of seemingly being controlled by something other than one's own mind? Of one's body doing doing things one doesn't want to do, and of having severe reactions to even thinking about basic Dharma concepts like benefitting beings?

This has been my experience and it is quite troubling, to understate it. I am desperate for help with this, because I have no idea what to do and who can help me get rid of this.

Malcolm wrote:
Seek medical help.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 2:28 AM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:
Hazel said:
Mod note: I think this is a fine thing to discuss, however I encourage folks to keep discussion to the dharma related implications of this piercing which was the initial question. We're dangerously close to the medical advice prohibition.

Malcolm wrote:
Its not a medical procedure, which is why you can get it done in a tat parlor.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 2:25 AM
Title: Minutes of Florida GOP Committee on Health Policy.
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
As seen on Twitter:





Hello everyone, and welcome to this meeting of the Florida GOP Committee on Health Policy. We're meeting today in this parking lot behind a Hooter's because Dale, our treasurer, died of COVID-19 last night and he had sole access to the accounts, so we couldn't rent out our usual conference room space in the Best Western. Apologies for any inconvenience and thoughts and prayers to Dale's family members who have not also died of COVID-19.

My name is Tad Horkington, and I'm honored to have been named president of the committee following the tragic death of Thomas Bilgenut, the interim president who last week died of COVID-19. Tom had, of course, replaced Hugh Frank, our previous president who died two weeks ago of COVID-19, along with his entire family and the youth football team he coached.

We will not read minutes from last month's meeting, as our committee secretary, Henry Sanford is presently hospitalized with COVID-19. We wish him and his loved ones well, send our thoughts and prayers and commend his courageous work on the "MASKS ARE TYRANNY!" float that appeared in the Labor Day parade in Vero Beach. Hopefully we can honor Henry and his team at our next meeting, assuming they are all off their ventilators or out of quarantine.

Getting to business, we need to sign off on the anti-vaccine-mandate statement that was put together by Belinda Thompson prior to her death from COVID-19. Thoughts and prayers to Belinda's family, all of whom were infected by Belinda at the vaccine protest she organized in a sealed tent outside the Granada Plaza Publix in Dunedin.

The statement, which Belinda composed using her iPhone's voice dictation feature, reads: "The Florida GOP Committee on Health Policy hereby denounces Sleepy Joe Biden's TYRANNICAL attempt to COUGH mandate vaccines for anyone COUGH anywhere or at any COUGH time. We encourage all righteous COUGH Americans to stand up against this COUGH COUGH COUGH unlawful government overreach." I would propose we vote to approve that statement, but unfortunately, due to COVID-19 illnesses we do not have a quorum and, in fact, I am the only person in attendance today, and even I barely made it as I'm feeling a little under the weather. Jan Dodson, who is the only committee officer allowed to change the rules on voting, is unfortunately visiting her husband Zeke who is in Tampa General Hospital's COVID ward. They won't let her in because she patriotically refuses to wear a mask, so kudos to Jan for standing in the parking lot holding a sign that reads "STAY STRONG, ZEKE AND DON'T LET THEM MICROCHIP YOU!!"

COUGH! Excuse me. I'm sure it's just a cold. I will now conclude this meeting of the Florida GOP Committee on Health Policy. COUGH! I feel a bit feverish, so I'm going to go into the Hooter's without a mask and get a beer and some wings. God bless America.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Saturday, September 18th, 2021 at 12:27 AM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:



Toenail said:
Because it is a violation of vows?

I would never get it through the tip, but I like how frenulum piercings look.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no explicit vow against, but piercing the body opens it to infection, and they are permanent open sores. But it’s your dick, so you do whatever you want to it.

Toenail said:
Doesnt the wound close though?

Malcolm wrote:
No, not really.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 8:13 PM
Title: Re: Thoughts on Ajahn Sona's video series on Buddhist Cosmology?
Content:
Heimdall said:
I should also point out a few things as well:

1. The monks themselves evidently don't take the mythology too literally - they demonstrate that the Ancient Indians believed the whole world consisted of the Subcontinent of India and nothing else - something obviously not true. Moreover, in their later video on the "Northern Continent", they use two completely contradictory sources in elaborating what the "Northern Continent" is, and these two sources seem unreconcilable - one source describes the Northern Continent as some kind of Utopian post-agricultural-revolution Garden of Eden, another source describes it as a realm of floating cities where Yakas (Demonic Ogres) have slave ownership over human beings (perhaps, soteriologically, the two sources aren't so unreconcilable when you look at something like the Soviet Union, or, more pertinently, Mao China)

Malcolm wrote:
Uttarakuru is the northern steppes, and also Ptolemy refers to people there are "Kurus." So this ancient geography was shared between the Occident and Orient.

And Its pretty clear that this was a typological cosmology, treated differently in different sources, which Indian Buddhists in the classical period would have been familiar.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 8:08 PM
Title: Re: Good source for practice items?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
Yak bone is an inferior substance. Don’t use.

nightbloom said:
Assuming this applies also to Nepalese water buffalo?

Malcolm wrote:
Yes. Mālas should only be made from substances prescribed in the tantras. They include, gold. silver, copper, iron, pearl, coral, crystal, human bone, etc. But in general these substances are for activities. Bodhiseed mālas are the ones for all activities and general use.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 7:36 PM
Title: Re: Good source for practice items?
Content:
nightbloom said:
I think I found the source for Beer's numbers. It is, as I suspected, an Indian scripture. Anyway - probably not an important thing to fixate on, and one's natural inclinations and experiences will undoubtedly vary, but carefully tailoring physical supports to one's practices can lend the latter strength.

Regarding yak bones - the mala I was looking at is painted red, with brass inlay. The color and general vibe seemed right, and you wouldn't necessarily realize it's bone just by looking at it. But I'm going to hold off on this one, I think, due to the wrathful associations.

Malcolm wrote:
Yak bone is an inferior substance. Don’t use.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 7:36 PM
Title: Re: Good source for practice items?
Content:
nightbloom said:
My practice text does not specify a bead count, but I have read that malas for use with Lotus family activities should have 25. Beer says this in his encyclopedia of Tibetan symbols (and gives numbers for the other activities as well), but I believe I've seen it elsewhere as well. Thoughts? Also, material: red sandalwood is specified for my practice, but this tree is endangered, and I would prefer to substitute it with something else.

Malcolm wrote:
The material and number for males is specified in tantras


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 7:35 PM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:
Toenail said:
I am thinking of getting a piercing. Is it against buddhist ethics or vows or so? E.g. counting as mutilating ones body etc?

Malcolm wrote:
Demonstrably unhealthy, and you’ll never pee correctly again, if you thinking of getting a Prince Albert.

Also, as a Vajrayana practitioner, arguably a bad idea.

Toenail said:
Because it is a violation of vows?

I would never get it through the tip, but I like how frenulum piercings look.

Malcolm wrote:
There is no explicit vow against, but piercing the body opens it to infection, and they are permanent open sores. But it’s your dick, so you do whatever you want to it.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 6:45 PM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:
PeterC said:
Then these stories get picked up by black kids in NY who can't speak a word of Chinese and incorporated into even more bizarre belief systems.

Malcolm wrote:
And great rap music.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 6:38 PM
Title: Re: Penis piercing
Content:
Toenail said:
I am thinking of getting a piercing. Is it against buddhist ethics or vows or so? E.g. counting as mutilating ones body etc?

Malcolm wrote:
Demonstrably unhealthy, and you’ll never pee correctly again, if you thinking of getting a Prince Albert.

Also, as a Vajrayana practitioner, arguably a bad idea.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 7:17 AM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:
Malcolm wrote:
The Man Behind Critical Race Theory
How Derrick Bell’s pioneering work gave rise to critical race theory.
Read in The New Yorker: https://apple.news/AqOnqIwHvSZS1XWSjwBAkig

Unknown said:
For the past several months, however, conservatives have been waging war on a wide-ranging set of claims that they wrongly ascribe to critical race theory, while barely mentioning the body of scholarship behind it or even Bell’s name. As Christopher F. Rufo, an activist who launched the recent crusade, said on Twitter, the goal from the start was to distort the idea into an absurdist touchstone. “We have successfully frozen their brand—‘critical race theory’—into the public conversation and are steadily driving up negative perceptions. We will eventually turn it toxic, as we put all of the various cultural insanities under that brand category,” he wrote. Accordingly, C.R.T. has been defined as Black-supremacist racism, false history, and the terrible apotheosis of wokeness. Patricia Williams, one of the key scholars of the C.R.T. canon, refers to the ongoing mischaracterization as “definitional theft.”


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 2:44 AM
Title: Re: Good source for practice items?
Content:
nightbloom said:
Yeah - I didn't mean to suggest that 108 bead malas aren't suitable for practice. Just that most online vendors I've seen have a pretty limited selection of ritual tools, and seem to cater to new age sensibilities.

Anyway, I think you're right. I'll have to string my own.

Malcolm wrote:
A mala should have 108 beads, plus the guru bead.

Potala Gate:

https://potalagate.com

Tibetan Spirit

https://tibetanspirit.com/collections/malas

There are others. as well, if you look around.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 1:41 AM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:
Sādhaka said:
Amir Fatir’s interpretations are probably considered fringe by most N.O.I. members.

But some of his interpretations I think are onto something, despite ‘Quranic Tantric Soulmates’ lol  And even if he’s off on that one, maybe there is a little something to it in context....

Anyhow, there even seem to be some interesting connections to the Moors, Ismailis, Drew Ali, Fard Muhammad, Elijah Muhammad, and ‘the Secret Chiefs’ of early American secret societies, H.P. Blavatsky, John Yarker, Paschal Beverley Randolph (the latter—like Fard Muhammad—was ‘mulatto’, was a founder of an Rosicrucian society and was supposedly an advisor of Abraham Lincoln).

Malcolm wrote:
LIkely through Prince Hall Masons:

https://www.blackpast.org/african-american-history/prince-hall-masons-1784/


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 1:39 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Nadereme said:
You’re acting like the medium is inherently bad.

Malcolm wrote:
It is.

You might read "In Absence of the Sacred: The Failure of Technology and the Survival of the Indian Nations by Jerry Mander.

Toenail said:
Or the unibomber manifest.

Malcolm wrote:
Umm, very different approaches, and very different authors, the former serving life in prison...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 12:55 AM
Title: Re: Practices and Insight into bacterial Infections
Content:
Donny said:
Does anyone know what practices are suggested in dealing with bacterial infection or what Insight tibetan Medicine has in these infections?


Malcolm wrote:
The best practice is to take antibiotics.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 12:51 AM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:



Sādhaka said:
https://archive.org/details/AmirFatirCollection/MothershipConnection/mode/2up

By Amir Fatir^. Of course not everyone is going to agree with his interpretations; but his interpretations are interesting.

Malcolm wrote:
Tantric Soul Mates in the Quran says it all....

https://archive.org/details/AmirFatirCollection/TantricSoulMatesInTheQuran/page/n1/mode/2up


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 12:35 AM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:



PeterC said:
Interesting is one way of putting it.  I thought the nation of islam were out there.  These guys' belief system is a whole new level of bizarre

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, and then you have the Wu Tang Clan combing this with their concept of Buddhism...

Queequeg said:
Wu Tang got their name from the Saturday afternoon Kung Fu matinees...

Malcolm wrote:
Indeed.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Friday, September 17th, 2021 at 12:29 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Nadereme said:
You’re acting like the medium is inherently bad.

Malcolm wrote:
It is.

You might read "In Absence of the Sacred: The Failure of Technology and the Survival of the Indian Nations by Jerry Mander.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 8:35 PM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:
Nadereme said:
I am sometimes a bit fascinated as to why so many Buddhists seem to have strong political opinions/views and sometimes are borderline extremists. Discussions can turn emotional and strong quickly. To me it is just more grasping.

Malcolm wrote:
I am always fascinated by how some Buddhists feign indifference to politics, as if the plight of their fellows is of no concern to them at all. There is all kinds of grasping out there, including indifference.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 8:32 PM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:


Malcolm wrote:
Well read that pdf I posted. Its interesting.

PeterC said:
Interesting is one way of putting it.  I thought the nation of islam were out there.  These guys' belief system is a whole new level of bizarre

Malcolm wrote:
Yes, and then you have the Wu Tang Clan combing this with their concept of Buddhism...


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 9:48 AM
Title: Re: Quiz - Which Political Party would you belong to?
Content:


KristenM said:
Bernie Sander’s video about people losing faith in government and democracy doesn’t imo fully address the deep seated mistrust of US government that a lot of people hold. The five percenters don’t trust anyone in the US government. I can’t blame them, even if I don’t agree with them.

Malcolm wrote:
Regressive forces want us to lack confidence in the gvt. What they really want us to do is to lose confidence in ourselves. That’s where tyranny begins, beginning with the first tyrant, Pisistratus, he was thrust into power because Athenians lost confidence in Democracy, that is, themselves.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 9:13 AM
Title: Re: Best translation Nagarjuna middle way
Content:
nightbloom said:
Thanks for these. Any others? My understanding is that Conze's old translations are not very well-regarded at this point.

Malcolm wrote:
They are just fine, though a bit dated.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 6:34 AM
Title: Re: Argument against common conversion about karma
Content:
Vajrasvapna said:
However Gnostic teaching have being adopted as Dzogchen in Tibet.

Malcolm wrote:
Bullshit.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 4:41 AM
Title: Re: The Buddha's Omnicience
Content:
Kurp said:
I’ve observed some so called “enlightened” beings, and my theory is, they are either omniscient and don’t care what the truth is (because: non-duality), or they are just as clueless and easily manipulated as everyone else.  Maybe “the Buddha” plays favorites and is easily persuaded after getting his freak on. Who knows?

But when you think about it… if you have a bunch of highly attained beings in a room together, can they really see into one another’s past / present / future with the utmost clarity? Or will there be trickery afoot to throw each other off track?

Just some silly musings from someone who doesn’t have a clue about anything.

Malcolm wrote:
Well, I am not sure what you mean by "enlightened."

Awakened people certainly make errors and so on, and have various kinds of limitations. Only buddhas, the fully awakened, are error-free in their conduct and knowledge.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 4:38 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:


Jesse said:
Cynicism ceases being cynicism the moment the world proves you right 90+% of the time, then it's just reality.

Malcolm wrote:
So you feel you are right, 90+% percent of the time. Man, I wish I had that confidence about the world. The older I get, the more I understand that I don't know very much.

Jesse said:
I voted for Biden because he was the lesser of the two evils, and I'd do it again. That doesn't mean a damned thing, the DNC is every bit as evil as the RNC.

Malcolm wrote:
We live in a two party system. It's not by design, but it just works out that way. The DNC is not the Democratic Party, and I am not a Democrat. However, the Democratic party  is far, far better than the GOP. If you don't see that...

Jesse said:
They are power strongholds that represent interests that do not align with regular peoples. They represent the rich, the elite, corporations.

Malcolm wrote:
You have a vote and a voice. If it matters so much to you, then use them. Don't just bitch about these things on Dharmawheel. Democracy is slow, it is messy, and often dissatisfying to those who want thing to change overnight. But it works.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 4:13 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
Jesse said:
Bernie sanders was about the only candidate who did.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 3:53 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:


Jesse said:
The law is written by those who claim power, by whatever means they can, lawful or not.

Malcolm wrote:
No, that is really not the case. But it is cynicism like yours that contributes to the decline of democracy, rather that strengthens and reinforces it. And that is exactly what people like Trump want to see. They want to see you alienated, angry, and feeling that your vote and voice do not matter. That's how they win, every damn time.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 3:51 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:


Jesse said:
I am stating facts.

Malcolm wrote:
No, you are not. You are stating opinions.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 3:49 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:
dharmafootsteps said:
What’s the logic behind Zuck being a Trumpster? Just because they’re active on his platform?

I don’t know much about Zuck’s politics, but he sounds pretty lefty on most issues: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Zuckerberg




Malcolm wrote:
Zuck hates regulation, so does Trump.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 3:44 AM
Title: Re: The Buddha's Omnicience
Content:
puggily said:
Frequently I hear in prayers about gaining the omniscience of the Buddha and this has led me to question this particular aspect. One of the reasons I left monotheistic religions is that I do not believe in a god that is omniscience, omnipresent, omnipotent, etc.

My question is: am I confusing my past experience of what omniscience means in Buddhism? Am I putting a western slant to an eastern idea which may view this heavily laden term differently? Any advice is needed. Thanks.

Malcolm wrote:
A buddha is omniscient about the _nature_ of all dharma and the extent of dharmas within their field of perception (and dharmas here is a very specific technical term), but more specifically it refers to their knowledge of all paths of liberation; not their insights into string theory.


Author: Malcolm
Date: Thursday, September 16th, 2021 at 3:41 AM
Title: Re: Facebook is bad
Content:


Jesse said:
There are plenty of politicians who have commited genocide, Coup d'états, and commited acts of violence against their citizens still on FB.

Genjo Conan said:
Well, that's true.  But the fact that Abiy Ahmed, say, remains on Facebook while Trump has been suspended doesn't show that the DNC is pulling the strings.
You might be alarmed to learn that they really don't give a shit, it's nothing more than politics, power plays, and catering to whoever they see as being of more benefit to themselves, and their profits.
I'm a socialist, so yeah man, my mind is frak blown to learn that a giant corporation is unprincipled, thanks for the heads up.

Jesse said:
Your welcome.


